Aitzaz’s Monumental Blunder

dost mittar: and btw, while jatts are probably a genuine tribe, these "high caste" rajputs are an artifical creation: Until the 11th-12th century, rajputs were unheard from, and then popped up in the wake of the turkic invasions that shattered the major indian empire at the time, namely the gurjara empire.

That said, it's time for me to "move up the ladder" and give them hell.....

Later, g'night

HP writes "IK has not shown that he disagrees with the establishment on most issues because he doesn’t. As he moves up the ladder he will be more responsive and susceptible to the establishment needs and will build some bridges at the right time. That is the nature of the politics.

The political structure in Pakistan requires adjustments. The army adjusted to the idea of elections, adjusted to the idea of civilian executive and agreed to the idea of Parliament making decisions. They may not be convinced but they adjusted. The politicians are adjusting too. What Aitzaz did with NS encouragement was not sellout. It was adjusting to the situation."


We disagree on this one. IK is against military overlordship, against American interference in our political economy, against dictatorship, this makes him anti-establishment in all issues that really matter. His time for "moving up" the establishment ladder has passed, and in this new Pakistan you do not need the establishment to move up the political ladder as I explained in the earlier posts, because the people have woken up.

Regarding AA, when a movement in its first show of strength proves to fizzle out to give the establishment a victory, its leadership is anthing but exemplary. As my earlier posts explained, it is too late to play the establishment "compromise" games, in all these compromise runs, the military as the dominant institution, with its American supporters always wins, hoodwinks the people and has reduced them to the state that they are in, no time or life is left in this nation for that kind of compromising any more.

As I had written on election day, these elections were a farce, part of the "compromise" pushed by the Americans on the Pakistan Army to salvage it from the harm done to it by Musharraf, now when both these parties have photocopied the Musharraf/American sponsored agenda after much fanfare and are the New Q for all intents and purposes, even succeeding in coopting the leadership of the only hope of this country, the lawyers movement (which is not only concerned with restoring the judiciary but upholding the constitution and rule of law for the people- the very basics regarding a nation state), we are shown once again that compormises just harm the people and in this new Pakistan, the people will take those that harm them to task, wait and see what these lawyers do with their sellout leader...

dost mittar #347 I consider it self-defeating of these rajasthani gujjars to seek to get ahead the easy way (affirmative action). I suspect they are not gujjars at all, but rather are cousins of sheikh rashid lota or of short-cut aziz. ;-)

These short-cut seekers would be better advised to do what my parents always taught us - there is no substitute for honest hard work and good education.

tahmed saheb:

Your community is now fighting to be classified to be the lowest caste in the weird race to the bottom being played in the quota-plagued india of today; if they win, it will be vaare-nyaare for your folks to the creamiest jobs.;)

#344 Posted by masadi
“Aitzaz was the latest casualty in the establishment war on democracy, one by one they have fallen, the only one standing is IK”

The war against the establishment does not have a dividing line. People make alliances, break them, change sides and get on the right side. The Lawyers struggle is not for revolution or for the change from one system to another.

It is revolutionary only in Pakistan’s peculiar environments where just following the law requires an effort. The Lawyers are not asking for changes in the constitution, they are asking to undo the illegal changes and follow the rules written in the constitution for hiring and firing the judges.

There is nothing revolutionary about forcing the establishment to follow the law. Revolutions require fundamental changes in the laws and the system.
Most of the leaders are with the establishment on most issues. Some differ on some issues but agree on the other.

Aitzaz is not someone who doesn’t agree with the establishment on all or most issues. He differs only on how the law is implemented and why the civilians should have control instead of the most regressive elements of the establishment- the army.

IK has not shown that he disagrees with the establishment on most issues because he doesn’t. As he moves up the ladder he will be more responsive and susceptible to the establishment needs and will build some bridges at the right time. That is the nature of the politics.

The political structure in Pakistan requires adjustments. The army adjusted to the idea of elections, adjusted to the idea of civilian executive and agreed to the idea of Parliament making decisions. They may not be convinced but they adjusted. The politicians are adjusting too. What Aitzaz did with NS encouragement was not sellout. It was adjusting to the situation.

hamid writes "and also put a chicken in abdul's pot ? "

Musharraf already took care of that. In his media appearance with select journalists he told them that if the price of daal was now higher than chicken the poor should have chicken instead, he has no problem with that. Honest to God truth, these were his very words....

HP writes " don't think Asadi got this one right.
Neither is Aitzaz a sold out nor is IK expected to do much...."

Aitzaz was the latest casualty in the establishment war on democracy, one by one they have fallen, the only one standing is IK, and I did not say that the Tahrike Insaaf will do much, I said that when this lawyer's movement understands the establishment coopting its leadership one by one, then they will flock to IK as the leader. IKs main handicap is his lack of charisma, and even though he is the people's friend he does not convey that by his persona. He takes care of these two and he can well head the people's movement to an overthrow of the establishment... Regarding hamid, the sage of the sewers calling me an "insuffrable idiot", well I got one thing crystal clear in all these manipulations to dupe the masses, IK has had the issues straight and has emerged as the cleanest supporter of the people in the new Pakistan...

Dekho dekho kaun aaya, sher aaya sher aaya.
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...for those who watch pakistani politics beyond the expatriate expertise, which is visible on this site, the by-elections should be providing an eye-opening result:

...i must say even a cynic like me, who thought that pakistan is too feudal and pir-based to independently vote in elections has changed his mind....perhaps the media has a lot to do with it....

....ppp must be shocked at the by-election results.....granted it was for a small number of seats, but it has lost seats, which historically the incumbent always wins.....and pml-n has won all the seats it was supposed to win, plus a few more......

consider the following:

-ppp and pml-n decided, early on not to compete against each other.....so multan (an area in punjab, where ppp has a hold) can be considered a good benchmark for ppp's popularity (or growing unpopularity).....

....the current pm - gilani - is from multan.....the no. 2 guy in his personal ppp group - shah mehmood - is from multan and is the foreign minister.....both are from big pir families...

.....shah mahmood's brother contested from multan from mahmood's traditional seat......the pm went to his constituency and made a huge donation and made a speech....pml-n did not contest against mahmood's brother....

however, the results are coming in, and mahmood's brother is losing to an independent candidate.....imagine......the pm's backed candidate, who is the brother of the foreign minister is losing from a traditional family ppp seat.....even though pml-n did not compete against him......to an independent candidate......

ppp is losing in other areas also........if pml-n had gone head to head against ppp, in these by-elections, ppp would have lost everything.....

i think ppp has already lost punjab to pml-n......i think even the pm - gilani - and mahmood - prime minister - would lose to pml-n in multan today, if elections were held......

further to #340: and hamidm, at least Naek gets paid to be a sleazy lawyer. you provide this service pro bono to all those involved in trying to enslave pakistanis.

dost mittar: i did not forget what you had mentioned. i was merely stretching your point about some hindu man coming to michigan while hamidm was the drill master on some parade ground a bit further from the parade ground to latrine duty.

btw, talking of the caste system: what about us lowly gujjars? doomed to be humble herdsmen in hindu society. i hope you are glad my ancestors got smart and said goodbye to the brahmins.

hamidm #337 you are now being like musharraf and zardari's lawyers - pointing to supposed lapses in procedure and places where the i's are not dotted and t's not crossed, while ignoring the substance. The substance is that had it not been for PMLN, would zardari have bothered to even have a Bhurban declaration? Would zardari even bothered to have played these funny tricks to prevent himself from joining musharraf in the slammer where the two belong?

I would be much obliged for a non-Naekesque response to this.

tahmed32#335:

You forget what I had said earlier that muslim converts in punjab are mostly high caste rajputs and jatts. They were the first converts and made sure that no neech-zaat would be allowed to enter their biradri.

hamidm2,

I noticed you're back and jumping up and down like monkeys over the Finance Bill. Is that it?

It means nothing. It only means PML-N didn't want to fight over this silly thing which can be revoked or changed at any time or the allocation granted through this re-allocated to something else by the Finance Minister. Did you know that?

So they just abstained from the vote. Conceded nothing. And also let me tell you now - if the judges are not restored by end July, NS has decided to leave the coalition, and the PPP Government will fall. Save this post somewhere.

Re: # 333

tahmed,

do you really believe nawaz sharif is supporting democracy and the rule of law ??? .... i guess you haven't been wathching his henchman dither, slide, lie and backtrack on the talk shows ........ how is he supporting democracy by signing up to create the world's largest supreme court that includes the pco judges, then turning around and 'not supporting' the pco judges, but then allowing the government to enter a plea in the pco supreme court to allow him to run in the elections ? ... he is just another paki .......

did i say granduncle? i meant great-great-great-grandfather.