The Price of Journalism

Re: Godot

`` Pakistan = 0

India = infinitely better ``

-- I would`nt say that. There are areas where pakistan is infinitely better also. For instance, casteism in India . There are still many people in India who are subjugated in terms of caste. Granted , caste exists in the form of feudal class in Pakistan too. However, unlike the class system in Pakistan, in India the caste system does not let someone from a lower caste move forward under any circumstances whatsoever. I can quote more examples where Pakistan is doing much better. However, keeping a perpetual hatred of India alive in the minds of the people of Pakistan works favorably for their politicians. The Indian politicians did try to do the same, but these grounds were never accepted by the Indian people since, very few in India share a common boundary, culture, tradition, etc with Pakistan.

About me being Rana`s spokesperson.....Hmm, let me assure you that i don`t intend to be one. Rana is probably quite capable of speaking for himself. I am only as much a spokesperson for Rana as we all are for say Najam Sethi. Does that clear it up :)

Rishi

dear beena,

can you please email the text of najam`s speech that is supposed to have offended the sharif government? my email address is anil_s49@hotmial.com

Re: Ferozk, #51

Your lopsided sarcasm duly noted.

Re: Rishi, #52

Pakistan = 0

India = Infinitely Better

Re: Rishi, #53

See my response to your Reply #52 above, and congratulations for your promotion as the Spokesman for RanaRansher!

re: maliani #50

Thank you. A couple of days ago, when i had read your post about the Subho Teendo banning, i had told a friend in Dawn. He immediately passed it on to other people within Dawn. Later i heard back from my friend saying that Dawn sources had been unable to confirm the news.

I did not mean to make it seem as if i were doubting you. As no papers had published the news until today, I just wanted to confirm that you had gotten the news from a reliable source. Given the immediacy of the net, news tends to multiply and come back to you from several ``different`` sources, although in reality the original source of all the leads is the same. In the current panic about the govt`s attitude towards the press, i just wanted us to avoid falling into such a self-fulfilling trap.

Re: Godot # 49

You wrote ``.....Pakistani and Indian leaders do not care about the abject poverty their respective countries are mired in. They use each other as tools to advance their own domestic political agendas, and keep their countries hostage to nationalistic motherland this and fatherland....``

Game, set and match!!!!

Re: Godot

This is not an India-Pakistan slang war. So please don`t misconstrue it as such.

A common mistake that many a pakistani makes is that given the amount of India centricity and india bashing that exists in Pakistan , they assume that such a reciprocal Pakistan centric polity would exist in India too. However let me assure you that this is not true. Even the nuclear bomb blasts by Pakistan did not evoke any response/fear/state of agitation among the common populace in India. Compare this with the situation in Pakistan after the Indian Bomb Blasts. Just check the content of our national newspapers. Compare www.dawn.com with www.samachar.com and you would realize the prominence given to India in Pakistan and the almost irrelevance accorded to Pakistan in India. Having said this let me add that it is only natural that people of both our nations react the way they do. A host of factors are responsible for this such as population, size, religion, democracy, poverty, economics, secularism, etc.,

However, one would have expected something better from someone who posts as intelligently as u do. You need not have ended your answer to Rana the way you did. An Indian friend i Know states with conviction that no Indian can hate Pakistan the way a Pakistani can probably hate India. I would be really happy if this statement is false.

Given the ground realities, i don`t think there can be any quick solution to a stronger secularism or democracy in Pakistan. The rise of Hindu fundamentalism in India does not help either.

Rishi

Re: Godot

--- Projection ?

Rishi

Re: subuhi Reply #43
Source: http://www.dawn.com/daily/19990514/index.htm

Sindhi Magazine ``Subho Thendo`` banned
Updated at 13:20 PST (08:20 GMT)
In a fresh attack on Journalism, the Sindh Government has banned a Sindhi monthly ``Subho Thendo`` published from Hyderabad, Sindh.

The Home Department, Government of Sindh, vide letter No. XII (10) SO-I, dated May 6, in exercise of powers conferred on Home Secretary under Section 99-A of the code of Criminal Procedure, 1898, imposed ban upon further circulation of the magazine in the province of Sindh and declared that all the copies of the same, if found in circulation, be forfeited to the Government of Sindh.

The Magazine ``Subho Thendo`` (DAWN will DAWN) is published by Gul Hassan Karano from Hyderabad. According to Home Department, it contained material against religion, the Federation of Pakistan, the Army and Intelligence Agencies. The copies of the notification have been given to the interior ministry and the Director General ISI, Islamabad.

Re: RanaRansher, #47

Can`t disagree. However, I hold to my belief that it is better to keep your enemy confused, chaotic and weak. A prosperous Pakistan is far more dangerous to India than a weak Pakistan: more money, more influence on the world stage, more confident, more spending on the army and new advanced weapons, etc. And that Kashmir issue! A prosperous Pakistan would not have tolerated, what is it, 200,000 Indian troops in Kashmir busy raping, looting and pillaging.

What it is, my friend (if I dare to call you that knowing that we don`t see eye-to-eye), that both Pakistani and Indian leaders do not care about the abject poverty their respective countries are mired in. They use each other as tools to advance their own domestic political agendas, and keep their countries hostage to nationalistic motherland this and fatherland that. Unless the leaders in both countries have vision and, yes, balls, Pakistan and India will remain enemies.

I don`t know why you keep talking about India`s ideology and Pakistan`s ideology. Who cares! From your other responses I`ve read, it appears that you despise Pakistan more than I despise Pakistan`s leaders. That is saying quite a lot, my friend (oops!).

Re: Rana Ransher # 47

Rana, I agree it is in India`s interest to see a stable Pakistan, but the problem is that Pakistan is so focused on India-centric issues and how to keep up with India that it is ignoring its own problems. India is a Pakistani problem, because unfortunately our politicans play the India card to mask and generally ignore Pakistani domestic problems. India is a scapegoat of Pakistani politics which allows our so called political leaders to avoid making hard choices and admitting their own failures by blaming India and anti-Pakistan-Islamic western conspiracies for the misery that haunts Pakistan. India, as a nation and an idea, dominates Pakistani thinking and we, Pakistanis, are fixiated on Indian actions and all our thoughts, actions, intentions and accomplishments have been nothing more than a reflection of what India does!

I agree with you completely on this matter. Whatever happens in Pakistan will have a direct impact on India. The present nightmare in Pakistan is not in Indian interests, but the question is how can India help Pakistan become more economically and politically stable? I can not speak for Indians or for India, but I would bet that there is willingness in India to tolerate a status quo with Pakistan and that implies a desire to settle the question of Kashmir by translating the Line of Control into an international boundary. An even harder task towards the political and economical stablization of Pakistan is how to convince its political leadership that it should divorce its India specific myopia and instead it should concentrate on its own problems.

That is the challenge India needs to address if it wants Pakistan to be stable and the odds are against it, because the Pakistani leadership, for self-expedident reasons, will resist this logical approach to solving Pakistan`s problems.

re: Godot

Extremely narrow minded and myopic view vis-a-vis India, reflected even in your politicians you despise.

It is in India`s interest to see an independant, self suffiecient, and prosperous Pakistan which will mind its own business while keeping itself busy constructively. The same applies to Pakistan`s interests in India. India`s ideology is completely different from Pakistans and it needs to remain that way. The biggest fear a lot of Indians have is, if there is `social unrest` in Pakistan, they will involve India (just as you are), afterall, it is always the kafir pigs fault !!!!!! You blame your politicians of creating `Indian scapegoats`, in the process distracting the general public from other issues, yet you yourself indulge in it.

Just look at the arms situation. In Pakistan automatic weapons are commonplace (most manufactured in Dera). These weapons have been pouring into India. Forget all the `holy warriors` and other irregulars. I am not blaming `Pakistan` for any of this, yet the link is there. If Pakistan is in a state of confusion, all these activities will only increase. It is besides the point whether Pakistan `officially` approves or disapproves of it.
Just read all the effects of having a porous border between Afghanistan and Pakistan, while Afghanistan was going through its civil war. Didn`t lawlessness, armed conflict, Islamic radicalism infiltrate into Pakistan.

You are making the same mistake your leaders are vis-a-vis your attitude to India.

Re: Farz # 39

First of all, I agree with you that the likes of myself will not alter the reality in Pakistan. My most basic intention is to not change the reality in Pakistan over night for the better, but to suggest that Pakistan needs help. I am not suggesting western policemen in Pakistan enforcing human rights. Even if I did that, the western governments would be loathe to risk being embroiled in a Pakistani mess.

This is the bare bones of my idea. Pakistani government and its political leadership has to be made accountable to the people. It has to respect and encourage basic human rights for the people of Pakistan such as a decent living condition, a sense of personal security and a freedom from hunger and poverty and access to a standard eduation. It must be stressed upon the mind-sets of the Pakistani political leadership that it`s purpose is to serve and protect the people of Pakistan and not to subjugate them to its power.

Given the state of Pakistan and its high ill-literacy rates, the people of Pakistan can not do this. Hence, we have to force a standard of accountibility on the government of Pakistan. The use of foreign aid could achieve this goal, because it is a force-multiplier; that is it can leverage a political situation to a certain advantage. Pakistan is a bankrupt nation which needs foreign monies to pay the interests on its debts. Remember, the sanctions against Pakistan, for its nuclear tests, will be re-imposed in October of this year after a year`s waiver and the question is, what has Pakistan done to deserve another waiver! It has practiced policies of denying press freedoms, it has continued with economic mis-mangement and its sense of security has not been attained for which it tested nuclear weapons.

Pakistan`s security is not threatened from outside, but from its own lack of crediable policies internally. The road Pakistan is determined to journey on will end in a disaster. The reality is that given its past performances, the re-imposition of sanctions will not be waived again and Pakistan will be in the same economic melt down that it was after the sanctions were imposed. Then Pakistan begged and cried and promised its western donors that it be given monies to help its economy. Those sanctions were lifted, conditionally on Pakistan agreeing to a nuclear non-proliferation regime, and Pakistan seems to working towards that end.

Thus, the question is, why can not the economic aid to Pakistan be made conditional on its human rights and democratic record. Pakistan is the begger in this situation and it can not choose which policies it wants to follow, because it is mortaged to the hilt to western nations. Pakistan`s affairs have to managed by western nations as a trusteeship of a bankrupt corporation and Pakistan has to be administed as a business enterprise. Pakistan needs western money to survive and in the past, the example of sanctions has shown a weak point in Pakistani government`s ability to resist political demands when the issue has been monetary assistence. Consequently, this weakness should be leveraged for maximum benefit of Pakistan in a general sense.

Hence, pressure must be leveraged against Pakistani governments to amend their ways and if this course of action, western aid for human rights, works it could be tried, because there is no down side to it!

Re: subuhi Reply #43

The news came to me directly from the Editor of the magazine. I will still confirm.

Re: Kant Patel, #42

Kant, it is difficult to deny that India and Pakistan are enemies. People like you and me, among other Chowk wahlas, wish to see relations between India and Pakistan not any different than the relations between the US and Canada. But, given the leadership of both countries, that is only a fantasy.

Given the reality, isn`t it better to see your enemy chaotic and hence weak, and hope that it remains that way? Me think that since Nawaz Sharif is making sure that Pakistan remains chaotic and bankrupt (both financially and morally), and hence weak, he`s the one who is working for RAW! He should be the one put on trial for treason, not Najam Sethi.

Re: maliani, #37

Hi - could you confirm where you heard the news about the banning of the Sindhi paper? I`ve heard that Dawn sources were unable to confirm the news. There is no mention of it in today`s papers. I received an almost identical posting about the banning (complete with index of articles) by email yesterday from a separate email list. Yet the similarity of the two postings suggests they came from the same source and one does not necessarily confirm the other.

Re: Chowk editors` link to Sethi`s speech at beginning of Sarwar`s article

Please update the link to reflect the new TFT website (although i`m not sure if the new pages have put up the text yet?). Your link still leads to the old, now defunct site. Thanks.

Re: Godot

You say, ``Good for India``.

I don`t think so. No country wish to have a country in perpetual chaos as its neighbor.