Chaos – Thy Name is Pakistan

philo,

No, I am not sure what ummah’s problem is with Ahmadis! BTW, I am glad you have decided to become the mouthpiece of the entire Muslim community!

A few issues ummah has with Ahamdis are as follows (depending upon who you talk to):

Ahmadis are …

1. British agents
2. Jewish/Zionist agents
3. An international drug cartel
4. Ring of sex addicts
5. Responsible for Pak-India partition riots
6. Responsible for Bangladesh partition
7. Have a khalifaa, and are therefore not Muslims …
8. Twist meaning of Quran, ahadith
9. Have their own prophet …
10. Destabilizing and conspiring against Pakistan
11. Any more???

But when taken to the task to validate their claims, ummah is unable to get beyond rhetoric. Although they are quick to declare Ahmadis non-Muslims in certain terms!

When you are done reciting poetry, feel free to tell us what is bothering you.

Re: # 136 sattar

(((you may want to share the content of this esteemed book with Urstruly, tahmed, philo, Salim et all)))

Tahir, Plz do share the content of this esteemed book with me.

((((all of whom have issues with Ahmadis, but beyond vague accusations, are unable to explain what or why.)))

sattar mian, what or whay???You still don't know what problem we(muslims) have with Ahmadis?

Arz kiya hai;

Be niaazi had se guzri banda perwar kab talak

Hum kahain gai haalay dil aap farmaayen gai, Kiya?


Yaani, hum ab tak jhuk hee maartay rahay.Aakheer ho gaye jay.

tahir (#64),

Your passing reference to “knowledgeable others� who share your anti-Ahmadi views is not an argument.

Note that Jesus too was opposed by ullema of his time, that Abu Jehal too was a scholar of his time, that Maudoodi too is considered knowledgeable by the ummah.

Re #75: You may have said enough about Ahmadis, and so have others. I have only heard innuendos and hyperbole so far. Again, tossing around names of books is not an argument.

Lastly, you may want to share the content of this esteemed book with Urstruly, tahmed, philo, Salim et all … all of whom have issues with Ahmadis, but beyond vague accusations, are unable to explain what or why.

Re: # 134
Who will bell the cat? Kiyani has already bared his fangs by asking the Prime Minister and the President to set their house in order. Nobody asked him to shut up.

I am deeply saddened by the state of affairs in Pakistan.
In absence of strong political governance and political stability through democracy, the Army wrested the initiative from public and politicians (who are/were mostly opportunistis) and created monster of a problem called Kashmir. When this started failing, they created Talibaan and now , both Pakistan and Afghanistan are paying a heavy price for the Army's follies.

Pakistan will prosper if Army , as in India is relegated to play only tertiary role in just defending its territories instead of poking they noses in daily life.

It is upto the public now not to let Pakistan become a Pariah state.

Nichio

Detroit

Re: # 125

I'd request this 'foreign power' to stop coming after our crown jewels and instead settle for permanently holding on to our family jewels (just one item out of the trio will do) with a loving grip!

of course things are not as simple as that....Pakistan instead of being a pawn in the global chess board has become the chess board itself.

its my understanding TNT was created after 1936's debacle .

support from Muslim Majority areas was needed to substantiate the claim of the only and sole representative of Muslim voice by the ML...hence TNT

jinnah -sikander pact provided opportunity to the ML to make inroads and they did .


By the way I am baffled , a nation such as punjabis which have gone though so much invasions in history ...still has no vision for future.......and fells again and again in traps set by others...


though of the topic, but loosing One's Land, abandoning one's language leaving one's culture that too , which has roots as deep as history itself ..... is surly not a wise thing to do .....


it baffles me...and they have not wisen up , just look at the way they are falling for another invasion from the North West in form of Talibans.


by the way some one told me, the core of these Talibans consist of Chechins, Uzbeks,...and people from central asia....... locals are just cannon fodders....is it true..

so are we witnessing another ...... historical invasion.into the sub-continent .... only this time the route is not to Panipat , but Karachi or Gawadar....

Re: # 124 Hasho: "Are all in minority in India happy now?"

This is another statement where most Indians have different view.

But overall agree with your comments.

Re: # 124 Hasho: "that united India would have been a political and economic haven for all Indians. Well, it is not for the people who still live there, so how could it be a haven for the people who left it?"

While there is always room for improvement, the first part (it is not for the people who still live there) is not true. However the second part (so how could it be a haven for the people who left it?) is true.

The Pakistani Punjabi Army will now be looking for the latest avatar of Tikka Khan for the next butchering of occupied Baluchistan

Re: # 100
sadna...
whether Jinnah wanted or not, Pakistan is a lovely concept to Indians (to get rid of large number of muslas)...\
All the BS started in late 19th century and early 20th century...the first generation of Indian intellectuals ( mostly Bengalis) co-operated with Brits to reform education, society, industry etc....If you read Bankim Chandra Chattyopadhyay, you can feel the sentiment within Indians...Muslas and specialy muslaism/islam was never welcomed into Indian society and creation of Pakistan was almost inevitable....

Congres should have managed partition better way....

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Re: # 123 Mr. Hasho good thinking.
Unfortunately some foreign power is planning to divide pakistan second time. The reason is this foreign power wants get hands on our crown jewels ie simple way to say they want to take away nuclear assets. They are shy to take snatch openly as it will be against UNO laws. They are making problems in B.Stan and there is lots of help to this biggest supper power from our other "democratic" friend you know ther friend, hahaha.... Any way problems of E.Pakistan also started in schools. Lots of Hindus were in teaching teacher positions in schools. They started poison of Bhasha Pride and anti urdu feelings and viruses spread fast based on hatred of others. THis time to nip buds from schools in B.Stan now or will need axex letter to cut grown poisonous fruits. Now two foreign power are interested in enormous gas wealth and copper and gold there.One power will like also big G in Pocket so they can get out of dependence on Karachi for sending stuff for WOT in A.Stan and possible future action against Iran if they make nuclear things. They want base in vital area and B.Stan fits the bill.
Worth reading article.
PPP admits national anthem abandoned in Balochistan schools




Wednesday, May 13, 2009
Governor expresses concern, orders probe

By Mumtaz Alvi

ISLAMABAD: The Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) conceded on Tuesday that even in several government schools of the provincial capital of Balochistan, national anthem has been abandoned and the national flag is no more hoisted.

Balochistan Governor Nawab Zulfiqar Ali Magsi during a media chat on Monday also expressed concern over the unfortunate practice and called for a thorough investigation into it.Nawabzada Mir Lashkari Raisani, who is PPP Balochistan Chapter’s President, when approached for comments, confirmed that schools in many areas no more echoed with the national anthem.

“Yes, it is a bitter reality that some elements are promoting this idea of abandoning the national anthem and avoid hoisting Pakistani flag on the school buildings and other government buildings,� the Baloch leader, who recently held back his resignation as a member of the Senate, maintained.

The National Party’s newly-elected legislator, Hasil Bezinjo, made a stunning revelation during the recently-prorogued session of Senate that the schools in his province had abandoned the national anthem because of the “seething injustices committed to the people of the province�.

A source close to Chief Minister Nawab Aslam Raisani told this correspondent from Quetta that the government was fully aware of the trend and he blamed a handful of separatist elements. However, he was quick to add that before this unfortunate practice took an ugly turn, those sitting in Islamabad, would have to take concrete measures to rectify the situation in Pakistanís largest but the poorest province.

The chief minister was not available for comments, as he was to board a plane for Islamabad, where he was expected to take up the latest situation in the province with the federal government.

Bismillah Khan Kakar, who is PPPís Secretary General, Balochistan, when contacted, said that certain elements were now openly campaigning for Balochistan’s separation from Pakistan in the provincial

capital.

“When we move around, we can see graffiti on walls of buildings even very close to the Governor House and the Chief Minister House in the heart of Quetta. The writings reflect the rebellious thinking of certain people,� he pointed out.

He referred to slogan like ‘long live Free Balochistan’ written on scores of government offices and schools. Kakar, who belongs to District Qila Saifullah’s Habibzai locality, was of the view that it was time to act and act fast to address grievances of the people of Balochistan.


Good day.

Gill sahib, you cut your nose to spite your face.

“After 60 years of mis-rule, Pakistan is in the grips of a civil war which has been launched by Taliban.�

Can you please tell me where is this civil war going on? Some three to four thousand or perhaps less people are fighting the state in a small area which barely has 2 million population and you call that a civil war? I guess you have no idea what civil wars look like. Try Indonesia of 1965 or the US of 1864. I hope things don’t get to that stage in Pakistan, but if they do, that still does not mean Pakistan will disappear in to the Arabian Sea.

I am not sure if you also understand the reasons for the creation of Pakistan. Admittedly, the front –religion- was only for the people in the central India. No one was buying Islam in any other part of the current Pakistan. I hope you know that even the most conservative NWFP barely voted for Pakistan.

When people did not buy religion in the most trying political conditions before the partition, when they were merely slaves of the British, why would they buy it now?

Religion is not a problem or an issue in Pakistan. It is a cover for the ruling elite. They promoted the religion as a political plank to continue to occupy the political landscape but now they are getting hammered by their own people in some part of NWFP. I think that’s good. The irony is that the Army is killing the people it supported for over 50 years. Army kay namak halals are now army’s namak harams.

Let me try and get this out of your head that united India would have been a political and economic haven for all Indians. Well, it is not for the people who still live there, so how could it be a haven for the people who left it?

The fact is that there are always going to be some in minority who would be grumpy about the majority and feel that they are being oppressed by the majority. Just look at where you live. Plenty in the black minority are full of complaints. This is in the economically most advanced nation with the highest standard of living in the world. Do you really think that an utterly and dismally poor India would have made the minority a happy camper? Are all in minority in India happy now?

On the flip side, there are always going to be some in majority that would be full of complaints about the minority. Again look around in the area you live in.

There was inevitability in India’s partition. If not 1947, it would have happened in 1967, 1977 or even in 1997 and it would have happened after so much acrimony and bloodshed that you probably would have learnt the true meaning of civil war. In fact, the civil war in India would have gone on in the annals of history as the bloodiest civil war ever.

I hope you understand what I am saying. Please ask if you need some more explanation. India was going to be divided or many states would have left India. Pakistan might appear to be a mistake to you now, but there was never any chance of an undivided India forever.

Anil writes "Is this how you claim to have proof positive evidence of God also? "


Anil stay out of areas you have no knowledge about and that would be all areas other than vegetable vending, a profession fit for HBS graduates.

In our period symbolic existence that determines what occurs on the ground is controlled by the U.S. elite that dominate information, knowledge and global institutions. They have built up these 4000 thugs otherwise they would amount to nothing. They were built up due to the structural requirements of the US political economy and its global war on terrorism, a war that cannot end otherwise a new one would have to be invented in order for the 'permanent war economy' to operate. Can you imagine if this economy tried to convert to a peace time one during a recession what would occur? Similarly God is necessitated by the structural requirements of the unverse. The initial conditions, the fine tuned constants that resulted in our universe and life evolving necessite God just as the structural requirements of the US PE necessitate war and building up enemies out of straw men and baboons....