A Nation of Beggars

Brilliant article!!

Ameeri Badao -- reminiscent of Deng`s exhortation to fellow Chinese: ``It is glorious to get rich.``

You mentioned something about India being wealthy until 800 years ago, and then the Brahmins did something -- what was this change you allude to?

There has been no reformation since Adi Sankaracharya in the 8th century AD. As late as 1800 (almost 5 decades after the British won the Battle of Plassey), we accounted for 20% of the world`s wealth -- see Paul Kennedy, ``Wealth of Nations.``

Cheers,

Sunit.

http://www.salonmagazine.com/may97/wanderlust/passages970520.html

Ther was an excerpt in SALON magazine of Octavio Paz`s article on India. Late Octavio Paz was awarded the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1990. His most recent work is ``The Double Flame,`` published in 1995. He says:

There, awaiting me, was an unimagined reality:

waves of heat; huge grey and red buildings, a Victorian London growing among palm trees and banyans like a recurrent nightmare, leprous walls, wide and beautiful avenues, huge unfamiliar trees, stinking alleyways,

torrents of cars, people coming and going, skeletal cows with no owners, beggars, creaking carts drawn by enervated oxen, rivers of bicycles,

a survivor of the British Raj, in a meticulous and threadbare white suit, with a black umbrella,

another beggar, four half-naked would-be saints daubed with paint, red betel stains on the sidewalk,

horn battles between a taxi and a dusty bus, more bicycles, more cows, another half-naked saint,

turning the corner, the apparition of a girl like a half-opened flower,

gusts of stench, decomposing matter, whiffs of pure and fresh perfumes,

stalls selling coconuts and slices of pineapple, ragged vagrants with no job and no luck, a gang of adolescents like an escaping herd of deer,

women in red, blue, yellow, deliriously colored saris, some solar, some nocturnal, dark-haired women with bracelets on their ankles and sandals made not for the burning asphalt but for fields,

public gardens overwhelmed by the heat, monkeys in cornices of the buildings, sh *t and jasmine, homeless boys,

a banyan, image of the rain as the cactus is the emblem of aridity, and, leaning against a wall, a stone daubed with red paint, at its feet a few faded flowers: the silhouette of the monkey god,

the laughter of a young girl, slender as a lily stalk, a leper sitting under the statue of an eminent Parsi,

in the doorway of a shack, watching everyone with indifference, an old man with a noble face,

a magnificent eucalyptus in the desolation of a garbage dump, an enormous billboard in an empty lot with a picture of a movie star: full moon over the sultan`s terrace,

more decrepit walls, whitewashed walls covered with political slogans written in red and black letters I couldn`t read,

the gold and black grillwork of a luxurious villa with a contemptuous inscription: EASY MONEY; more grilles even more luxurious, which allowed a glimpse of an exuberant garden; on the door, an inscription in gold on the black marble,

in the violently blue sky, in zigzags or in circles, the flights of seagulls or vultures, crows, crows, crows ...

Ref FARANGI_KUSH #: 41

You ask {How to worship the cow and still eat a juicy steak without the red red blood gushing out of its nostrils & arteries.Such is the tyranny of life Ramoobhai.}

Actually, not a problem at all. Vedic rituals such as a Yagna call for the sacrifice of a cow, offering its flesh in the sacred fire, and then eating the roast beef as ``havis``. We had barbecues going in India long before you guys invented sheesh-kababs.

Mohajir:

Why this great need then to cut & paste and come to a Pakistani site and ``play the armpits``(baghlain bajana).

Obviously such articles are there to make the hindus look good.We have no problem with that.When was the last time you read anything good about the Muslim Ummah.

What do the rekhas & kundlis say.Are they not reliable anymore? Have they failed? No gods drinking milk anymore?

Ever seen hindus in North America grovelling for muslim dinner invitations?Can`t buy biryani on their own?Always on the look-out for secularists?

How to worship the cow and still eat a juicy steak without the red red blood gushing out of its nostrils & arteries.Such is the tyranny of life Ramoobhai.

__________________________________________________

http://members.xoom.com/_XMCM/KoenraadElst/articles/superpower.html

India, superpower in the 3rd millennium BC-and AD

by Koenraad Elst, Leuven (Belgium), 5 May 2000

In the 3rd millennium BC, the Indus-Saraswati civilization was the world leader in science and technology as well as in trade and philosophy. We are witnessing a return to India`s roots, considering the bright prospects of India in the 3rd millennium AD, soon to begin. In current discussions about this development, the Pokharan nuclear tests were the inevitable main points of reference, because they have acted as an eye-opener to Indians and foreigners alike. The tests have made the point that India now plays in the top league: technologically, because Indian scientists have demonstrated their mastery of that very technology which, after 1945, decides a country`s status in geopolitics; and politically, because India has demonstrated the will and capacity to assert its vision of a multipolar world, as opposed to the unipolar ``new world order`` inaugurated by the Soviet implosion. In this guest column, I would like to look into some of the implications of the emerging power e! quation.

India`s relations with the Muslim world It is still customary in the Western media to see `Hindu India` as one half of an antagonistic duo with Pakistan or the larger Muslim world. If this perception was ever valid, the nuclear tests and other developments have rendered it completely obsolete. Pakistan just cannot compete with India, and the Indian tests were correctly explained as necessitated by India`s defense needs vis-a-vis China and the US. Contrary to all predictions by foreign `experts`, the BJP government has not built gas chambers for the Indian Muslims, and it has not given an anti-Muslim thrust to its foreign policy.

In this connection, I must congratulate the present ruling party, the BJP, for a policy of which I personally used to be a critic. When you study the BJP`s foreign policy statements since the party`s founding in 1980, you find that they strictly avoid any confrontationist positions vis-a-vis the Muslim world as such. There were of course harangues against Pakistan and its proxy wars, there were warnings against Islamic `fundamentalism`, but underlying all this was a basic assurance that a BJP government would continue India`s policy of cooperation with Muslim countries, in parallel with the BJP`s charm offensive towards India`s Muslims. While independent Hindu revivalist intellectuals have analyzed relations with the Muslim world in terms of a `clash of civilizations` since long before Samuel Huntington popularized this expression, the BJP`s approach was strictly nationalistic: treat Indian Muslims as Indians, and likewise treat the Arabian Muslims as Arabs, the Ayatollahs !

as Iranians, rather than as representatives of a mythical pan-Islamic power. In years past, I used to deride this de-ideologization of the Hindu approach to the Muslims as a sign an intellectual sloppiness and opportunism; but in fact, it is eminently wise policy. While focusing on Islam as a doctrine remains a valid project for scholars of comparative religion, it would be wrong for politicians to treat Arab or Indian Muslims as essentially spokesmen of Islamic doctrine, reducing them to their religious identity. In reality, the national interests of Iran or Egypt and the individual interests of Indian Muslims are shaped far more by objective realities than by religion. Hence the correctness of the BJP`s approach of disregarding religious identities and emphasizing national identities instead.

Policy-makers in the West should pay more attention to the difference in economic and technological performance between India and the Middle-Eastern countries: while the former is poor but dynamic, the latter are rich but stagnant, unable to outgrow their status as a mere market for American goods. India`s image is increasingly determined by its brainy engineers rather than by Mother Teresa, and the country should prepare to take a leadership role in the progress of its less dynamic West-Asian neighbors. Among other things, this will help all parties concerned to exorcise any remaining bad memories of religious conflict, and get on with their lives. For Muslims in India, it is now glaringly clear that their best interests lie in joining the mainstream. They have given up on Pakistan, witness recent occasions where Indian Muslims celebrated Indian rather than Pakistani sports victories. Pakistan, let`s face it, is in a shambles: it is socially stagnant, educationally backward, economically bankrupt, and the number of Muslims killed in sectarian violence in the last five years is a hundred times higher in Pakistan than in India. Indeed, Pakistani Muslims too are reconsidering their position, increasingly emphasizing their ethnic (Sindhi, Baluchi, Pathan) identities and musing about some kind of confederation with India. While Pakistan as a state has an obsessive hostility to everything Hindu and Indian, India can treat Pakistan as just a nuisance, a failed state from which an increasing number of Pakistanis seek to free themselves. India plays in a higher league, it is one of the emerging world powers, and South-Asian ! Muslims want to be part of this, rather than play along in Pakistan`s pitiable proxy wars.

India and the USA

One of the sad aspects of the Cold War was the estrangement between India and the West. For most of the time, India has been the only democracy between the Jordan and the Yellow Sea, and should have been the West`s natural ally in the region. Attitudes on both sides were shortsighted and pre-occupied with ideological posturing and strategic calculations, but that should all be history by now. The aftermath of Pokharan saw a lot of anti-US defiance among Indian politicians and commoners, but now that the dust has settled, India should prepare for global partnership with the US, China and other countries to ensure peace and cooperation. The US, on its part, should of course invite India into the club of permanent Security Council members: this is a demand of fairness, but also of American interests. Both the US and India have been major targets of terrorism, so the US cannot continue to sponsor anti-Indian terrorism in Jammu and Kashmir all while combating anti-American te! rrorism in the Middle East. To the extent that the US sees China as a threat, it has an interest in treating India as a counterweight and check on Chinese expansionism. This is all so obvious to any rational observer, and it is about time US policy-makers wake up. Probably the gradual realization of the failure of the punitive policy against India, imposing `sanctions` on a fellow nuclear power, which only draws more strength from them, will drive the message home.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/south_asia/newsid_769000/769635.stm

Excerpt:

``A team of engineers in Delhi say they have found an innovative way of bringing the internet cheaply and quickly to India`s rural population.

They plan to use India`s extensive railway network as a conduit for communications cables. Stations along the route will also be part of the network.

The team is adding cybercafe kiosks to stations along the track for use by local people without their own computer equipment.

Experiment

A pilot project has just started which covers 40kms of railway track with 5 stations along it, linking two towns in southern India, Vijayawada and Guntur. It should be finished by the end of June. ...``

A non-sequitur, but thought people would like to to know this:

http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/00/05/biztech/articles/28india.html

I would like to learn more about this.

The quote is from Murad`s response to Ananth``

``Concerning your strong words Ananth, I should point out that I am also a historian and stand up for my point of view. The cast system of the Vedas was very different to what it later became. The caste system virtually died during the 1000 years of Buddhism and took a completely different shape on it`s revival after the 8th century. Brahmins, as the keepers of India`s religious tradition, did much for enriching India`s culture, religion and philosophy but they also shaped the evolving caste system. Today`s Hinduism has little to do with the Vedas but a lot to do with the Puranas composed between the 4th and 10th century AD.


They used the moral sanctions from convenient parts of the Vedas as well as convenient portions of the Manusmriti (dated between 227 and 320 AD) to define a whole new meaning to caste. It was, however, Kulluka`s commentary in the 7th century that was to make it so oppressive.


The Brahmins may not have been intrinsically feudal but they revived a dying caste of Kshatriyas and made them an arrogant and feudal caste more concerned with their pride and honour than with any concern for their subjects. It took a few centuries before their influence squeezed out India`s vitality and made ritual and orthodoxy supreme.``


Since Murad is not a regular on line contributor may I ask gymnosophist or arun or someone else better informed to elaborate?

rgds

t

GEN MUSHARRAF`S PRESS CONFERENCE

Gen Musharraf seems to impacted the psyche of a despondent nation in his pidgin english press conference the other day. Most Pakistanis do understand the need for reform more than they did a week ago. Reorganising the government, cutting its expenses and getting people to paying their dues is fine but he seems to have avoided the need to answer the question of the defense budget which needs to be cut down. Eventually people reforming themselves and arming themselves for a war against indebtedness and economic malaise will question the need for maintaining this kind of military posture. The regime will also face sabotage at the hands of the civil bureaucracy who are past masters at creating incidents that imperil governments. In this case the murders of a trader in Faisalabad by the tax people and the murder of a young boy, the other day, by officials of the Agriculture Development Bank whose father owed the bank Rs 23,000. An incident like this is enough to trigger a riot that all the strategies and tactics of this regime moot. The pressures generated by the mother of all shylocks IMF is equally to blame in this case.

For all the haughty posturing by RI`s and all the sermon preaching by the NRI`s, the fact remains that India has as much going for it as it has dragging it down. Why can`t we shut up and just fix the damn roads, generate sufficient power, provide clean drinking water, and build highways? It`s nothing complicated and we need not get into esoteric debates about economics and politics to do it. There`s ample funding from the ADB, World Bank, taxes on corporates, and foreign investors to pull this off if the government can display some competence. Despite all our brainpower and technological expertise, our airports (all of the subcontinent`s, not just India`s) still look like farm sheds in a banana republic. Isn`t there an irony when the newly minted software millionaires drive up to the airports in their Mercs and pass through these airports? In India, for example, the Tatas offered to build and maintain a new world class airport in Bangalore but demanded that the government buzz off and not interfere. Of course the government cribbed, delayed and played games and the place still looks like a barnyard. The power minister decides to start cracking down on power theft in UP and the workers, i.e. bribe-takers, go on strike. Let them. They`ve funded many an ostentious wedding from these bribes and we know exactly how poor they are, so let them strike and crib.

Following response was sent by the author via email:


I just opened Chowk and have been amazed at the number of responses to my piece on Beggars.

In reply to the 30 reactions I would like to first thank Macgupta for his elaboration on the manipulations on poverty data by NSS, NCAER and others. These clearly underline how important poverty is as a manipulative tool for many people in India and elsewhere as well.

I would also like to thank others who have detailed progress in other countries. In particular Ras Siddiqui for his interesting dope on the infrastructure development in Pakistan. As a motoring columnist among other interests, I found the data on the highways fascinating. Building a good infrastructure is very important but it is not the only key to progress. India unfortunately spends very much more on subsidies than on infrastructure so it loses out on both counts but is lucky to have a strong private industry going for it.

Many writers have taken up many side issues. I am not an NRI and have not considered their points of view though these are also interesting.

The main thrust of my short article was that the `beggar mentality` over the past century that has infected so many officials and their political masters and now hurts progress and shows India in a much worse light to foreigners and locals than it deserves to be.

The second thrust was to indicate that poverty in India, while undeniable, is not all that it is cracked up to be.

The final point was that all the soft peddling on core issues, usually in the name of the poor, has hurt India`s work ethic and unless people in Government or business work, there will be no progress.

As you say Vikram I the last thing I want to do is to bash India. I love it too much. With many years experience in tractor marketing I probably know more about rural India and its poverty in every region than most people I know. I love the country and my strong words are a cry of pain for the huge opportunities we are losing while words, laws and ritual actions are bandied about instead of real work to get to the roots of the problems.

Time does not wait and lost opportunities are lost forever. Tomorrow`s opportunities wait for tomorrow but today`s loss is lost forever. The suffering and pain endures while planners play their intellectual or material games. Socialism is a failed experiment and capitalism is no instant manna. The only ism we need is pragmatacism.

Concerning your strong words Ananth, I should point out that I am also a historian and stand up for my point of view. The cast system of the Vedas was very different to what it later became. The caste system virtually died during the 1000 years of Buddhism and took a completely different shape on it`s revival after the 8th century. Brahmins, as the keepers of India`s religious tradition, did much for enriching India`s culture, religion and philosophy but they also shaped the evolving caste system. Today`s Hinduism has little to do with the Vedas but a lot to do with the Puranas composed between the 4th and 10th century AD.

They used the moral sanctions from convenient parts of the Vedas as well as convenient portions of the Manusmriti (dated between 227 and 320 AD) to define a whole new meaning to caste. It was, however, Kulluka`s commentary in the 7th century that was to make it so oppressive.

The Brahmins may not have been intrinsically feudal but they revived a dying caste of Kshatriyas and made them an arrogant and feudal caste more concerned with their pride and honour than with any concern for their subjects. It took a few centuries before their influence squeezed out India`s vitality and made ritual and orthodoxy supreme.

Thank you all

Murad

Vikram # 30

You totally miss the point. Everytime an Indian critisizes India, other Indians jump on her or him as ``bashing`` the country, but it is precisley b/c of their love of country that they say what they say. of course india has much to be proud of, and one must always balance the bad with the good. my concern is that we pat ourselves on the back a little too much. i kind of liken it to the NRI parents who constantly critisize their children no matter how well they do. the parent has such high standards for the child and never complements them no matter how well they do. i`m not saying that this is the most balanced approach to parenting, but do you think that the parent dislikes or bashes their child? no. they just have high expectations, just as all indians should have high expectations for their country.

don`t you think its sad that you`re pointing out how well indians deal with power outages without asking why we even have them? and besides, no matter what anyone says, these are just words. why don`t we as indians leave the complements to others (and if others don`t complement india for her accomplishments, who cares?) and focus on correcting our problems -- problems which are our own fault and can be fixed anytime we are willing to face up to them.

regards,

harish

Ref Vakram #: 30

``Look at any western country and tell me do you think they can survive even a simple power cut without going ballistic ? I dont think so. So the next time you decide to trash my country make up something substantial.``

If Indians went ballistic over something as simple as a power cut, dragging out the local Electricity Department engineer and linemen and lynched them, do you think there would be any power cuts? I know MLAs and MPs who get direct lines from the local substation so they do not have a power cut when the local yokels have to swelter in 112 degree temperatures. This attitude of ``Good enough for Indians`` is not actually self-denial as you imagine it to be but contempt for oneself; you don`t think you deserve any better. Perhaps YOU don`t but don`t make the rest of us suffer for that.

Yea for the software industry! Back to coding sheets when the power goes off and you can`t use your computers. I really can`t believe the sh *t that comes out of Indians` mouths when they talk about their software industry. I can find high school grads in the US who can code as well as you guys do and probably with a greater sense of responsibility. And I am yet to see world-class software packages come out of India. Name something that successfully competes against something like SAP or Oracle Applications. As is typical, you guys won`t invest up front in product development. That is why you still have to go buy stuff from the US and Europe.

This shows how indifferent both our governments are.

The Man Who Never Was
After 26 years, Pakistan releases an Indian spy
By RITU SARIN New Delhi

``Sahariya, who was apparently released on health grounds, is now trying to get used to being a free man in a large city. His wife, Sashiwala, re-married soon after his capture, and he remains bitter that the authorities offered her no help in adapting to his sudden absence. While he may have been lionized by the Indian media, the man who never was has been largely ignored by the Indian government - apart from being debriefed at the airport by intelligence officials. He is a lonely, aging spy, looking for support and compensation for his lost years. He may get neither.``

For full story pls. go to:

http://cnn.com/ASIANOW/asiaweek/magazine/2000/0602/nat.india.html


rgds

t

Hi,

I was absolutelyy aghast at your article, how can you so blatently just overlook at everything that we have achieved over the past 50 years, 63 % literacy, immunisation 160 million children, our huge software industry, the smart younger generation, democracy, you dont seem to appreciate any one of those, sure we have our misgivings in the past but nothing we are not working towards. Yes the politicians are crooks but not all of them are you know. I am proud to be indian, indians are survivors, we have survived for 300 years and will do so for 3000 more. Look at any western country and tell me do you think they can survive even a simple power cut without going ballistic ? I dont think so. So the next time you decide to trash my country make up something substantial.

Re: 28

Mr. Chaudhary: Dream on, pal! your paranoid hatred of India and your pathetic hope of it breaking up, both are hilarious. Dream on!

Re: 27

Arun, now lets not have another division, between RI/NRI`s, as if we dont have enough divisions already. I am a sometimes RI and sometimes NRI, and so I can say that it doesnot matter where an Indian is, India remains in his/her heart. Might sound tripe to you, but thats how I feel. Of course there maybe many different ways people might feel about how to improve things back home, but lets not generalise, please! No more NRI/RI, Hindi/Non Hindi...just discussions among Indians.

Regards