Hidden Hindus

well i just want to place couple of questions

i have been to india and i have seen muslims there in worst conditions

why incident of Baberi masjid took place ?

What else you would have expected as a reaction?

What do you have to say about what is happening in Kashmire?

may be i am getting a little bit off the track but still if you can feel so much about indians in Karachi u must have tosay somthing about mislims in india .

Jay the pathetic#

If I am Jihadist. Do whatever you can do?

Your 700,000 strong BRAVE Soldiers show what you can do? Only commit savagery. And the more you commit savagery in your country, the more your writings start blaming Pakistan. i.e second law of Indian politics. The savagery committed by India against its own people is directly proportional to its onslaught on its neighbours.

Why you want to hide atrocities of Indians done in their country in the name of Secularism and Democracy. At least our Jihadist are not Bigots. Your actions come in worst kind of atrocities committed on humanity. The dreaded face of India is more than evident and no amount of word mincing can change the fact that in India minorities, secessionist and lower caste are killed mercilessly with the connivance of police and army or state in large numbers on daily basis.

Mosques are demolished, churches burned, priests also burned and killed. At least be bold enough to accept that this is not democracy and secularism. If you think it is, then we are better off without that.

And when I say daily. It MEANS Daily. Give me any date, any date when it has not happened in India and I will give you the incidence. Do you have guts to tell another lie on this board Mr. pathetic.

Jay: A search at a local library for J Krishnamurthi`s books brought up 12 titles. Any suggestions for starters? Thanks!

Re: The Pimple & Turkey

hahahahahah. ``Jeevay Pakistan???``

Maybe that`s why Turkey has been pressuring India on Kashmir? Oh but wait, last time I checked they didn`t utter a word when the leader visited India. Stop your fits for a second realize that I never suggested anything about India and Turkey. There`s little for India to gain other than goodwill and another insult to beat Pakistan with.

And take your little PSA playgroup nonsense from Rutgers and keep it there. I`ve met and worked with many a Turk who could care less about what/where/who Pakistan is. Most of those fellows are a mellow, chilled out group looking for a good time. Not Quran-tied-to-chest-fatwa-announcing-and-Jihad-demanding Pakistanis.

Re: krashid

Is Pakistan`s broken economy, the bodies of dead terrorists (aka Pakistani mujahideen) lying all over Kashmir, and the circumcision of the country in 1971 also a reflection of God`s will?

RELIGION AND FOLLOWERS,

It has been repeated so many times that it is as true as k for kafir, that muslims are the problem and not islam. It has been said by pakistanis, from a country where islam is supreme, `sharia courts` ensure that pak legislations are in tune with teachings of islam. Judges on these courts are islamic scholars, not some one with temporal knowledge.

Read the blasphemy laws, read its dealings with the ahmadia, ask the question, what has the sheria courts done about it.

Read post # 312, its various responses, the usual islamic/muslim name calling, while I take take a humble bow. Rare indeed.

Satyavadi#

First you did not give the reference from Dawn for K for ``Kafir`` (chotiwala Kafir and not Kalash mind you).

Second don`t worry with God. HE has his own way of dealing things. You will not know or might not be knowing, and will not realize. The division in Indian society, epidemic of AIDS and very poor condition of most people might be just that. It is a matter of realization.

Pullu

Not only is that possible but that is what I have been advocating. On the other board I had asked people not to look at Jinnah vs Gandhi as a clash of good vs evil because that just isnt fair ... I asked them to look at Politics and at History from a historical perspective .. and this extends to all facets of the bilateral relations between

Pakistan and India ...

Unfortunately the Indians only replied with personal insults.

Anyway thanks for the compliments :)

Yasser Hamdani

Sadhana and others:

Mind if I join in?

I think the socio-ethical arguments surrounding the practice of eugenics boil down to a single question - whether we have the right to deprive someone of basic human rights - the right to life, the right to choose. Are we not violating a basic human right by deciding who shall have the right to live? Are we not robbing someone yet unborn the freedom of choice by deciding on their behalf to donate their body parts to save another person`s life? How fair is it to expect this of anyone?

I agree it is great to be able to save a life without risking another. And I can empathize with those who now have the choice to have a child without the risk of giving birth to someone with a serious genetic disorder (a traumatizing experience for both the parents and the child). It can be argued that by genetically screening the embryos first and selecting the healthiest one out of the lot, the other unhealthy ones can be spared the pain and suffering they would have to face were they to be born. But, again, are we right in assuming that the unhealthy contenders would not want to experience life because of what they might or might not have to face? Do we have the right to decide what quality of life a person might want to live? We haven`t even finished dealing with the issues surrounding euthanasia and the right to choose death and we`re already arguing over which unborn individual should and shouldn`t be given a chance to experience life.

Lubna

Satyavadi

As far as I recall.. the comment of `k for kafir` was made in a post here that was an excerpt from an Indian newspaper, quoting an Indian - presumably some political/military figure.

I`d be happy to be corrected, if ANYONE remembers the source (which may well have passed into Chowks own pop culture.. hey, Bogie never actually said `Play it again, Sam`, after all..).

Sorry for the typos in my previous post

Tibor#310, Patrick#317,sb#325

Its slightly hard to explain. IMO, traditionally humans think of themselves as justifications in themselves, part of the greater scheme of things, part of a continuity. Religion, culture, family ties ingrain this `identity`, even if its say, a heir to a property or a kingdom who knows that he was born for a `worldly material` reasons,too. This question of identity, as fairdinkum says, does have a nonzero effect on those who don`t know their antecedents.

I`m not sure its so easy to reconcile that one is alive only because one`s body parts were of use to another human being, the choice being made from among many `others` after being examined under a microscope? Maybe of we were all `off the assembly line` types, we could get used to it?

Frankly, I think society cannot afford to mainstream something which creates human beings with such an impersonal cost-benefit approach, social engineering almost like a paper-pushing percentage-computing bureacracy. And PM, you`re the one who brought up the word sacred and reminded me of this case :-).

There was the recent case of the Siamese twins, whose separation by surgery has been ordered by a British court, which would result in the death of one of them. While I personally believe that its better to save at least one child, the argument of the lawyer for the `surviving` one was disturbing, too. According to a NYT article, ``An Unjust Sacrifice``, By Robert A. Sirico, Spet 28 `00, www.nytimes.com,
`` But utilitarian rationality has overtaken their case. The lawyer appointed by the court to represent Jodie insisted that Mary`s was ``a futile life.`` That is a dangerous statement -- sending us down a slippery slope where lives can be measured for their supposed value and discarded if deemed not useful enough.``
(end quote)

The right language(according to me) would have been to say that both lives and souls were equally precious, but nature sometimes forces us to make a choice and if at least one can be saved and the alternative was that we lose both, then we should do everything we can.

Similar `futility) arguments(I cannot cite exact references) are apparently used often in other European countries to expedite the death of severely ill people, even when it is not clear whether the patient consents to such a end. In my personal experience, such an argument was used for a young cacer patient by his doctor, until another (SAsian) doctor pitched in and saved him in that instance, and the patient survived a few more months.
As this guy says
``That is a dangerous statement -- sending us down a slippery slope where lives can be measured for their supposed value and discarded if deemed not useful enough.``

Re: abortion which will inevitably come up :-): I am for a `woman`s right to choose` over her government`s right and IMO, this question becomes relevant only when the said government has a lot of money to spend on ideological choices. I am also for discouraging abortion as a `mainstreamed` choice available to all and sundry just for the heck of it. Is this stand contradictory? Maybe.

Sadhana

RE: Slink

The power of observation is the most pathetic ``power`` that we humans have. It varies so drastically from individiual to individual. Even our left eye see a completely different picture than our right eye, metaphorically speaking of course. It is imperative that we seive our observations through various filters. So I admit that I am guilty as charged but my motives are different contrary to what you might have ``observed``.

Ylh #re326

You undeniably are an extremely passionate person.

`` YLH :

Now Satyavadi ... ALLAH KI QASSAM there isnt any such text in any school books .... the dawn writer, whom you didnot quote, must have written it as a jest or sarcastically.

And I dont care if you dont think I am authoritative ... I have swore by Allah and if I am lying may the worst curse be on me! See you make me invoke religion but I do it with utmost sincerity .. ``

Maybe (if you say so), it is not true afterall.

That`s more of a compliment to you.

But sadly, pullu is an indian (hindu)and of Indians, your opinion keeps changing from post to post. :)

Keep your passion flaming,

Pullu

{

I remember an old hindi song starring Raj Kapoor and Zeenat Aman..forgot the film name..

``Tumhari bhi jai jai,

Hamari bhi jai,jai,

Na tum haarey, na hum haarey``

Wonder if this spirit is possible.

}

THE FUNNY MIRRORS

It is so much fun to see yourself and have others see you in Funny Mirrors at a circus or a theme park. These mirrors make dwarfs larger than life and giants look like Lilliputians. Strangely, enough when one steps out of the realm of that imaginary world he finds himself so insignificant. The whole business of Funny Mirrors is so sarcastic.

Satyavadi,

I agree to host you ... and the rest I dont need to do because if you are an objective human being ... you will see a lot of it for yourself ...not that you will give up your perspective but see our perspective better. Had you read my earlier posts ... you would see that I have invited you atleast 2 or 3 times.

Now Satyavadi ... ALLAH KI QASSAM there isnt any such text in any school books .... the dawn writer, whom you didnot quote, must have written it as a jest or sarcastically.

And I dont care if you dont think I am authoritative ... I have swore by Allah and if I am lying may the worst curse be on me! See you make me invoke religion but I do it with utmost sincerity ..

A Few weeks before Prem went to Pakistan, Rafay Alam, another one of the Pakistanis whose credibility Indians dont question... wrote about how people in Pakistan wear Arabic clothes. I swear to ALLAH I had never seen a Pakistani wear Arab clothes till I came to America ... so I took Prem all over Pakistan and he didnot see any Pakistani wearing Arab clothes ... So please unless you just want to Hate Pakistan, PLEASE dont believe whatever you read.

Thankyou

Yasser Hamdani