Muslims in America

Indians need not look to these statistics with pride. US and west is on down turn. Indians should create Bell Labs here in Jhumritalaya. We have history of building Nalandas and Taxilas. Newer generations from IITs and IIMs are not any more attracted to the green card. I had a news link (dna) in one of my posts.

We need to build IITs for social sciences and humanities so that we could employ scholars such as Masadi Sahab without asking him to convert to Inidan religion. We should get rid of ghettoes of India haters, such as JNU, St. Stephens, Xaviers, Loyalas and Deoband.

The point is Netravally does not need to convert to Christianity or take American name to head Bell Labs or be in management. Same is true about many Indians who had successes in US in other fields.

Lucent China having Bell Labs now the % of Indians might be less as payrole employee. Anyway it's now Alchatel for last 3 years.

It's not forwarded email statistics coming from Nigeria. What can you guess about me?

I have a friend who works in Bell labs. I can check it out.

Generally, I'm skeptical of all the forwarded emails which claim that such and such company has X% Indians. It is mostly not true.

Core Research at Bell Labs was conducted in Murray Hill, some in Holmdell. If you include contractor/consultants even in developmentthe Indians might be higher than 30%

Masa,

"I think this statistic is BS. Do you believe this?. "

The figures were true by 98-99. Check genesis of Juniper. Before Bell Labs split in Lucent & AT&T Labs in 96 the % might be less. bUt major chunk went to Lucent and there Indian population in core research and not development might be 60% around Y2K.

Are you techy?

World is smaller, thanks to communication technology and progress in aviation. 30% employees of Bell Labs are Indians. More than 50% of telecom and internet related start ups in silicon valley were started by Indians. NASA is 20% Indian.

truth,

I think this statistic is BS. Do you believe this?.

Good questions on the names of Muslims. Islam looks like arab worship in disguise, makes everyone pray towards arabia, adopt arab names and culture. Arabs would be laughing at the craziness of these folks. Anyhow I should appreciate the arab Muhammad. He is a smart guy.

Tahir,

"We Muslims say 'ji sarkar' to God, not to expolitive man-made systems. Look around and see what capitalism and communism have givem us!"

Hold a mirror in front all the Muslim states from Turkey to Indonesia, do you see whom they are saying Jee Sarkar. Since most of Koran and Hadith is about War Craft and political power, in Muslim faithful mind, political power and violence to achieve it is deeply rooted.

"Why not sob and cry about invaders before Muslims came along?"

Who were they. Aryan Invasion Theory is a myth created by Britishers, since they could not accept the origin of number system, math and claculus in India, evolved spiritual thought and even the grammar of Sanskrit being the foundation of grammar of Latin.

Tahir can you please stick to the points under discussion.

Faith, weird faith out of false humbleness is devilish because it first denies presence of devine within oneself, presence of divine in one's own intellect and the actions taken using that intellect. There is Indian word Vichar, which needs to be given first importance over Vishwas. Vishwas is needed for not inventing the wheel again. But first Vichar has to come. Vichar makes one search within. Weird Vishwas makes one search outside within a book, guru, peer or prophet. Vichar is action based...actions togo deeper within oneself. Vichar will lead to Vivek, an action which is for common good.

Re: # 206 Un-Truth

"Did the process of Islamization of non Arab lands/civilization caused this subservient "Ji Sarkar" populace?"

We Muslims say 'ji sarkar' to God, not to expolitive man-made systems. Look around and see what capitalism and communism have givem us!

"Since Islam tries to capture first political power, then dhimmifies large % of populace before gradual conversion to Islam, this population can be manuevered easily."

You're dead wrong; you've chosen Laddu's perspective. Why not sob and cry about invaders before Muslims came along?

"Faith needs to be redefined other wise in its present form it's fatal for the civilization."

This is God's Word for the entire mankind and eternal too! Man-made systems change, not God's!

"walking into future. You can walk ahead if you know where you are at present."

Go ahead, we'll help you when you fall.

"This weird faith in religius dogma, esp Islam keeps one always backword looking, fixeted one personalities and tribal socities."

As if other religions don't have fairy-tales built-in! If you're a devoted Hindu, you ought to know better.

"This faith is very gross, materialistic in its own way and deadly to oneself, ie one is not even a thinking human."

It appears you've missed the finer points of your 'dharam'. There's a description of such folks: hatt dharam!

Understand before its too late; don't abuse Islam.

Masadi Sahab,

Sorry, if I hurt your feelings. Generally religion, sex and money (RSM) are avoided in discussion. It's little easy to talk about Benezir, Britany, Birla and Bhangra. But for mst of us, yours truly included, RSM occupies big chunk our mind almost defining our identity.

First, it is not Islam that "captures" political power, the fools do that in the name of Islam,

Who are those fools? Are they non-Islamic? To capture political power "the fools (TF)" need faith enhancing pirs, courtier writers and King-Nama creating historians and foot soldiers and dhimmi tax (Ziziya) paying financier and Jakat (tax) and Chanda paying believers, as per my understanding. Please correct me.


second the ability to colonize the life world was perfected by the capitalists of today and not by the Muslims of the Middle Ages who even when they got political power did not by fact or defintion get rid of the alternative identities that coexisted, at the time of partition the Hindus outnumbered the Muslims of India, and did not consider themselves subservient to them,


Let us leave capitalist of today aside for time being. Hope we are not playing blame game. Do you mean Aurangzeb did not happen? Shahajan was equally brutal as Aurangzeb. Large populace was allowed to practice Hindu religion for political exigencies, tactical reason and for generating revenue as Jiziya. It was not because of any altruistic or attitude of "celebrating diversity."


unlike the European settlers who wiped out wholesale the very existance of the indigeneous folk, the fact regardless of your bigotry against Islam (contrived and full of BS)


Granted they might have done to Americas but did not or could not do it in Asia. But why bring them into picture. We are focused on Islam. I would like you to hold my own mirror in front of me, not show my image you see in your camera. All of us tend to have tented lenses when we focus our camera on others.


is that never before in the history of the world have so many of such diverse cultures been enslaved by externally defined sense of worth and self, as in today's America-led world. The world today is much smaller than it ever was in the past, which has ensured that the means to define and process reality in the hands of the elite are much greater and the feat much simpler.


Compared to Muslim period, in present so called American period there is more celebration of Indian culture, spiritual practices and art all over the world not just in India. More Indians are doing Yog, Meditation and chanting compared to Muslim period. More Indians are Garv Se Kaho Hum Hindu Hain. World is smaller, thanks to communication technology and progress in aviation. 30% employees of Bell Labs are Indians. More than 50% of telecom and internet related start ups in silicon valley were started by Indians. NASA is 20% Indian. While achieving these successes Indians do not need to profess new religion or disown their culture and identity. Compare that to Rajputs of medieval India. Aren't majority of them Muslims with Arabic first and lat names? Can these Rajputs talk there Rajasthani or Marwari language? Trace the progeny of Raja ManSingh.



Islam has never had problems of identity and worth based on label, Muslims have invented their preceived superiority just as people of other faiths have; the sense of worth Islam defines is based on character and act and not on some label or belonging with a group, in fact it busts xenophobia and ethnocentricity by declaring that all are equal creations of their one God who because of how they act and what they do either stunt their growth or reach higher levels of development.

Would you be able to call yourself from today onwards as Mandar Lahorkar? A Jain or Boudha can be Mittal, Agrawal, Chougule, Shinde or Singh and be devout Jain or Boudha. Even Indian devout Christians have names such as Rev. Arjun Krishnan. How about Muslims? I have not seen a Indian Muslim with their native language names. Look at even Bangladeshis who separated from west Pakistan because of the pride in their language but you won't find a Bangladeshi Muslim with names such as Nirankar Dhakkakar. The new converts to Islam first lose their individual identity.


Now I know you Hindu bigots are obsessed with Islam, but only a fool would learn from your perversion of history and your ignorance of the Quran what it is about, so refrain from constructing strawmen where you define what your miserable understanding of Islam


For the survival of true Islam you need to get obsessed to save spiritual part of Islam and throw away imperialistic and cultural linguistic enslavement part of Islam.

Masadi Sahab,



Sorry, if I hurt your feelings. Generally religion, sex and money (RSM) are
avoided in discussion. It's little easy to talk about Benezir, Britany, Birla
and Bhangra. But for mst of us, yours truly included, RSM occupies big chunk our
mind almost defining our identity.

First, it is not Islam that "captures" political power, the fools do that
in the name of Islam,

Who are those fools?  Are they non-Islamic?  To capture political
power "the fools (TF)"  need faith enhancing pirs, courtier writers and
King-Nama creating historians and foot soldiers and dhimmi tax (Ziziya) paying
financier and Jakat (tax) and Chanda  paying believers, as per my
understanding.  Please correct me.

second the ability to colonize the life world was perfected by the
capitalists of today and not by the Muslims of the Middle Ages who even when
they got political power did not by fact or defintion get rid of the alternative
identities that coexisted, at the time of partition the Hindus outnumbered the
Muslims of India, and did not consider themselves subservient to them,

Let us leave capitalist of today aside for time being.  Hope we are not
playing blame game.  Do you mean Aurangzeb did not happen?  Shahajan
was equally brutal as Aurangzeb.  Large populace was allowed to practice
Hindu religion for political exigencies, tactical reason and for generating
revenue as Jiziya.  It was not because of any altruistic or attitude of
"celebrating diversity."

unlike the European settlers who wiped out wholesale the very existance of
the indigeneous folk, the fact regardless of your bigotry against Islam
(contrived and full of BS)

Granted they might have done to Americas but did not or could not do it in
Asia.  But why bring them into picture.  We are focused on Islam. 
I would like you to hold my own mirror in front of me, not show my image you see
in your camera.  All of us tend to have tented lenses when we focus our
camera on others.

is that never before in the history of the world have so many of
such diverse cultures been enslaved by externally defined sense of worth and
self, as in today's America-led world. The world today is much smaller than it
ever was in the past, which has ensured that the means to define and process
reality in the hands of the elite are much greater and the feat much simpler.


Compared to Muslim period in this so called American period there is more
celebration of Indian culture, spiritual practices and art all over the world
not just in India.  More Indians are doing Yog, Meditation and chanting
compared to Muslim period.  More Indians are Garv Se Kaho Hum Hindu Hain. 
World is smaller, thanks to communication technology and progress in aviation. 
30% employees of Bell Labs are Indians.  More than 50% of telecom and
internet related start ups in silicon valley were started by Indians.  NASA
is 20% Indian.  While achieving these successes Indians do not need to
profess new religion or disown their culture and identity.  Compare that to
Rajputs of medieval India.  Aren't majority of them Muslims with Arabic
first and lat names?  Can these Rajputs talk there Rajasthani or Marwari
language?  Trace the progeny of Raja ManSingh.



Islam has never had problems of identity and worth based on label, Muslims
have invented their preceived superiority just as people of other faiths have;
the sense of worth Islam defines is based on character and act and not on some
label or belonging with a group, in fact it busts xenophobia and ethnocentricity
by declaring that all are equal creations of their one God who because of how
they act and what they do either stunt their growth or reach higher levels of
development.

Would you be able to call yourself from today onwards as Mandar Lahorkar? 
A Jain or Boudha can be Mittal, Agrawal, Chougule, Shinde or Singh and be devout
Jain or Boudha.  Even  Indian devout Christians have names such as
Rev. Arjun Krishnan.  How about Muslims?  I have not seen a Indian
Muslim with their native language names.  Look at even Bangladeshis who
separated from west Pakistan because of the pride in their language but you
won't find a Bangladeshi Muslim with names such as Nirankar Dhakkakar.  The
new converts to Islam first lose their individual identity.  

Now I know you Hindu bigots are obsessed with Islam, but only a fool would
learn from your perversion of history and your ignorance of the Quran what it is
about, so refrain from constructing strawmen where you define what your
miserable understanding of Islam

For the survival of true Islam you need to get obsessed to save spiritual
part of Islam and throw away imperialistic and cultural linguistic enslavement
part of Islam.

Re: # 205 Dost

What part of the message do you NOT understand? May I help?

Urdu translations are not my favourite as they weave in too much of 'ahadith' literature and sub-continental fairy-tales!

Anyway, I'm glad you did try! Many here haven't even seen the Qur'an, leave alone read it!

Regards.

Truth writes "Since Islam tries to capture first political power, then dhimmifies large % of populace before gradual conversion to Islam, this population of new converts acquires this skill of internalizing externally imposed identities, and later the elite have it easy in manuevering/fooling this populace."

First, it is not Islam that "captures" political power, the fools do that in the name of Islam, second the ability to colonize the life world was perfected by the capitalists of today and not by the Muslims of the Middle Ages who even when they got political power did not by fact or defintion get rid of the alternative identities that coexisted, at the time of partition the Hindus outnumbered the Muslims of India, and did not consider themselves subservient to them, unlike the European settlers who wiped out wholesale the very existance of the indigeneous folk, the fact regardless of your bigotry against Islam (contrived and full of BS) is that never before in the history of the world have so many of such diverse cultures been enslaved by externally defined sense of worth and self, as in today's America-led world. The world today is much smaller than it ever was in the past, which has ensured that the means to define and process reality in the hands of the elite are much greater and the feat much simpler.

Islam has never had problems of identity and worth based on label, Muslims have invented their preceived superiority just as people of other faiths have; the sense of worth Islam defines is based on character and act and not on some label or belonging with a group, in fact it busts xenophobia and ethnocentricity by declaring that all are equal creations of their one God who because of how they act and what they do either stunt their growth or reach higher levels of development. Now I know you Hindu bigots are obsessed with Islam, but only a fool would learn from your perversion of history and your ignorance of the Quran what it is about, so refrain from constructing strawmen where you define what your miserable understanding of Islam is (based on the racist perversions by people like Ali Sina the charlatan) and then attack that miserable understanding, that was contrived and full of BS to begin with....


Tahmed writes "masadi the hypocrite and liar, and may you never have to suffer the miseries you wish upon me. And may you get the mental treatment you badly need (I am giving you a pass on your hateful posts as being the result of insanity..."

As usual you don't possess the brains or the b@lls to respond to what I wrote, and complain about insults while your own post is nothing but insults, and talk about my insanity when I say that human life should be protected and not destroyed as those insane people you worship are doing. May Allah damn your kind of fools and relegate them to the lowest dregs of hell as he has promised in his book....

Reply to # 69 by Yasser Latif Hamdani

Dear Yasser , now you are denouncing your faith and it is such a shame for an Ahmadi like me that Ahmadies always lie about their faith and their commitment to Pakistan.

I am witness to this fact that most of the Ahmadies who take part in internet discussions pretend that they are no more Ahmadies.

Most of the Ahmadies have fake hindu IDs and they are dreaming that Pakistan and India will destroy each other one day.

As fifth columnists Ahmadies are trying their best to provoke West about threats of Mullahization,where as our Jamaat has opened huge new factories ( Jamia Ahmadiyyas ) of Ahmadi Mullahs in Rabwah and Europe.

There are reports that some Ahmadi agent women entered Jamia Hafsa and some Ahmadies entered circles of crazy Musharraf.

They provoked both parties in such a way , which ended up in that never ending vicious cycle of blood shed and which polarized Pakistani society.

I am also witness to such techniques of Jamaat Ahmadiyya when they were sending highly trained spies to the Jalsas of Khatme nubuwat in Chiniot ( River Chenab ).

Those Ahmadi spies were pretending to be pious Sunni mullahs , they were praying and eating with Sunnis and they were causing drifts, divisions and fears among Sunni Mullahs.

We never know which Sunni mullah is a hidden Ahmadi and we never know who is on the payroll of Jammat Ahmadiyya.

Ahmadi agents are every where and Ahmadiyya money is working every where.

masadi the hypocrite and liar, and may you never have to suffer the miseries you wish upon me. And may you get the mental treatment you badly need (I am giving you a pass on your hateful posts as being the result of insanity).

(i have briefly glimpsed a couple of the unsolicited posts you have written to or about me, and see it is more of the usual abuse).