Living Gandhi and King Today: Unbroken Historic Continuity

Yeah Usmani was so insignificant he led Jinnah's funeral prayers by Jinnah's own request.

No we mean Jamiat e ulema hind was pro congress, pro kkk, pro bacha khan, part of the Congress government ...and today its present form JUI-F is led by Mufti Mahmood's son fazlur rahman who is held to be the father of the taliban.

We are talking of JUI NWFP for which Khidmatgars are being held responsible. Which other JUI was there? The JUI faction in Karachi was the one supported by the immigrants to Pakistan from UP. Was the Karachi JUI pro-Congress?

Muthu,

MKG's comments on caste (in 1922 when he was a 53 year old) can hardly be called modernist.

Regards

I can't believe that sadna is wasting time when she knows that we were talking of Jamiat e ulema Hind (present day jamiat e ulema islam fazloo group) and not Usmani's breakaway JUI.

Oh, you mean JUI was pro-Pakistan anti-Congress anti-Khidmatgar in NWFP till 1947. In 1947 Usmani was asked by Jinnah to raise the Pakistan flag for the first time. Then after that Usmani remained alive two more years but JUI became pro-Congress and purged all its pro-Pakistan members. Is that your story now?

All I am saying is that he promoted a anti-modernist religious attitude into national politics (which was hitherto dominated by moderate secularists like GKG and MAJ) which has mutated today into Taliban, SIMI and BD.


I think that anti-modernist religious attitude was restricted to Islam. He was much modern in regards to reforms in Hinduism. I think it is acceptable, because as a dhimmi he can't influence much anyways.

Sadna/YLH,

So do we finally agree now on the following:

That Mufti Mehmood was a INC ally till 1947.
That Mufti Mehmood was Fazloo's father.
That Fazloo was Taliban's founder.

Regards

I can't believe sadna's entire argument is based on a deliberate confusion of the names.

Atleast she has now admitted that Mufti Mahmood was a Congress ally till the end.

Muthu,

somehow this looks like a weak reason for any kind of hatred against Gandhi.

MKG appointed Jwahirullah as India's PM and he went on to **** Indians/Hindoos royally and you think that is a weak reason to hate MKG?

I don't think being a 'dhimmi' is that bad, especially given the circumstances that Gandhi was in prior to partition.

What were these circumstances pre-Partition which made dhimmitude desirable?

I agree that it has spread a wrong message of "dhimmitude".

Thanks for agreeing on this at least.

Regards

Sadna...

Electorally the Jamiat e ulema hind was part of Dr khan sb's government in NWFP...

Additionally Maulana Azad had been elected on a JUH ticket from NWFP ironically in 1945 elections ...

We are talking about this group which was led by Mufti Mahmood and which is called JUI-F today.

Just admit that you lied and got caught as usual.

Sadna,

I cant answer about YLH but for myself I have never held KKs responsible for Taliboon. I am not saying that the fedayeens read verses from "My Experiments..." before blowing themselves up or that MKG had a fling with Baitullah Mehsud's grandma. All I am saying is that he promoted a anti-modernist religious attitude into national politics (which was hitherto dominated by moderate secularists like GKG and MAJ) which has mutated today into Taliban, SIMI and BD. And Frontier Congress and its allies JUH did encourage Fakkir of Ippi types.

Regards

Sadna,

The present day JUI-F is JUH of Mufti Mahmood... Not the JUI breakaway faction you are talking about ...

Was Mufti Mahmood not a Congress ally? He was. His son is the father of the taliban.

Why are you going in circles? Why aren't you answering the question?

No one is holding KK responsible for JUI of shabbir ahmed usmani. we are talking about Jamiat e ulema hind of Mufti mahmood which is the jamiat e ulema islam fazl group today.

That incidentally is one of my main grouse against him and his appointee as PM, Jwahirullah imprinted dhimmitude on the whole country

Ok. somehow this looks like a weak reason for any kind of hatred against Gandhi.

I don't think being a 'dhimmi' is that bad, especially given the circumstances that Gandhi was in prior to partition.

I agree that it has spread a wrong message of "dhimmitude".

majumdar
Why worry about finding more facts of history to ignore or selectively 'de-emphasize' when you are only trying to construct a mythology? Fazlur Rehman's father might have been a hold out till 1947, but the JUI in NWFP had a tradition of British collaboration against Khidmatgars. Khidmatgars went to jail immediately after independence. Fazlur Rehman's father went on to form NWFP's government, correct me if I am wrong. Why were Khidmatgars responsible for Fazlur Rehman's dad when they were themselves banned and in jail?

How could Khidmatgars be responsible for JUI in NWFP when JUI in NWFP was paid for the entire length of the war to preach support for the British and Muslim League and ALSO preach in favor of Pakistan in NWFP as early as in 1942 and oppose the Congress/Khidmatgars?

Then suddenly in 1947 JUI in NWFP turned traitor to Pakistan and Khidmatgars became responsible for JUI?

And pls. note Khidmatgars were not allowed by the British to enter the tribal agencies, only mullahs paid by Cunningham(AND LISTED IN HIS DIARY) were allowed to enter the tribal agencies. Yet KHIDMATGARS are held responsible for the situation in tribal agencies.