Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde

Pakistanis are not smarter than western people or vice versa. However, pakistanis who have migrated to western countries and have achieved success do not represent ordinary Pakistanis. The successful Pakistanis have to be educated, intelligent and hard working. The main difference is the strong institutions that allow deserving and brilliant people to reach their full potential. I have seen highly effective people become total failure in Pakistan because there are no institutions that allow fairplay. Japanese,Korean and other western people add up by working in unison whereas Pakistanis and Indians subtract from each other.

other

whoops i gave you guys my old e-mail it`s sidrapower@hotmail.com not sidra333.=)

Re: TAhmed321

That is an important point, building character. In this context, this implies a moral code for personal and public behavior.

Now, my question is the following: Why have the religious and cultural institutions failed to teach even the basics of this character building?

The problem is very deep-rooted. Pakistan is full of ``religiously trained`` people who have no qualms about committing murder or any other crime in the name of religion. What is the reason for that?

Let us examine the driver`s behavior: (a) he was not stupid (he ran off when he sensed the gas was leaking); (b) he lacked concern for other people or any sense of responsibility (he ran off leaving his truck in the middle of a populated area). The failure is one of character, not one of intelligence.

Let us examine the cook`s behavior: (a) he was a talented cook (no doubt); (b) he was wrapped up in his own self-importance (he ran off when the client was unavoidably delayed). The failure was one of character here as well, and perhaps no less than that of the driver (even though the conseqences were less tragic).

So, brother Wasiq, perhaps what we should be concerned with is building character in our children (if you do not have any, you will one day).

RE: Tahnoon Pasha

Granted we (LDEs) are poorer in terms of access to basic needs of life such as food water, sanitation. Granted we have more people and more poverty. Neither of these is a logical reason to ape the development models of the West. An economy is a function (for want of a better word) of the society it is based upon and vice versa. Superimposing a financial or economic model which worked in a developed economy is not going to work. It has to make sense to the people of that economy and be user-friendly with the social system; it should make the people work and motivate them to keep on working. What makes that happen in USA may not work so well here.

More on the spiritual front: What is meant by quality of life?. Is the West happier with more food? `Must be` an Ethipian thinks. But happiness is a relative term. No number of things can give peace or happiness. It comes from within. One may create all the text-book conditions for it but it may still remain elusive. Remember that underneath the 20 mattresses the princess still felt the pea. Sensitive skin or just a chronic complainer?

Re: Saima Shah

I think the point is that however constrained people in the occident are, they are freer than us.

Ascetism is very noble, but socially counterproductive. Numbers of dying infants, enslaved brick builders and starving peasants would probably take exception to your view.

The material resources of the west afford a latitude to pursue alternatives unable to those wishing to earn a living wage in our nations.

A final point. In the papers recently, 200 mostly innocent people were slaughtered in Algeria, Man-made forest fires in the far east are covering whole nations in haze, and from further back in memory the body count in Karachi in 95/96 ran into the thousands. That kind of inner peace I can do without.

I echo Safwan`s hope that our children will be ``free``. Free from wondering if their being Asian is a handicap. Conversely, I dont quite agree that Western `achievement` is it. Is the West free? Don`t atrocious umbrages to human dignity exist in the West? I think there is a LOT Asian cultures offer to anyone pursuing self-realisation, and spiritual growth. I feel we are strong. But different. In a world order where desire for material things is overtaken by a need for spiritual truth (inner peace) I think the East will offer many solutions.

Nicely put.

Without prior knowledge of the incident, or the people I can only speculate. I think you may be doing them a slight injustice. Among those affected could have been artisans, expert woodworkers, even some-one who made a mean daal-maash. I don’t mean to minimise the tragedy. The driver was culpable. The municipal authorities were slow, uninformed and arguably incompetent.

In mitigation, you highlighted the ignorance of the proponents. This is not a trivial point. There is no he-reditary meme for handling industrial chemicals. One ontological view argues ``there is no rational excuse for altruism``. In an earlier post you argued the merits of universal education. I refer you back to that to answer the closing and subtextual query in your article. Multiple forms of education are essential if we seek to enhance and fulfil the potential of our nation. My opinion is that we cannot assume a driver is less skilled in his milieu than an expert chef or a hod carrier. Neither do we have the means and in my case the inclination for an experiment in mass social engineering.

We can demonstrate the value of co-operative and responsible behaviour, we can make education more accessible and we can make it a more critical success factor. In no instance will we be able to eliminate the potential for selfishness and ignorance from people. At best we can limit the consequences and reduce the frequency of such occurences.

The ultimate question posed here (the staggering difference between the desi and the west) does not
seem too unanswerable to me. You almost
seem to have answered it yourself in
the last paragraph: As the reason for your knee-jerk ``Heck NO``, you mention that Pakistanis who come here do at least as well
as their western peers, and usually better.

So for instance, compare yourself and your life till now, to the culpable truckwalla and his likely upbringing and life experiences upto the point of the accident. You will surely see many factors wherein lie the differences.

I think the more interesting (and less obviously answerable) conflict is in comparng the present to teh past - the truck walla to the laborer of two hundred years ago. But there I feel that a more pervasive (i.e. not restricted to the desis) degeneration has taken place. The modern day motivations for the majority of human existence are fear (of being found culpable, inadequate) and self-promotion (as someone who is not culpable, inadequate, afraid).

Only the trees store the potency, reality of prior existences.

Good thoughts in the article. Thank you.

Got me thinking. Well, I see the first 2
paragraphs as metaphors for (1) Self Respect even pride and (2) Selfishness -to say the least. I subscribe to the notion that ancestry has nothing to offer except false notions. I also subscribe to the notion that individuals and cultures need to be proud of themselves before they can do others proud.

The comment by the elderly acq. clearly indicates that ``we`` suffer from a deep rooted complex that makes us doubt our abilities. Why it exists is something to wonder about.

Some obvious factors, in my opinion, are the British Raj, the Mughal Raj, the various other Raj`s and Invaders. I think that these kingdoms programmed us to doubt ourselves and admire the ``raj al waqt.`` Even religion and dogma contributed. We were always made to feel that we are great because of our faith and family name and not because of our accomplishments and actions.

That we feel ``intellectually impotent`` is a natural outcome of several hundred years of ``intellectual genocide.`` The day we stop this ``genocide`` things will begin to change very rapidly. I cant speak for others but I am willing to admit that in the back of my mind this ``stereotype`` of a ``dumb darkie`` does exist. And that I do take competition with the Westerner as a challenge. Regrettable isn`t it? But then this is what happens when a society or culture is made subservient. May our children be ``truly free.``