Indians and Pakistanis Must Start Anew

Ylh,Umair,krashid,urstruly,kafir khan et al.

(and a lot more proud Muslims of India & Pakistan,on THIS side of chowk LOC).

When has intellectualism achieved anything.Is it not great that you know the hindu mind a bit better now.Remember,they are after your body.Are you willing to offer? or rather would like to operate on their body and change THEIR mind.

(We are certainly indebted to the great swamiji for letting us know the inside story----unless Sudheershun Kulkarkani misquoted him(& I think he did) then I really really thank Mr.Kulkarni for being a `ghar ka bhaidi` for his side).

Think about it.

Keep on the relentless fire,Mujahideen e Chowk.

It`s KARGILL TIME AGAIN

(Ghulkhand can wait KAFFIR KHAN).

[Anybody following the news lately.Farooque Abdullah & all(HA HA HA),IOC in Malaysia,Frances` resonating slap on the Ugly Satans` face.(The Ba Ba Blacksheep newspapers[english] are squeamish about these---``what will Uncle Sam think,hain jee.

--------``The `world it is` a-changin```.

__________________________apologies to Bob Dylan

__________________________________________________``Quwwatt e Isque sey hur pust ko baalaa kr dey

dehr mein ism e MUHAMMAD(sww) sey ujala kr dey``

A L L A M A IQBAL.

tr:With the POWER of your PASSION(ishque),uplift

the downtrodden.

And brighten up this earth by the name of MUHAMMAD(sww)

__________________________________________________

with dua pyaar ,

WASSALAAM

__________________________________________________

dear udayakumar

``we shall fight them in the hills, we shall fight them in the mountains, we shall fight them on the beach, we shall fight them on the hills and in..``

said winston churchill (or at least words to the effect)to which mad magazine asked: ``oi, how about fighting them in germany?``

likewise, how about making peace with `them` in india first?

secondly, have you been the northwest frontier province?

i haven`t but i`m told it`s no picnic. i think one bihar is quite enough, thanks very much.

regards

aakar patel

correction #60: ``The example of Kashmir points towards the later occuring, and not the former.``

should read, ``The example of Kashmir points towards the former occuring, and not the later.``

Dear Mr. Kumar,

I would never want to live in a unified India. I consider Brahminism the most vile, inhuman, and un-natural socio-religious system ever. We in Pakistan are lucky to have escaped and have no desire to go back. We are more prosperous, better educated and healthier than the unfortunate muslims left behind in India. Our places of wroship are in better shape than Babri mosque and Golden temple. Can you even count the number of muslims killed in anti-muslim roits in Ahmedabad, Bhiwindi, Bhagalpur, Bombay, Dehli, Faizabad, Moradabad, Meerut, Surat and nummerous other God-forsaken places while your law enforcement agencies either watched or actively participated?

If I were an Indian, I would be more concerned about the BJP wallahs who bombed a mosque in AP the other day, and who have been killing priests and bombing churches and descerating (sp?) christian graveards. Have the Brahmins who forced their urine down the throats of 3 nuns in Bihar been caught yet?

Mr. Kumar India needs your attention, we don`t.

Kabuli Wallah and iahmed both have accused me of things without even researching the truth ..

Once again may I say that my knowledge doesnot come from a Pakistan Studies Textbook because I really never went to a Pakistani school ....

Since to Indians all Pakistanis (except a tiny minority which is against the two nation theory) are biased ... and also because all pro Pakistan western scholars are also biased ... I am going to mention a book by a congress party worker who fought for independence in the 1940s and is an ardent admirer of Mohandas Karam Chand Gandhi and is a Hindu and an Indian ....

The book is

Quaid e Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah and the creation of Pakistan

by

Sailesh Kumar Bandopadhya

sterling publishers private ltd 1991

Do read !

The fact is simple and clear

Pakistanis dont want reunification!

So leave it that

TO THIS GUY IAHMED

FIRST OF ALL I NEVER WENT TO A PAKISTANI SCHOOL SO

This guy iahmed is obviously a new comer ... and he has made some assumptions .. DONT MAKE ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT ME ...

Pakistan was not made in the name of Islam !!!!

If this guy had cared to read my posts or read History would know more ... the irony is that these people speak without even bothering to read

PAKISTAN WAS MADE TO SHIELD THE MUSLIMS OF SOUTH ASIA (WHO CONSTITUTE A DISTINCT NATION NOT ON THE BASIS OF RELIGIOUS BELIEFS ONLY BUT CULTURE LANGUAGE AND A COMMON HISTORY) FROM THE TYRANNY OF THE MAJORITY .......

A NATION IN ITS WESTERN CONCEPT ... WHICH I PARTICULARLY LIKE .... IS THAT A COMMON CULTURE IS WHAT MAKES A NATION ....

SO IN THE WORDS OF ZIYA GOLKALP (IDEOLOGICAL MENTOR OF ATATURK) ``RELIGION INSPIRES CULTURE`` ...

AND IT IS TRUE ... SO IF YOU WANT TO ATTACK MUSLIM NATIONALISM ... PLEASE DO ... BUT DONT SAY THAT IT IS BORROWED FROM A PAKISTANI TEXT BOOK BECAUSE IN PAKISTANI TEXTBOOKS YOU WILL NOT FIND STATEMENTS LIKE ``JINNAH WANTED A KEMALIST STATE`` WHICH I TRULY BELIEVE .....

PEOPLE LIKE IAHMED TRULY NEED TO READ MORE ... AND MAKE LESS ASSUMPTIONS ....!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-PAKISTAN ZINDABAD

TO THIS GUY IAHMED

FIRST OF ALL I NEVER WENT TO A PAKISTANI SCHOOL SO

This guy iahmed is obviously a new comer ... and he has made some assumptions .. DONT MAKE ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT ME ...

Pakistan was not made in the name of Islam !!!!

If this guy had cared to read my posts or read History would know more ... the irony is that these people speak without even bothering to read

PAKISTAN WAS MADE TO SHIELD THE MUSLIMS OF SOUTH ASIA (WHO CONSTITUTE A DISTINCT NATION NOT ON THE BASIS OF RELIGIOUS BELIEFS ONLY BUT CULTURE LANGUAGE AND A COMMON HISTORY) FROM THE TYRANNY OF THE MAJORITY .......

A NATION IN ITS WESTERN CONCEPT ... WHICH I PARTICULARLY LIKE .... IS THAT A COMMON CULTURE IS WHAT MAKES A NATION ....

SO IN THE WORDS OF ZIYA GOLKALP (IDEOLOGICAL MENTOR OF ATATURK) ``RELIGION INSPIRES CULTURE`` ...

AND IT IS TRUE ... SO IF YOU WANT TO ATTACK MUSLIM NATIONALISM ... PLEASE DO ... BUT DONT SAY THAT IT IS BORROWED FROM A PAKISTANI TEXT BOOK BECAUSE IN PAKISTANI TEXTBOOKS YOU WILL NOT FIND STATEMENTS LIKE ``JINNAH WANTED A KEMALIST STATE`` WHICH I TRULY BELIEVE .....

PEOPLE LIKE IAHMED TRULY NEED TO READ MORE ... AND MAKE LESS ASSUMPTIONS ....!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-PAKISTAN ZINDABAD

And Iahmed .... let me tell you something else ..

dont even start making assumptions ...

1)I never went to a Pakistani school in my life

2)How does my view that Jinnah wanted a secular Pakistani state come directly from some text book?????

Which one of my arguments is based on text book knowledge????

Honestly I am so upset right now that I am on verge of tears ...

if I choose to love my country why am I criticized for that??????

Why is that if I say that we want to exist as a NATION SEPERATELY that I am criticized ......

Why is it that eveyone here these PSEUDO INTELLECTUALS, sacrifice everything that we hold dear as a self respecting nation to prove to others that they are intellectuals ...

Why is that if a completely foreign educated person like myself chooses to take pride in his own country that he is told that he is just suffering from the inadequacy of the educational system in Pakistan...

If anyone cares to remember ... I never said anything against India untill I came across the ridiculuous views of Indians ....

The truth is 99% of the people in Pakistan dont desire reunification or for that matter the fact that something like this can happen is not even in their psyche ... we were born Pakistanis .... we will continue to be so ....

Pakistan Zindabad

And Iahmed .... let me tell you something else ..

dont even start making assumptions ...

1)I never went to a Pakistani school in my life

2)How does my view that Jinnah wanted a secular Pakistani state come directly from some text book?????

Which one of my arguments is based on text book knowledge????

Honestly I am so upset right now that I am on verge of tears ...

if I choose to love my country why am I criticized for that??????

Why is that if I say that we want to exist as a NATION SEPERATELY that I am criticized ......

Why is it that eveyone here these PSEUDO INTELLECTUALS, sacrifice everything that we hold dear as a self respecting nation to prove to others that they are intellectuals ...

Why is that if a completely foreign educated person like myself chooses to take pride in his own country that he is told that he is just suffering from the inadequacy of the educational system in Pakistan...

If anyone cares to remember ... I never said anything against India untill I came across the ridiculuous views of Indians ....

The truth is 99% of the people in Pakistan dont desire reunification or for that matter the fact that something like this can happen is not even in their psyche ... we were born Pakistanis .... we will continue to be so ....

Pakistan Zindabad

For all of you who are coming to this forum ...

Please read Umairr`s post number 60 ...

Umair keep up the good work .... these Indians and

Imposter Pakistani wannabes like OmerAli will keep attacking you ...

What I dont understand is that why is that if we choose to be proud of our country ... is it assumed that we are anti Indian ...

If any of you took OmerAli`s post seriously ...

It is actually an Indian posing as a Pakistani and I know exactly who it is ....so please dont take his words seriously

Ok first of all Chowk staff .... once again you have done the balls ... you can publish such an article but you censored my post ....

The question I will like to ask RSaxena is that since he hates us ... and believe me I hate him ... why does he keep interacting with us????

And while you are at it ... tell me how many times have you seen Pakistanis going on to predominantly Indian sites to interact with Indians??? What is this obsessive preoccupation with Pakistan that Indians have ??? Why do they insist on giving us their unneeded, unwarranted, and annoying two cents?????

Please leave Pakistan to us ....

As for Feroze K .... again I will like to point out that a Utopia to me will be a Perfect Pakistan not a Unified South Asia ....

And let me also make it clear that maybe in 1920s

a compromise was possible .... maybe in the 1940s if the Congress Party accepted the Cabinet Mission plan that Jinnah did ... Maybe India would have stayed together as a confederation but it was the Congress Party that rejected it ...

Also remember that before Pakistan was made ... such solutions might have been viable to Indian Muslims (solutions that were denied to them by their Hindu countrymen) .... but to a Pakistani born in Pakistan like myself, Pakistan is the motherland ... Pakistan is my country ... and any talk reunification is not acceptable to me because

I for one was never an Indian, and never will be

Inshallah .....

Pakistan Zindabad

Quaid e Azam Zindabad

Ataturk Zindabad

Jiye Bhutto

Imran Khan for PM

Yasser Hamdani

PS Chowk staff hopefuly you will put this post up

and not censor it

Ok first of all Chowk staff .... once again you have done the balls ... you can publish such an article but you censored my post ....

The question I will like to ask RSaxena is that since he hates us ... and believe me I hate him ... why does he keep interacting with us????

And while you are at it ... tell me how many times have you seen Pakistanis going on to predominantly Indian sites to interact with Indians??? What is this obsessive preoccupation with Pakistan that Indians have ??? Why do they insist on giving us their unneeded, unwarranted, and annoying two cents?????

Please leave Pakistan to us ....

As for Feroze K .... again I will like to point out that a Utopia to me will be a Perfect Pakistan not a Unified South Asia ....

And let me also make it clear that maybe in 1920s

a compromise was possible .... maybe in the 1940s if the Congress Party accepted the Cabinet Mission plan that Jinnah did ... Maybe India would have stayed together as a confederation but it was the Congress Party that rejected it ...

Also remember that before Pakistan was made ... such solutions might have been viable to Indian Muslims (solutions that were denied to them by their Hindu countrymen) .... but to a Pakistani born in Pakistan like myself, Pakistan is the motherland ... Pakistan is my country ... and any talk reunification is not acceptable to me because

I for one was never an Indian, and never will be

Inshallah .....

Pakistan Zindabad

Quaid e Azam Zindabad

Ataturk Zindabad

Jiye Bhutto

Imran Khan for PM

Yasser Hamdani

PS Chowk staff hopefuly you will put this post up

and not censor it

temporal #29

You say

``HaiN aur bhi ghum zamanay maiN mohabbat kay siwa....

I agree with you but with clarifications.

The many replies to this article will illustrate the problems Indians and Pakistanis both face. The problem is that the architect keeps going back to the drawing board, nateeja, all we have is a load of blueprints and no house even after so many years.

As an Indian, I`m not in favor of providing the `leaders of society` any more excuses to play hooky from their real day jobs, which is providing good governance and assuring a decent life to everyone to their country. Politicians and intellectuals talk vision, but do nothing to bring it about then go talk another vision to mask their failures and get tenure.

The best and most logical confederation will happen automatically when Indians and Pakistanis are secure, confident and happy, with enough food to eat, with their children`s future and safety of life and limb assured. We have enough tools to achieve all that, lets use them. Spending time in the clouds is not going to bring THAT about.

Sadhana

# 60 Umairr

Another long-winded article in your usual style.

Do you ever read what others write? You are

turning into a gas bag, my friend.