Zardari and the Politics of Defiance

#24 Posted by HP,

HP, you're a fool! Have you read the distribution of power between the pillars of State in the 1973 constitution? What Nawaz did with the army chiefs and the CJ did with Suo Moto BOTH were within their rights. It's quite another thing if you agree with the original consensus 1973 constitution.

I'm very fast losing my respect for you as an analyst. You're just a drameybaaz dancing pony in mela muwaishyaan.

Re: # 11


Zeemax

(Tell me, what do you really think Pakistan is? Is it a weak country of weak people? Resourceless, consciousless place with no character?)

Not a fair question, how can we discuss politicians of pakistan by passing judgement on the poor masses who have hardly any say in the process. Coming back to your question, we have plenty of resources but still no understanding of how to share them. Water, port, gas, tax revenues these are issues which remain unresolved. Not a healthy diagnosis but to be fair, politicians cannot be blamed for this state of apathy.

As for the people or poor masses, divided ethnically and religiously with very little national spirit. Concept of nation state was lost somewhere between bangladesh and Islamization, having said that all this can be reversed with time and effort.

...as usual tahmed is clueless because he sees everything through the propaganda filters of the white man whom he worships unconditionally...

The author writes "The reason Zardari has given for taking this about turn to confront the presidency is reflective of the mood of society."

Not the mood of society rather the mood of the "powers that be" who like I said want to incorporate the political into the power equation of the country moreso than the past, an establishmentized political institution that works and cooperates with the miltary but is not ousted by it. Together with this about turn comes the announcement that the US would prefer the ISI to work under the civilian government! This thug is manipulating on behalf of the US/Pak Army, Musharraf is a nobody now without Army and US support and if he goes it will be because he has lost it and that day, it seems, is coming. All of these manipulations are for the prime reason of not restoring the judiciary because that would be a step towards REAL democracy of which the US/Pak Army are mortally afraid. These manipulations want to coopt the people's movement led by the lawyers, they want to coopt the other welcome side effect, i.e. the personal enmity between the NS and Musharraf that is leading to postitive results for the judiciary, and they want to coopt the anti-military sentiments of the military. Zardari is an Army peon through and through, he should be ignored and the protests should continue...His confidence in his declaration comes from assurances from the devil, the US elite themselves and he has military support- and as we know BB's "confidence in the devil" ended with disaster, so will his and in all these manipulations, the people of Pakistan will emerge victorious, inshallah...

#21 Posted by hamidm2

... zardari just decalared that he never accepted musharraf as a constitutional president but he wants to work with the president !!!

Ok ok I get it. You're frustrated. Ok Zardari is a characterless bastard. No surprises there. He's proved he is exactly what you say re Pakistanis. Great extrapolation hamidm!

The constittional package announced by Zardari:

1) CJ tenure reduced to three years. Meaning Iftikhar Chaudhary retires in June.

2) 58-2 (b) removed.

3) NWFP renamed as Pakhtunkhwa.

Bullshit! No one will accept this. PML-N has already rejected #3. They have their vote bank in Hazara and they don't want any stupid Pakhtunkhwa bullying. Afghania may have been a better idea. Pandering to Asfandyar is a bad idea. These people are Verkotey Angraiz - beyghairat. This same Asfandyar had made a famous speech in the coalition's banquet back in Feb after elections saying 'Beyghaiarat nahin baney gein" and then supported muttarraf.

#13 Posted by hamidm2,

Your posts are getting more and more odious with time.

Yaar, I can understand your murtid part, but why become an enemy of Pakistan?

Re: # 27


naqshbandi,

... i don't think it is just the pakis, but all moslems, respect a brutal strongman like omar ibn khattab, saddam hussein or hafiz asad ...... the problem with musharraf is that he is benign ....... i think zardari has potential - he has that evil look ......

#27 Posted by Naqshbandi on May 24, 2008 10:38:16 am


pakis respect a strongman


You have George Dubya Bush...The drones will keep you straight..

Re: # 13
The poor ex-Pakistani describes himself thus:

"do not have any character....stupid and ignorant....it is the lack of character that sets the....apart from the rest ..... unfortunately, this lack of character has become our national character and so nobody thinks it is a problem until they are personally affected by it ........"

Thanks, now live with that stagnant character while we work on improving ours.

Re: # 24

hp,

... so you are saying that the droopy eyed cj is just another untrustworty and power hungry paki without any principles ?........ and it wouldn't matter if his name was tahmed instead of chaudhary iftikhar ahmed or hamidm ...... that's what i have been saying all along - we can't be trusted ...

hamidm mian and others...
..i seriously sometimes think this democracy malarky might not suit pakistani tastes...a benign dictator would be best for our part of the world...like a hugo chavez or fidel castro...
pakis respect a strongman...or someone who at least appears as such...vaisay i am a proud paki myself so don't mind my use of the word 'paki'...of course if a non-paki --esp. and indian!--uses it all hell breaks loose but that's because we are basically indians with a chip on our shoulders...that chip coming from being rulers for so long it has become a genetic trait for some of us to act like we a nawabs even if we are beggars!
maghroor faqir haaN aseeN!

#1 Posted by zeemax on May 24, 2008 1:53:01 am


But you cannot fool all of the people all of the time


all pakis can fool themselves all the time

case in point: mushy telling pakis pakiland is ahead in space technology because pakiland rented a orbiting pile of junk..or pakis using nominal GDP numbers..

HP/Hamidm: Lets be clear: Hamidm wasnt bad mouthing political maneuvarings - rather it was the "Pakistani people". And I reminded him that we already have enough posters from India doing that, not to mention the arab/persian worshippers from Pakistan.

Politics is indeed the art of the possible. But does anyhone seriously think that it is not possible for the resurgent parliament to restore the CJ with a one-line order from the PM? Or that it is not possible to follow up on Zardari's words that Musharraf is an "illegal president" by then doing the logical thing and stop treating him like a legal president? Failing that, all this talk is mere bs, and fools no one.

hamid,
"but i still don't understand why zardari hates the droopy eyed cj so much ....."

I think I had discussed it somewhere else too. In the power circles when you say no, you are of no use. That's why mushy kicked the CJ out. But that No has made him a very popular man. That means he can say No again, if he gets another opportunity.

Reinstated with the same powers, he will control the government like he did when he was making jalebian around the poor Mush and frustrated him to no end.

I doubt that even Nawaz would accept him, if positions are switched and Nawaz takes over in place of Zardari.

No politician would allow another center of power. They fight with the existing ones. The history of Pakistan is replete with such incidences. Why BB was dismissed twice, and why Nawaz dismissed one COAS after another? They want power and fight for it. Comes naturally to the REAL politicians and not to some chaudries of Gujrat or any other Fajja mujja.

Re: # 22

hp,

... i agree with you, but i still don't understand why zardari hates the droopy eyed cj so much ..... the man is a twit and i wouldn't trust him as far as i can throw tahmed, but zardari seems to have 'forgiven' everyone else ..... he really must hate this little suo moto man !.... i don't buy the argument that he is afraid of the cj opening up the nro can of worms - i think it is something else .... what can it be?