The Wrong Mix

Why is terms like Catholocity made to be associated with kindness Christianity (catholics }Is that less disassociative than Islamic anything.words are just association .Jehad is now dirty word recently but not so before .No matter u practice or not there IS something that loosely called 'Islamic economics'.
if you accept evolution of christians which is more than 600 yrs older are we not at the stage christianity was 1400 something ?

Church of Scientology



Scientology organization in Hamburg, GermanyThe 'Church' of Scientology is the largest organization devoted to the practice and the promotion of the Scientology belief system. The 'Church' of Scientology International is the mother 'church 'of the Scientology 'religion', and is responsible for the overall ecclesiastical management, dissemination and propagation of Scientology.[1][2][3] Every Church of Scientology is separately incorporated and

#38 #39

Do you ever try to argue for argument sake.Just for once dont try to be yes man apologist b/c more eloquent Hamidm says that
Not that i think all science eminate from Koran for god knows i haven 't eversen a rich muslim pay his share of zakat,Majority of muslim do not understand arabic to figure out anything.Interpretation are as many and modified amended to form score of lemlins folowing either agah khan burhanuddin mirzaee peer murids in subcontinent Chisty ,Nizamuddin

Seperating political ideology and science from religion (islam )is all fine But this joined atthe hip is not unique to Islam ....hindutva has become Vedic ,Christian earlier incorporate sciencepart of Christianity Islam is trying to come to terms with reality and irrefutable facts of life as other religions nothibg derogatory of islam.Why there is CHISTIAN science monitor Why Mary Baker Eddy did the same thing Benifits of Sports exercise and athelitism was incorported as mUscular christianity




"Muscular Christianity is a term used to refer to a movement within the Victorian era which stressed the need for energetic Christian activism in combination with an ideal of vigorous masculinity. It was most associated with the English writers Charles Kingsley and Thomas Hughes, though the name was bestowed by others.

Kingsley and Hughes promoted physical strength and health (at least for men) as well as an active pursuit of Christian ideals in personal life and politics.

The term has also been applied to later movements that combine physical and Christian spiritual development"






"The Christian Science Monitor (CSM) is an international newspaper published daily, Monday through Friday. Started in 1908 by Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of the Church of Christ, Scientist, .
Forum page, the content represents international and United States news."

sheep herding .........

....as far as i can remember, islamic socialism was just another empty slogan invented by zab to sell himself to the unwashed and islam obsessed masses ...... the unwashed masses understood the simple slogan of 'roti, kapra aur makan' but zab had to confuse them with big words like :"islam hamara deen, socialism hamari maeeshat!" ..... like all leaders of the moslem herd he had to play up islam to appease the sheep and get them to fall in line ...... in order to sell anything to the moslems you have to label it 'islamic' ..... that's all

Re: # 38

tahmed,

.... i saw the palace and mosque exhibition and, like i said, it was half ass ........ repetitious geometric shapes and squiggly calligraphy gets monontonous after about five minutes ....... we moslems are obsessed with 'islamizing' everything and in the process making fools out of ourselves ....... islamic science and sex are great examples ...... i learned all about islamic sex in order to pass the 50 point islamiyat paper in engineering college - it prohibits foreplay, requires the participants to place a sheet between their bodies and pray a lot before, during and after the act ! ... subhanallah

Re: # 40; NP
"People are given false hopes that you will be given everything as things will drop from sky."

why can't we damn it!

if the prototypical 'chosen nation' could have the "manna", then why not us??!!

The decision to give up East Pakistan was made well before the 1971 war.

#44 Posted by HP on May 19, 2008 11:38:58 pm

Such claim need corroborative evidence.

#40 Posted by NangaPir
“Pakistan was cited as an example of progress and S. Korea took the blue print and implemented it” “However that model was based on exploitation due to its nature.”

The model was suggested to Pakistan by the US after Pakistan had joined military alliances with the US. This was the reverse of the model that Soviet Union used to push as I mentioned in my earlier post.

The cold war was not just about the armaments or the military strength; it was also fought on the economic front. Both the US and the USSR pushed their own economic planning and models.

The reason it failed in Pakistan (and was successful in South Korea) was not just exploitation of Bengal but it was all about misallocations/misuse of the windfall by the Pakistan government. Instead of investing the profits back in to the country and development, the Pak army went on binges of buying expensive arms and expanded the army beyond the country’s means. The 1965 war was a major blow to the economy and keeping Bengal together with Pakistan after 1965 became too expensive due to restrictions imposed by India.

Contrary to the conventional wisdom, after 1960 West Pakistan was feeding East Pakistan. Income from the only resource (jute) from East Pakistan was not enough to feed that part of the country.

The decision to give up East Pakistan was made well before the 1971 war.

Re: # 41; madani sahib,

I don't mind one way or the other what happens to society in terms of its"sexualisation" or otherwise.

Using that argument to enslave our female population (not just physical but mental slavery; and of the worse kind) is what I'd like to see abolished.

This can only be achieved by economic empowerment of the 'better-half' of our population.

Khuda Hafiz

Re: # 40; peer-o-murshid,

"Pakistan was cited as an example of progress and S. Korea took the blue print and implemented it."

I have been a great believer in that myself

yet another gem, if I may say so. Will read in more detail later.

Re: # 37
Dr. Sahib It will be great if sexual content in our society increases. Many people go out of country as they get tired lack of not sex but sexual content. Outside of lahore and karachi you travel how much fair sex is nonparticipant in life is pathetic. It is many times hard on eyes to see all beared faces and poor woman caged in special dress or just women have no value or no prescence in day to day life. It is for normal world a pleasure to eyes for men and women to large number of other sex faces add something to life. Even have observed my all wasted time ( with playing with cats and Khabootars) of beautiful things. My cats gets even get excited to new faces when they cross . I have seen new male comes all females cat just leave everything and watch new kid on block. Not they do much anything but see excitement. and otherway. Even as amature Khabootarbaj pigeons get excited with new faces and they are happy. Cats (mammals) and birds are happy and we are sexual unfortunately and sexuality is deep in our blood we can not supress but such can control and leading to sublimation. You cross west punjab to east punjab even in small cities women are driving scooters and bullock carts. That is organicness of life is lacking in Muslim nations. I have met rich arabs ( saudi) who abandoned homelands as they made cardinal mistake of visiting west where there is good sexual content in society that soothes them at same frightens. ( probably you may know how bradford little pakistan in kind Psyfreinc ( do not spelling) stage. They will not like their chidren suffer. So they some times leave motherland not for money but sexual content.
Former Wall Street editor ( Karen Lodge) wrote interesting articles in economist if correct.
She wrote most rich sauddi men and women in closed quarters open bottle of whisky and watch blue movies. They told her the sex sublimation is not possible as when they were in west.
With supression of sex sublimation is problem . Everybody knows how it is hard for women travel in public busses men pervesion easily passes from pinching bottom to bumping. You iknow better you have lived at many places .
Many times times life of muslims will more pleasuarble if sexual content in society is increased. That will also put stop on being over sensetive about religious things. Many times that suppression of sexuality may be leading to violence as most preachers are sex obsessed and at same time afraid of sexuality. So they even want to ban pictures of women but after surmon watch blue movies. It is ripe topic to lanch hundreds of PhDs. This has led to wrong information. If you ask a question to men or women what is most important sexual organ rarely you get answer as brain.
Please let us ow the name of book if on internet it will interesting to know what is muslim sexuality. One will be interested to know twhat people who have studied say.

Good day.

Social models emerge out of survival needs for all species and human are no different. It was extreme physical exploitation in Europe that helped paved the way for socialism. Religions are mostly on the side of oppressed but in Europe that was the real powerhouse of the world, one-third wealth belonged to church. The last such stronghold was apartheid South Africa. In one two three Marx translated it into Revolution, Class Struggle and Dictatorship of Proletariat. Workers successfully established Paris commune earlier but were overrun in few weeks. After great turmoil Bolsheviks succeeded in controlling Russia. A gang mugged Lenin on the third day of assuming power in Moscow. You can realize the circumstances the revolution took place. Some countries were in dire need but in others it became a romantic fashion for rich and a false hope for the poor. Anyway, communist up to this point have successfully learned how to organize, campaign, bring and defend revolution. So Paris commune scenario was not repeated. However, they needed to learn how to run it. Our cosmos is a dynamic phenomenon and flows due to differential imbedded at the quantum level in the form of probability and randomness. But Lenin vehemently rejected quantum idea as Bourgeois poly. Then in China, the communist party started its campaign in areas where farmers used to work at night because they had no clothes. That is how the revolution is organized. Although this is not the appropriate forum to talk as all those who visit here are affluent and do not need revolution unless they are highly conscious of it. Arabs actually started nationalism not socialism in that part of world. Qaddafi had his own version with his Green Book. This was in response to European monopolizing of Arabian resources. Ba’ath party’s General Secretary was a Christian so the question of Islamic socialism is out of question. The author just wrote hotch potch things collected from scattered resources. Bhutto had nothing with socialism. His fundamental slogan was Taskand Agreement. He needed students’ help and when he visited Dow Medical College, NSF forced him to wear a red star and included socialism in his manifesto. That was a turning point. Pakistan under General Ayub Khan made huge strides in energy and other infrastructure. In just 20 years it had proportionate matching structure with India. All the huge projects were left in India including Tata Berla, educational etc. Pakistan had only some irrigation system and military cantonments. Pakistan was cited as an example of progress and S. Korea took the blue print and implemented it. If the progress had gone smoothly then Pakistan would be ahead of S. Korea. However that model was based on exploitation due to its nature. Bengalis were the main victim and there was no hope that the fruit of this capitalist venture will ever trickle over there. Maulana Bhashani had socialism too. Wali Khan had his own socialism. So it was a mix bag.
Socialism is a socio-economic model. Bhutto did lot of blunders and Islamic socialism was one of them. He confiscated mills etc and handed over to his party goons who just robbed them at various levels. This decimated the whole development process. But worse of his crimes were rehabilitating the East Pakistan war criminals and giving them nukes. He paid dearly for that. Mujahideen Khaliq are now allied with CIA. Ex-Iranian president also joined them. So you can figure out their ideological standards. Building planned socialism is wrong. Whenever you build any such thing you will have external forces attacking it. You will have to build walls like Berlin or American or Israeli or DMZ. Let thing evolve naturally and let them flow. People are given false hopes that you will be given everything as things will drop from sky. No plan is made how to scientifically and efficiently utilize resources Russian paid for that policy. Chinese were quick but they will have huge problem. Capitalism is like oil beneath hot water. They have capitalist economy and communist rule. Whenever Uncle Sam would like there will be movement for freedom and democracy over there. But now Americans are doing what made Russian bankrupt. Sustain allies with money and that is the real problem. Today lack of capitalism is considered as an issue not it exploitation because of development of science and technology. In short most communist movements achieved their objectives of education, health, jobs and ending colonialism. But they did not learn the treachery and dishonesty of conventional bourgeois politics. Today when they compare Cuba with Miami imbecile say socialism is failure. In fact they need to compare Cuba with Haiti or Dominican Republic. And when it is claimed that if Burma would give us access we will save all those hit by Cyclone. But they forget how many did you save in Katrina. It needs high acumen to solve capitalist puzzles. In conclusion, there is nothing like Islamic, Hindu, national or Christian socialism. But some try hard to be. As we have political science, computer science, Islamic science and even Christian Science. But the real sciences, such as Physics, Chemistry etc do need such a nametag.

further to #38 I agree though that the concept of "Islamic science" is absurd (unless muslims indeed live in a different universe, as arjun claims), as is the concept of an "Islamic state" (which is merely another way of enslaving a nation by an individual or group of individuals).

hamidm: While scientists are seeking to proved that for every particle of matter there exists a particle of anti-matter, you have proved that for every islamic fanatic there exists an anti-islamic fanatic.

That is the only explanation I can find to understand why you think "Islamic art" is half-assed (your words). Too bad the Victoria and Albert Museum in the UK or the Smithsonian Museum in Washington DC, both of which have permanent exhibitions devoted to Islamic art dont share your pov. Also too bad the hundreds of thousands of people in the US who visited the special exhibition titled "Palace and Mosque" a couple of years ago dont share your pov.

Re: # 36; hamidm sahib,

recently I came across a book titled "Islamic Sexuality"!!

islamic socialism seems to be like islamic music, art and fashion ........... half ass

It will be interesting to know if iranian Tudeh party had faternal relationships with afghan socialists Khakaquis and perchamis ?
It appears Tedeh had some following and Imam Khomani used them against shah and then islamic revolutionaries slaughtered THIS SOCIALISTS. Iran Kurdish movement was socialist type but after revolution when they angered many were hanged by Islamic republic gauards to break the dangerous splitist socialistcs ideas. By hanging kurds in Mahabad in open day light they put fear of god in kurdish population. In general in middle east and muslim world many strong men captured power ( many were defence officers) they proclaimed as socialist but followed brute authoritian regimes. That made many arabs/ Muslims to loose attraction to name and ideas of socialism. These dictetors misued name of socialism for personal dictership.