Discovering Ali Hasan

re amber

i like the way you have inserted that poem at the end. makes the point well. but for the line

``My face is my dowry sir.``

i would change it to:

My brain is my fortune (dowry) sir.

cheers :)

I`m surprised at all those going on and on about Ali Hasan being immature, loser, needs to get-a-life etc etc. When I first read this story, my first impressions were that this guy went through the classic symptoms of what`s called a CRUSH. Other ways to describe this would be Puppy love, and being head-over-heels in ``love``. For those of you who think this is a desi-male phenomenon only, I ask that you step into your average high-school/junior high school in the west and you`ll find that most non-desi kids have experienced some version of crush-like feelings too. i.e being consumed by feelings of ``love`` for someone they`ve only seen from a distance or talked or danced with once.

For those wanting to dismiss this as male-only behavior, let me remind you the BackStreet Boys and N`Sync wouldn`t be selling any records if it weren`t for the hordes of teenage girls who are absolutely ``IN LOVE`` with these ``cute`` boys that sing ``I`m going to Love you forever`` in 10 different ways and then distribute that as a new album release.

Have any of these girls ever met the boys? If they are lucky they dished out $50+ for a concert and saw them from a distance and dreamed about the day they will be walking down the aisle with them.

Pathetic? Of course! Not to worry though, most will grow out of it in a few years when they hit their 20`s.

Ali Hasan`s problem is that his background is from a culture where exposure to the opposite sex is limited. And as such his puppy love stage is repressed and comes out at a later age when he hits college. To add further complication he is attracted from afar to a girl who is obvious very different from him in many ways.

If he was in Pakistan and was attracted to some girl in college, he wouldn`t be consumed by such doubts of whether the girl will ``blend in`` to his cultural background and personality. He`d simply chat it up with the girl. If the girl, being likewise inexperienced in ``love``,is sufficiently attracted to him, would proceed to fall into puppy love. And then both would live happily ever after... Until the parents find out that is! :)

What I doubt is completely realistic about Ali Hasan, is the fact that he`d ``decide`` not to pursue her after pondering the prospect for a few days. In my opinion he most likely would have pursued such a relationship, which either resulted in something great or something horrible. If it did end horribly then after that he`d approach his mom and tell her to find him a ``Piyaari, shareef, and non-taiz`` larkee.``... :)

Cheers

Fozia

Jawahara2: Hilarious pun. The Jewels have probably been conferred to someone else by now, given the strong & intolerant patriarchical family background of the person i had in mind. However, I shall always hold the exclusive intellectual property rights in that nick name.:)

Hope you & she both find real happiness in life. You are both equally impassioned about certain things. Repression does no good but create serious mental problems in desi chicks.

regards,

OMAR

re omar1974,

chowk has had `the guts` to print material far more provocative than anything you could possibly dig out of the mind of a desi male.

re fozia,

sure you find this everywhere, sure young women can be equally stupid. it`s just very pathetic to see this is a college student, particularly one who takes himself and his sense of identity very seriously.perhaps its also that rehan has erected a cardboard figure for me, representing all that i detest in the male of this species, and shooting bull bullets at it is a form of venting for me (and perhaps other anonymous readers).
the difference between the east and west is that in situations like this in most other countries where bands like boyzone etc are popular, the kids in question grow up, have the opportunity to experience different forms of lust and love etc.here, there is no tomorrow. there is only the endless day of immaturity as soceity,tradition and religion slither together to form a blanket around his perceptions. the pakistani male will not grow up because his doing so will threaten the fabric of our present soceity, of his power, of his control over the workings of this country. he doesn`t need to grow up, he just needs to learn how to provide..in this he is as much a slave to expectations as the woman is..but his reward is greater, not just more freedom (movement, speech etc) but also houris in heaven when he dies.

re faraz,

may i suggest that it is impossible for you, a `not married` male, to ever even come close to understanding the saas-bahu relationship.

shandana

Dear Slink a/k/a Shandana,

Then We Shall See.

OMAR

Hamlet & Ali Hassan

Perhaps its only appropriate that the Prince of Denmark and the vaccillitating nerd boy appear together in the same essay. He too was neurotic, and prone to the anxieties of Nerd boy here. They do share similar character traits, and ``the thing`` preys too deeply upon their minds as they vacillitate between action & inaction. I wonder if the author realized this irony he inadvertantly created by quoting from Hamlet or not ? Can we get an honest answer ?

OMAR

Re Jawaraha

``Faraz, if success and happiness of a complex relationship like marriage is measured by an absence of divorce, then yes, arranged marriages are totally successful``

No, no no. That was so not my point. My point was that even accounting for the fact that some desi marriages are held together by the taboo associated with divorce, the success rate (the presence of ``Companionship, friendship, love, support etc. etc`` in a good deal of arranged marriages) is too high to be considered due to chance alone. There is something in the system that does work. I wasn`t implying that it is the only feasible option or even if it is the most feasible, only that there is some intrinsic merit to it.

re: slink

Do you ever write anything with a different intent than that of shocking people?

``chowk has had `the guts` to print material far more provocative than anything you could possibly dig out of the mind of a desi male``

and

``the pakistani male will not grow up ``

I`m not insulted, just amused at your little tirade. It would be pretty interesting to see the response from the feminazis on Chowk if a desi male were to ever make such sexist statements directed at desi women.

Oh and I can`t ``ever`` understand the saas-bahu panga? Never? Too stupid to?

And the Houris waiting in heaven: Take it up with God.

Faraz

Its the turn of the century. With all its portends of doom and promises of el dorado -- the 21st Century stands poised.

Oblivious masses of humainty stare happily at the shadows shifting, morphing, undulating on the walls that hem in their lives. Distorted perceptions of morality engage in a desperate scuffle with dimmed intellects and blunted spiritualities until passion thought emotion reason are strangled -- by the unyielding rhetoric of culture and religion that rules upon the foundation of innumerate ``because we say so``.

Then why blame the product of the system ? Ali Hasan is a product of the system. And for every insensitive, immature gland there exists a self absorbed bundle of caprice.

Maybe Ali Hasan did make the right choice. For him. After all its not easy being a scandal.

cheers

dL

re faraz,

`did you ever write anything with a different intent than that of shocking people?`?

actually, yes. the only thing i have written with just the itent of provoking people was `city of gargoyles`. if you go back and read my second comment to rehan, you`ll find i advise him against it.

`non-married male cannot ever understand the saas-bahu relationship...too stupid etc`

that comment was not a personal statement meant to hint at your stupidity. i do believe to truly understand a situation, you have to be a part of it. right now, you aren`t, and since you are male you will never have the same relationship with your saas that you future wife will. this has nothing to do with whether you are stupid or not. don`t take it so personally.

shandana

It does not matter whether one is desi, valayetti, cheeney or japani, love and lust are basic to our nature.

Tender nurturing and a sustained diligent effort cultivate love over a period of time. Love gradually grows and constantly evolves. It is multidimensional. It is the evergreen tree that grows from the seeds of liking planted in the soil of trust. It needs sharing, patience and understanding, like a plant needs water, nourishment and sunshine. Neglect or abuse it and it can perish. Cultivate it and love thrives.

Lust is only the raw animal passion, as real as hunger, thirst, pain, anger or joy. None of these passing waves ever last, but they are all valid and must be celebrated as they manifest life itself.

Sudden infatuation, on the other hand, usually breeds repentance.

re: slink

This is off the subject (an irrelevant tangent) but I`m beginning to get concerned about this growing trend on the Chowk. Just because its becoming an obsession does not mean that I`m off the mark, there must be a conspiracy somewhere here. I wrote about it under Zehra`s `Muslim in You Ass A` article, but then the article vanished somewhere deep into the cyber bowels of the Chowk. The plague is spreading and you are the third person to get effected now.

First it was BG (who became bg) and then Zehra become zehra and now et tu shandana from Shandana? Why do you women only use all lower case letters in your writing? (No guys have demonstrated this malady yet, so it may be gender specific?) You certainly didn`t used to do this before, but now you too do it.

Like I said to Zehra, I`m not imploring anyone to use UPPER case letters (in first person singular pronouns, beginning of sentences and proper nouns, name initials and acronyms). Is it just plain old laziness that prevents you to press the `shift` key? Is it, as I am really beginning to wonder, some radical feminist revolt against patriarchal conventions of English language? What is it? The trend is growing others are also doing it more and more.

now i`m no longer just plain old curious. i am getting worried, the bug is spreading.

...SR

dear dear sr,

i`ve always used lower case (you can go back and look at my oldest posts on chowk main forum if you like..or you can just take my provocative word for it). it`s because i`m too lazy to find the shift key.if i did it once, then the beginning of every sentence would expect me to act the same way.
if there is indeed a conspiracy..i`m not going to be the one to break and spill the beans.

.handana

re sr

you are cracking me up. no, please dont write in lower case only. as easy as it may be to type, its harder to read ;)

fyi, i know one man who types in lower case only, inspired by crunchy-granola organizations who use lower case only (in their materials) to appear friendly, accessible, informal.

i think the men on chowk dont, because aside for a few notable exceptions, they tend to be more conformist than the women. (of course i`m not suggesting that using lower case only is some kind of political statement, but it does show indifference to tradition)

you already know why shandana and i do it. lets see what zehra has to say...

re faraz

`` feminazis``

dear faraz, you have hit a nerve. pardon me while i go into a monologue:)

first of all, ``feminazi`` is just a label to discredit feminists/feminism. and like all other labels, it is meaningless. it is meant to deride, not to respond to any real feminist concerns or arguments.

secondly, this lable feminist + nazi implies a fascist feminist. this may be a funny way to retort, but does in no way do any justice to the feminist ideology or movement. the most basic definition of feminism that most feminists would probably agree to is: equal rights for women and men (however defined). no feminismt movement has every been fascist in the way that movements in the US or europe are/were or like the religious movements in our part of the world are. i can understand when rush limbaugh coins and uses this term (what else can one expect from him?) but it is troubling coming from others who may not have bothered to think about the term or about feminism.

thirdly, feminism has NOTHING TO DO with man-hating or man-bashing. if women attack men, it doesnt mean that they are feminists or that feminism promotes man-hating or that all feminists are man-haters.

the best feminist thinking focuses on power analysis and at its core, feminism is a challenge to traditional relationships, distribution and structures of power.

feminist critiques go way beyond what are understood as gender relationships -- that is the relationship between men and women. they include contributions to history, philosophy, epistemology, sceince, theology, economics, politics and popular culture, to name a few. speaking for myself, feminism has given me a whole new look on LIFE, not just women, not just men. it has not taught me to hate men. on the contrary, i am much more sensitive now to different kinds of oppression that men and women face for different reasons.

regards.

re: bg

No offense intended. It is a pretty funny term though (and no, I`m not a fan of Rush).

re: Her Slinkness

``that comment was not a personal statement meant to hint at your stupidity``

I`m hoping that was just poor sentence construction and not another insult!!! I`ll give you the benfit of the doubt.

Faraz

ps. Oh and ladies, its ``Faraz`` not ``faraz``. I know its a big zehmat for you but please, maree khatir, hold down that shift key.

Re Omar: repression creating serious mental problems in desi chicks..

one day some chick is going to just smack you..unless it hasn`t already been done. repression creates problems in ALL people..though i do feel that desis are better equipped to handle and ignore it and lead relatively normal lives. the strength to deal with repression is inherent for the average desi, male or female. and just for clarification purposes, i don`t consider anyone on chowk to be the average desi. also, i read your article and it seems that chowk may go ahead and publish it..it wasn`t all that risqué as you claimed it to be..talk to shahbaz ( where is that boy?)..you seemed to want to elicit a reaction from me ( seeing how i am the token hijabi feminist non-conformist activist on chowk)..truth be told, i thought it well written, a lil more editing would refine it and it was entertaining. thanks for sending it on to me. i wasn`t recoiling from anything you had written cuz i have friends who would fit the character you portrayed. one of them a former boyfriend.

Re: sr and the lowercase conspiracy..

my lips are sealed and go back to my other posts..im always lower case…i don`t believe however that ive gone from Zehra to zehra as of yet..the cult headed by ``---`` has not fully transformed me, but i have said too much already. do not worry, dear SR, we are safe and loved and will be better human beings for this. (that`s what the brochure said) sachee main waisay, im just too damn lazy and i like the way it looks. though when i type my replies up in a Word document, it automatically capitalizes etc for me..so that is nice :) i have had complaints about it before. also, thanks for responding about your kids growing up and the kind of identity issues they may or may not face..im looking to actually design a major that deals with culture, politics, ethnicity, history and philosophy all in one..the closest thing ive come to that is folklore..lets see kya hota hai.

Re :feminism

just to add on to what bg has said about feminism…people will always ask how i can call myself a feminist and still wear hijab and support arranged marriages, or the big one, plan on not having some professional career..that actually angered many of the young women i studied with at a woman`s college..well, the answer is simple, feminism allows me to be whoever i choose to be. whoever i choose to be is the most important thing to me and i realize that somewhat naively i assume the rest of the world will follow suit..that is just who i am..

Re: the pakistani male

fozia seemed to think it was natural for him to feel this way since its just a crush. tto me, as i mentioned before it seemed really pathetic that one glance of her was enough but then again, that is the idea of ishq in pakistan..for the masses atleast. this is why i believe that arranged marriages to some extent do work in pakistan and other places around the world ( faraz, i don`t feel that most marriages are unhappy..many are but not most..gross generalization on your part). personally, since the idea of this kind of ishq does not jel for me, i would never be satisfied by an arranged marriage but there are people whom it works for, and why not let them be happy? in omars story, (the one he thinks chowk will not publish for content, he emailed it to me), one of the women portrayed is this bold and daring creature but she goes ahead and marries in the traditional way. in the story ``for my love`` on chowk, read the two sides that there are to every issue..its never, never just black and white. i hope that makes sense to some extent..sorta tangential but then that always happens on chowk :)

as a sidenote: all those interested in a big chowk bash, email me at errerr@hotmail.com. im just seeing how many people would actually want to attend. feedback is important.

z. rizvi

Dear Zehra,

Thanks for your comments. I guess i was just trying to point out that not all desi guys are so bad as to want their mama`s to pick out their wives for them. Come to think of it, in Freudian terms, isint that just a little bit sick? The woman who gives birth to you also picks who you share a bed with? Or is it just me thats out of touch with reality? So much for all the good mama`s boyz.

Z says: Re Omar: repression creating serious mental problems in desi chicks..

one day some chick is going to just smack you..unless it hasn`t already been done.

REALLY !!!! I seriously doubt that (its been done just once, by my current gf and i don`t remember why). If anything i`m a pretty good shoulder to cry on, and someone who generally can be counted on to empathize. As for being smacked, gee thanks ... feel free anytime. Its true i probably would let any woman get 1 freebee ....:) FRANKLY ZEHRA, i`ve seen just a bit too much repression among desi chicks up close and personal to just ignore it. And it seems to be the direct result of the desi culture. It doesn`t matter whether its in Pakistan or in N.America. Its the same crap dished out by the majority of desi parents everywhere that creates psychiatric patients out of their otherwise perfectly healthy normal daughters. Some suffer silently, others act out.

But i suppose one can argue its most interesting from a clincal study point of view when the kids grow up in N.America while the parents are still mentally still living in Pakistan (of 20 years back). That really creates the most serious problems for the kids. I think that the reason you felt like smacking me is that what i said hit a sore spot and really rankled with you. Otherwise you`d never have lost your cool.

Its okay Z, like i said, one freebee (its true I can usually just about get anyone`s goat).

Smile,

OMAR