Tehelka Tapes: Modernising Media Morality

Farzana Warsi #

My Rapport with God starts with worst crises in my life which would have shattered me.

My own way of dealing with crises is unique.

I took solace in books, all kinds. And mosque.

Especially Kahlil Jibran and many others and prayer.

Once I come out of crises slowly and partially over a lengthy 6 months, my belief in God strengthend and still gives me great strength. And my philosophy to life is much impressed by Kahlil Jibran.

In a way you can say that those 6 months or so were the most formative years of my life which taught me immensely to stand alone on my feet.

It looks like there is someone who can understand me or at least listens to me(meaning you).

Life is beyond Nationalism and patriotism. It passes steadily. The best thing is what we can do to our life first, people with whom we come in contact second, and if we have more power what legacy we leave behind.

Life in its fullness is probably beyond the daily struggle for survival, food, housing etc.

Looks like I have started preaching to you who already is well versed in life in all its manifestations.

Regards.

Farzana #74

(Chowk I don`t understand why you have censored my posts to Farzana. There was no personal attack or foul words in any of them).

Farzana, you promised an introspective article. Now, are you trying to back out of it.

As far as I have seen you have focused only on the Hindu society and how it has brutalized the muslims. I wonder how long it will take for you to start advising me about introspection if my posts are only about muslim fanaticism (there is plenty of that going around in India).

Regarding Indians frothing at their mouths. How many are doing that can you please let us know? Aren`t you generalizing here? How many Indians have frothed at their mouths when Pakistanis like Bahmad and Tahmed have taken to any Indians. People who have taken to you are bigots like Urstruly who have nothing to say but, Hindus are trash.

So, I am asking you again. Do you think Urstruly is a bigot? Is Harimau a bigot? Please answer honestly.

Ref MaheshG #: 73

[Harimau,

If you don`t care about my opinions why do you keep trying to insult me? Just ignore my posts.]

I am trying to deprogram you from the brainwashing you have suffered under the Indian education system. My methods of pedagogy are unorthodox but I didn`t take any teacher training classes.

Farzana #74,

And do all Indians froth at their mouths just because some Pakistanis have taken to you?

And do all Indians froth at their mouths when Pakistanis like Tahmed or Bahmad take to any Indians?

You sure have some nerve!!

How easy it is for you to generalize as far as Hindus are concerned.

Farzana #74,

You promised an article on muslim shortcomings and now, you are trying to back out of it.

If I start writing only about the fanaticism in the muslim society let me see how long it will take for you to hound me about the Hindu society.

As far as I have seen you have attributed all problems in the muslim society to the Hindus. That just won`t cut it.

Regarding Urstruly and Harimau I wish you had answered the question honestly.

farzana,

[...Do not assume that whatever you say is `understood` only because you have stated it...]

of course i shouldn`t. in your case, everything has to be stated very explicitly or you start seeing ghosts. there is NO understanding.

[...And I certainly do not think you are an authority to decide on what constitutes the most absurd arguments, unless you have gone through the whole gamut of them...]

of course i am not an authority. it is only an assessment and a personal opinion that one presents on chowk. but what makes you think that i have NOT gone through the whole gamut of them? and i am referring to the ones presented by you here on chowk. besides, are YOU an authority on anything except your personal life?

[...The fact is that a couple of Pakistanis occasionally take up for me...]

more than a couple of indians and pakistanis take up for you and will take up for you when you talk sense, which, unfortunately, is not majority of the time on chowk. a couple of pakistanis take up for you irrespective of that.

[...and the Indians start frothing at the mouth, and then they talk about peace. Rubbish!...]

only frothing at the mouth seems to be coming from you. and i certainly do not think that you are an authority to decide on what constitutes indians, or frothing at the mouth, or talking about peace, or rubbish.

Concerned (#57):

Do not assume that whatever you say is ‘understood’ only because you have stated it. And I certainly do not think you are an authority to decide on what constitutes the most absurd arguments, unless you have gone through the whole gamut of them. The fact is that a couple of Pakistanis occasionally take up for me and the Indians start frothing at the mouth, and then they talk about peace. Rubbish!

As for your wish, “have a good life and i hope your endeavors in improving the daily-life of your fellow citizens are fruitful”, I thank you and wish you the same. Unfortunately, I do not have much of an influence on the daily life of my fellow citizens. One tries to do one’s bit, that’s all.

MaheshG (#58 & 61):

[“I am still waiting for your analysis of the shortcomings of the Indian muslim society that you promised a long time back.

As an aside do you think Urstruly is a bigot? Is Harimau a bigot?”]

Wonderful! Do you realise the irony? I have to point out the shortcomings in Muslim society only because I have made straightforward comments about what is wrong with the fanatic elements in Indian society, and they happen to be Hindus as they are in a majority. I wish I could compile what I have written along the way about Muslims, but this sort of pinning me against the wall (and, no, I am not playing martyr) makes me really angry. This is what I have been saying all along – in such an atmosphere where you are constantly being made to prove yourself, secularism is a pipe dream.

I am curious to know what is really bothering you in my articles and interacts at Chowk. Is it because you think that I am revealing aspects of my country that are negative? Does it need only one woman to upset the apple-cart? Don’t they, and we, already have preconceived notions? Will my questioning of the Muslim community change the ugly face of Indian fanaticism as we witness it today?

As regards bigots, I have avoided referring to individuals in such terms. I can see that many people are large-hearted enough to be thrilled to see the ‘human’ side of certain people revealed; I would have been too. But for inexplicable reasons whenever I have penned something sensitive, the reaction has been uncouth, to say the least. In fact, I am told that being emotional is the biggest problem with me!

[“Harimau #59,

cool it mister. I am just trying to figure out Farzana`s thought processes. If she considers you a bigot but not urstruly then I am going to hound her for an explanation. That`s all.”]

I think my thought processes have always been clear. I am afraid you cannot ask me for an explanation. As for hounding me, so what’s new?

Krashid (#65):

[“For me it does not matter. Because ``I have to carry my own cross, ultimately`` Neither

Pakistan nor Islam is going to do something for me. I have to do it myself. Islam gives me strength. Pakistan gives me a sense of belonging. (This is true, inspite of all the infighting and grudges)”]

Nicely put. I can say the same about India – in fact I maintain that I love my country, though I cannot always like it. Regarding Islam, you know my views more or less. And since your being identified with these does not bother you, I can go right ahead and thank you for your consistent support.

Urstruly (#66):

[“You dont look good compromising.”]

Where did I compromise? I was just tired. Elemental women do not give up or give in. They just take some time off to work up some bile:)

Harimau,

If you don`t care about my opinions why do you keep trying to insult me? Just ignore my posts.

You have assumed a lot about me. How the heck do you know that I don`t help people? And how the heck do you conclude that I am amongst the people who have visited some ``porn for girls`` board. Don`t even know what it is.

Ref AAmir #: 68

[I BELIEVE HARIMOU ,WOULD HAVE DONE THE SAME THING IF AEISHA WAS FROM PAKISTAN & URSTRULY WOULD HAVE FOR Cheryam .]

I HAVE done the same thing for a Pakistani who needed daily rides for about 3 weeks till he got a car and took him around car shopping too.

[I am surprised ,how indians identify the commonality between indian subcontinent .Pakisan,Bangladesh.Sri Lanka,even afghanistan,Iran,as DESI.]

I had an Afghan come into our office as a computer technician and the 3 Iranians were all over themselves trying to talk to him in Farsi. I used to query an Afghan PhD student about the Persian words used in India and his statement was that today`s Farsi had the corrupted pronunciation; of course, the Afghan pronunciation agreed with the Indian!

But Jay is right in that Urdu is not spoken among Muslims of Tamil Nadu or Kerala. Kerala Muslims go to madrassahs in the evening to learn Arabic so that they can read the Koran in the original. All power to them!

Reply # 67 jay

[A muslim from kerala is usually first a keralite, then an indian, and then a muslim.]

This not the reality, this is the way Brahmins would like it to be. Ethnic, Regional and sub-regional identities are good good, but religious identities are bad bad. Specially if your religion teaches you that all humans are equal and Keralite Shudras need not clean the potty of Keralite Brahmins for a living.

BTW, why would Keralite muslims elect non-Keralite Ibrahim Sulaiman Sait if they thought of themselves as Keralites first?

Ref jay #: 67

[A muslim from kerala is usually first a keralite, then an indian, and then a muslim. You should have asked about urdu the alleged language of the muslims in india.]

You are correct. Ayesha was so excited to hear about the local Kerala Association and took out her cream-colored silk sari (so typical of Malayalees) to wear to the Onam celebration. (Pakis, Onam is a great big Hindu festival so you can excommunicate Ayesha and all the Kerala Muslims for celebrating it. There goes the dream of Moplastan too!)

Ref MaheshG #: 62

[Thanks for the story. Shows a different side of you. The side I thought didn`t exist.]

One could forcefully articulate a viewpoint without necessarily trying to carry it out. That is why I never say `Deport Muslims to Pakistan` but ask why is it that Pakistan won`t become the homeland for all of the subcontinent`s Muslims. Makes the Pakis (and Sadhana) squirm.

Ref MaheshG #: 61

[cool it mister. I am just trying to figure out Farzana`s thought processes. If she considers you a bigot but not urstruly then I am going to hound her for an explanation. That`s all.]

I give lot more credit to Farzana than you do. Having been a recipient of unsolicited diagnosis such as ``You need to get laid`` from Ali1, I am sure she would stick to issues. I try to bash Farazana for her opinions.

[I think Urstruly and you are in the same category.]

I don`t care for your or anybody else`s opinion of me. People like you are the ones who rushed to Mahim Maher`s ``Porn for Girls`` board and offered their phone numbers and e-mail addresses in the hope that they could be of service to her.

Ref dost-mittar #: 60

[It was nice knowing your kinder, gentler side. Could you please show a little more of it in your Interacts? You may not think that all muslims are bad but your posts frequently give that impression. Remember, you can catch more bees with honey than with vinegar.]

I don`t want to catch bees; I just want them to go away so that they don`t sting me! (Smile!)

I never had a problem with a Muslim or a Pakistani. I do have issues with the way Muslims stand by and let the mullahs carry out their pogroms against persons of other religions or get the masses to trash other perople`s shrines.

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

harimau 59,

A muslim from kerala is usually first a keralite, then an indian, and then a muslim. You should have asked about urdu the alleged language of the muslims in india.

regards

jay

Ms. Versey # 56

I like you better in your fencing gear-attacking, dodging, retreating, slashing, poking, maiming, and finally putting your foot on enemies chest and telling him that you forgive him.

You dont look good compromising.

Jahan main ehl-e-eeman soorat-e-Khurshid jeetay hain
Idahr doobay, udhar niklay, udhar doobay idhar niklay

(Translation: People who beleive (in themselves) live like Sun in this world; here it rises there its sets, there it sets, here it rises)

..... Daanaa-e-Raaz Allama Iqbal.

Farzana Warsi #

For me it does not matter.

Because ``I have to carry my own cross, ultimately`` Neither Pakistan nor Islam is going to do something for me. I have to do it myself. Islam gives me strength. Pakistan gives me a sense of belonging. (This is true, inspite of all the infighting and grudges)

Re:Reply #: 59

harimau

``For those Pakistanis who like to condemn Brahmins as the root cause of all evil, I would like you to know that Ayesha`s classmates and best friends who provided her with support, friendship, and assistance during college years and accommodation during her job search were Tamil Brahmin girls who shared neither a native language nor a religion with Ayesha``.

Well said Harimau,

I do admire the selfless way you helped a fellow being to find a job and an apartment. Brahmins in general are as good or as bad as any other community. It may interest you to know that a Tamil Brahmin teacher helped and influenced APJ Kalam (the father of Indian missle system)to the extent that he remembers him fondly to this day. This is not to say that some Brahmins are not biased. With power structure gradually shifting to Dalits and poorer masses in many states,the age of Brahminical dominance is fast approaching its end (vestiges of it may still remain in places like Bihar).

sridhar

``Even though Hindu religion tries very hard to make poor people not complain about their miserable lives by conditioning them to accept it (btw it has worked for thousands of years), newly imported “virtual Christian culture” will not allow poor people to accept it``.

To begin with India was not always a poor country. Until the beginning of the Industrial revolution, China and India were top 2 economies as per the GNP. Even when the British came to India, the trade between England and India was in favor of India to the tune of about 30 million pounds (which would translate to billions of US dollars today).

India became poor because of systematic economic exploitation of the economy by the British (what the Ghaznis and Gauris did pales in comparison to what the British did). For the first time, India had mass starvation,a direct result of uprootment of local artisans due to high taxes by the British. India,instead of being an exporter of finished goods,became an importer of raw materials and a market for finished products from U.K`s mills.

India`s problems continued after independence with stupid economic policies pursued by Nehru. It is wrong to think that India`s poor masses are resigned to fate and accept their plight as Karma. They may rationalise thus but what other choice they have.

I have said in another forum that karma is a much misunderstood concept even by most indians. It by noway means fate but is an affirmation of freewill. Unfortunately such freewill does not exist for most poor people in India who cannot make choices even if they want to, for want of opportunities. Hopefully all this will change with liberalisation.

sridhar

Harimau #59,

Thanks for the story. Shows a different side of you. The side I thought didn`t exist.

Harimau #59,

cool it mister. I am just trying to figure out Farzana`s thought processes. If she considers you a bigot but not urstruly then I am going to hound her for an explanation. That`s all.

I think Urstruly and you are in the same category.

Ref MaheshG #: 58

[Farzana Versey,

Is Harimau a bigot?]

Let me relate a story that happened over a period of 6 years and ended in 1992.

A Kerala Muslim girl was divorced shortly after her marriage to an Indian Muslim living in a Persian Gulf country. This girl happened to live a couple of streets from where a brother of mine lived in Bangalore. The girl and her mother became friends with my mother. When the girl finally got an opportunity to study in the US, my mother gave her my phone number.

The girl calls me up during her summer break because of the connection with my mother and comes to visit me. She goes back to school and eventually off the radar screen as I switch jobs and move twice to other locations.

Fast forward another 6 years. The girl now has an MSEE after her MS in Physics for which she came to the US (all her degrees were in Physics, so she had to do a whole lot of engineering courses) and she is looking for a job. She has targeted the area I live in because there are a lot of electrical engineering companies. She also has a classmate`s sister living in the general area with whom she can stay while looking for a job.

I drive her around for interviews (about 140 miles each roundtrip as I calculate it now between where she was staying and where the companies were located) several times and she lands a job after about 3 weeks. She demurs about taking the job immediately because the commute would be impossible. She wants to find an apartment close to her place of work before she starts the job.

I insist that the girl move into my apartment so as to be reasonably close to work and I move out to a friend`s place. Good thing because 3 days after she starts the job at my insistence, her employer announces a hiring freeze. For the next two weeks, I give her daily rides to and from work while searching for an apartment during the weekend. We finally locate an apartment within walking distance for her and I help her move there and stock up on groceries and stuff. We stay in touch for a year or so and I know the girl now has a green card and has a steady future (as steady as employment in the US would allow).

Pathetic people like you who probably will not lift your little fingers to help another person in need ask arm-chair pontificators like Farzana whether I am a bigot. I am least botherd by your perceptions.

For those Pakistanis who like to condemn Brahmins as the root cause of all evil, I would like you to know that Ayesha`s classmates and best friends who provided her with support, friendship, and assistance during college years and accommodation during her job search were Tamil Brahmin girls who shared neither a native language nor a religion with Ayesha.

Farzana Versey,

I am still waiting for your analysis of the shortocomings of the Indian muslim society that you promised a long time back.

As an aside do you think Urstruly is a bigot? Is Harimau a bigot?

If you don`t want to respond on this board let me know which board your response will be on.

farzana,

perhaps i should have explicitly stated that the only people who are supporters of you EVEN FOR YOUR MOST ABSURD ARGUMENTS are urstruly and ali1. i thought that was understood.

however, i do agree with you (count me as your another supporter if you want) that this discussion is irrelevant.

have a good life and i hope your endeavors in improving the daily-life of your fellow citizens are fruitful.

I thought this board was about Tehelka and the media, so what the heck is wrong with discussing it? If the point of taikonaut’s post (#44) is only to let us know that this is “pseudo intellectual blabbering”, then I think it is a pity. I agree there are other issues. I had in fact raised the question about the need for the corruption to be exposed almost immediately, but that too was looked at with suspicion; at the time some people had said where was the need to bring it up!

I think there has to be a certain level reached in the interactions, and even if I say so myself I think Faruk, Harish and I have maintained that standard on this board. (And incidentally neither has been fully in agreement with me.)

Urstruly (#54):

Can’t get into further trouble by commenting on this one:) However, you need not have addressed it to Hindus. That will be seen as ulterior motive! And the reference to “1 billion moral degenerates” was avoidable.

temporal (#51):

I am equally ‘concerned’. Do you think that old song would be apt here…”Na shikwa hain koi, na koi gila hain, salaamat rahe tu, meri yeh dua hain…”? Do you think the concerned party will find it patronizing?

krashid (#49):

I am glad at least someone’s memory here is not selective. But I know that if I were to thank you, you would be initiated into a hall of shame by the rest. Your fault? That you are a Pakistani and Muslim! So, I shall spare you…but will remember your gestures of support, despite our difference of views on religion, in mind always.

Akash (#48):

[“What concerned is saying is true. Urstruly, Ali1 and if you insist Harimau are the ones who are the most abusive people here on chowk. Beware of those who praise you fulsomely, especially on cyberspace for they have ulterior motives. Why is it that inspite

of all this your heart is full of warmth for the likes of Urstruly and Ali1. You say their heart is in the right place. So is my liver. If these guys are simply misguided youths, how is harimau (not that you said)a bad boy. Or are your good books reserved for your coreligionists. If that is the matter, I will understand.”]

I could have decided to skip this post, especially because of your naughty insinuation that I am full of warmth towards certain individuals because they are my co-religionists. However, since you have brought up the subject of ‘ulterior motives’, I thought I should clarify. If those who occasionally agree with me have such motives, then what about those who needlessly rubbish me? I am not talking about the ones who point out flaws in my argument, but just personal attacks…what do I make of them? As for Urstruly and Ali, the former has often been quite unsparing in his criticism of me (he asked me to stop bashing up Hindus!) and I have repeatedly asked Ali (who, btw, has in fact made the worst comment about me on Chowk yet) to desist from making snide comments about Indians and Hindus. I would like to add that at a time when it was very convenient to make use of their ‘support’, I came out in clear terms to say that I am an Indian and they should not use my situation to get back at my countrymen. If all I wanted were hosannas, would I have even bothered to alienate them? As for other bad boys, they do not let me have a word in at all, and when I do, each one is used against me. Please understand that I do not enjoy these futile battles at all, and to maintain one’s dignity despite is not easy.

concerned (#47):

Kindly see the contradiction in one single post of yours:

[“if you choose to focus on 1 against you and ignore the 10 that were for you, and further, imply that 10 were against you, it can only be called unique.”] …and then…

[“ever wonder why majority of the time your only supporters on chowk happen to be urstruly and ali1?”]

I rest my case. I think this discussion is irrelevant. Okay?

(PS: Sorry about this derailment of your Board, Harish. But as you are witness, I had no control over it.)

Regards,

Farzana

Pardesi #53

You have to read more Islamic history to know the role Mullahs played in the downfall of Islamic empire and keeping the masses in check for the benefit of rulers of their time and in some cases foreign invaders also.

Short 53 years history of Pakistan is sufficient proof of this.

Don`t make me relive another life to see otherwise.

Dear Hindus!

Plz take off your Hindutva Ainuk for a second and try to see and listen what Ms. versey is trying to tell you. She is one single voice of truth, fairness and justice among all of you 1 billion moral degenerates. Try to accept the fact that truth hurts in the begining but in the end it benefits all. Stop the character assassination of this lone crusader and give her the due respect that she rightfully deserves. If it is too hard then at least try to learn from her. Just listen to yourself for once and ask yourself this question: How the bashing of your neighbors will solve your problems. Hasn`t enough harm done already?

dost-mittar, taikonaut, Krashid, Urstruly # various

Upper class elite (i.e., politicians, generals or industrialists) in the sub-continent have no morality. It does not matter whether they are Hindus or Muslims. If they had any morality, they would not pile up money in foreign accounts for their own next 50 generations but rather share some of it with the bhookay-nangay people in their neighborhoods if not cities or whole countries.

Indians were wise in 1947 that they didn’t try to use Hindu (our collective heritage) morality as the foundation for new republic. They are trying hard to graft Christian morality and back filling our own cultural weaknesses while still calling it Indian cultural morality as their base. I think that’s smart and hope it works. There was no other way. This keeps people happy and gives them some pride about their past while new imported value system takes roots.

However, there are two major risks while this great transition goes on: a) If people seriously start believing that their past culture was indeed great (e.g., hindutatva), since every one is paying lip service to it, watch out. This needs to be crushed. B) If the fruits of progress do not reach lower level people who are awakened, there will be backlash. Even though Hindu religion tries very hard to make poor people not complain about their miserable lives by conditioning them to accept it (btw it has worked for thousands of years), newly imported “virtual Christian culture” will not allow poor people to accept it.

Pakistan, in theory at least, does not suffer from this malaise of Karma acceptance. However, sub-continental concept of acceptance of miserable life is ingrained deep in the poor convertees too. Success of Mullahs is exactly for this reason and Urstruly is right on this. The problem you have though is that while problem is correctly pointed out, and used to awaken people, I do not believe that the Mullahs have any blueprint for progressive state machinery or foundation that is more moralistic. Are their any model Islamic states which address downtrodden people’s concerns and focus on making economic pie bigger rather than just shrinking (or even destroying) the pie and then dividing it and therefore no net improvement at all?

Justice in the long run for poor people in India’s model will hopefully come when education reaches down to the lowest levels. Then, they will not be railroaded into accepting their fate. Until then, I will rely upon more Tehlkas and will watch out aggressively against VHS types.

temporal,

[...and my other concern is that your concern is slightly misplaced... ]

how so?

concerned #38,43 &47:

You asked,``farzana, do you just have poor memory or are you always hallucinating?``

I ask you, ``Did you abuse your husband/wife last Tuesday night?``

...since you are avowedly concerned I suspect you will get the drift....

....and speaking of concerns surely there must be other concerns than these concerns regarding the determination of Farzana`s concern that are more pressing on the Concern-scale...I mean sure you have the right to express these concerns...and try as they might our other concerns... we will come to your defence to express your concerns under the freedom of concerns..sorry make that expression...and my other concern is that your concern is slightly misplaced... the lady in question has shown she can take all concerns hurled her way and accept, thank, agree, disagree and hurl back concerns as the concern demands...hopefully...you will forgive me this concerned intrusion on this board...and having expressed my concern...I remain...concernedly temporal:)

Taikonaut #44

Is it some conspiracy by so called elite and their intellectual cronies to keep the fruit to themselves without sharing it with majority of population or actively preventing the majority to be a partner in prosperity. To keep theirs and their progeny`s future safe at the cost of millions and million. And to muffle and muzzle all the voices through bribing so called armed religious zealots.

I don`t know, but I have a feeling that this rationalizing has this aim.

Farzana Warsi and Concerned#

I am seeing with interest the logic presented now by people on this board.

If people`s memory is not selective and short term. They can recall hounding of Farzana Warsi as a pathetic writer with no thoughts of her own. A third grade columnist and whatnot, by these same concerneds, extinguished Sadhnas and the whole lot riding into the same bandwagon.

So the crocodile tears are now everflowing.

I think apology is in order rather than rationalizing the misdeeds.

Who will take this task from the castle high in the air, looking down on other people as insects, is difficult to predict.

Farzana and concerned

What concerned is saying is true. Urstruly, Ali1 and if you insist Harimau are the ones who are the most abusive people here on chowk. Beware of those who praise you fulsomely, especially on cyberspace for they have ulterior motives. Why is it that inspite of all this your heart is full of warmth for the likes of Urstruly and Ali1. You say their heart is in the right place. So is my liver. If these guys are simply misguided youths, how is harimau (not that you said)a bad boy. Or are your good books reserved for your coreligionists. If that is the matter, I will understand.

farzana,

if you choose to focus on 1 against you and ignore the 10 that were for you, and further, imply that 10 were against you, it can only be called unique.

ever wonder why majority of the time your only supporters on chowk happen to be urstruly and ali1?

Concerned:

I agree. Computers do not lie; neither do I. Regarding the `volley`, please look up the posts, if you are at all inclined to do so. They were not pleasant, to say the least, and the `abuse` went on for quite a while.

You said you were trying to say something...what is it? If you care to share, and not get into unnecessary battle...your post was completely unwarranted; I was answering a simple query by Urstruly about my silence regarding corruption in India with the response that I had done so. Why is such simplicity considered unique? Incidentally, did you notice that I also asked him in the earlier post whether he thought there were no crooks in Pak. Or did you `select` to ignore that as well?

As for my conscience, it is doing well, as always. Thanks for enquiring, anyway. I am touched. Really.

[reposted]

Krashid # 37

This board`s focus on Tehelka.com is completely misplaced. It`s like we see a big black spot on our face and immediately start talking about the mirror. Tehelka is just a mirror and Farzana et. al. are writing profusely about some mirror makers. That`s simply pseudo-intellectual blabbering and nothing more.

Our focus must be on the fu$king generals. They are looting all of us right and left. Our focus should be on the drama of so-called national security. This drama beats the heck out of Maha Bharta. Our hard earned $$ are being stolen from right under our noses and we are singing some Tejpal songs. That`s a pity my dear. A pity on our intellect, our foresight (or lack thereof), our very reason to be out of our homeland working for those elusive dreams.

Think about two modern nuclear powers and see the length of beggars (oops visa-applicants) at the gates of Western embassies and then ask yourself, what on earth has gone wrong with us.

You talk about some ``vibrant`` democracy on our side of the border. You are better off calling it ``Demo-Crazy``. Every one of us is an English speaking ``INDIAN`` and not a single soul is a Bharati. The bureaucrats and generals are raping us the so-called educated elite and we all are enjoying every bit of it. In fact we go back for more and come out even happier.

So Farzana! keep talking about some old Tejpals and some new Tejpals. I know we all pseudo-intellectuals enjoy being subjected to these day-light robberies and rapes.

Gurv say kaho hum Bharati hain.

We all need to take pride in true Bharati culture and not in some westernized, corrupt INDIAN culture.

farzana,

you certainly have a curiously unique way of answering a simple question with a simple answer.

selective memory/research? computers don`t lie.
your post to urstruly implied that you asked a `casual` question and you got `volleyed`. only your conscience can attest to that truthfully.

[...Is there something really important that you are trying to say?...]

yes. how about yourself?

CLINTON-ISM & HINDUS

It is not in a distant past that Clinton’s perversion with cigars and Monica Lewinski was brought out in front of the whole world. It will be a matter of deep interest for any sociologist or even a common man around the globe to observe the changing behavior of American nation and its reaction towards the whole situation. Just imagine that if the same thing would had happened in 60’s or 70’s or even 80’s any US President would have to leave the office. But people’s behavior towards such perversions have changed dramatically. Various polls on TV and print media have suggested that it doesn’t matter to people anymore. People were openly found claiming that “So what! He is just like us. Don’t we do the same in our lives?”. So Clinton got off the hook in the public court of opinion easily. Repulicans –aaaaaaakh thoooo.

Now compare this to the Hindu politicians and Generals’ perversion and corruption when they used their cigars on hungry half-naked millions of Hindustanis who die everyday dreaming of two loaves of bread in one meal. The catchy phrase in this case is “Sab chalta hay”. People have no confidence whatsoever in a system and polity. No one even bothers to ask to bring the crooks to justice or at least the Government should resign. No one cares no more.

See that is the problem with a secular democracy. The collective morality of people derives the morality of democracy. Human beings are prone to corruption and hence the existence of religions and reformers. I don’t blame Hindus for preferring Secularism over their religion. It is quite understandble, what could have their religion delivered. It is also interesting to note that the people who are in power in Hindustan right now are the flag bearers of the Hindu morality. They are the “thaykaydars” of this religion. I understand their perversion. But all Hindus must ask themselves a question-if their religion has failed them and they do not consider it worthy of running their lives and if they rightfully feel queasy about it then is it necessary that other peoples of other religions should feel the same about their religions?

Krashid # 37

This board`s focus on Tehelka.com is completely misplaced. It`s like we see a big black spot on our face and immediately start talking about the mirror. Tehelka is just a mirror and Farzana et. al. are writing profusely about some mirror makers. That`s simply pseudo-intellectual blabbering and nothing more.

Our focus must be on the fu%$

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

Concerned (#38):

It is my hallucination/poor memory versus your selective memory/research. Kindly check out the `volleys` between and after the posts, before coming on the board just to make a pointless point. I was responding to a simple question with a simple answer, but, no, you have to come in and start your bang-bang percussion, without any rhyme or reason.

Is there something really important that you are trying to say?

farzana,

[...For the record, on the Patwardhan board I casually asked the interactors about Tehelka (it had just been announced that night) and what the Indians had to say about the corruption, and there was a volley against me...]

here is your `casual` post about tehelka to the indians -

http://www.chowk.com/bin/showr.cgi?f=apatwardhan_mar0401&n=130#reply382

``...BTW: There is palpable silence by the Indians here regarding the arms deal bribery scam in the BJP exposed by Tehelka.
Will some of you please come forward and say something? Aren`t you people worried? Or are you still shedding tears about the poor in Afghanistan versus the Taliban discussion? Come on, time to look in our own backyard...``

and as far as the `volley against you` is concerned, here is what you wrote in response to the replies about tehelka posted by indians -

http://www.chowk.com/bin/showr.cgi?f=apatwardhan_mar0401&n=80#reply428

``...i thank those of you have come forward to comment, and taken my plea as just that and not seen any ulterior motives in it...``

farzana, do you just have poor memory or are you always hallucinating?

Taikonaut#

Your post always interest me.

India has the advantage of democracy (in name only may be) for its press to be vibrant (though I may be mistaken). Pakistani press has also been vibrant in much worse circumstances. Particularly since the time of Bhutto and Zia-ul-Haq and is probably the only blessing we have so far in recent history.

If India can listen to its people rather than filling the coffers of Generals, Beureucrats and politicians its people will be in much better position. (Same thing as in Pakistan with musical chair game).

I can pray for your position for Bharti people. You can pray for us Mohajirs, Punjabis, Sindhis, Baluch, Brawhi and Pakhtun, majority of whom have similar problems.

Do you think man should be taught a lesson of humanity before giving him any degree.

Urstruly (34):

I am well aware of the murderers etc that you talk about. For the record, on the Patwardhan board I casually asked the interactors about Tehelka (it had just been announced that night) and what the Indians had to say about the corruption, and there was a volley against me. So, I have questioned GOI. I do not wish to get into an argument here with you over this.

I read your post on Sameer`s board, and I am convinced -- as I always was -- that your heart is in the right place.

Ref Urstruly #: 34

[May Allah Save us All. Including some decent Hindus, if there are any.]

Allah hasn`t done diddly squat for the Chechens, the Palestinians, the Bosnians, the Kosovars, the Uighurs, the Iraqis or -- before 1971 -- for the Bangladeshis.

This proves that Allah is not omnipotent. It further proves that Muhammed is the most complete fraud on earth.

Get your nose out of the camel dung and smell the real coffee that is brewing all around you.

Ms. Versey

Sitaution is even worst in Hindustan than I thought. Check the last 30 posts and some of them on the other board-everyone is asking for more TDC and more power to press etc. and not a single soul (including you) has even remotely demanded GOI to make its transactions transparent and to punish the culprits. I dont expect much from a country where Prime Minister is a known murderer. He and his chamchay karchay have redned their hands with the blood of minorities of all sorts; a country whose PM defends such attrocities; what do you expect he will condemn petty theft? I dont expect much from a country where Bosnia and Rawanda level of attrocities are committed against Kashmiri people in which over 100000 Kashmiris have lost their lives, property, and dignity. Instead of saying one single sentence against such attrocities the citizens of that godforsaken place spend day and night justifying them. What do you think this petty theft will mean to them.

The cause for concern definitely is that this amoral society has the power to press the red button and send everyone in the region to a nuclear oblivion. The latest saga has unvield that their politicians are not only corrupt they are stupid too.

May Allah Save us All. Including some decent Hindus, if there are any.

Harish:

[“Without prejudice to the elders...as you pointed out...they were from a generation when hitting out was not the favoured form of journalism. They suffered from excessive passivity.”]

You do realise that, more than them, it was the owners who were to blame – newspapers were identified with political parties, if they were not in some part owned by them. Yet, we did have people like Khushwant Singh, who in fact legitimized brashness and energy, whatever be the merits of his version of it. Besides, it is not only the elders who are pooh-poohing Tehelka; many, including Kuldip Nayyar, have come out in favour of it. And why do you think the Young Turks are taking up for snoopy journalism? Not to justify such a high-level of expose, but so that in future they can enter bedrooms and closets for their low-level scoops.

The older generation may have been “pathetic newsgatherers”, but today it is the Response departments of publications that decide what ground-level news has to be furnished. I do not mean to run down the efforts of an industrial house (the Ambanis) in earthquake relief, but who do you think was deciding how much coverage the daughter-in-law of that family ought to get as opposed to the social workers in Kutch? Or for that matter, how important was it to mention what Bill Clinton wore on his tour of the area? The darned reporters cannot even tell the difference between parrot and olive green!

[“And, unfortunately the heaviness with which they wore their scholarship...or linguistic skills...made reporters...newshounds...or newsgatherers...seem second class citizens of the press.”]

Do you think the reporters are any better off today? They may not have pedants spouting philosophy sitting on their heads – instead they have upstarts, ready to sell their souls for a paltry consideration. I know of bright young people who have gone out to investigate stories and found to their chagrin that a 900-word article has been reduced to 250 words to accommodate an advertisement. Do you think such editors have any spine?

[“In an earlier post i had mentioned some extrordinary reporters...can you recollect how many of them went on to become news driven publications` editors?”]

I can mention names like Asrun Shourie, Nikhil Wagle, Pritish Nandy, M.J.Akbar….but I do not believe that an editor has to be a former reporter. He/she ought to have impeccable news sense and conviction, and even an opinion, though it must not colour what the others have to say. But most of them become puppets. They are unskilled labourers carrying the burden of creating someone else’s edifice. It is disgusting to see that they are so happy to have a titular title that they are willing to ignore ideals, if they have any left.

Your other points are apt, but…

1. The naming of names, instead of the good old “allegedly” does not reveal the courage of the news media – people are themselves flaunting their ‘failures’! Jaya Jaitley has no qualms about occupying a part of George Fernanndes’ house and heart.

2. I cannot complain about audacity :-) But how many of your brash ground-level reporters would take on the real scourge? Will they be allowed to?

3. Again, I have no problems with Ricky Martin as opposed to Aung San, but these kids want to even make the latter into a pop icon!

4. The “march of progress” does not necessarily come with the “inevitable”. It evolves by making things happen, or giving the ‘happening’ an all-new perspective.

…“professional, not romantic”. I root for the latter, for ideals make you truly professional.

Clarifying…mystifying…I guess today those distinctions are blurred.

Regards,

Farzana

Faruk (#30):

I am afraid in India, and maybe the subcontinent, news is not disseminated as it perhaps is in the West. Your examples regarding the Washington Post and NY Times would just not find a parallel in our society; at best a paper is a habit with us, not something that mirrors our views. (Except for niche publications or politically-motivated pamphlets.)

[“Do people really want to know ? If they did there would be someone catering to that need…Journalism has always been about telling people what they want to hear. Its that one odd writer / journalist who beats the system and makes a difference. When they do they make history and believe me you cant do that every morning.”]

While it is true that rebels cannot sustain themselves with a new cause every morning, I think it is facile to believe that the market decides who calls the shots. It isn’t the reader’s market, but the movers and shakers; one has to accept this as part of the business, but the public is a victim of ‘manufacturing consent’ and auto-suggestion. My grouse is that in this instance perpetrators of crime, so to speak, get to sit on the jury. I want to know of one example where the newspapers have exposed the misdemeanours of their own kind.

[“If there is a market for bullshit, what’s wrong with selling it.”]

Firstly, I don’t agree there is such a market; bullshit is being sold as holy cow dung. And if it is indeed bullshit, then we are reading toilet paper, not newspapers.

Farzana

Urstruly (#28):

[“I agree with Ms. Versey and Hindus that there should be more TDC in India. That will help filter out the moronic crooks and only the best will reach to the top. A smart crook will be good for Pak in two ways. He will think before pressing the red button and he

will do his ``job`` with more efficacy.”]

My dear, if I am not mistaken this article and my post were about the media. Where do Hindus come in? And, are you trying to say there are no crooks in Pak? What red button? Come on now, looks like you are sharpening your knives already. Do you mind a friendly whack? :-)

F

Farzana,

There is little to disagree with the content of your post. Its intent, especially.

But, yes I do recognize the problem with trying to make up our minds on an issue by fighting on ``both sides of the question`` as our friend Stephen Leecock would say.

When I say that eminence grises of the press in India were constantly harping on the lack of ethical standards in the tehelka team`s expose...I was not contrasting them to the MTV guys in a manner that you have mentioned.

Without prejudice to the elders...as you pointed out...they were from a generation when hitting out was not the favoured form of journalism. They suffered from excessive passivity.

The youngsters today are actualy fulfilling a need that the current times demand. In the light of the net...and the lightening speed at which information becomes so much garbage...our press is still not too concerned with information gathering. And, editorialising once did do its fair bit to help create certain opinions.

Having worked with a few nespapers...i do know...that those considered writers...senior editors...etc were pathetic newsgatherers.

And, unfortunately the heaviness with which they wore their scholarship...or linguistic skills...made reporters...newshounds...or newsgatherers...seem second class citizens of the press.

That worked well, as long as the credo of the establishment was opinion or view driven.

But, some of our ``seniors`` still spout archival material to pad up stories which have no information. And, newsstories that matter...has to have new/significant information. That meant a lot of legwork...and as usual the infantrymen of the press was neglected.

In an earlier post i had mentioned some extrordinary reporters...can you recollect how many of them went on to become news driven publications` editors?

In effect these are some of the points that exercised me

1) Give information its due, especially in the information age. The names, amounts, ambience of the site of ``crime``...made the impact that tehelka did. The same story in an older mould would be full of insinuations, allegedly-ies, a lady president of one of the 23-member ruling coalition ...etc.

2) The brashness with which the brat pack overtook journalism...has its problems. But, if i present them...by contrasting them with the elder lot...then I`ll again have to reduce the latter to a negative. But, the brash ones have ``the audacity of youth...and an almost impossibly high stamina.`` Neither much valued earlier.

3)The fallout of the gap in idealism...for want of a less unfashionable word...has had the youngsters believeing talking to Ricky Martin is the unforgettable journalistic experience over Aung Sang Sue Kyui. But, that need not be a loss...unless perceived as such. And if one does do so, then obvioulsy one is already allying with the older generation.

4)I think...whatever is happening is good only in the sense that what is inevitable is good..as the march of progress. The new sensibility will, and therefore, I presume should take over. What can be donme...is slipping the values one cherished in journalism. Here I mean professional, not romantic.

The last couple of points is enhanced by Faruk`s earlier post.The exigencies of time.

I do not know...how much of this contributes to clarifying...and how much to mystyfying the interracts here.

Farzana # 27

Any electronic or print media, is essentially a business. It caters to a captive audience first. That is how they survive. They are preaching to the converted.

The Washington Post is a conservative newspaper, its readers like the news presented from their perspective. The same is true for the New York Times, the readers in this case are looking for a liberal view of the world around them. The articles in this newspaper cater to the interests of its readers.

Now to you question :

“Who is calling the shots?”

I think their market.

“Journalism today is full of the evils it accuses society of. Where do the people who really matter figure? Isn’t a cavalier attitude also an infringement of the readers’ right to know?”

Do people really want to know ? If they did there would be someone catering to that need.

“And what about the writers? They have no voice; often their words are culled to suit the ‘policy’ of the paper…no one wants to rub people the wrong way. I say, since when has journalism been about telling people what they want to hear? “

Journalism has always been about telling people what they want to hear. Its that one odd writer / journalist who beats the system and makes a difference. When they do they make history and believe me you cant do that every morning.



” So, isn’t there anything like freedom of expression? There is, but not for the angst of the idealist, only for the barf of the bimbos. Have you not wondered how so many celebrity-penned columns have sprouted? Infotainment is not only an issue about our appetite for mindless gossip. It is an issue about misplaced priorities and lost opportunities of making meaning. It amounts to the subversion of truth. Press releases passing off as ‘reports’ are old hat. “

If there is a market for bullshit, what’s wrong with selling it.

Faruk

Farzana # 27

Very good post... excellent points.

THANK YOU TEHLEKA DOT COM

I agree with Ms. Versey and Hindus that there should be more TDC in India. That will help filter out the moronic crooks and only the best will reach to the top. A smart crook will be good for Pak in two ways. He will think before pressing the red button and he will do his ``job`` with more efficacy.

Everyone is agreed that we need more Tehelkas. But I found that the article tended to be a paean to the rookie reporter and the rookier editor, when the truth is different. Tehelka has stuck its neck out; newsprint journalism will not do so. And what is wrong with scholarship and fat and greying editors? Must we look down on them only because some MTV kids jump with a mike and act like watchdogs of society? If the old order was stuck in a groove because it wanted to play safe, the new lot is into another game altogether. They are nowhere near a Tehelka style revolution.

And the extent of their arrogance is manifest when an expose I was asked to do came with the proviso that I should steer clear of mentioning names! This is the Indian media – the conscience-keeper of the nation. If you will bear with me (and Harish, pardon the intrusion, but it may provide another point of view), this is partly what I wrote and published:

[“Who is calling the shots? Journalism today is full of the evils it accuses society of. Where do the people who really matter figure? Isn’t a cavalier attitude also an infringement of the readers’ right to know? And what about the writers? They have no voice; often their words are culled to suit the ‘policy’ of the paper…no one wants to rub people the wrong way. I say, since when has journalism been about telling people what they want to hear?



There is the mistaken notion that political pressure plays a major role. While in the communal times we live in, the Them vs. Us tussle is a worry, it is simpler to deal with. I have found politics is an easy target if you want to camouflage the bigger scourge - commercial considerations. You rile against cancer and splash ads of things that cause the disease; you flaunt naked bodies and to salve your soul you put in regular sermons. This is sickening, by far worse than the demagoguery you witness from the ‘dhoti-sherwani’ brigade.



So, isn’t there anything like freedom of expression? There is, but not for the angst of the idealist, only for the barf of the bimbos. Have you not wondered how so many celebrity-penned columns have sprouted? Infotainment is not only an issue about our appetite for mindless gossip. It is an issue about misplaced priorities and lost opportunities of making meaning. It amounts to the subversion of truth. Press releases passing off as ‘reports’ are old hat. The rich and famous now have the temerity of going through editorial copy before publication. What does it have to do with giving ‘voice’ to the ‘voiceless’? Instead of disseminating information the Press has become insular. A handful of people constitute society and Society.



There have been times when one has wanted to laud the lone rangers in journalism, who fight for a cause. I am told that either there is a political agenda here as well or the cause being espoused is to help a friend or to make sure personal relations are perfect for that bait of the Rajya Sabha seat or the flat to be had under some quota.



Everyone is screwing up their noses at the stink, not realising the garbage is in their own backyard. The Press talks about ethics, it is time it looked within. If you have a dissenting voice, you will be accused of lashing out at “imagined opponents” by people who are busy sucking up to various lobbies.”]

Can we talk of media morality at all, in its modern manifestation or otherwise?

Farzana

PS: Romair, this Tehelka article has appeared thrice because the poor poets had to be shunted out quickly!

India`s kickback syndrome

By Prof Khalid Mahmud

TEHELKA.com has done a great job in exposing institutionalized corruption in Indian defence deals. Full marks to the enterprising team of journalists, in particular the two young reporters who spent six months running from pillar to post to gain access to the routes that eventually led to the racket. That everyone has a share in the booty - the politicians, the bureaucrats and the men-in-uniform - is the message that the ``Operation West End` has brought home. Stunning were the revelations. Some despondent Indian observers were prompted to say that a grave moral crisis had overtaken the country.

Nonetheless, the business remained as usual. Although the opposition disrupted the proceedings in both House of Parliament for more than a week and did not let the government transact any business during the budget session until the Parliament went into recess, the ruling coalition had the cheek to dismiss the whole affair as a `conspiracy` to discredit the government. Prime Minister Vajpayee whose own offices is under fire for a hand in the shady deals, was virtually unmoved until he made the token confession that some mistakes had been made.

Vajpayee and associates, it seems, are quite confident of weathering the storm. Contrary to the expectation of the opposition, the scam has not caused any disarray in the ranks of the ruling coalition. Mamta Banerjee who resigned from the union cabinet in protest was in fact looking for a pretext to wriggle out of its electoral alliance with the BJP in West Bengal, so as to clear the way for a deal with the Congress before the forthcoming state assembly elections in May. But keeping her options open, though Mamta has quit the ruling National Democratic alliance (NDA), she has not yet removed her party`s backing for Vajpayee government. No other component of the NDA has raised any questions about the scam or shown any strong disapproval of the way the government has been trying to deal with it. Rallying round the coalition partners was no problem for the BJP. For whatever reason, Tehelka revelations have not been deemed a scandal big enough to split the BJP-led coalition.

The Vajpayee government had no cause to be panic-stricken, since it was assured of the allies falling in line. The opposition`s clamour for the government`s resignation made no impression on the ruling coalition. In fact, the Congress party as well as the left front which led the offensive were guilty of miscalculation. With indecent haste, Mulayam Singh Yadav of the Smajwadi party joined ranks with the communists to announce the relaunching of a third front, called `Lok Morcha` (People`s front), as if realignment of forces was on the anvil. Jyoti Basu was named its leader, while V.P. Singh also found it necessary to share the platform for equidistance from the BJP and the Congress.

In a similar vein Congress president Sonia Gandhi announced her party`s willingness to go for coalition politics, indicating that the Congress was no more fixated with the idea, as it was in April 1999, that it had the prerogative to lead non-BJP alternative without a power-sharing `arrangement with other parties.` The two moves were symptomatic of the concern to fill the political vacuum if and when the NDA fell apart.

Little wonder, the BJP was not perturbed by the proceedings and took its time to respond to the hue and cry raised by the Congress and other opposition parties. From flat refusal to acknowledge any wrongdoing and counter-charges of a frame-up manipulated by the Congress, the government eventually offered a full-scale debate in the Lok Sabha and also agreed to hold a judicial probe. `What is there to probe?` Congress parliamentary party leader Madhurao Scindia told pressmen outside the House: `everything is clear and transparent`. Ironically enough, even Bangaru Laxman, who was shown in the video accepting the gift money of Rs one lakh, tried to play the innocent until he was forced to resign his office as the BJP president.

It goes without saying that Defence Minister George Fernandes was the `prize catch.` Reputed to be a `tower of political integrity`, the veteran warrior of countless causes - from railway strikes to Tibet`s independence - was trapped, courtesy his close confidant and handpicked president of the Samata Party, Jaya Jaitley, who negotiated the kickback arrangement with the Tehelka reporters in the defence minister`s official residence.

Fernandes is still sticking to his guns. He told the BBC that he was contemplating legal action for defamation. Perhaps his optimism is not entirely misplaced. Although he was allowed to resign from the cabinet, he has been retained as the convener of the NDA, indicating that he still enjoys the confidence and support of the prime minister. Little wonder then that Fernandes is hopeful that he will be back as defence minister in a few months` time.

The scene of action may now shift from parliament to the streets. The opposition parties cannot afford to go on making futile noise, as they stand no chance of breaking the ruling coalition`s majority in the Lok Sabha. Logically their next move should be to take the issue to the people as V.P Singh did in 1989 to highlight the Bofors scam. There were some signals of such a thing happening, as both the Congress and the BJP organized mass rallies in New Delhi but there has since been no follow-up. Regardless of what strategies are formulated by the warring factions to fight the anticipated battle for `Delhi durbar`, it is understood that no one, not even the opposition, wants early mid-term polls. One reason why the ruling coalition partners have stuck together is that they have a stake in maintaining the status quo, and do not want to disturb the existing arrangement so long as they are assured of a share in power.

As to what has been the magnitude of the damage to the Vajpayee government`s image is perhaps a little too early to say. The CBI`s drive to unfold the Bofors episode has been neutralized by the Tehelka disclosures. Whatever moral edge the BJP was perceived to have had over the Congress in terms of a clean leadership has been lost. Both the principal contenders for power in India are in the dock for promoting corruption in high places, and the only wish the people can have is `plague on both your houses.`

A rather erroneous observation made by some commentators is to wait for the outcome of assembly polls in five states scheduled to be held in May to ascertain the popular mood in India. In all the five states which go to the polls in a few weeks - West Bengal, Kerala, Tamil Nadu, Assam, and Pondichery - the BJP has only a marginal presence. Barring Tamil Nadu where it is a junior partner of the DMK, the BJP`s political fortunes are not at stake in the coming state elections.

It may not be an overstatement that the phenomenon of corruption in high places is so omnipresent in India that the people have by and large resigned to it as a necessary evil. A politician, in public perception, is no less than a monster who thrives on his nexus with the bureaucrats, the police and the criminals. It is no news to them that people in positions of power and authority make fortunes by unscrupulous means, even at the expense of compromising the quality of the country`s defence purchases. The Indians have had an incredible number of corruption scams brought to the fore during the past decade. The year 1996 in particular is remembered as the `scandal season`. Apart from the widely publicized `hawala` case which unravelled a corruption scenario beyond the imagination of even the prophets of doom, several other scandals of making money through shady deals were exposed.

In August 1996, Rs 3.51 crore in cash was seized by the CBI in raids on the houses of ex-union minister Sukh Ram who was alleged to have favoured a Hyderabad-based firm during his tenure as a minister. The Jharkand Mukti Morcha (JMM) pay-off case, revealed in September 1996, provided a new perspective on money politics when four JMM MPs were charge-sheeted by the CBI for receiving Rs 3.5 crore to support the ruling Congress party in a crucial vote of confidence to 1993. Two other notable scams brought to the fore in 1996 were the Rs 133 crore `urea scam` involving Prime minister Narashimha Rao`s son, Parshar Rao, and the `fodder scam` in Bihar which led to Bihar chief minister Laloo Prasad Yadav`s trial.

http://www.dawn.com/2001/04/04/op.htm#2

Jay:

SNM Abdi broke that story of Bhagalpur blindings, Aswini Sarin broke the story of buying and selling women in Madhya Pradesh famous as the Kamla case, Pritish Nandy got the first exclusive interview with Frank Camper who trained militants in his terror school in US, Rajat Sharma first revealed Chandraswami as a fake..because the Swami claimed he had seen him coming...and proclaimed his name as Pritish Nandy, Arun Shourie`s claim to fame is the famous Antuley case...which was headlined ``Indira Gandhi as commerce,``

If you notice...the reporters went on to be reporters...while the editor`s get the credit for these stories. Few of these reporters get remembered...or even credited in public memory.

Newsgathering is not as highly regarded by the general public unless it makes an impact. And then, it is the editors who are remembered.

This is not a grouse against editors...only underlining a particular malady of our press..that tehelka cut through. The reporters being interviewed...writing about their exploits...etc...

Harish

Re: Shankar # 14
One can only agree with your conclusion.
But us non-martial Pakistani ``Banias`` already
know what the fortune tellers and palm readers
in Delhi are saying about us.
The Roadrunner can only outrun the Cayote on
a full stomach. But both need to be aware of the
Jackal who watches for either one or preferebly
both to fall.

Ras

[reposted]

macgupta Apr-3-01 #: 20

No lectures to our neighbors (period). Need to clean our own house first. There is no need to discuss these lists or ratings set up by one organization or the other.

Man we must realize that our military is corrupt to the core. This was the last institution we believed to be above the Hindutva and Congress ``FUND`` raisers. Now that belief has gone down the drain.

If our generals are squandering our hard earned dollars then they need to be given the boot and I mean the military boot. This is the time to kick some f#$@k!ng a$$.

Military drama, the security drama and the hindutva drama must go. Down with the three dramas.

Poor masses need bread and shelter. There ain`t no f#$@k!ng sovereignty if the people are conned in some day light Hindutvai robberies.

Gurv say kaho hum Bharati hain.

We all need to take pride in true Bharati culture and not in some westernized, corrupt INDIAN culture.

macgupta Apr-3-01 #: 20

No lectures to our neighbors (period). Need to clean our own house first. There is no need to discuss these lists or ratings set up by one organization or the other.

Man! we must realize that our military is corrupt to the core. This was the last institution we believed to be above the Hindutva and Congress ``FUND`` raisers. Now that belief has gone down the drain.

If our generals are squandering our hard earned dollars then they need to be given the boot and I mean the military boot. This is the time to kick some f#$@k!ng a$$.

Military drama, the security drama and the hindutva drama must go. Down with the three dramas.

Poor masses need bread and shelter. There ain`t no f#$@k!ng soverinity if the people are conned in these day light Hindutvai robberies.

Gurv say kaho hum Bharati hain.

We all need to take pride in true Bharati culture and not in some westernized, corrupt INDIAN culture.

ROmair # 18

very good question

----

An international anti-corruption organization

http://www.transparency.org/

This org. is active in India (one of my relatives started a local chapter).

You can find their corruption index for 2000 at

http://www.transparency.org/documents/cpi/2000/cpi2000.html

India ranks 69 out of 90.

Pakistan is not on the list. It was on the list in 1999 (http://www.transparency.org/documents/cpi/1999/index.html#cpi)

Why it is not on the list in 2000 is not good news -- ``This year`s CPI covers 90 countries, compared to 99 last year. Some countries had to be dropped because there was insufficient 1998-2000 data. For example, some of the surveys used in the CPI are based on international investor attitudes and if a country is widely seen to no longer interest investors, then some survey sources may drop that country in their polling.

``The message is clear: dropping out of the CPI for lack of data may be bad news for countries and may indicate reduced investor interest stimulated by enhanced perceptions of widespread corruption in these countries.

-----

Urstruly, you will always lose if you play the bash-India game.

-Arun Gupta

Romair:

It is to stress on the fact that Indians are inherently very corrupt. I congratulate them on their newly acquired staus of being the most corrupt nation on the planet and probably the known universe (Far Eastern Economic Review). Their corruption should not be a cause for concern for Pakistan, however, what should worries us the most is that fact that they are corrupt AND morons that they got caught in that pathetic way. And these morons & religious nuts are sitting on the nuclear trigger. Hasta la`Vista everyone.

Why is this article on the page three times?

taikonaut reply #: 11

``Corruption won`t stop as long as hate mongers are ruling Bharat``.



I agree, also IMO, the fundameantalists and communalists are always, everywhere, more corrupt and unscrouplous than any other ruling group.

Just one thing though,how exactly one defines a unified Bharati culture? I guess I am not very comfortable with the idea of a single culture for a country like india........it does have ominous portents.

Sincerely

Bakait

Harish,

Arun Shourie with the reporting of the blinding of the prisoners in Bihar was the first true investigative journalist. Blitz and Karanjia was primarily a tabloid journalist. Only thing going for karanjia was the personal friendship of Gama Abdul Nasser of egypt. Blitz was more of slander and rumers than any investigation.

regards

jay

taikonaut,

No Bharati believes that corruption will stop after tehelka. Politicians & civil servants will have to be more careful, thats all. Just the fact that these corrupt SOBs are going to become more paranoid & spend some sleepless nights is sweet victory.

Monicagate wont stop a future US President from cheating on his wife. However, I doubt if a future President will consider getting a bj in the oval office. Besides, no American smokes a cigar these days without a chuckle:) It was worth it.

Ras,

Yaar you have figured us banias out quite well. We dont consider ourselves coyotes for nothing. Now we can tell the world that cleansing our internal political structure is more important than futile talks on Kashmir that everyone knows wont go anywhere. The US press will wholeheartedly agree & will applaud us banias for developing the fourth estate.

Tehelka killed two birds with one stone. Like Omar Mirza says, US opinion IS important. Whether Pakistan likes it or not, you arent the darling boy who stops Soviet expansion anymore. Those days are over. Just yesterday a storm is brewing between China & the US over the spy plane. Watch us banias exploit both US & China.

It takes more than the chest thumping ``martial races`` to check the bania coyote:)

URstruly, start foaming at the mouth:)

Indians need a crash course in corruption

By T. V. R. Shenoy ,Gulf News

http://www.gulf-news.com/Articles/news.asp?ArticleID=13563

``Would that some power gift us the power to see ourselves as others see us!`` wrote Robert Burns. I had just that experience, being outside India as the Tehelka scandal chugs along. The first man I met – airline staff and airport officials excepted of course – was Mohammed from Multan, the driver assigned by Virgin Air to take me from Heathrow to Buckingham Gate. That is a ninety-minute drive in rush hour, and Mohammed was in a chatty mood. Given that he was from Pakistan I braced myself for some insults, but Mohammed was charity itself.

(Perhaps the fact that he has been in Britain for thirty-eight years had something to do with it.) Instead of being rude about India and its leaders, Mohammed preferred to be complimentary about the Indian media. (No, I had not told him that I am a journalist.) Defence scams, he said, take place everywhere, including Pakistan, but nobody challenges the Establishment.

Everything came out into the open in India, he said, because the media is free and can pursue its job without fear. And the strength of that democracy will see India through this crisis too.

The next person who talked to me about the Tehelka exposé at length was Michael, a don at the Sorbonne in Paris. Michael began by pointing out that corruption is not unknown in France – just now his Prime Minister and President are going through an embarrassing period of their own. But the worldly-wise don was surprised at the naivete of the victims.

How, he wondered, could the Bharatiya Janata Party president accept money from a total stranger? How could the chief of the Samata Party discuss contributions while sitting at the residence of the Defence Minister? Michael, as befits a don, is very thorough with the details. He knows that a contribution of a lakh or two will not get anyone any contract even if graft is involved. He was surprised at the utter amateurishness of all concerned.

``You should invite us to run a crash course in corruption``, he said. (Well, it was nice to hear someone from the Western world admit that Indians still have a thing or two to learn about graft!)

However, the most bizarre reaction by far was heard in Washington. Several Non-Resident Indians had gathered in the American capital to greet Lalit Mansingh, the new Indian ambassador. Much to my astonishment I found myself a target in my capacity as a representative of the Indian media. Most of them, it seemed, thought the whole Tehelka exposé was a giant conspiracy.

One set – and I won`t bother mentioning which part of India they hail from – was convinced that it was a plot to defame South Indians. Why? Well, because Bangaru Laxman`s roots are in Andhra Pradesh, George Fernandes hails from Karnataka, and Jaya Jaitly is a Malayalee. I tried, feebly, to point out that Laxman was not elected from Andhra Pradesh, and that Fernandes has only been elected from Maharashtra or Bihar. (As for Jaitly, I can`t remember her standing for even a Panchayat election in Kerala.)

I cannot say that my interlocutors seemed convinced by these facts. Instead they gave way to another set of people who were firmly convinced that it was an anti-minority plot. Taking pity on my bemusement, they deigned to explain that Laxman is a Dalit, Fernandes the first Christian to rise so high in the ranks, and Jaitly is a woman.

Quite frankly, I was left a bit staggered by all this. Tehelka`s actions may be open to question. (I understand that people back home, too, are wondering whether everything was above board; some even allege that it was nothing more than a put-up job by the Congress (I).) But I am sure that Tehelka did not deliberately take aim at Bangaru Laxman, George Fernandes, and Jaya Jaitly for ethnic reasons!

And I was frankly shocked that a taxi-driver from Pakistan had more faith in Indian journalism than did the wealthy Non-Resident Indians gathered in Washington. The fourth reaction that I encountered came from a friend in the U.S. State Department. It was particularly interesting since Americans have had an overdose of scandal in the past four years or so – the second Clinton term. So how does an intelligent American see the fallout of the Tehelka scandal?

His reaction was interesting, not least because he is a member of the American foreign policy establishment. He preferred to focus on the future rather than speculate on conspiracy theories. The first point he made was that the Vajpayee ministry should carry on without being too perturbed. If nothing else, there is really no other alternative, so it will be irresponsible to do anything else.

The second part of his thesis drew upon the lessons of the Clinton years. For only the second time in history, he noted, an American President had been impeached. Charges of corruption - including money-laundering, tax evasion, sale of offices, perjury, and misuse of the power to pardon - had been hurled at Clinton. Most of these allegations were believed to be true. Nevertheless, Clinton`s personal popularity continued undimmed.

There is also a lesson for the Indian Opposition. In the Congressional elections of 1998, at the height of the Lewinsky scandal, the Republicans actually lost seats in both houses of the American Congress. Two years later, the Democrats came within a breath of retaining the White House – and they might have done it too had they used Clinton during the campaign.

The lesson seems to be that voters were more interested in bread and butter issues than in scandals. The lesson for Sonia Gandhi is: tone down your rhetoric, or take the consequences.

So there you have them: the reaction from a Pakistani taxi-driver, a French don, several Non-Resident Indians, and an American diplomat. Whom does one agree with?

Concerned # 6 & ba_kait # 9

Aaap log ``Tehelka Machanay`` ka matlab to
samajhtay hain?

Ras


Anyway another interesting tidbit from the

Kashmir Times (Srinagar) April 3, 2001:


Who was behind hijacking of IA plane ‘Ganga’?
Hashim Qureshi makes startling disclosures about the hijack drama

From Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI, Apr 2: Who was behind the hijacking of Indian Airlines plane ‘Ganga’ in 1971? The question is haunting the researchers even after 30-years. India’s first hijacking commanded by Hashim Qureshi and his cousin Ashraf had then started a chain of political events ultimately leading to the dismemberment of Pakistan.
In a startling disclosure, Hashim Qureshi who is in custody since last January following his ``surrender`` to authorities at the Indira Gandhi International Airport here, has confessed that he was working on the post of sub-inspector in Border