Yes we can, Obama!

Re: # 190

kaalchakri mian,

... you are beginning to scare me! .... is there nothing you hindoos can do about this problem? .... look, we successfully eradicated pagans and parsis from the maghreb to malaysia and we took a good swipe at hindoos and managed to cleanse large parts of northern india ....... why can't you guys stop the moslem hordes from overruning your ancient religion and culture ....... it must be the vegetarian diet .... or is it the fact that it is easier to laugh off a god with an elephant nose than an invisible goon in the sky who constantly threatens you with fire and brimstone .........

.... hindoos! wake up before you become extinct like the kuffar of mecca

Among indian who are most likely to be unmarierd or remain so i have seen Bengali higher cate b/c they are married to books !

The ordinary bengali family population is proverbialy large

beywakoof bulleya,

"of the three large monetheistic religions, one will have nearly disappeared demographically - judaism.....one will stay even or go down - christianity.....and one will be booming and will become the largest, overtaking christianity - islam......."

..... so what is there to rejoice about ? ....... this is like saying that the common cold will be eliminated and aids/hiv will be booming ...... i know misery loves company, but why would you wish such a horrible fate for mankind?

...And the culture of Early Ans MUST marriage is in hindu business community ALSO
like Jain marwari communities who dont fret about lengthy education ....

Addendum


i.e. rate of growth total india ....not forgetting 97 %of Muslims are ...where they are more than million


lower in rate ..29 % in 91/2001

from higher ......32 %in 88/91

Kaal Bhai


i have not followed what has led to your query .About non shrinking numbers in muslims

marriage is extremely important among them ,In my opinion it is so important that boys have to accomadate it by certain age even if there education or carreer is compromised so in other words marriasge is THE most important duty .

Similarly success of women is not in terms of whether she is Doctor or IAS officer ,The only important answer ppl want to know is she married or not

Now i dont know any other society treat marriage as may be 6th pillar of islam I may be wrong .But the rate of Hindus marriage and children are comparable .Aside from proaganda of 4 marriages and intentional large family Other social reasons like poverty is common factor to both hindu & muslims .The data for india i have seen there might be .2 % difference in RATE of growth ....Is that significant ?

Romair, population growth figures are exceptionally important. I respectfully disagree with those, who for whatever reasons deny the importance of these data. No one in their right mind will argue that other factors don't have their effects. But numbers impose their own impact.

Now there are two different issues here.

One - sheer physical numbers of humans. These numbers create both opportunities (necessary for creation of services, goods, ideas etc) and challenges (imperative of feeding, educating, clothing, housing them). These can be linked to poverty, growth, environmental decay, and pressures for human migration - in and out of countries.

Second issue is of ideological commitments and perceived (socio-political) identities of these raw numbers of humans. This is where religion becomes most important and cannot be avoided. It cannot be avoided also because, call it coincidence, ideology, or God's plan, the religious numbers that are growing everywhere are also, among major groups, of those who have the strongest group identities - Muslims.

(If there is any country in which the numbers of Muslims either in absolute terms or in relative terms is shrinking, I would be gladly corrected. People may disagree on what the reasons or the implications are).

..ironically, the future of europe is, now, dependent on the willingness of chinese, africans and south asians to migrate to europe....much like the present day of middle east is dependent on south asian immigrants.....if all south asians disappeared from the middle east, uae, saudi arabia, qatar, etc. will collapse immediately....

if these three regions show economic progress, then their citizens may not migrate.....in which case, europe will run out of manpower.....not sure how it would handle that, with an aging population.....on the other hand if it does allow them, its white citizens will face the same situation as israel.....

.....usa should be fine, for a while, even with no hispanic migration.......but it probably will not be able to grow....

canada is already heavily depenedent on chinese and south asian immigrants for its growth (with montreal, to some extent, on african arabs)......

israel (and jews in general), europe, russia (part of europe) and japan are in big trouble, demographically, in the next 50 years.......they are in a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario.....

oil-rich middle east countries would be in the most trouble.....however, they are forming economic unions, and should have enough arabs to rotate through each country, from poor arab countries....and muslims from pakistan and bangladesh and india, to maintain their identities......

current total population of tworld: 6.7 billion
current total population of saarc: 1.5 billion
current total population of china: 1.3 billion

- so, south asia and china are 41% of the world's population (this % is higher if you count their diaspora)

expected world population in 2050: 9.1 billion
expected south asian population in 2050: 2.25 billion
expected chinese population in 2050: 1.5 billion

- south asia and china will remain 41% of the world's population by 2050 (this % is higher if you count their diaspora and this will be higher if infant mortality rates go down in these regions)

- europe constituted 21.7% of the world's population 50 years ago.....it constitutes 12.8% now.......it will constitute only 6.8% in 2050!......africa is going in the other direction.....it is going from 8.9 to 12.7 today, to 21.8 in 2050......exactly the opposite of europe......

- the growth in population of the different regions from 2000 to 2005 shows that 325 million out of the total 383 million people added to the world were asians and africans (much of those added outside these places were due to migrations of these people)....

in 40 years, south asia, china and africa will be 63% of the world's population!......while europe will be down to 6.8% (many of whom will, actually, be south asian and african).....they will be the complete work force of the world!

....the only westernized country that will be able to keep pace is usa....which will grow from 300 million today to 400 million.....however, most of this growth will be hispanic, as well as due to hardworking immigrants like urstruly and hamidm mian.......by this time white americans will be less than 50% of the population.....

....if people want to see the future of the world, the first and foremost factor has to be demographics.....not current power.......

the world in 2050 will consist of indians, chinese, nigerians, indonesians, pakistanis and bangladeshis.....i.e. indians, chinese and muslims.....chinese and south asians.......with a sole western power, usa, starting to be dominated by hispanics......

russia and japan will reduce in population from around 140 million to around 110 million, each.......46 countries will lose population by 2050, many in eastern Europe.....the population of Bulgaria will fall by 35%, Ukraine by 33%, and Belarus, Romania, the Russian Federation, Moldova, Latvia, Lithuania and Poland by 20% to 30%.......

the proportion of growth in europe will be only of african and south asian immigrants.....i.e. europe will start becoming black, much like usa is starting to become brown.....


of the three large monetheistic religions, one will have nearly disappeared demographically - judaism.....one will stay even or go down - christianity.....and one will be booming and will become the largest, overtaking christianity - islam.......

Correction:

This issue is so basic that one should fully expect religious groups with growing populations and liberals to soon ask that census taking be entirely banned, or religion be not monitored at all.

(1) The FIRST thing to do is to RECOGNIZE that demography - the issue of changing population sizes of different religious groups - is of FUNDAMENTAL importance, as tahmedji said.

This is one data that has to be tracked and publicly monitored and discussed on a regular basis everywhere.

(2) Because demography is so important - the fusion bomb in social relations - ANY discussion related to demographic trends will elicit wildly emotional responses from different people.

Owing to their fundamentally conflicting interests, politically savvy people from different religious groups will never agree on data, anlyses, conclusions, or anything else. Their agreement on population trends of different religious groups would be akin to military establishments from different countries publicly agreeing on who has, and is building in different places, how many nuclear bombs.

That is fine. The objective of tracking such data is never to be convince everyone (or arrive at any kind of consensus among everyone) but to inform oneself.

(3) If religion is a factor, its demographic effects should show up both locally and globally. And those trends should leave its effects on social relations in both ways.

In different ways, we should notice changes in Assam and in Australia.

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This issue is so basic that one should fully expect some groups to soon ask that census taking be entirely banned, or religion be not monitored at all (becuase the world is unfair to them, and they cannot trust anyone but themselves.)

Holy Roman Script! LOL

Madani sahib, you are the best. :)

hamidm mian #: "... so you are looking forward to the time when jews will be extinct and the earth will be inhabited by half-witted punjabi retards and imbecilic bedouins ...."

i am, neither, looking forward, nor backwards, nor sideways......i am, simply, stating a statistical fact....

the future of the world belongs to south asian, chinese, hispanics, (and arabs).....they are the cockroaches......while the japanese, russians, white europeans and jews are the dinosaurs.......

you should be happy.......desis are set to rule the world.....they will spread out all over the world, and much of the western world will look like uae....i.e. a small local minority owing national assets, with a large south asian majority doing the work........

Re: # 182; madani sahib

I knew very well what you meant sir

a very good day to you too

# 179 Dr. Sahib it is hoped and understood by yourself just as native writes in Holy script that is not going to impress me.
Just to have clarity of my thinking.
Good day.

#151 Posted by dost_mittar
“According to the 1971 census data, the total marital fertility rate for Muslim women was 11% higher in urban areas and 20% higher in rural areas than the rate for Hindus. Even when education was controlled, the Muslim rate remained higher.�

This new study seems more in line than the other one. I think Tahmed you should read DM’s post #151 carefully and I hope he posts some links to that study. However, I had a chance to look at some data and it is true that Muslims in India or even in Pakistan don’t practice any nussbandi or birth control in general and the reason is primarily religion. I also heard from an Indian Muslim, I know socially, that Muslims still don’t support family Planning in India but the Muslim women who end up in hospitals after a few births go for snip,snip and in some cases w/o telling their husbands.

Now this may not be a rule but there certainly is an element of religion as to why Muslim population in India is on the rise. The religion and education and the lack of it could be two most important factors. It certainly is not a genetic issue.

I don’t know if the religion says something about family planning or not but if it does, Islam must be the most progressive religion of the first millennium CE.
Thanks.