Chaos – Thy Name is Pakistan

#46 Posted by BJ2

“I don't think that the country of Pakistan is going to be swallowed by the Talibanese�

No Sir! That is not the problem. The problem is that now that the civil war has started it is just not one protagonist against another. There is not just one constituency which is disgruntled, everybody is unhappy in their current circumstance. With no strong central authority, no coherent Pakistani identity and no principles on which every one could agree upon it seems that the lid from all these frustrations is coming off. For the foreseeable future where as in the past interest groups would talk about or protest or petition for their causes, from here on they would fight for them. This means we are destined towards greater chaos. Different constituencies will ally with each other and fight each other at different times during this civil war.

The first signs are already there. The army is not fighting the Taliban with the only aim of defeating them, had that been the case they would be fighting a lot smarter war then they seem to be. Its more like fighting an American style war with one of the goals being to extract as much aid as they can. Same is true of the civilian leadership who are more interested in their portrayal on the world scene and enriching themselves whether through the war effort or the humanitarian crisis that it is creating.

Trouble is that once such a civil war starts it just doesn’t die down quickly enough. So the long grueling struggle that the country has to endure, when the infrastructure which is already crumbling gets destroyed even further, another generation gets lost because schools cant function, jobs are not there and nothing works. That is the calamity, that is what we mourn and that is Gill Sahib’s lament.

d_m
"
Of course, the Unionists wanted a unite Punjab. They were Punjabis and had no problem with fellow Hindu and Sikh Punjabis. They associated with Jinnah primarily because Nehru foolishly made it plain that their future would be grim in Nehru's India."

Yeah Nehru gave them their first lesson in respecting elected majorities. Unfortunately inspite of Nehru's lesson, Jinnah and the Punjabi Muslims deluded themselves that they could evade the majority principle for ever, and that is the 60-year story of Pakistan.

Re: # 52 BJ2 you know elites. You have quite lot of them there also.
Elite is like Yuppy. He mimics white people is snob and eats with spoons and eats on table, eats mango by cutting by knife than sucking. He is cruel and have got free ride like our bb or your rahul and they just god damn look for themselves and and always want to help poor people. They wear coats and toiies at 45 degree temp. They think they are smart and most importantly they feel awam owns them lot and they have right to be PM and what not and pontiff on everything and give messages.THey talk too much worry about rise in temp and always tell what govt should do is make solar and wind energy and go home out of car and start generator and AC and laments when desis are going to care for rise in temp and in anger open freeze and let co2 go from bear and drink it and say our people are never going to learn.
Elite thinks too much about himself and always feel all others do not know any thing and they are no nothing as recently elite gentleman from Ibad has told Masadi you are nothing etc. They have strange attitude if elite farts he feels he is giving message to masses etc.
Now some time i will write but now let me go.
Generally if meet pompous man then after his big talk you feel bad and he was irritating then you have met elite.MOst Elites believe is to not act but talk and talk, tons of talk and no one gram of action and he has contempt for others little people.You get it hope.

If the subcontinent had remained one it would have been a Lebanon with 1.5 billion people with the social and economic stats of Burkina Faso. What good wud that have done to anyone- Hindoo or Muslim? I agree with YLH that two/three successor entities with the majority nationality comprising more than 80% majority wud be the most stable outcome.

India and Pakistan's problems arise out of the fact that both made wrong choices. India took to Nehruvian Stalinism for about 45 years while Pakistan made a turn to militarism and militancy. And even in Pakistan's case I can't help thinking that had Kashmir been resolved peacefully it may never have turned out that way.

Regards

Re: # 46 BJ2 you are wrong and Dr Gill is correct. There is moral corrouption 200% ( not talking about tax evasion and making black money). Imoral leadership has encouraged Talibs they know whom they are against. They are not kind they are cruel is open ( it is open secret leadership is 200% corroupt and spinelss, they are so coward they can not even say openly against talibs except whiping boy of all ie Altafbhai)
You look in nature it not size or strength but character of wild lion which brings down one at time buffllow at time. Buffllow is quite strong but is afraid so can resist. Already Moulan Disel and other are becoming defender of talibs. Talibs know fear is key. They will slowly demolish and take over state of pakistan the way army is fighting them in classical american and french fashion leading to defeat in Vietnam. It is astonishing for short term avoiding losses army has entered the trap set by talibs and it must just as planned. Only it can be averted if moral leadership will arise and tell army to fight proper way not army basic aviodance way. ( there is no body with that moral character and authority to force army fight.Kindly read little pavo. ) Good day.
I hope for best for army and presidents victories.

madani sahib: so you think taliban is not corrupt pipple? you are right. they are not pipple, corrupt of not. they are animals. so they cover face with towel, so you dont see their dog-going-to-hell nose.

Re: # 51

Ahmedmadani sahib, what is this rant against the "elites"? Are you trying to give Masadi sahib a run for his money?

Re: # 18 Mr. Gill aka AK.... Your response is right.
It is extremely cruel to make such coment to say they are making too much of Internally Displaced people.Almost 1 million people will be moved if not more.
British people left but we are still slaves in mentality. All world is appaled at looking pictures. The elite of pakistan is worst and most inhuman than wild animals. One feels shame how a person who is in his prime , leaving in pakistan in IBad in posh area, having all advantages that elites get wealthy parents, good business background can make such comments. This disease of uncaring has become character and second nature. With so many displaced and running away most head of state will rush back but president is "spending" time in newyork. Our elites have become heartless, in their poltics people lives , specially poor and tribal have less value than animals. People have no food, water, they had homes and families they are uprooted. May be talibs are harsh and what not but if elites of pakistan moving in california and discussing stuff with indians as if this some painting a abstract painting. If our leading young educated foreign trained preveliged young men feels this way then we should ask for recolonisation for those whites are too kind compared our future heartless leaders. I appreciate mr. Masadi many times and some times feel he need to moderate but in this case he is too mild. If majority adult elites are like this then people will feel Talibs far kind than so called liberal secular and "educated" in foreign ivy colleges. With high command with such moralless and cruel morally superiopr Talibs will finish elites slowly but surely like barbarians did to Corroupt Romans.
I feel sad how elites and so heartless are elites.
This is very disturbing trend in young successful men and women and it gives shudder what is in store for this land which already is punished so long and so harshly. Your comment were harsh which proved mr. Manto but they are true and bitter.

anil...

Sure... you have my email?

Pew,

Well yes... but this is not as simple as either side makes it. It may be argued that the grouping of Muslim majority areas, constituting independent and autonomous units, as embodied by the Muslim League's Lahore resolution (later popularized by the Congress as "Pakistan") was not in variance to the notion of Indian unity.

Furthermore... it must also be realized that the Cabinet Mission Plan did not go far enough to meet the proposal of the Lahore Resolution... it actually rejected all the planks of League's demand including parity. Therefore it is very significant that Jinnah accepted it nonetheless. It is equally significant that Congress chose to reject the CMP.


Masadi mian,

So now I live in a million dollar house. good...anything else in your depraved third rate mind that you have to say?

Yasser:

If you visit San Francisco area, I can take you out for a lunch. It would be interesting to listen to what you have to say.

Re: # 42 Manto

Did you reach the conclusion that MAJ did not desire Partition, and had no choice when Congress accepted it rather than agree to the Grouping formula of two separate Dominions?

Dr. Gill, you worry needlessly. Yes, these are times of turbulence but I don't think that the country of Pakistan is going to be swallowed by the Talibanese -- with or without any acts of war by the khakis. I base that prediction on the common sense observation that the Talibanese style of living is so suffocating and stifling that nobody will live under it too long, so it can be sustained for only so long and like the Communist system, will destroy itself -- only a lot faster.

oh and finally, I am not obsessed with your puny brainless chidish rants about Jinnah, but I'll be goddamned if I step back and let your type of morons take ownership of either Pakistan or the Muslims of India, one Jinnah mistake is enough, he succeeded because of the Brits, you want to push the American agenda following in his footsteps....

TNITC masadi

Manto writes "Know your auqaat bhai."

My auqaat is that I stir up things wherever I go based on the intelligence Allah has blessed me with. I amaze people regardless of the paper pushing losers you refer to as my 'colleagues'.

Have a nice day,

TNITC masadi

Manto writes "it is not that India does not have the problems we have... or that India is this perfect utopia that people make it out to be... but Indians don't indulge in this unnecessary exercise of self immolation which goes beyond academic inquiry... and is in the realm of Obsessive Compulsive Disorder... an national OCD of sorts. Indians don't have it. We do."

Manto you charlatan, you live in a million dollar home in Islamabad and then claim to have a grip on the pulse of the nation that is food deprived? Further, you don't understand the basic point of this alarmism about Pakistan and not India. India is a major distraction a flag bearer for legitimizing Western imperialism in this age while Pakistan is supposed to 'fall' to facilitate the U.S. war machine. You don't get this basic point you moron so the rest of your analysis is the depiction of the goddamned loser you are, you rich fart, you know less about Pakistan than the common rickshaw driver, get that in your dumbass skull...

TNITC masadi