Minorities and Blasphemy Laws in Pakistan: A Legal Perspective

so you admit to all that i say about Allah and Mohammad......

good.......

my knowledge may be pathetic but all I can say that the knowledge you have gained is a waste cause you talk like an athiest ... trying to find logic in faiths.

you talk about us getting tried in court when you yourself act no different, the treatment of Dalits is no hidden fact .. what you do to them is more humiliating than what goes on in pakistan.

http://archive.gulfnews.com/articles/09/08/11/10339169.html

read and be proud.

Re: # 17

"There can only be one God and not Gods, even your books says that as well, so when you compare someone with God, you are breaking a law and there will be a punishment for that."

Mian , this is absolutely NONSENSE.

This is infact SPIRITUAL FASCISM that does not admit of pluralism of spiritual beliefs.

Infact, it is another way to justify Islamic genocide of mushrique hindus that has been going on since ages by the Pakistanis.

No Pakistani can foist his Allah or any other imaginary deity on hindus and they CANNOT even try to 'punish' (what a subterfuge by the Islamic goons) hindus for believing in 80 crore deities.

Infact Pakistanis must be tried in the court of international justice for trying to push their spiritual fascistic agendas on any hindu or non-muslim in Pakistan.

Re: # 18

Infact hindus are MUSHRIQUES. they are idolator pagans like Meccans.And Mohammad commanded the mushriques to be killed and slayed only for being a mushrique.
hindus are not even kafir because a kafir can be turned into a dhimmi - but a mushrique ONLY deserves to be killed !!

It was only through bribery of khalifa during qasim's days that hindus were able to get themselves certified as people of book and hence kafirs who can be turned into dhimmi slaves.

#17 Posted by bhs75

"I do not believe that on one hand quran says "come to common terms between you and them" and then tells you to kill them, I don't think so."

Your knowledge of quran is pathetic if not parannoid.

You speak like Indian moderate muslims who strain every nerve to explain to you that kafir is a non-believer, while actually, kafir is a non-believer OF ALLAH. It makes a lot of difference. A devout hindu is a kafir according to Mohammed.

Instead of trying to expatiate on what you want quran to be, try and study it. May be a mankind will get another "thinking kafir"

(with apologies) like them twisted minds of talibans who take the same verses, does not know the background of them and start blowing stuff up,you and those who does not want to find a common ground will also believe the same ...

There are 3 types of Jihad and the jihad which so called muslims are doing these days, is the least of the 3 jihads, first 2 are most important, jihad bil nafs and jihad bil qalm. since you looked up verses from quran I am sure you can look up about these jihads as well. Prophet did sent out messengers first to convey message of peace but when kuffar went hostile,only then jehad was ordered, there is no evidence ever that the Prophet started a war without any reason cause if He ever held a grudge against non-believers he would have not forgive the kuffar-e-mekkah when He entered Mekkah.

every reference from quran points to something, specially killing of kafirs in soora touba, refers to a deal which kuffar-e-mekkah broke therefore the surah was sent with regard to that, THAT does not mean it applies to eternity, it refers to that point in time only.

I do not believe that on one hand quran says "come to common terms between you and them" and then tells you to kill them, I don't think so.

what makes you think a muslim will not go to hell? every muslim will pay for his sins in hell. you think muslims who drink or are involved in adultry or any kind of shirk will have it easy? no ... the punishment will be same as anyone else.

There can only be one God and not Gods, even your books says that as well, so when you compare someone with God, you are breaking a law and there will be a punishment for that.

As far as non-believers, to my point of view there are 2 types, there are muslims who are muslims by name only and rest of thier acts are like non-believers, and then there are those who are not muslims. like I said before, muslim or not, you will not escape punishment for your sins, quran says they will burn in hell then they will burn in hell. period. if your book says that same about muslims than let it be, I will not confront your book either cause it's all about faith. hadith talks about the deepest pits of hell will be filled with Mullas who pretended to be leaders of islam.

it's all about belief and on the final day we all shall find out, or is that a matter of debate as well? cause after centuries of debates on religion, we must know that it leads to nothing and can go on forever & this will continue to poison the minds of the weaks.

BUT we are not weak, sensible we must remain and must respect and tolerate all religions and leave the judgement to God.

#15 Posted by bhs75

This may perhaps help clear your doubts.

“…Quran tells us to: "not to make friendship with Jews and Christians" (Q. 5:51), fight them "until they pay the Jizya (a penalty tax for the non-Muslims living under Islamic rules) with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (Q. 9:29). "kill the disbelievers wherever we find them" (Q.2:191), "murder them and treat them harshly" (Q. 9:123), "fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem" (Q. 9:5).

Quran says that all those who disbelieve in Islam go to hell (Q. 5:10), they are najis (filthy, untouchable, impure) (Q. 9:28), and orders us to fight the unbelievers until no other religion except Islam is left (Q.2:193). It prohibits a Muslim to befriend a non-believer even if that non-believer is the father or the brother of that Muslim (Q. 9:23), (Q. 3:28).

It says that the "non-believers will go to hell and will drink boiling water" (Q. 14:17). It asks the Muslims to "slay or crucify or cut the hands and feet of the unbelievers, that they be expelled from the land with disgrace and that they shall have great punishment in the world hereafter" (Q. 5:34). And tells us that "for them (the unbelievers) garments of fire shall be cut and there shall be poured over their heads boiling water whereby whatever is in their bowels and skin shall be dissolved and they will be punished with hooked iron rods" (Q. 22:19-22) and that they not only will have "disgrace in this life, on the Day of Judgment He shall make them taste the Penalty of burning (Fire)" (22:9).

Quran says that "those who invoke a God other than Allah not only should meet punishment in this world but the Penalty on the Day of Judgment will be doubled to them, and they will dwell therein in ignominy" (Q. 25:68). For those who "believe not in Allah and His Messenger, He has prepared, for those who reject Allah, a Blazing Fire!" (Q. 48:13).

As for him who does not believe in Islam the Prophet says that after he dies it will be announced with a "stern command": "Seize ye him, and bind ye him, And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire. Further, make him march in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits! This was he that would not believe in Allah Most High. And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent! So no friend hath he here this Day. Nor hath he any food except the corruption from the washing of wounds, Which none do eat but those in sin." (Q. 69:30-37)

The holy Prophet prescribes fighting for us and tells us that "it is good for us even if we dislike it" (Q.2:216). Then he advises us to "strike off the heads of the disbelievers"; and after making a "wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives" (Q.47:4). Our God has promised to "instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers" and has ordered us to "smite above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them" (Q.8:12). and "to strike terror into (the hearts of the enemies" (Q.8:60).

He has made the Jihad mandatory and warns us that "Unless we go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish us with a grievous penalty, and put others in our place" (Q.9:39). Allah speaks to our Holy Prophet and says "O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be stern against them. Their abode is Hell,- an evil refuge indeed" (Q. 9:73).

He promises us that in the fight for His cause whether we slay or are slain we return to the garden of Paradise (Q. 9:111). In Paradise he will "wed us with Houris (celestial virgins) pure beautiful ones" (Q. 56:54), and unite us with large-eyed beautiful ones while we recline on our thrones set in lines (Q. 56:20). There we are promised to eat and drink pleasantly for what we did (56:19). And have sex with "boys like hidden pearls" (Q. 56:24) and "youth never altering in age like scattered pearls" (Q. 76:19)

Re: # 7

I asked you to give me reference where muhammed (pbuh) said to either kill the kafir or convert them.

Bin Qasim story happened centuries after that, and again it was an individual ...it was a war ... what do you expect? again if you stay on this chapter than you will say ... what about sher shah soori? what about tipu sultan? the list goes on ... but this is not what I asked you.

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Blasphemy laws are a continuation of the policies started by the establishment in cahoots with the religious lobbies to change Pakistani society, main objective is separation from the Indian everything and give this country a separate identity. Bhutto tried Socialism and failed, Zia Islamized (Arabized) and succeeded.

There is no political party or state institution that can change these retrograde laws, for change to come about mindsets need to be changed and more importantly discredit those who support and promote such ideologies. This needs time, patience and sacrifices, possible but difficult.

Mobs should not try to implement laws. Thats what courts are for.Even corrupt courts are better than mob justice.
Whether Delhi,Gujrat or Gojra criminal hide behind mobs.

It's true that the said law has been used times and again by the religious zealots to carry out their violence sagas they often unleash upon those they hold the 'lesser Muslims.'
Not surprisingly, in nearly none of the cases of blasphemy registered since the notorious amendment of Zia's times was a proof created that could be substantiated to the alleged culprit.
The fact stays that the law was merely one of the other blind, biases and idiotic instances of Zia's regimes and continue to haunt our nation even today. The blasphemy law ought to be immediately dissolved to the relief to a vast majority who doesn't want to be Mullah-styled or else be held hostage by them over refusing to jump to their side.

Those that helped craft the blasphemy laws in Pakistan are sadly not pseudo scholars. They have studied Islam and that’s what Islam is all about, and indomitable ideology with no room to wiggle. Blasphemy laws of Pakistan are just another nuisance along with many other idiotic laws and certainly not an isolated instance. The basic psychological ailment that the Mullas suffer from is their delusion about being the sole guardians of Islam and that of the dead Mohammad (pbuh). If it were not for blasphemy, they will surely find some other reason to denigrate the religious minorities of Pakistan, like requiring yellow armbands. This is no different from the early days of Islam, under the leadership of Umar and Moaviya, for example.

Good job Nauman Asghar.

"I would like to see you give me references from the books where it says it was the "fear" which made people to convert."

here is a sample of conversions in sind during Qasim's invasion-

In one of his dispatches to Hajjaj, Mahommad bin Qasim is quoted to have said :
" The nephew of Raja Dahir, his warriors and principal officers have been dispatched, and the infidels converted to Islam or destroyed. Instead of idol-temples, mosques and other places of worship have been created, the Kulbah it read, the call to prayers is raised, so that devotions are performed at stated hours. The Takbir and praise to the Almighty God are offered every morning and evening. "

so - "....the infidels converted to Islam or destroyed...."