How it Became Bakistan

nem,

We don't study in madrassa as well. Those who do, we send them over for proxy wars.

Yeah right...BBC. I stand puzzled!

And NO. Right is NOT wrong, just cuz you say so.

This is the post-modern world. We all have perspectives, no final truth.

So Pakistani perspective is different than yours. We can only talk about it when you intend to do so in good faith. But till then I feel compelled to be rigid n rude, just cuz I love my country.

Think abt it.
If not in good faith...I wish you 'rest in peace' soon.
Bye.
-E

#58 Posted by bittersweetmojo

"God! What happened to your history lessons back at home, Nem?"

We don't study in madrassa. It is a god given gift to us to at least try to be inquisitive and differentiate between right and wrong.

Shastri's death was out of context of the present discussion.
Do you know at the time of 1965 and 1971 wars we used to rely only upon BBC for authentic news?

Wrong is always wrong even if I love my country so much.

Nem,

Nobody can claim who ran backwards n who didnt when fighting a war!

And for that matter, quoting a website won't help you win THIS war. So give up or keep ranting, I am leaving.

Cheers.

-E

Re: # 55

God! What happened to your history lessons back at home, Nem?


P.S: How swiftly you irnored my remark abt Shastri ji. Good job.
-E

#56 Posted by Kulharee

I do appreciate your constraints. But speaking a lie a thousand times and calling it a truth is also not fair no?

In other countries (also in India) the follies are exposed over a period of time. We know the follies of nehru and vkk menon vis-a-vis china war and we curse them for that. But indoctrination in Pakistan is so strong that two plus two is twentytwo because major saab said so.(in army parlance)

Re #8 and #53. Nemesis, I somewhat agree, but my take on this was like this: If we don’t lose very badly, we consider it a win. We have set very low standards for ourselves. We won 1965 war because we got to keep the whole country.

#54 Posted by bittersweetmojo

"Same can be said about India, no?
All India Radio was at work back then, wasn't it?"

hmmmmm... yes.

"And I am sure you guys have been given tuitions the same way about the 65 war."

No. Mercifully, I got it from globalsecurity.org

This is the next para

Pakistan was rudely shocked by the reaction of the United States to the war. Judging the matter to be largely Pakistan s fault, the United States not only refused to come to Pakistan s aid under the terms of the Agreement of Cooperation, but issued a statement declaring its neutrality while also cutting off military supplies. The Pakistanis were embittered at what they considered a friend's betrayal, and the experience taught them to avoid relying on any single source of support. For its part, the United States was disillusioned by a war in which both sides used United States-supplied equipment. The war brought other repercussions for the security relationship as well. The United States withdrew its military assistance advisory group in July 1967. In response to these events, Pakistan declined to renew the lease on the Peshawar military facility, which ended in 1969. Eventually, United States-Pakistan relations grew measurably weaker as the United States became more deeply involved in Vietnam and as its broader interest in the security of South Asia waned.

This may not make you happy. But what doooo... You have to accept the facts.

nem,

Same can be said about India, no?
All India Radio was at work back then, wasn't it?
And I am sure you guys have been given tuitions the same way about the 65 war.

Besides Shastri ji didn't die of heart attack. His diplomatic success led him to rest in peace, a medical report said so. :D

Cheers.
-E

#8 Posted by shankar

"He fought a successful war in 1965 over Kashmir with India"

This is what it was:
Overall, the war was militarily inconclusive; each side held prisoners and some territory belonging to the other. Losses were relatively heavy--on the Pakistani side, twenty aircraft, 200 tanks, and 3,800 troops. Pakistan's army had been able to withstand Indian pressure, but a continuation of the fighting would only have led to further losses and ultimate defeat for Pakistan. Most Pakistanis, schooled in the belief of their own martial prowess, refused to accept the possibility of their country's military defeat by "Hindu India" and were, instead, quick to blame their failure to attain their military aims on what they considered to be the ineptitude of Ayub Khan and his government.

In pakistan, you don't have to win a war to claim success. Your hallucinations become a reality. Majority of Pakistanis are uneducated and believe the Radio Pakistan news.

Kafir-Tahir,

Your day of punishment is approaching!
Soon.
-E

Re: # 48
"But as an atheist, dont you think it is quite odd on your part to pronounce Tahir mian a kafir."

Clever questions! If this fool did the same, he'd get decent answers from within; but he doesn't!

Check out my I-log: Who is a Kafir?

Regards.

Re: # 49
Jetzt muss ich wechseln zu Deutsch du Narr!

Gehen Sie liegen in einem Grab ummarked für alle mir, und nehmen Sie sie mit heidnischen Philosophie.

majju sahib,

I have a right because of my pastlife in and with Islam. How about that? Besides who cares if I haven't any right whatsoever in this regard, BUT I can prove that he's a Kafir by any standard of both Islam and Sui-ism.

My people! hmm...
All Pakistanis in general, atheists and Marxist in particular. Fanatics like Tahir and the elite establishment are NOT my beloved people. :D

I have a special love-respect-package for Marx, Muhammad, Sartre, Sachal, Bulleh and the rest as well. Do you mind?

Anyway. Now I have to go.
Have a nice day.

And I know Tahir will be damned sooner or later.

over n out.
-E

Kadvimeethi sahib,

I have been a known atheist and ve lived freely in Karachi

It is certainly heartening to hear that. But as an atheist, dont you think it is quite odd on your part to pronounce Tahir mian a kafir.

if my beloved people are accused of reactionary claims

Who are your beloved people. All Pakistanis or merely atheist Pakistanis.

Regards

majju sahib,

"Then perhaps you acted in haste in pronouncing Tahir mian as a kafir."

Certainly not. I know where people like tahir come from, hence I know what they mistakenly think they know about anything they claim to believe in.

If you are curious, let me tell you that Taliban could punish me for this if I were in their reach. And even if I were, I would never take back my words.

I stand by it: Tahir is a Kafir at large by any defination of Islam or Sufi-ism for that matter.
-E

#41
majju sahib,

Frankly speaking, kisi ka baap bhi kuch nahi bigaar sakta mera! :D
For the last ten years, I have been a known atheist and ve lived freely in Karachi as I damn please.

------------
tahir,

The fact is that you don't deserve my time.
So go to hell, you moronic fanatic!
Meet me someday if you have guts of a man!
Let me show you how violent I can be, if my beloved people are accused of reactionary claims.
-E