Living Gandhi and King Today: Unbroken Historic Continuity

There you slip away again Majumdar bhai! Nevertheless, Happy Dusshera to you too!

Yeah so Mufti was the only extremist in JUI NWFP and the pro-ML pro-British JUI and other mullahs who were paid to propagate Pakistan and anti-Khidmatgar propaganda were secular moderate people. I see.

Guys,

I am off, happy Dushera/Vijay Dashmi to all of you in advance. Sadna, YLH it was nice to see you guys slug it out just like the good old days.

Regards

#252 by majumdar

He believed in something very noble but untrue (Hindoo-Muslim Unity) and saw the light too late. MKG believed in something very ignoble.

Majumdar bhai, now you're trying to spin this into something very different. I'm not arguing on the merits (or the lack of it) of their beliefs. Just tell me why is it okay when Jinnah "realizes the truth" when he was more than 70 and Gandhi not allowed the same when he was much younger?

No sadna ... Our contention is that JUI-F of today is the historic JUH of NWFP of which Azad was national president and elected representative.

The rest is your twisting and turning and nothing else.

Majumdar,

Even Adam Khan admits that Mufti Mahmood was a staunch Congress ally.

JUH elected Azad to the constituent assembly from NWFP

corr: I dunno about the Congress(which was not allowed in tribal areas) but Cunningham certainly tried to bribe Fakir of Ipi.

Yaar Masanamuthu, both Yasser and Majumdar bhai are being disingenuous by claiming Gandhi was a casteist all his life. I sent Majumdar bhai a link to a web page in which was documented Gandhi's evolving views on the caste system and by the end of his life, he had even lived the life of a Harijan by cleaning his own toilet, something I'm not sure many of the highly enlightened folks would do even today. Obviously, he didn't read it because if he did, he wouldn't repeat the same old falsities time and again.

majumdar
Everyone tried to bribe Fakir of Ipi, the British and ML too. Cunningham certainly tried.

Mantolives
Your assertion that the pro-British anti-Khidmatgar JUI in NWFP went out of existence in 1947 is just your assertion, nothing more.

Your implication that the pro-British anti-Khidmatgar JUI in NWFP which you assert went out of existence in 1947, was moderate/secular unlike JUH, is just your implication, nothing more.

Harishbhai,

He believed in something very noble but untrue (Hindoo-Muslim Unity) and saw the light too late. MKG believed in something very ignoble.

Regards

Sadna,

I think YLH has already said that JUI was not a KK creation but a minor pro-ML Deobandi outfit.

As far as KKs being not allowed into tribal areas is considered, it maybe true (although I am not an expert at NWFP history and geography) but Frontier Congress did support militants like Fakir of Ippi didnt it? These were the forerunners of todays Baitullahs. You can correct me if I am wrong on this.

Same ways, you can clarify on whether Mufti Mehmood remained a Cong ally till almost the very end and on whether his son cannot be considered the father of Taliban.

Regards

#227 by majumdar

MKG's comments on caste (in 1922 when he was a 53 year old) can hardly be called modernist.

There you go again Majumdar bhai! How old was Jinnah when he engineered the Partition? Last night you offered the lame excuse that Jinnah tried to be the "best ambassador" and all that and once he realized the truth, he chose to break India into two. If Jinnah is allowed to "realize the truth" when he was almost 70, why can't Gandhi be allowed that liberty?

When I asked you this, you disappeared and here you are today, offering the same excuses to absolve Jinnah of all blame. Sigh!

Sadna,

So are you denying that Mufti Mahmood was part of Azad led Jamiat e ulema Hind in 1947?

Those preaching hatred against the Americans and those responsible for the taliban are from Azad led JUH.

The "JUI" you are talking about is no where today ... The JUI-F is the historical JUH.

corr: You need to show some facts for example that the JUI which operated at say so of the British and Muslim League in NWFP had a moderate/secular ideology without Mufti and only when Mufti/JUH joined the NWFP JUI, only then NWFP JUI became extremist.

majumdar

I showed that until 1947 JUI in NWFP was in the pay of the British governor helping him with pro-Pakistan pro-Muslim League and anti-Congress/Khidmatgar propaganda. Also that the Khidmatgars were not allowed into the tribal areas only British-paid mullahs were. Neither of you even acknowledged this or the fact that Khidmatgars were not responsible for the JUI in NWFP, the British and ML were.

I have also seen no evidence from you that Mufti was not part of the JUI Usmani faction which broke off and supported Pakistan in 1945. You need to some facts for example that the JUI which operated at say so of the British and Muslim League in NWFP had a moderate/secular ideology without Mufti and only when Mufti/JUH joined the NWFP JUI, only then NWFP JUI became extremist.

Is Mantolives in fact saying that JUI preaching enmity against Hindus and Khidmatgars(as JUI did at ML and British say so before 1947 in NWFP) was secular moderation but preaching enmity against Americans(as the Taliban does) is extremist?