The Psyche of Al-Qaeda

Re: # 109
dear khurram...thank you for answering my questions. your answers helped me understand your position better. i have to go now to write my other article
a black man in the white house
for another website
but before i go i want to thank you for engaging in a meaningful and dynamic dialogue. i wish you were in town and i could invite you for a cup of tea (or a drink) and learn more from your brilliant mind. it is like an olympics computer that records 1 / 100 of a second. you are gifted. we might disagree but that does not stop me from appreciating your gift.
i also want to thank pinky and kal chaakra for their inspiration...sincerely sohail

Re: #102 muradbaig,

Your founder/culture distincion seems rather arbitrary. Isn't the founder part of culture too? Eid and Ramzan may have been pre-Islamic customs, but they were practiced and preached by the founder.
And how does this apply to Hinduism? Does it even have a founder?

The last comment was for drsohail #110

Re: #108
"al-qaeda is a state of mind of all those militant muslims who
...have a religious ideology of dominating the whole world
...have a religious personality that their truth is THE TRUTH, the holy truth that they want to impose on others"

Your article has not even made this case!

#108 Posted by tahmed32 on
[[
Once we get this clear, we can get back to the subject - what is the psyche of a hoodlum. What childhood influences did he go through in saudi arabia that caused him to grow up to be a decoit.
]]

Your second statement gives a hint, but their group is much larger abd bigger than dacoits, and much better organized.
Psyche of al-qaida, if it was an individul, could not have been such an important issue.
What gives room for such individul "psyche" to fit in or become a large group psychology that works in an organized way? And for what do they work, what it the objective they set for themselves... How their "xyz" type of psychology gets that common objective?

Only a strong ideology can create individuals having such a comon group psychology, not just social environment.

Collective psyche of al-qaida is political Islam, where they find refuge for their any kind of social or political or individual shortcoming. Very few people are happy with politics of any state/nation, but they don't get such easy psychological asylum as political Islam, nor other things can move so freely under the global umbrella of a religion and with power of speaking God on their side.

Christianity has lost that power (because Christians ignored it) and can not any more controll state in a visible way, but definitly it is not happy about it.

Re: # 108
dear tahmed 32,,,your question has two parts

a, al-qaeda is a state of mind of all those militant muslims who
...have a religious ideology of dominating the whole world
...have a religious personality that their truth is THE TRUTH, the holy truth that they want to impose on others
...have decided to pursue guerrila war techniques as they believe the end justifies the means
Such a mental set has a history in the Muslim world from Ibn-Tamiyya to Maududi to Syed Qutb to Zwahiri

b, psyche of each al-qaeda leader and follower
i have written articles about the personal life of osama bin laden and syed qutb and shared how their religius ideology reflects the tradition of kharijites who at the time of ali and muavia felt disillusioned with the political process and left the group and later on used violent means and assassinated ali. they tried to assassinate muavia also but were not successful
it is interesting that these militant muslims not only kill nonMuslims, the infidels, but also other Muslims who they believe are not genuine and authentic Muslims...they use their unique concept of takfeer.
Bin Laden and Zawahiri use that concept of takfeer against secular leaders of Muslim countries as they consider them part of Jahaliya. They want to revive pure Islam that is 1500 years ago and are members of salafi and wahabi tradition.

It is also intersting that many members of al-qaeda are the well educated middle class suicide bombers who are motivated by religious militant ideology and are quite different than those teenager, uneducated, desperate suicide bombers of palestine who are living in refugee camps and are fighting against israel.
i have written a number of articles on the subject but in each article of 1500 words for chowk i can just focus on one aspect.
i apologize if the topic of my article was misleading for you. i should not have used the word PSYCHE, obviously it meant something different to you than I had in mind.
thanks for your honest criticism. i will keep your criticism in mind in the future.
if you want to read my articles
...syed qutb..a leader of religious fundamentalists
...militant muslims...the new kharijites
feel free to send me an email
welcome@drsohail.com
and i will be more than glad to send you the articles. But then you might already know far more than i do. smiles...sohail

drsohail,

Let me answer your specific questons in the hope of clarifying the general point I was making.

"when Catholic church says that the church will ex-communicate those who will divorce?"

This is not coercion. Catholic Church is a voluntary community with clearly defined set of rules for its members. It has a perfect right to exclude members who disagree. If I disagree with it, (as I do) I don't have to join it. If I am alredy in it I can leave. I don't have to agree to or even respect the Catholic Church's doctrines. I have only have to respect it's right to hold and practice its beliefs. As long as the Catholic Church reciprocates that respect (which it does) I don't see how it contributes to violence in the world.
The Church's history of violence was based on its belief in stamping out heresy by force. It abandoned that belief several centuries ago.

"when Saudi Arabian government would not let women drive or perform haj alone or even go to music stores and consider it unIslamic"
This is coercion by the Saudi state.
"Ahmedis declared non-Muslims by Pakistani Government"
The decalaration itself is not necessarily coercion. But laws that restrict Ahmedis from practicing their religion and calling themselves muslims are coercive.
Again, muslims can oppose these laws without regarding Ahmedi beliefs as equally valid. They can continue to regard their own beliefs as 'THE truth' without forcing it upon others.

The general point I want to make is that believing in 'THE truth' does not necessarily lead to coercion becuase the principle of non-coercion can also be part of "THE truth".

Drsohail: while the US has no doubt projected military power internationally and Saudi Arabia has not, the implication that this somehow makes Saudi Arabia holier than the US assumes that the only relevant factor in international politics is military power. The fact is that while the US is the world leader among nations, saudi arabia is a pathetic little kingdom living off oil and with nothing else to offer the world except its medieval superstitions (which is not even Islam as it claims it to be) and hoodlums like ben laden.

Once we get this clear, we can get back to the subject - what is the psyche of a hoodlum. What childhood influences did he go through in saudi arabia that caused him to grow up to be a decoit. Neither your article, nor your discussion, touches on this. Only your the title of your article.

Re: # 89
dear HP...thanks for sharing your comments. i agree with your criticism of western imperialism and colonization but saudi arabia has not been as innocent as you might think. history tells us about arab-islamic colonization of africa and asia.
world has suffered because of communist domination on one hand and capitalism on the other hand
nations were affected by spread of christinaity on one side and by islam on the other side by preaching and holy wars, some call it crusades, others call it jihad.
let me share with you one quotation from my favourite Nobel Prize winner writer Wole Soyinka from Nigeria who shares the plight of African people in these words,

"Taken together, therefore, the history of African people provides us with two principal enemies of their authentic traditions and their will to cultural identity. One is European Imperialism, the other Arab-Islamic penetration and domination of significant areas of the continent.
"...Freedom, remains an antithesis of power, that historically proven corllary of enslavement. Obviously power can only be made manifest with the act of enslavement of some other. What then of the Third World, captive and client of the two ideological estates...socialism and capitalism...even as it has been, and still holds itself in thrall to two other alien contending religions, Christianity and Islam? Both these religions in their turn operate globally in mindboggling, fluctuating alliances with the two main ideological scaffoldings, left and right, yet constantly strike out in their own specific authoritariansism, often of the most destructive, anti-humanist nature."
Dear HP...Like Vatican of Christianity, Saudi Arabia has its own dark side of history. Thanks for sharing your thoughts honestly and enriching the dialogue.
sincerely
sohail

Re: # 102
dear muradbaig...thank you for joining the dialogue and making some valid points. you came late but it is better late than never.
i am of the opinion that any religion comes in a culture, so culture precedes religion and religion takes on some of the values of that culture. similarly scriptures come in a language because language exists beforehand. for example arabic existed before quran and arab culture existed before islam and since middle eastern culture was patriarchial...all three religions, judaism, christianity nd islam are patriarchial. there are no female prophets and males have more powers and privileges than females.
thanks for sharing...sohail

Re: # 89
HP...
Who is sponsoring spread of jihad and other nuicenses associated with medieval darkness (Islam) accross the world?

When the tribals invade Kashmir and attack Indian forces and indian civilians, they are heroes. When they are sent to heaven of 72 arab virgins (per d***), they are victims!!!!

#102 Posted by muradbaig on
that was good analysis.... except

[[
All religions preach the faith of their founders
]]
this assumes that no religion or sect evolves which is wrong assumption, it depends on that sect and religion and what defines it..


In any case, it is important to tell people very clearly what is good and what is bad for them, irrespective of why it so happened...

Ideas develop when you have time (and hence mind) to think, not everybody has that luxury all the time and even when you have, you may not utilize it...

but again there is no democracy in truth or idea, the closer an idea is to truth the more acceptable it should be... if it isn't we need to create that environment..

I get a red flag for using the word jerk but HP who used it in the post I replied to doesn't. Whoever flagged me care to explain their position?

I have just read this interesting article and some of the many interacts. I think you might find the extract from an article I wrote last year of interest:

All religions preach the faith of their founders but they also carry a huge baggage of customs that are social rather than spiritual. Easter and Christmas were never part of the teachings of Christ while Eid and Ramzan were ancient Arab customs that long predated the advent of Islam. Revenge was also an old Arab custom that has unfortunately become a part of the Muslim tradition worldwide. Revenge had been a necessary survival custom in the precarious times when small tribes of Arab Bedouins had to protect themselves from bigger or more powerful tribes who, without the fear of revenge, could easily loot or molest them.

Life in the desert was always very tenuous and there was fierce competition over the scarce sources of food or water. Individuals could not survive except with the protection of the bonds of blood within their tribes and through alliances with other tribes. This was expressed in the Arab ideology of Muruwah that not only meant manliness, pride and courage but endurance in suffering, protection of the weak, avenging each and every injustice and boldly defying stronger enemies regardless of the consequences.

Oppressors had to therefore be very careful for this well established tribal code made it certain that any injustice would be avenged at some future date. Regardless of power and position no one could ever be absolutely safe from attack, had to tolerate lesser tribes and be very careful not to incite any serious animosity.

The American cowboy glorification of revenge arose out of similar compulsions among numerous isolated ranchers who, far from legal remedies, had to protect themselves from their potential oppressors. Paradoxically today we see America’s cowboy spirit pitted against the Muruwah spirit of the Muslim world that views America as an oppressor.

This Muruwah was an old Arab custom so modern Islam does not need to glorify hatred and vengence as the El Quida so proudly advocates

thank you sohail...

i always thought good trolls are good for discussion:-)

Re: # 89

For those who think of HP as some kind of secular guy and not the disguised jihadi he really is this post should raise some suspicions. Here he springs to the defense of Saudi Arabia. What countries did the Saudis attack? In the last 50 years they funded Jihad throughout the world and in case anyone forgets including this HP jerk they flew aeroplanes into the world trade centre.

The Saudis historically have about the most aggressive history of any nation barring perhaps the Mongols too.