How Would Gandhi Answer This Attack?

WHY THE US NEEDS PAKISTAN NOW



There seems to be a lot of speculation about the fact that Pakistan is now in between a rock and a hard place. The US is going to run over Pakistan if Pakistan doesn`t do everything the US wants. Some Indian newswriters are naively suggesting that the US will actually attack Pakistan.

On the US side, people are suggesting that the US should just invade Afghanistan and get Osama, or even take over Afghanistan, and take out the Taliban. I wonder how much experience these people have in military operations. Probably not much.

For starters, people need to keep in mind that the whole Russian military, with a common border could not take over Afghanistan in ten years of conflict. The British tried, with a common border, and they could not do so either. So I hope none of the US policy planners are thinking along these lines.

``Don`t go to ware against Afghanistan: Russian Veteran

It is no secret that Afghanistan is one of the toughest places on earth to wage war.

.......The Afghans will be ready to fight, no worse than they fought against us, and they fought very well against us`` (Russian colonel Yuri Shamanov, www.brecorder.com)

I don`t think the US can or is threatening Pakistan on this issue. Infact, it greatly needs Pakistan`s help. Why in the world did it contact Pakistan, when it could carry out ops from various different countries. It can carry out a ground offensive through Uzbekestan, Turkemanistan, or the Soviet Union. It can station its forces in the Northern Alliance area of Afghanistan, as well. It can lauch an air offensive from India (which has offered its bases) and Russia and even Turkey. Then why contact Pakistan?

Just because Pakistan recognizes Afghanistan doesn`t mean it controls it. Pakistan recognizes India also, but that doesn`t mean the BJP does what Pakistan wants. However, there are certain things militarily that only Pakistan can offer to the US. These are as follows:

Pakistan operated in Afghanistan for a decade during the Afghan/USSR war. No other military in the world knows the terrain of Afghanistan like the Pakistanis. No other country has nearly the level of intelligence info on Afghanistan as Pakistan does. The US military has neither the intelligence info, nor the knowledge of the terrain. Attacking the flat deserts of Iraq is one thing. Fighting battle hardened Afghanis in mountanious terrain is another. Only Pakistani soldiers can assist in this area.

The US pilots do not know the terrain of Afghanistan, either. They will be sitting ducks for the expert Stinger firers of Afghanistan. The US pilots are trained for high altitude percision bomb attacks. In Afghanistan, they have to fly low into the mountains. Once again, only the Pakistani pilots know the terrain and have this experience. If the US carries out an aerial attack, I am sure they would love to have a Pakistani F-16 pilot, fully trained on F-16s and familiar with the terrain, sitting in one of their F-16 cockpits.

If the US wants to carry out a quick commando operation into Afghanistan to get Osama, they will need Pakistan`s help. It is not as easy as going in to get Noreiga. Who are the best people to fly them in? A good choice would be Pakistani Army helicopter pilots. According to one of my colleagues, his coursemate in the Pakistani Army actually did fly 15 US commandoes into Afghanistan years ago, in a get OBL operation. This operation was carried out by the US, against the advice of the Pakistani Army. He went back to the rendevous point to pick them up and none showed up. All of them were killed. Don`t know if I believe him, but he has never lied to me before.

There are many more reasons, but these are some of the reasons due to which the US has contacted Pakistan first, and so far only Pakistan. So for all those sitting in fear of the US running Pakistan over, I doubt it will happen. It definitely needs Pakistan`s assistance. And the last thing it wants is to create a nuclear armed enemy from a state whose people are neutral towards the US.

I am very interested in seeing the strategy the US will use against Afghanistan. The Afghanis are nearly out of the world financial system, so sanctions will not work. And they are sanctioned to all ends, anyways. There is nothing much to bomb there. They defeated the Soviets and British in long protracted wars. Handling a few hundred commandoes dropping in is a piece of cake for them. Afghani terrain is extremely difficult to fight on, unlike the Iraqi flat terrain. A tank invasion is thus not possible. High altitude air strikes will do nothing more than kill innocent civilians. These will not kill guirellas hiding in mountains. Afghanis are the most experienced users of anti-air Stinger missiles in the world. A tactical nuclear strike will not be tolerated by the rest of the world. And most of all, Afghanis have twenty years of uninterepted day-to-day fighting on their own terrain. Even an Afghani child can take apart and put together a gun. They have a long track record of success in battle. Everyone underestimates them and invades, and gets bogged down, and then retreats.

How will America handle this? If you ask me, they definitely need Pakistan`s help, unless they want to get caught up in another Vietnam. I would be interested in any intelligent non-Pakistani- hatred filled comments (if someone wants to type anti-Pakistani comments, I would suggest a simple, ``I hate Pakistan`` will suffice and save everyone from the misery of reading a long post).

9:00pm 11th September 2001

Caught In-Between

In an attack that killed indiscriminately on September 11th 2001, one can clearly state that it is a war on all humanity. The world trade center encompassed in it the utopia-like belief where all the flags form all over the world lined up with equal grace. Saudi Arabia, Japan, Iran, Pakistan and countless other countries that had their people affected by this attack in some way.

When the embassy in Kenya was bombed years ago, I could easily relate to it because I have walked those streets the 4 years I lived there. I can almost re-live the moment I saw the world trade center for the first time form the America West flight landing in Newark. Anyone with nerve endings can relate and imagine the pain associated with such a tragic attack on human lives and property. Would I be wrong in saying that this world’s intelligence would weep at this bloody crime against the very dignity of God’s creation? Or maybe I am wrong.

I read a book the day before the attack about atheists pointing to destructions and using that to vindicate that there is no God…Americans have shown immense amount of faith despite the lack of figures in who was the believer and who wasn’t. I knew yesterday that faith didn’t belong to a certain religion but lies in some core inside of us. I learned that faith is simply breathing…the power inside of us to keep going on, the intuition that guides us away from danger and the ability to tell our truth.

Those innocent people who perished beneath the rubble too had faith till their last breath. So, the people who did this are fighting a loosing battle they will never win. Who ever they are, they may have put an end to the breath of many but they can never put an end to faith before the murder. Who said self-preservation is the main motivation of human beings? Brave men ran towards danger to save lives. Stories moving against the tide of self-interest hum around that place.

Yesterday America’s security was threatened and so was mine: Not only as an international student in the US, but also as a Pakistani. My country was made from the grounds of dissatisfaction, boiling over after the introduction of religion into politics by Mahatma Gandhi. For Pakistan religion has been a curse. It never seemed to get out of the chains of its illusion. It became an “opium of the people”: Literally and otherwise.

Islamic fundamentalists who vigorously supported Mahatma Gandhi, such as the Ali brothers shouted anti-Pakistan statements before Pakistan was made. Pakistan was helpless in keeping these people out of Pakistan. These fundamentalists of Gandhi’s genre who thought religion as an inseparable part of politics became the religious leaders of Pakistan. They let all rules of dissent die in midair, they forgot that they once declared a fatwa asking the Muslims to follow Gandhi as their leader, they forgot that there is no clergy in Islam, they selectively ignored that progress and education go hand in hand, and like the people who attacked America yesterday, these fanatics forgot human dignity.

Today America has seen terrorism; Pakistan has seen it in series. Pakistan has seen terrorism in Karachi. The bombs the arms the heroine that was quiet non-existent before the US abandoned Afghanistan in its war-ravaged state. This served as an ideal breeding ground for minds behind the Taliban.

So, that is the story of my country. I am sure it wasn’t meant to be this way. Our founder, Barrister Muhammed Ali Jinnah stood for all values that supported the protection of Pakistan against the fanaticism and fundamentalism. He spoke repeatedly of justice, fair play, of being free in the state of Pakistan, of every citizen being equal, of the importance of law and order, of being friendly with all its neighbors, of religious freedom, of a sovereign independent nation with democratic institutions and most importantly the address to the Constituent Assembly in 1947 where he speaks of separation of religion and state.

Yesterday American planes were hijacked; the very same kind held Pakistan’s foundations hostage 53 years ago. Perhaps this may not have been so difficult a task for Pakistan if it hadn’t got the Kashmir issue to devote itself to. Being friendly with India was a reinforcement of our reason to be. But we could not play friendly with a nation in which the constitution states Kashmir is part of their territory, when the people don’t want to belong to India. The fact that a plebiscite didn’t occur was tragic to the tale. Nothing beats over 600,000 Indian forces in Kashmir today. This is tyranny of the majority over a civilian minority. Tyranny is what Pakistan escaped form and it is the very evil that grips it today.

Today the mullah’s have the nerve to feel sympathetic towards the Taliban. Today the Pakistani fundamentalist organizations such as the Lashker-e-Tayiba exist under the protection of the right to assembly of any group of people. Pakistan is forced to walk the narrow path, in response to the sandwich that it is of both India and Afghanistan. Pakistan is choking on its self-created neutrality. It needs to quit being democratic by the standards of anyone and simply ban the fundamentalist Islamic groups as President Musharraf has and it additionally needs to isolate the mullahs.

Yesterday New York lost its aesthetic beauty and its symbol of power; Pakistan is next to a so-called democratic nation that stood by in silence as Hindu fanatics demolished the Babri Mosque. Violence never ends. War breeds more war even after triumph is of the better side. Pakistan is on the defensive almost constantly. It was up against the wall in 1998 when India tested its nuclear weapons. Though unspoken, Pakistan was well aware of the only likely target of those mass murderer weapons. In retaliation Pakistan tested its nuclear weapons.

Victims of Afghanistan’s post war problems come to seek shelter with Pakistan. Armed only with the belief that like India they hold a gift of being the world greatest something. Instead of the world’s largest democracy, they claim to be the world’s truest and purest territory: The most holy place for Islam. Afghanistan is now the “Mecca of the Islamic world”, they profess.

For me it’s like the beginning of an end. My country is looked at in suspicion just because someone somewhere pointed a finger before looking at policies. Pakistan is maligned. But faith is like that I guess… comes and goes like the breath… After all, Russia and America who have now join hands have taken a little too long it seems…it’s a little too late.

Rather pathetic to see the way India has no reverence whatsoever for what has happened. Self promoting article that is an attempt to have India`s agenda promoted. Testing missiles...gosh!

I am short of words at this. Your extremely un charismatic prime minister was kissing up to US pleading to wipe its crap, when it has not been asked to...I have never seen a country so edger to please. Pathetic!!!

You have the nerve to ask what Gandhi would say. He would say:

1. Follow me

2. No, follow my inner light

3. Be submissive

4. be non-violent to the extent that it causes my non-violence to have over 20 policemen killed because they are blind to my inner light

5. When my people get too violent, I will shift my inner light to be a simple fart

6.India has an ancient Hindu tradition of peace SUBTEXT: non-Hindus shut the f up!

7. Forgive me for in forgiveness lies ENO:

Love light and Peace

Gandhi(And he would add a smily face to the manipulation):)

There!

Aisha Fayyazi Sarwari

Y`know this Gandhi article and subsequent replies remind me of good ole partition days. All the Kattar Leagueies used to hate Gandhi and give him choice abuses. Then, the riots started and they all become Gandhi lovers.

The same mullahs who hate the United States, propagate hatred against anyone not in tune with their specific beliefs, call people of a specific religion DINGOS, LANGOORS, ETC. are suddenly falling for the concept of Gandhism. Is this irony or the height of two-facedness?

Can anyone help me out with this situation here? Coz I honestly don`t get it. Advocate violence upon others, but chant Gandhi`s name when you yourself are a possible target? And they call us cowards?

RE: hamidm

``...... as repugnant as the taliban and their ilk are, what is equally sickening is the way the indian jackals and the israeli hyenas are trying to feed off the carnage in ny ``

Well-said, hamidm. It is about time you showed some patriotism. Now if only India`s relevance to this situation was half as important as the number of times Pakistanis have talked of India in this context.

It seems like the only people giving India undue attention are Pakistanis, when it deserves as much attention in this context as Peru does.

...... as repugnant as the taliban and their ilk are, what is equally sickening is the way the indian jackals and the israeli hyenas are trying to feed off the carnage in ny .........the indian press and the dhoti-brigade in new delhi is anxiously trying to equate this heinous act of terrorism with the struggle in occupied territory ( even though it has been hijacked by wild-eyed fanatics in jackboots ) ...... and the israelis are trying to compare it to the just struggle in the occupied territories ...... these shameless scavengers are doing what comes naturally - but they do it well ........

........the indians are being particularly shameless in trying to capitalize on pakistan`s predicament .... hopefully, the self-styled president will have the courage to stand up to the mullahs and do the right thing - otherwise the horrible hindoos will be proven right ......

What would Gandhi say to acid throwers?

Dirty little liar caught red-handed.

People on Chowk often wonder: ``Why does every discussion end up in an Indo-Pak bashing?`` To which, the dirty little liar always screams: ``The Indians started it. I was only saying positive things about Pakistan.``

Well, Chowkies, here is what this liar has just written, without provocation, and with a clear intent to start a Jinnah-Gandhi/India-Pak bashing match:

{{{I am afraid Gandhi is being unnecessarily glorified... anyone who has read Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi, will know that Gandhi would ask the US to `get slaughtered man woman and child and not to respond but dont let your spirit be conquered.`}}}

Now just watch how this board degenerates as he gets thrashed (I`ve already started it).

So who is this dirty little liar? Your very own YLH. Taalian taalian.

Udayakumar: ``Gandhi would focus on soul-searching, self-purification, dialogue and a carefully prepared redemptive program. Instead of spending more money on

the military that could not help New Yorkers and Washingtonites, Gandhi would put those resources into education for peace and justice.``

I agree. Gandhi was a man of action. He could never be a George Bush. But if he were alive today, he would be working with the rescue workers in NY, helping to find victims with his bare hands. He would walk barefoot on broken glass and cinders, dry every teary eye and console every broken heart. He will read from Torah, Bible and Koran at his prayer meetings. Gradually most of the world will come around to his messages. European jews will pack up from Israel and go back to Germany, Poland and Russia. Asian Jews will resign to live under a new Palestine ruled by Osama Bin Laden. Not a man to leave any good deed undone, he would then take a fast unto death to force USA to pay compensation to Japan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and a million dollar each to Udaykumar, Farzana and Yours Truly for their unstinted support of justice and peace. While George Bush and his cabinet will be hesitant at first, even the communal jew Greenspan would agree at last to Gandhi Ji`s demands.

He would be killed by two right-wing nuts with plastic knives.

Fifty years from now, a young Yahwah armed with thirty books would convince the whole world that Osama was the true secular leader of world peace and Gandhi was a communal trouble maker.

Trying to put a Gandhi Cap on Mr. Bin Laden`s skull -- after the kill -- is like lecturing a Hyena on the health benefits of vegetarianism.

What Mr. Laden really needs right now is -- some skull cracking -- not a Gandhi cap.

``Gandhi would be steadfast in his stand that violence cannot and should not be countered by super-violence for it would not only resolve anything but only

justify the initial violence. His answer for terrorism would not be counter-terrorism or heightened terrorism as governments tend to believe.``

What would have Gandhi achieved in South Africa, had he been there in place of Mandela?

Sometimes, only the guns can be understood. Nothing else.

This is Crazy. It is the fantasy of a mind desperately seeking alternate answers and comes up

with a total misfit.

There is no relation to time, situation,geo-political reality. Give Gandhiji his due. He was not just a spiritual leader, he was an astute politician, a great one at that.

BTW did Krishna teach Geeta to George Bush on the eve of the Gulf war? Or did Gandhiji ask the Aghans to boycott AK47 when the Russians invaded?

Pullu

Udayakumar: ``Gandhi would focus on soul-searching, self-purification, dialogue and a carefully prepared redemptive program. Instead of spending more money on

the military that could not help New Yorkers and Washingtonites, Gandhi would put those resources into education for peace and justice.``

I agree. Gandhi was a man of action. He could never be a George Bush. But if he were alive today, he would be working with the rescue workers in NY, helping to find victims with his bare hands. He would walk barefoot on broken glass and cinders, dry every teary eye and console every broken heart. He will read from Torah, Bible and Koran at his prayer meetings. Gradually most of the world will come around to his messages. European jews will pack up from Israel and go back to Germany, Poland and Russia. Asian Jews will resign to live under a new Palestine ruled by Osama Bin Laden. Not a man to leave any good deed undone, he would then take a fast unto death to force USA to pay compensation to Japan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and a million dollar each to Udaykumar, Farzana and Yours Truly for their unstinted support of justice and peace. While George Bush and his cabinet will be hesitant at first, even the communal jew Greenspan would agree at last to Gandhi Ji`s demands.

He would be killed by two right-wing nuts with plastic knives.

Fifty years from now, a young Yahwah armed with thirty books would convince the whole world that Osama was the true secular leader of world peace and Gandhi was a communal trouble maker.

This is more of what I`d like to read - a thought-provoking version of what`s going on with humanity.

Thank you for this look at the cause...

I am afraid Gandhi is being unnecessarily glorified... anyone who has read Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi, will know that Gandhi would ask the US to `get slaughtered man woman and child and not to respond but dont let your spirit be conquered.`

Spoilt Brat throws Tantrum, Advani criess: ``baby needs attention!``

``India tests surface-to-air missile: NEW DELHI, Sept 14: India today test-fired its medium-range surface-to-air ``Akash`` missile from the eastern state of Orissa, a defence ministry spokesman said. ``