Let’s talk about Bollywood

veeresh #103

As far as I`m concerned, be my guest. Just send me tickets to the premiere.. :-)

the happy one #105, #106

Right on the mark!

Adding to SameerJB`s corrupt cop, the slimy sleazy Munshi or blood-and-sweat second-in-command who may or maynot want to marry his daughter/son into the hero/heroines` family.

One guess about the use of Urdu in courtroom scenes is that it was the language of business, law and administration before Independence in the Hindi belt and still may be the language of law? I know previous generations in my family used Urdu in business/legal documents.

About Hollywood stereotypes, sure, even their trailers are stereotypical. Count the number of Hollywood trailers which have the blood-pounding intonation `Only One Man ...`,`One Man...`, `Only One Woman ...`(less common)

SameerJB #109

About Roshan, it seems after `Barsaat Ki Raat`, people would go to see movies just because Roshan was listed as music director. I think there was a movie `Qawaali ki Raat` made just as a showcase for him, though I`m not 100% sure.

About `Gazal`, I don`t know if it is the same movie as you mention, how about `Rang aur noor ki baraat kise pesh karoo`n` with the line `maine jazbaat nibhaaye hain usoolo`n ki jagah`? Pretty subversive stuff, now :-)

Sadhana

Mannyd: Roshan has been long dead. Here is something I found about him on the internet.

Roshan was born in GujraNwala on July 14, 1917. He got his music education in Lucknow with Ustaad Alaauddiin Khan and Manahar Barve. He was associated with AIR, Delhi as an artist and instrumentalist for many years before joining the movie industry. He died on November 16, 1967.

Three of his famous movies are Barsat ki Raat, Tajmahel, Dil hi to hain. He has given great music to many many songs. But no song is as famous as the ``Na to karawaN ki talash hain``. Taj Mahal with Pradeep Kumar and Beena Roy was watchable only because of songs like ``Paav chu lene do phulo ko inaayat hogi`` and ``Jo vada kiya wo nibhana parhee ga``. One of his memorable music is for Sahir’s Ghazal, ``Tum agar mujhe na chaho to koyi baat nahin--ghair ko chaho gee to muskkal ho gee``. May be the poet is threatening honor killing? Just kidding!!!

The Happy One: Ba-Mushaqqat means ``with hard labor``. You must have seen, in the movies, many prisoners working in the fields or breaking stone. That is ba-mushaqqat. Another memorable corrupt politician role is in the movie ``Inqilab`` where Amitabh Bacchan as a good police officer guns down all the politicians. Another typical vilaina are police officers and one of the best depiction is in a recent Punjabi movie ``Mahaul Theek Hai`` by Jaspal Bhatti. It is worth watching.

London`s famed Madam Tussaud`s museum announced its decision to create its first ever Bollywood star in wax.

Museum spokeswoman Diane Moon yesterday said: ``Bollywood stars enjoy the same international icon status as the biggest in Hollywood. However, we haven`t yet made a decision about which star we will approach.``

Acknowledging the audience-pulling power of the Indian film industry, she said, ``We are currently seeking advice from a selection of Bollywood pundits to come up with a shortlist of candidates.``

The public will then be given a chance to vote on the final choice for the wax figure, which will cost 30,000 pounds

Re: Sadhana

You might like this one... this is how a judgement is read

Tamaam bayaanaat.... Moka-e-vardaat per paaye gaye tamaam saboot.... aur muljeem ke ekbal-e-julm ko madday-nazar rakhte hooay... Yeh adaalat ees nateejay per pahoNchi hai ki... Dafaa teen so doe aur dafaa teen so bayalles tazeerat-e-Hind ke tahet... Muljeem ko Katl-e-aam ke julm me Bees saal sakht-e-kaid baa-mushakkat karrar di jaati hai.

Do you have any theories on why verdicts are read in Urdu? Also Ive been to several court sessions and hearings in India. Nothing really sounds works or looks like the typical movie courtroom. Theyve probably been using the same set at Filmistan for all shootings thus far. Like any thing else, the court scene in a Hindi movie has its own rules, syntax & sequence. Its all the same, very predictable and nothing to do with realism.

And BTW, what does `Baa-mushakkat` mean?

Top 10 Villain types

Every thing in the Hindi movie industry follows trends. Somebody comes up with something successful that seems to touch a chord with the masses. It could be a tune, a lyric, a plot, an actor, a situation, an animal, an inanimate object, a deity, an actress, a line, a comedian, a type of villain, anything... generally referred to as a `formula`. The society at large is always in a certain state defined by the times and if a commercial movie maker wants to rake it in he would have to find a way to put a finger on the pulse of the society at just the right time. All formulas have their contextuallity in time. They work briefly and then they get over worked and something fresher had to be invented. Those are the rules.

The character of the bad guy is no oddity and follows the same rules as any other ingredient of the formula. Following is my roughly chronological list of top 10 bad guy trends that I can remember.

1. Evil Landlord:

Feudalism was rampant. The evil landlord theme struck a chord with the masses. Scenes like the landlord`s ``saaNp kaa saMpola`` Chhotaa Thaakur riding into town with his buddies asking Raamdin to send his little Chhamia to the Haweli that night characterized the oppression subjected upon the feudal subjects. This would then translate into the scene where the Chammia is chased thru the Haweli and ends up into the Thakur`s bedroom, gets backed up all the way to the window and promptly turns around and jumps.

Prime example: Cant think of one....Any suggestions?

2. Daaku:

A more stark version of the evil landlord. This was primarily due to the rural market gaining tremendously in importance and also based partly on reality due to the notoriety achieved by real life Daakus in Chambal valley. Different versions of the Daaku ensued... the Robin Hood touch could be applied with ease and so could the Mexican bad guy from the westerns. The latter resulted in the most successful movie of all time `Shollay`. Speaking of shollay.. what a movie, huh? And the casting! Who would have thought that the casting of Sanjeev Kumar & Amjad Khan would overshadow that of Bacchhan, Dharmendra & HemaMalini.

Prime example: Amjad Khan`s Gabbar

3. Evil Industrialist:

The more sophisticated version of the evil landlord. By now the nation was well and truly immersed into the ``Jai Jawaan Jai Kissan`` mentality and this was fully exploited by filmmakers. Especially Rajkapur who took the socialist cause and married it with the Charlie Chaplin`s tramp and played on both the `tough times` and the `proletariat unite` themes. These movies and other works of popular culture during these days, reflected the fact that in India it was virtuous to be poor and evil to be rich. Only in the post Manmohan Singh era have we finally seen the fading of this attitude.

Prime example: K.N. Singh`s many roles

4. Gold Smuggler:

These days were of strict state control on all kinds of trade. The gold shortage brought about this allure and mystique about gold biscuits. How innocent must the nation be at that time that movie after movie showed the absolute baddest dude to be somebody who broke trade tariff & octroi laws! But this mild badness gave rise to the subtly comic villain. Embodied by Ajit whose character alone gave rise to a joke cult and about a gazillion web sites and joke posts. In interest of all concerned I shall refrain from digging into my vast reserve of Ajit jokes.

Prime example: Ajit`s Loyan (was it Hamid Ali?)

5. Megalomaniac Super Evil dude:

This character was probably generated due to fear of a military takeover and India`s long history of evil insiders collaborating with outside conquerors for a shot at the coveted `puppet ruler` spot, but its also a popular bad guy in movies across the globe perfectly parodied by Mike Meyer`s Dr. Evil.

Prime Example: Amrish Puri`s Mogambo

6. Evil Minister/ Evil younger brother/ Evil uncle etc.

The quintessential Shakuni Maama. Need I say more? The one actor that I can think of that made a living out of this character was Jeewan. But my prime example does not go to him. This character also has shades of that wisely bad guy who collaborates with outside forces.

Prime example: Prem Chopra`s Shambhu ka dimaag do dhaari talwaar

7. Local Gangster:

Organized crime had arrived and the common city folk really felt the brunt of it. Extortionist was rampant in the big cities and since the market had shifted in a big way towards the urban population, most themes were very urban. This is also a variation of the evil landlord but in the urban violence context.

Prime Example: Sadashiv Amrapurkar`s Raama Shetty

8. Evil Politician:

The movies that had the gang violence also depicted the nexus of politicians with gangsters and inevitably ended with the death of the gangster with the overall feeling that the real bad guys, the politicians remained untouched. Then of course the movies were made where the actual politician was chased by somebody like nana Patekar down the street and slaughtered in front of the masses.

9. Terrorist/ Arms dealer:

Obvious response to what has been happening lately in India. This is the biggest problem facing the nation and folks are fiercely nationalistic.

Prime Example: Naseeruddin`s Gazal singer character from that Aamir Khan movie? I dunno.

10. Neighboring hostile nation:

Again... post Kargil, what else did anybody expect? A lot of care has been taken to not name Pakistan specifically. I fail to see why. I remember in war scenes they said `Dushman` is doing this and `dushman` is doing that and then they would show the `dushman`. By appearance then you could judge if they were referring to Pakistan or China. Although Pakistan is clearly insinuated in many of these movies its not my all time favorite.

Prime example: Dongrilla (A map in the villain`s control room showed China with `Dongrilla` written across it)

Notable exclusions: Compulsive Rapist, British General, Serial killer.

Any more suggestions or examples?

P.S: If you think hard enough you can find parallels in Hollywood to all of the above categories. The Hindi movies & their characters are a 100 times more caricaturized that`s all.

Reply: 101

He has a Gujarathi father and an English mother and brought up in England.

Ref. Sameer #77, #78

``I actually like Sahir/ Roshan couple lot more than Shakeel/ Naushad and do not mind listening to all kind of Punjabi, Urdu/ Hindi ..``

You took the words out of my mouth Sameer Sahib. Roshan produced some memorable tunes for some non-movie songs and Ghazals also(Available on 3 part cassettes). I wonder if he is still alive.

Thanks for the article on Noor Jehan. I had the pleasure of listening her in concert here, but while growing up in East Punjab, many of her Urdu songs you mention somehow did not get on the local air-waves. The Pakistani Punjabi songs were of course played everywhere. This is before television was introduced on the sub-continent. Things are probably different now.

VK # 70

Being a fan of Naushad or Roshan does not mean I belittle the work of other music directors you mentioned. When you have time fill us in on R.D. Burman`s work. Yes A. Rahman is good and promising. Who else would you put in his leauge these days?

Ref. Sameer #77, #78

``I actually like Sahir/ Roshan couple lot more than Shakeel/ Naushad and do not mind listening to all kind of Punjabi, Urdu/ Hindi ..``

You took the words out of my mouth Sameer Sahib. Roshan produced some memorable tunes for some non-movie songs and Ghazals also(Available on 3 part cassettes). I wonder if he is still alive.

Thanks for the article on Noor Jehan. I had the pleasure of listening her in concert here, but while growing up in East Punjab, many of her Urdu songs you mention somehow did not get on the local air-waves. The Pakistani Punjabi songs were of course played everywhere. This is before television was introduced on the sub-continent. Things are probably different now.

VK # 70

Being a fan of Naushad or Roshan does not mean I belittle the work of other music directors you mentioned. When you have time fill us in on R.D. Burman`s work. Yes A. Rahman is good and promising. Who else would you put in his leauge these days?

I can make a movie script out of these responses. Please advise if rights are available?

F_K #99

Looking for ``bigotry & hatred``, ``clothed/unclothed heroines`` ``very good songs``?

Its all here:

www.thefridaytimes.com

``Reema in the dock

According to daily Jang, filmstar Reema, clad in burqa, finally appeared in the court of a Lahore additional judge to face charges of singing a song which prayed for the long life of both India and Pakistan. Frivolous litigation is made possible by a provision in the Penal Code.``

Sadhana

Mohajir

the movie from a few Indian directors and the choice of Ben Kingsley (born Krishna Bhanji) ?????????????

Pardon my ignorance but Ben K is of Desi decent? Please explain

Two films, two nations - Editorial

If you want an example of how India and Pakistan differ as nations, then the sagas of the Gandhi and Jinnah films provide a perfect contrast.

The Gandhi film was made by an eminent British director, found international success and won an Oscar as Best Picture of the year, beating even Steven Spielberg’s ET. There were low-key protests against government financing of the movie from a few Indian directors and the choice of Ben Kingsley (born Krishna Bhanji) for the lead role was resented by some actors who worked in Bombay. But the protests quickly dissolved once the film was made and almost everybody agreed that Kingsley made a brilliant Gandhi. Nobody minded that a foreigner wrote the screenplay or objected to the movie’s other stars — except, of course, the Pakistanis. Pakistan banned the Gandhi film. One of its main objections was that the role of Mohammad Ali Jinnah was played by a relative unknown (Alyque Padamsee) and that the Qaid-e-Azam had been given a raw deal in the screenplay. It took the Pakistanis nearly 15 years but eventually, they came up with their reply to Gandhi — an English language movie called Jinnah. Curiously — in view of their objections to Padamsee — they did not choose a famous Pakistani actor to play Jinnah.

Instead, they hired Christopher Lee, whose chief claim to fame was a 1960’s low budget horror flick called Dracula — Prince of Darkness. Nor were they able to assemble the kind of international team that made Gandhi. They used a Pakistani director and the movie’s guiding spirit, a Cambridge academic called Akbar Ahmed, said he would write the screenplay himself. Throughout its filming, the movie faced protests from Pakistanis and after it was finally completed, everybody was unanimous that it would not even approach the success of Gandhi. Thus, it was unloved in its own country and rejected by the world at large.

Now, Jinnah faces a new controversy. The film’s director has alleged Akbar Ahmed did not really write the screenplay. A London-based Parsi called Farrukh Dhondy did it. Dhondy agrees that he wrote it but says that he accepted payment in a variety of semi-clandestine methods (air tickets, etc) because Ahmed told him that he was a non-Muslim and thus could not be seen writing a movie about the founder of Pakistan. Ahmed, who is now General Musharraf’s High Commissioner to London, faces the double embarrassment of defending himself against allegations of lying as well as fighting a law suit filed by the film’s director. Indians will find all this bizarre. Nobody here objected when Saeed Jaffrey, a Muslim, played Sardar Patel in Gandhi or cared about the religion of the script writer. There was no subterfuge, no deceit and no Dracula. Perhaps that is the difference between our two countries. And that is why Gandhi got an Oscar while Jinnah is stuck in the law courts.

sadna:#98

Kaisay teer andaaz ho seedha to kr lo teer ko.

Please direct your bigotry & hatred where,I think,it really belongs.Arabs never conquered India.Afghans,Iranees,& Turkistanees did.

Also a lot of Indian are earning ver good money in arab speaking countries.You might be their Aalam-Fuqra(third world) but they are the Paymasters too.Syed Nehru really drooled over them.



And now for something completely different:

Follywood follies:

How about the eternally classic``Tehro,yeh shaadi naheen ho sakti``.

Ever wondered why the urban hero can never profess his love in hindi/urdu.It is always``sadhna,Ilove you`` rest is in hindi/urdu.

(I know the reason why --it is profound--but will not divulge it yet).

Why is the heroine always ready to shed clothes.Why so much dirt & vulgarity.Sometimes I feel that they are zoo animals in heat separated by the bars but they can smooch through the openings.So pathetic.

english movies are worse---but at least they are on diverse subjects & plenty to choose from.

My favourite of the ones I rented recently:

Ashwani----superb music by Ravinder Jain.Acting,what a treat!

another one:Ishwar.very good songs & one dance-number really really intellectually,sensously,& emotionally gratifying---not in that order!

wassalaam.

FARANGI_KUSH #97

I will leave the Arabs for another time and place.

syjam #85

I`m glad to see you back.

Over to Bollywood and stereotypes:

sobia, sac, futema, your earlier responses to an earlier post `aakhir aap chaahti kya hain?` :-)

sobia, sure thats another unescapable line: `mein tumahare bacche ki maa`n banane wali hoo`n`. If its a supporting character played by say Aruna Irani, well and good, no female mortality issues, but if its Sridevi its a sure date with death.

A few tail-enders:

`aaj se tum ghar sambhaalo, ab mein aaram karoongi` (precursor to morning scene with newly-bathed heroine in white/yellow sari with a red border singing devout bhajan inspiring beatific expressions in the whole household including faithful retainer, young winsome hero is always late, BTW)

`Sahib Mein khaana laga doon?` (Darkened posh home of hero, he comes in holding his coat slung over his shoulder)

`Nahin tum khalo aur so jaao, mujhe bhook nahin hai/mein bahar se kha ke aaya hoon`(Dark stirrings in so far clean-living hero`s soul, ominous sign of haemorraging relationships)

`Sahib bibiji ne savere se kuch nahin khaaya hai`(using time-honored methods of emotional blackmail to domesticate self-absorbed insensitive selfish male. Notice, w/o the faithful retainer, long-suffering heroine would have starved to death eventually)

`ab aap kuchh karoge bhi ya yuhin chup chaap khade rahoge`(much further down the road after her transformation to fishwife)

`potey ka moonh kab dikhaaoge?` First it was `bahu ghar laaoongi` then `chand ka tukda`, now this.

`Mein Kashi jaa rahi hoon`(Matriarch trying to shame too-independent family members into accepting her continuing dominance over their affairs)

`mein aisa hargiz nahin hone doonga` (audience winces, fun and games over, as well as all songs except the cabaret and a sad number, heroine will henceforth appear only soberly dressed in saris, the long haul begins )

`mein kuch samjha nahin` ( What has long been obvious to the well-trained audience if not to the moronic hero but story must be carried forward, its a movie not a Test match)

Stereotypes such as these are the safe signposts of the movie world, inspite of it all I will actually feel sorry if Bollywood decides choose more cynical idioms. I will then watch Telugu movies which BTW have quite as much glamour and a lot more innovation in story lines:-).

Sadhana

macgupta & sadna:#94 & #96

At least my `fulminations` have elicited some informative responses.That was the idea.This would benefit ignorant among us muslims & also perhaps those hindus who care not.

The Swamijis writings I`m reasonably familiar with.His visit to Chicago to attend the world religious conference in or around 1860 is a matter of pride for us all.It is also important to teach our children the `treatment` meted out to him by his hosts(not all,of course).His devotion & service to his Guru suffering from leprocy and the Swamijis `proof` to the Doctors has been a beacon for my understanding of some aspects of medicine & human will-power.

My teacher,my guru has composed a beautiful poem to pay his homage to the great Swamiji---The one & only,IQBAL.

May be,of late,the intellectual tickling by me brought tears to your eyes.That was not the intent.I firmly belief that true friendship is to learn about the others belief rather than sanitize it & pretend that it is not there.The children who go to secular schools are suddenly confronted with the real world headlines & then they are unable to cope with it as adults.Religion is not problem,it is a necessity and we better harness its power early on in the formative years.Most hindu/muslims are scared of each other because of their non-chalant attitude towards religion.

No matter how much we want it we cannot wish religion away.If past 10,000 years are any indication, let us not delude ourselves into thinking that we in the 21st century are `different` & `modern` and our forefathers were a stupid moronic provincial bunch.To test the waters just seek an opinion about yourself from your children.

Let us try to live together as proud practitioners

of our faith and try to find common inter-active ground within these.Creating new beliefs & theories would only be fractious.

I did not mean to make it my long `Dominant Discourse`--thank you bilal ahmad.

And thank you all!

wassalaam.

Veeresh:#92

2)About``show me``

Let me enlighten you ont that:

Everything really is about money & power plus you can add looking `foreign` in your homeland,having spent years in Ba Ba Blacksheep Schools,& knowing western trivia.Show me someone who abhors all these and I`ll show you a Digembar Jain Sadhu.A good sight for you to flaunt your under-wear fetish.

for the uninitiated:(Digembar Sadhus never wear any clothes and walk around without even a whiff of an underwear)

3)Banning,albeit temporarily,reigion & adoption of sanitized & radiated handles:

This is the dreamworld of an avowed atheist,secularist,& ex-socialist---

``Religions of the world!Unite,you have nothing to lose except some `friends` & relatives.``

PS:Plenty of under-wear sites on the net.Why pukar? a poor parody of the colonisers at best.

You see muslims never roll over & play dead.

wassalaam.