The Islamist and Hindutva Politics: Identities of Outlook and Objectives

RSaxena #286

Sorry man.

We lost those wars intentionally.

Including 1948, 1965 and 1999.

Be happy. You are no more enunch.

See how we make ass-ho--- out of enunch.

Harimau # on various posts:

May be future historians will laugh at us that those people would marry in their late twenties and sometimes thirties and forties.

You cannot take out a society out of its circumstances.

If you find time from your useless posts, you will find that Aisha`s hand was given by her father none other than Abu-Bakr willingly. And there is no evidence so far that there was any objection because of her age. It was a normal cultural thing.

As you are ranting regarding invasions by Muslims and its revenge. Why don`t you take revenge against your Hindu ancesstors who sided with Muslims against their own brothers.(And we start taking revenge on Muslims who killed their Muslim brothers along with Hindu)

If your philosophy teaches you to belief that those fights were Hindu Muslim fight then your Hindu bretheren are more to blame because they were involved in killing their own brother.

Do you believe that earth is supported on the horns of cow or you are still living in 10,000 years B.C.

Harimau # on various posts:

May be future historians will laugh at us that those people would marry in their late twenties and sometimes thirties and forties.

You cannot take out a society out of its circumstances.

If you find time from your useless posts, you will find that Aisha`s hand was given by her father none other than Abu-Bakr willingly. And there is no evidence so far that there was any objection because of her age. It was a normal cultural thing.

As you are ranting regarding invasions by Muslims and its revenge. Why don`t you take revenge against your Hindu ancesstors who sided with Muslims against their own brothers.(And we start taking revenge on Muslims who killed their Muslim brothers along with Hindu)

If your philosophy teaches you to belief that those fights were Hindu Muslim fight then your Hindu bretheren are more to blame because they were involved in killing their own brother.

Do you believe that earth is supported on the horns of cow or you are still living in 10,000 years B.C.

A heart felt thank to Fairdinkum for #288. See the offenders like Ali1 or Harimu do not accomplish anything by hurling garbage to people, it only shows the decadence of their thinking pattern.

Thanks once again.

Regards

cheraym

Ref Jsandhu #: 258

[India might be feeling big and strong after the bombs but what Thakre and Harimanu need is Viagra to have the same feeling.]

Is that why you prefer your women to be raped by Islamic thugs?

[Good luck Mannu, and stop writing Hari in front of your name.]

That `hari` is NOT a prefix referring to your god Vishnu whom you don`t respect sufficiently. Harimau is a word from a language outside India. So, don`t jump to conclusions from little knowledge; you will end up with mud on your face as you fall flat on it.

[Mannu describes your personality pretty well]

How abou `buddhu`? Does that describe your intellect?

PS to Chowkwallahs: Last time you deleted this response. I dare you to post it.

Harimau:

I salute your spirit and your unwillingness to bow down before these pseudo-secularists.

Dear pseudo-secularists:

Harimau represents the angry, frustrated and ready-to-take-his-fate-in-his-own-hands Hindu majority of India. Enough with your shrill shenanigans. He is the real face of Hindu India. Stop trying to shout him down.

Rsaxena:

The short answer to your question is sharaab, shabaab and kebaab, all 3 of which are in short supply in India (and Pakistan). Result is that you end up with people like Harimau who worry more about what happened in the 15th century than what can happen to their kids next year.

harimau #278

``My ancestors had a code of conduct ruled by the caste system. Rape by any person meant automatic exclusion from the caste. So I have no doubts regarding MY ancestry.``

What a load of bullsh *t! You`re either a liar or high on Hindutva hashish like Vijay Amrit. In India high-caste men rape low-caste women as a matter of routine. It`s an everyday occurance. The low-caste men just accept as a fact of life that their wives and daughters will regularily be sexually molested by high-caste men.

But don`t worry, the Shudras will take your advice and seek revenge for 5000 years of this inhuman treatment...especially with us Pakistanis here to help and encourage them..lol!

PS. I apologize for my pathetic inadequacies of English language :)

Ali1 #278

Dear Ali,

You say:

“It must be devastating to ask yourself: Why couldn`t you stop a few thousand Afghans or Brits from ruling over your sorry arses? Are you eunuchs? Is it bad genes or a protein deficient diet?”

And

“Nothing can be worse than not being sure about your ancestry. What did the barbaric Afghans do to your grandmother? Where did your brown eyes come from, was it a turk or a mongol? green eyes? the rapist must be a Brit or a Portuguese then!”

Harimu, and other Hindus on this forum are probably hurt, and enraged, and you probably feel satisfied that you have put harimu in his place… but beyond that what do such statements achieve?

I usually don’t respond to people who have adopted an all out confrontational approach, and use indecent language to put their point across, but Ali, you have a sharp mind and you are well read. Please make an effort to engage in positive, fruitful discussions… And when I say positive, constructive, and fruitful discussions/debate, I don’t mean that we shouldn’t disagree with each other.

In Lukhnow, when Hindus heard accounts of what had happened to the family of Mohammad in Iraq, their women came out with buckets of milk and threw it at the feet of Zuljanah (the replica of Imam Hussain’s horse) and sang a sad song which went something like:

If Mohammad’s family had come to Hind
We would have accorded a warm welcome
And treated them with milk and honey
How sad that Mohammad’s children were slaughtered
They were thirsty and hungry
Even the 6 month-old Ali Asghar was not given a drop of water
Instead the little angel received an arrow, which pierced his dry throat
If only Hussain had decided to come to Hind instead of going to Iraq

This sad song became so famous that Muslim migrants (Mohajirs) from parts of Lukhnow still sing it in Karachi during Moharram… only there are no Hindu women in Karachi who would throw milk at Zuljanah’s feet.

Turks, and Mongols were uncivilized, and crude compared to people of Hindustan. And Arabs (Muslims) slaughtered Mohammad’s family merely a few years after Mohammad died… Hindus, have been traditionally peace-loving, accommodating, and hospitable people who went out of their way to learn about people of different culture. India embraced and provided shelter to the persecuted people from all over the world. If Mongols, and Turks and Brits were able to conquer India, it was not because Hindus were cowards, but because they were sure that once these sword wielding invaders get to know us, they will become part of us… to a large extent this held true… until TNT was proposed.

Harpreet #281 ``Ali1 and Harimau are two sides of the same coin.... look how serenely and with such empathy Ali1 talks to him.....``

I am enjoying this duel already. Maybe you and I can start selling tickets to this show.

Re: Ali

``- In a country like India which has been conquered over and over again, it must be difficult for the Hindus to get over their sense of inadequacy.``

Can you Pakistanis give some advice then? Surely you have experience after losing every war you have ever fought with India. Not to mention that royal beating which sent your grandfather`s friends running in 1971.

correction:
If you have a problem with the way things are done presently(wrt your belief in an India where ALL its citizens can live with dignity and pride) and want to bring about change, the hatred and anger from the past will not get you there(unless you are a politician, in which case, get lost)

And shouldnot you show SOME reason or rationale why anyone should believe you when you assert that you are better than others?

harimau
Just a question: are you committed to an India where ALL its citizens can live with dignity and pride?

(Let us restrict ourselves for the sake of this argument to those who are at this moment its citizens)

If you say no, some are more deserving of dignity and pride than others, then what is the difference between you and a Saudi Arabian shiekh?

If you say yes you are committed to an India where ALL its citizens can live with dignity and pride, well then there is scope for discussion.

Namely, that past/present hurts to dignity and pride have occured with everyone in India. The way to move ahead to more equitable and happy dispensation is not offering or demanding subservience from or to each other`s aims but trying to accomodate all aims.

You seem to feel that affirmative action, celebrating multi-religious heritage and restraining ourselves from violence is subservience. You are mistaken. Its not necessary to give up on pride of Hindu heritage to celebrate the diversity in India or correct historical inequities.

Think of it this way, the `past injustices` you speak about happened in absence of affirmative action, in the absence of celebration of multi-religious heritage and because violence was not restrained(by all concerned).

Now you will say ``but everyone else but Hindus demand subservience and gain their point through disrespect of multi-religious heritage and through violence``. Well, you are not quite right. India would have descended into civil war long ago if large numbers of people hadnot decided to go the peaceful way. What Serb pride or Afghan pride do those countries and communities have left? What Hindu pride will you have left if the situation was like that in parts of Indonesia where religous festivals herald onset of violence not festivities?

Indian politicians make a mess of it because their fundamental aims are different from ordinary citizens viz ``belief in an India where ALL its citizens can live with dignity and pride`` Donot take their actions as benchmark.

If you have a problem with the way things are done presently(wrt belief in an India where ALL its citizens can live with dignity and pride) the hatred and anger from the past will not get you there.

And shouldnot you show SOME reason or rationale why anyone should believe you when you assert that are better than others?

Sadhana

Ref ali1 #: 278

[- Nothing can be worse than not being sure about your ancestry. What did the barbaric Afghans do to your grandmother? Where did your brown eyes come from, was it a turk or a mongol? green eyes? the rapist must be a Brit or a Portuguese then!]

My ancestors had a code of conduct ruled by the caste system. Rape by any person meant automatic exclusion from the caste. So I have no doubts regarding MY ancestry.

On the other hand, you are the ones inventing fanciful Arab, Persian, and Central Asian ancestry to hide the fact that somewhere along the line you had rapists in your family. And let us not forget the Sayyids, the true descendants of the Prophet among you. And the Ashrafs and the Mirzas and the Baigs. The invaders only had princes and no common soldiers, it would seem. Or, as the saying goes, All chiefs and no Indians.

[I am sure these questions enrage you and I am sure you curse your forefathers for rolling over for every barbarian who crossed the Khyber.]

For reasons mentioned above, I am not enraged but amused. The lowest of the Dalits in India stands proud that he did not abandon his religion despite a millennium of abuse by the invaders. You people do not have that pride; instead you go around claiming to be the sole possessors of Truth, Knowledge, Wisdom, and the way to Janat with 72 houris waiting for jihadis.

[I have nothing but sympathy for you.]

Don`t make me laugh harder. As it is I can hardly hold my sides.

Ali1 and Harimau are two sides of the same coin.... look how serenely and with such empathy Ali1 talks to him.....

Can I make a suggestion? Both of you take your gangs of bigots to the Thar desert or somewhere and fight each other to the death. Whoever is left standing we can finish off with afew missiles....... seriously, be patriots, you`ll both be doing our countries a very big favour......