In This Together

Reply # 66 Eklavya

[``LOL...I could rip you apart in two minutes but I gave up that game long ago.``]

Dhannivaal Maharaaj.

Reply # 68 sadna

Distortions, exaggerations and outright lies

Sadna, its a waste of time interacting with proven shameless liars.

Remember the lie ``no women were allowed to vote in the local bodies polls in NWFP``?. Remember how a pakistani kid, young enough to be the liar`s grandson, exposed this lie?

``Sakina`` was discussed in detail in a recent Chowk article. Read it again. You might remember more than you ``seem to remember`` now.

Re: Ali

When I was a kid, there was a guy in my school whose name was David Din Dayal. What a wonderful name -- you would never have been able to guess his religion (was he Christian, Muslim or Hindu?). We never asked, and never imputed him to change it. I doubt that even you would be rude enough to ask anyone face to face (like you did to Jawahara) the type of question that you asked her. Not a single person has found you to be polite.

Reply # 70 saminashah

I am impressed. I think your students are blessed to have you as their teacher. Your husband is blessed to have you as his wife. Your friends are blessed to have you as a friend. Chowk is blessed to have you as an interactor.

I am blessed to have you as my guide, mentor and teacher.

love and regards

manhoos aadmi

ali1 #76
``Sadna, its a waste of time interacting with proven shameless liars. ``

Authenticity by accusation, thanks.

`` Distortions, exaggerations and outright lies ``

Interesting statement of self-realization:

ali1 #52
`` Your parents in India made such a compromise with your first name. ``
ali1 #55
`` Of course we make all sorts of (fig-leaf) justifications for our compromises.........``

ali1 #63
`` But a ``beleaguered Indian pseudo-secular muslim`` like yourself couldn`t help jumping in, probably just to prove your secular-than-thou credentials?

ali1 #63
``Until it happens both ways, it would remain a compromise (aka suc_king up to Hindus) on the part of Indian muslims.
Unless ``any natural expression of big heartedness`` comes from the other side, this ``small hearted`` pakistani would continue to think of your kinds as spineless turds.``

Till Indian Hindus adopt Muslim names, the Pakistani is the one with the spine. This what they teach in those Oxford/Cambridge schools at such great expense?

``BTW what do you consider a ``natural expression of big heartedness`` from the other side these days? That they haven`t burnt down your house in the past 5 years and that you are not one of 17000 Gujrati Muslim TADA detainees?``

Ahmedi mosques can get burnt and Shias can be killed, and those taken in custody after the incidents are Ahmadis and Shias. Thats the same Pakistani showing his self-same spine.

So are Hindus adopting Muslim names blasphemous or not? Were Muslims protesting the same Sakina right or wrong?

shammi on ali:

``Not a single person has found you to be polite.``

with all due respect sir, i have, i think ali is a fine young man. he gives back what he gets, which is why he is stereotyped as he is. we need to be fair in our critisism. there are other interactors wo behave as obscenely as he does (and he DOES)- why not reprimand and direct posts to them too?

ali1:

she is an absolute, bonafide, certified, verafied jaan :)

ali

Indeed.

Ali1

Has heera mandi given you a family discount?

All this worrying about names a bit amusing. For a longish time I had a female friend, an Indian Hindu lady, with a very ``Christian`` name. Names like Iqbal Singh are a dime a dozen. Mixed Hindu-Christian-Muslim names too can be found, especially in the southern parts of India. And, often times, writers and poets take up pseudonyms derived from all kinds of linguistic and religious traditions. And all of us know that language is not religion.

I think for a parent to name a child must be an exciting, meaningful, even overwhelming excercise. It is a highly personal thing, often a homage to a close friend, a beloved relative, a venerable public figure, a personal thank-you to a generous God. Naming a child, thus, is a cultural feat, a linguistic feat, a personal feat. A friend of mine, married to an American Christian lady, recently named a cutest-looking newborn son of his as ``Nikhil`` or ``Nicholas,`` depending upon which of the two sets of doting, overjoyed grandparents is spending time with the lucky bundle of diapers!

What matters is respect. Do we have respect for those around us? Do we have respect for our parents who have named us, for our cultures - separate and common, for our nations, and for all that adds value to our lives and to the lives of our children? Once we find that respect in our hearts, we can move on to meeting our real challenge - nurturing our humanity. If we dont, we - Hindus, Muslims, and others - will go on abusing people for their names, and perhaps, wont mind getting a few others blown up so long as they have ``wrong`` names.

Actually, for me, it is very hard to be rude to someone using the nick ali. That name has a deep and intimate meaning for me. But that is not a subject fit for Chowk.

sadna,

Do you always stick around after having been told to buzz off, albeit subtly?

Now buzz off. Go chew on a redwood log. I am not talking to liars.

``Women were not allowed to vote in the local bodies election in NWFP``. -- Liar

[``i think ali is a fine young man``]

Thanks. This fine young man will celebrate his 77th birthday next September :-)

[``she is an absolute, bonafide, certified, verafied jaan :)``]

So are you, kiddo.

ali1 #84
``Women were not allowed to vote in the local bodies election in NWFP``. -- Liar

How does calling me a liar strengthen your stupid statements and generalizations about names of Indians ?

``Do you always stick around after having been told to buzz off, albeit subtly?``

Its amazing that your responses seem to correspond to Pakistani history so exactly. Now is this where the Hindus were driven out or where someone was hanged? Is it the Pakistani spine which decides who stays or who goes? Well, hopefully (for you) there was a mercy petition somewhere in Pakistani history and you will apply for it soon.

manhoos aadmi aka ali1,

don`t you dare say anything mean to Eklavya again.

leave your anger and gali galoch for people who dish them out.

ali1 #63

…alialiali…..you just picked on zafar and

eklavya, two of the nicest ppl here….is there anybody here you find no fault with except yourself?

ali:

``Thanks. This fine young man will celebrate his 77th birthday next September :-)``

LOL..i recognize that as a hint, albiet a subtle one, to stop stalking you all over the place :)

be happy :0)

I just heard excerpts from MLK`s speech accepting the Nobel Prize for Peace, 1964. It was a stunningly beautiful and effective delivery....I am going to look for an audio collection of all his available speeches.

Here was a superior human being by far, in spirit, in intelligence, in courage. My salutations to him. If there is a heaven, it belongs to him.

anNy,

You are quite right. One loses credibility if one is not even-handed, even though being even-handed is hard and we are all apt to slip at times, particularly if we see ourselves to be in a situation of conflict.

Nevertheless, there are a couple of things that I find very offensive, and consider very low, beyond the usual India-Pakistan and Hindu-Muslim blabber. And I hope I do not fail to criticize anybody who goes down that inhuman route. At the top of that list is religious fascism. This fascism dictates what other members of one`s religious group may or may not do. If, for example, one Hindu called another Hindu lady a slut and prostitute because she was trying to learn Urdu, or because she had some Muslims as friends, that will be an example of religious fascism. In India, we have a politician by the name of Mulayam Singh. I don`t like that politician for many reasons but there is one thing good about him: he, for reasons of either political expedience or genuine conviction - champions the cause of Muslims. For that transgression, some people call him Mullah Mulayam, suggesting that he is not a real a Hindu. That is religious fascism, pure and simple, and very very low. I know of one young girl named Nafisa Sharma. Her dad named her thus because the poor fellow had the biggest crush on Nafisa Ali (actually, I wonder if any Indian man who watched the movie Junoon didn`t skip a few heartbeats! :)). That name may evoke some curiosity (as everything not in complete conformity with the world around it invariably will), but if some Hindus accused her of sleeping around with every Muslim man, then THAT will be religious fascism, and, again, very very low. Once you mentioned on Chowk that you had a Hindu classmate. Now, if other Hindu acquaintances of this person began to suggest to him that he must not be loyal to Pakistan, must not not take any pride in the cultural, political, and scientific achievements of other Pakistanis, then THAT will be religious fascism of the very worst kind.

Such fascism is a very common disease, far more common than should be the case in this day and age. It is a sign of inner weakness in us all, an unerring sympotom of inherent spiritual darkness, reinforced by cultural and religious prejudices, unmitigated by the light of education, reflection, and human experience. I myself am not fully immune from it, for this strand of fascism is very seductive; it feeds into our traditional, ready-made images of the good and the bad, you-bad me-good nonsense, and completely short-circuits the need to think for ourselves. But I do hope that when I see others - Hindus, Muslims, others - behaving as religious fascists, I stand up to their evil, and others stand up to me when I do the same. That is the only way to live as human beings.