Anti-Americanism in Pakistan and the Taliban Menace

Re: # 24

supersize,

.... you sound like one of those crazy immigrant women in nadeem aslam's "map for lost lovers" ....... you still seem to be living in morbid fear of being adopted by white people who will make you eat pork, drink alcohol and not wash your butt after you go to the bathroom ....... trust me, toilet paper will not kill you ..... you need to have your djinns exorcised by a mullah from multan ......

“The recent killing of eleven Pakistani soldiers at Gora Prai by American and NATO forces across the border in Afghanistan unleashed an amazing storm[…] But had the killers been the Taliban, this would have been a non-event.�

This is just ridiculous! Dr. Hoodbhoy has been writing about political issues long enough to know the simple thing that any attack by a foreign force is always condemned, whereas an attack by internal fighters would not get the same attention. Despite the hue and cry in the newspapers, Pakistani foreign office had a hard time to get the US ambassador in the foreign Secretary’s office to lodge the complaint. The idiot FM Qureshi ran away. The Pak ambassador in DC wasn’t even prepared to condemn the whole thing. Expecting these people to protect the national interests, is little too much. The Pak army has taken on the role of Mir Jaffar. Dr. Hoodbhoy wants people to look at the menacing Taliban but the Taliban are in a small part of Pakistan. What people see daily is a parade of some of the most insipid characters leading the country. The President defies resentment and to stay in the office he begs the US to make some phone calls on his behalf.

Common folks don’t see the finer points that Dr. Hoodbhoy is advocating. They see what is in front of their eyes. When they see a government, an army, and a President mooning the whole country for their petty interests, even criminals fighting the traitors in power, become heroes.

The Indian History would bear me out. Not only the Indian, but Dr. Hoodbhoy can learn this lesson from the world history. The Thugs in India became part of the folk lore because people perceived them to be defying the state by their criminal activities. In South America many criminal gangs became the anti establishment heroes. We are watching the same phenomenon in Pakistan. People don’t support the Taliban, they support the defiance, and they support any action that is against the criminals controlling the state.

A minor incident like the PMLn support of 29 judges in a petty finance bill brought the public condemnation and the PMLn scrambled to control the damage. When the public sentiments against the establishment reach the level that it is now in Pakistan, anyone defying the state with arms would be become a hero.

A thoroughly foreign financed politician Nawaz has tapped on the same sentiments. He has become the official opposition because at this time the establishment can only trust its own to lead the opposition and control the resentment. While Zardari is helping the establishment now, Nawaz would take over this mantle after him. The Lawyers movement was getting out of hands but that too is now controlled. Pakistan’s epic battle is not with Taliban, it is with the establishment or the army, and instead of accepting defeat the army would balkanize the country. That is the danger. Taliban and Islamists are a bunch of petty criminals and people are beginning to figure that out too.

Re: # 25

Zeemax thinks this is an excellent summation, he has his reasons, I see this as a deliberately crafted disinformation.

Posts such as these are designed to instigate action, action that will invite nothing but trouble for the poor masses of Pakistan, hasten the avoidable, provide the necessary groundwork for the ultimate catastrophe, decimation and then balkanization of Pakistan.

Globalization does not permit troubled states, particularly those with Nukes and crazies, there is much at stake here and benefactors of Pakistan are getting impatient.

replying #32,

Eklawya,

You said:
[Speaking of minorities, SupersizeMe, ignoring all advese propaganda, Islamic system provides among the best environments for them (not sure which would be better).
If you feel apologetic, you should compare minorities in Pakistan, with say, minorities in India.]

Do you want to live in some Islamic land and check what growth opportunities and freedom you will get as a hindu without converting. Or may be check what you get after converting?

What else you need in India? You shuold live in Saudi Arabia and pay Jijia tax, or you should live in Pakistan and should get to know their muslim caste hierarchy and where you as hindu minority will be counted.

Who is in minority in India and what do they not get?

What the hell is this "disaffection and alienation", who is getting affection in India? In Pakistan nobody even used to count if remaning hindus were killed or raped, at least in India somebody counts them to some extent.

As per Islam there are no rights of minorities, all they can deserve is killing or slavery or if it helps Islam then probably living as second rated citizens. In India you can at least show your resentment openly, you can fight whatever way you want, in Islamic countries all you can do is suffer in silence.

#32 Eklavya

[Speaking of minorities, SupersizeMe, ignoring all advese propaganda, Islamic system provides among the best environments for them (not sure which would be better).
If you feel apologetic, you should compare minorities in Pakistan, with say, minorities in India.]

This is why I say that a lot of times, instead of using a clever choice of words to get your point across, you are actually being two-faced.

So tell me, WHY do you think that minorities are better treated in Pakiland as compared to India.

he means to say, there are actually minorities in India of note. not a random traffic cop sardar...actually never mind..he is not a traffic cop no longer :)

Re: # 37

ajeya,

..... eklavya is a true hindoo nationalist who wants the pakistani people to destroy themselves - that is why he is always encouraging the lunatic fringe of the crazy paki society .... he is like the man who stands on the street encouraging the suicidal fool to jump ......i wouldn't be surprised if he was on thackery's payroll .....

#38 chaltahai

[he means to say, there are actually minorities in India of note. not a random traffic cop sardar...actually never mind..he is not a traffic cop no longer :) ]

I realize that he is possibly being sarcastic. but my point was that sarcasm is only effective when people get it. If they don't, then what you are saying is being construed as the literal truth - and has the same effect as if you are NOT being sarcastic.

So therefore, he is assisting in propagating a lie. No matter what his motivation might be. He should be smart enough to realize this.

#39 hamidm2

[..... eklavya is a true hindoo nationalist who wants the pakistani people to destroy themselves - that is why he is always encouraging the lunatic fringe of the crazy paki society .... he is like the man who stands on the street encouraging the suicidal fool to jump ......i wouldn't be surprised if he was on thackery's payroll ..... ]

hamidm,

The fringe might be lunatic, but the rest of the society, while not lunatic, is infected with Islam, and acts as the breeders of future lunatics that keep popping up here and there from WITHIN the non-lunatic mainstream.

Therein lies the problem.

Over the centuries some Muslims have struggled to get out of the "system". Maybe Ahmediism is a way out. Or that Persian Bahai thing. While all are equally idiotic, at least these are less violent, and less dangerous alternatives.

Re: # 39

hamid is right... pakis should be careful about a hanood saying sweet words... Kaal is the ultimate hanood, he has a knife hidden in his armpit... :)

yaar I don't know, why you guys even take the fool seriously. I summed him up in #29. he is a clown

Re: # 41

ajeya,

.... i agree with you - the whole lot is crazy but the lunatic fringe is ready to blow - it is one dynamite stick short of a suicide belt ...... and your friend eklavya is ready with the match stick to light the fuse ..... he is a true indian patriot

Re: # 43

kaal, the clown, does have an "interesting" view point... his unabashed support and sympathy towards islamism and other such bedouin voodoo ideology is kind of unique...

islamists do take him seriously - and that may not be a bad thing... like hamid pointed out, islamists are all geared up to self-destruct and kaal is just egging them on... Not a bad thing at all...

HP #34 "Taliban and Islamists are a bunch of petty criminals and people are beginning to figure that out too. "

True. Bush and co. never figured thism out too - as the British PM Brown pointed out when he said the response to 9/11 should have been a simple anti-crime action, rather than inflating it into a "War on Terror".

Thus, today the Nation has this revealing story:

Pak-Nato joint action on Afghan border

KHOST (Agencies) - NATO and US troops killed dozens of militants on the Afghanistan-Pakistan border, officials said Tuesday, after the foreign forces suffered their deadliest month since the fall of the Taliban.

US-led helicopters and bombers killed 33 insurgents in eastern Khost province late Monday, while NATO soldiers in the same area cooperated with Pakistani troops across the frontier to kill several more rebels, they said.
..ISAF, co-ordinating with the Pakistan military, responded with air strikes, artillery and rocket fire, causing the militants to flee into Pakistan, it said....

Meanwhile, four persons were killed during a shootout between two rival groups ..to settle a goats’ theft clash.


So: here we have 21st Century NATO forces with all their technical sophistication fighting..guys who are still fighting one another over goats!!

pandit hamidm: ommm.....shanti....what irrationalities are we airing today?

tahmed buddy, how is that democracy thing coming in pakistan? I recall you were jumping all around celebrating like a little bangladeshi on a camel....how this time its different? who are you supporting now? the camel I hope!!