Afghanistan Reflections

DOCTRINE OF NECESSITY,

The above is a unique contribution of pak supreme court to the legal system. When ever there is a coup, the great supreme court of pakistan says that the coupe is all right and is legal because it has taken place and if we dont agree, we will be shot. hence is the term doctrine of necessity.

Now the great mushy also could have used this to justify his tail between the legs run from the taliban. No he has coined a new one, THE DOCTRINE OF NATIONAL INTEREST. Instead of accepting the reality that they had no choice, or rather the choice was to get bombed along with afghanistan, or get the bombing postponed to another day, the mushy chose the first. In fact that is the only choice for closet islamict of the allegedly ataturk variety. But he says that it was done on national interest, which leaves the question, what was he doing all these days.

Well, all that he aws interested was the good of the military.

Osamas’ stab passengers



BY ANIL ASHUTOSH

TIMES NEWS NETWORK



HANBAD: Osama bin Laden travelling in a general compartment of the Ganga-Damodar Express? Sounds ridiculous. But two youths identifying themselves as ‘Osama’ not only created a brawl over a petty issue in a compartment of the train on Wednesday morning but also stabbed three co-passengers.

According to the SP (rail), M M Ojha, some passengers of the Ganga-Damodar Express coming from Patna pulled the chain of the train near the outer cabin of the Gomoh railway station about 4.45 am Wednesday to alight from the train. Other passengers objected to this, which led to a heated altercation. As the altercation was on, two quarrelling youths, all on a sudden, announced that they were Osama bin Laden and stabbed three passengers.

tahmed,

Thick plottens is/was a common expression in australia, at least in those days in melbourne.

jay

Romair:

I always thought that ppl like `jay` r the worst voice of India, and I was yet to see the worst voice from Pakistan, my country.

And then i read some recent posts of urs.

Can a man be so blind to belive in Pakistani army`s absurd policies in the region, which has threatened the normal lives of so many ppl? Even the belief in God should be tested on some rationality, from time to time.

Now when the gneral musharaf is behaving like an internatioal prostitute (unwilling, though) in selling the national honor and sovereignity, which no arab country is ready to do, even saudi arab, ppl like u r still seeing the wisdom in army`s old policies. If now, they had to talk to former king of Afghanistan, why did they push jahil students of Fazlur rehman on Afghanistan? They perhaps thought, if punjabis can dominate pakitsan, why not pathans in Afhanistan. After all, they both r major ethnic communities in pak and afghanistan. It is just like how army intelligence came up with Punjabi-Pukhtoon ittehad in Karachi to defeat MQM. Now, this Punjabi-Pukhtoon ittehad was building up to defeat India. And they called it `strategic depth`. my foot!

As if an unwilling prostitute murmurs from time to time to beg for some good treatment, General musharaff is begging USA not to let northern alliance get Afghanistan. And he got a timely reprimand from former king`s camp to mind his own business. Can a general be so degraded? it is worst than 1971 defeat, as it came to an end. But this deefat wil haunt them as long as single Afghan is there across the border to remind Pakistani army of its kingmaker role in Afghanistan.

By serving the temporary US interests, the army would get something in money and plotical recognition from USA, but the dishonor that they brought to Pakistan for supporting and creating that jahil regime in Afghanistan will not go away. Their kashmir policy (of getting kashmiris trained in Afghanistan), and then denying their roles in insuregency is also in doldrums.

The only way that we can limit these absurd and militant role of army in Pakistan is to limit its size. its gonna hurt the punjabis the most, but they must accept their realistic role in Pakistan, as much as pathans need to understand their size in Afghanistan.

Lets put and end to this punjabi-pukhtoon ittehad in the south east asia.

Urstruly

China and Pakistan need each other more than ever

There can be no doubt of this. China is set to invest $100 billion into Xinjiang, additionally the Shanghai group was organized to facilitate this investment and to provide a western outlet for the fruit of that investment.

Now The American has asserted itself in Central Asia, and will not leave; the Russian has made his choice. The American suggest that other Muslim nations will also be targetted; the seeds of a larger conflict are being sowed. In a way this is the beginning of the end of American forward position in the Middle East and South Asia and a yet another retransformation of the internal and external organization of Muslim polities from North Africa to Indonesia.

Pakistan joined the coalition after consulting with the Chinese, either way, neither China nor a combination of China and Pakistan could have saved the Taliban client, indeed the Taliban regime could not have been saved under any circumstance, the event of September 11, only served to speed up the inevitable. Pakistani nuclear facilities to be targetted? Get real, more than just Pakistan have an interest in these facilities and global balance. Yes, it serves to sober up cetain elements in country but makes no sense and is naive.

Keep their nerve, and their fingers crossed, is all either China or Pakistan can do for the time being - unless, something of a spine developes in armed segments of Saudi society (not necessarily anti American) and Pakistan enacts laws to gaurantee Saudi and Gulf investment. The single biggest reason Saudi and Gulf investments shy away from Pakistan is the lack of consistency of Pakistani economy policy, followed by the lack of trustworthyness of Pakistani politicians.



For next three to five years, Look for:

A stronger, more liberal, in key areas, more authoritarian, Pakistani State, preparing for distinct possibility of a slow building, nuanced but larger conflagration.

The possibility of an acceptable deal on Kashmir

A ``quiteism``, (preceded by a lot of street protest and it`s brutal suppression) in the ranks of parties such as JI, followed by the slow championing of liberty within a Islamic framework and Islamic/Islamacized references. Liberty is Liberty, does it make a difference what color the cat is as long as it catches mice?

A barren wilderness, a poverty of vision, character and integrity, in all other national and regional political parties.

Without approval from official and unoffical Islamic sources and references, The system of Qist or installment payment, requiring an acceptance and respect of credit (to be defined as an aspect of Amanat), Internal market based a framework of documentation and transparency, profitable banking, Infrastructure and home construction and sales, automobile industry, mass consumption of big ticket household consumer goods, will not takeoff, regardless of the level of investment. Before the investment, there has to be an intellectual basis for the acceptance of the underlying system of economic development.

(If I had a dime for every wish? - actually, I do think this is doable)

In terms of Pakistan, historic investment in education and human resource development.

A gaurantee, the American will not enable any sale of weapon systems such as fighter aircraft or AWACS or JSTARS to Pakistan. Pakistani navy will continue to be a small, impotent, littoral navy, with an strategic emphasis on tactical submarines. Pakistani hardware for all services will continue to be less than first rate, with the exception of missiles.

A more diversified set of export customers, with more emphasis on exports to EU, and Middle Eastern manufacturing and sales joint ventures.

Closer alignment of the Pakistani economy with that of the Chinese; with Chinese manufactured goods imported and Pakistani raw and semi-processed material exported to China.

Some interesting replies thus far but it appears that most people here are avoiding calling a spade a spade.
Much has been written on CHOWK on this subject now. I tried to make it a point not to mention India anywhere in this piece but as usual, the
small group of posters with origins from across the border could not resist dragging Pakistan-India relations into this.
The forces of extremism threaten everyone. On September 11, among the dead were innocent Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, Iranians and Arabs. This attack not only targeted America but ended up hurting the whole world.
It was a crime against humanity.

Ras

Romair # 62

I like Ali1`s theory better. Even if it does not apply in this pareticular instance, what Ali is suggesting is bound to happen, sooner or later. If I were an American, India would have been my first choice to control unstable and ``rogue`` nations on its West. Pakistan needs China more than ever and vice versa.

Re Banjaara #: 32

[``Musharraf, the wily Delhi-born Muhajir that he is, has made all the right moves, at the right time.``]

Guys, you got your dream. We have a guy eligible for Indian citizenship under Indian laws ruling Pakistan.

Oops! I guess you guys want a Pakistani to rule from Delhi.

Sometimes, you got to change your dreams.

Jay #43 ``The thick plottens``

And hate makes Jay speaking forgottens...

ali! #56: Your conspiracy theory is pretty good:-)

Here is another one:

Musharraf had personally appointed Mahmood and Usmani at their respective positions, after the coup. They were close friends of his, specially Usmani. These are well-known facts.

However, during Mahmood`s visit to Afghanistan, he was indoctrinated by the Taliban. He was so impressed by Mullah Umar, that he became a disciple, right there and then, and vowed to disown Musharraf and Pakistan (a person for whom he had risked his life in a coup, and a country for which he had fought a war).

Mahmood then started to influence Usmani. And within two days, their personailities completely changed. They were no longer the same people that Musharraf knew before Sep 11, 01. They turned into fanatics, overnight. Usmani even started to let his beard grow out.

Musharraf then decided to appoint Aziz as the new ISI head. However, tehelka.com had already declared Aziz to be a fanatic. This, of course, definitely makes him one:-) And his beard was a Navy stypled beard like Ayaz Amir`s, which makes him a bigger fanatic than Usmani (who has a shorter beard). And almost, but not quite, as big a fanatic as ZZ Top (the rock group which has longer beards than anyone). However, how could tehelka.com be wrong? That is impossible. They know the personalities of the Pakistani generals, better than their own wife and kids.

This placed Musharraf in a pickle? How did all his colleagues who helped him carry out the coup, become fanatics overnight. He had known them for thirty years. Due to this, he decided to, ``purge`` the Army of all fundamentalists by superseding these two guys. He also decided to renew his membership of tehelka.com, so that he can keep an eye on his close friends.

Either these two guys were the only fanatics in the Army, in which case they made a mistake of assisting in overthrowing NS, who was about to pass the Shariat Bill. If they only would not have assisted in the coup, there beloved Shariat Bill would have been a law. Or tehelka.com and other papers (and many Pakistani contributors on Chowk) project themselves to know more about the internals of the Pakistani military, than they actually do. Or Pakistan Army is still filled with fanatics (who for some reason never become COAS), and soon they will recruit ZZ Top as their new leader.

Re: Romair #35

``...Let democracy take its course in places like Egypt and Algeria. If Islamic govts. come into power (which they will in Algeria), work with them...``

What is good for the goose, should also be good for the gander. But, not if your prescription above is compared to what you frequently cited as criticism of the NS regime. You were, if you recall, justifying the unconstitutional removal of NS on the grounds that he was about to introduce the Shariat Bill in the Assembly. Be consistent in your convictions.

Here is an excerpt from an article by Ikram Sehgal in day before yesterday`s ``The Nation`` daily. Ikram Sehgal is one of the most strongly supporter of Musharraf in Pakistani media.

[Mahmood has been one of his closest friends and a regimental colleague from 16-Self-Propelled Regiment (of Artillery). As Commander, Mahmood led the 10-Corps troops (111-Brigade) into the PM’s House (closely following SSG troops heli-lifted earlier from the Mangla Airfield on orders of the CGS Aziz) on the fateful 12 October 1999. It was Muzzafar Usmani as Commander 5-Corps Karachi, who took over the airport to allow the PIA aircraft in which the COAS was travelling, to land. Usmani has again being his close friend and colleague for many years, first as a student and then fellow instructor in both the Command & Staff College, Quetta, and National Defence College (then at Rawalpindi). Yousaf was probably the odd man out of the loop on the fateful day as Aziz as the CGS who masterminded the counter-coup, which brought Pervez Musharraf back as COAS, and de facto ruler of Pakistan. But when it came to replace Aziz (who needed experience as a Corps Commander) he chose Yousaf as CGS. Arguably, the CGS-slot is the most powerful in the Pakistan Army after that of the COAS, particularly because the elite SSG is under his direct control. Aziz was the one who denied control of GHQ to the new team hastily selected by then PM Mian Nawaz Sharif’s COAS-designate Lt Gen Ziauddin Butt.

Mahmood has always been a good professional soldier with a good reputation throughout his career. As DG ISI he stayed very much in the background as it should be and never threw his weight around as other DGs ISI before him. He is from my alma mater, Lawrence College, Ghoragali as is Amjad (formerly Chairman NAB), both quite insignificant characters as schoolboys. Generally, they have been clean except when putting their “Gallian” classmates (and chums) either into various lucrative slots (mainly square pegs in round holes), targeting people like Khalid Aziz (Additional Chief Secretary NWFP) just because he gave them a tough time in school as “head boy” and lastly, protecting some black sheep friends. Unfortunately, Mahmood has never heard a shot being fired in anger, having no combat experience at all. In a news analysis “

Muzaffar Usmani is an acute personal disappointment. Personally very fond of him, I got upset with my good friend and 34th PMA coursemate (and fellow Gallian) Maj Gen (now retired) Malik Saleem Khan when he held up Usmani’s wearing of the rank despite his being approved as Major General. Before that my close friend Ambassador Brig (Retd) Saeed Ismat, Sitara-i-Jurrat had spoken of about an incident in Saudi Arabia where he felt Usmani would have been sent home on adverse report.]

Although the above excerpt speaks for itself but I would like to touch upon couple of points. Ist one deals with Khalid Aziz, additional chief secy NWFP. Some of us might recall, above an year or so ago, Bilal Ahmed brought his plight into our attention by reproducing a letter from his daughter to Pakistani newspapers above unfairly charging her father with corruption and keeping him in attock fort (jail) in solitary confinement and perhaps abusing also. I recall discussing his case with some chowkwallahs. Now read the excerpt and understand the reasons behind Khaled Aziz plight. Just another example of corruption free government by people whose ``only`` interest is ``serving`` Pakistan.

Second point is the lifting of SSG troops from Mangla prior under order from gen Aziz by helicopters to Islamabad on october 12, 1999. It also appears from the excerpt that it happened before 111 brigade started moving to conquer Islamabad (111 brigade followed SSG). Funny eh? Did ND fired Musharraf first or Aziz order to bring in SSG troops to Islamabad? I think, NS fired Mushy after seeing the begining of a coup against him by Aziz`s move to bring in SSG men (Mushy was core commander Mangla before appointment as COAS and trusts SSG more). It seems that firing Mushy had nothing to do with accumulating power or appointing more loyal Zia Uddin Butt but a last resort effort to stop coup from succeeding.

Amit # 49

``I have personally known Pakistanis who have served in their army and airforce. They are indeed very polished, well educated people.``

That`s why they are sent on early retirement or kicked out:)))

Jay # 43

``The thick plottens.

Alliance staffer who took hijack call dead ``

Maharaj!

Please dont be afraid.Control your self.Do not

cast aspersions on the good name of RAW.Let`s all

wait and see the``thickened plottens`` unfold in the

coming days.Dont worry about 24 year old Wani,he was only a Kashmiri muslim or do you prefer to call him hatoo.

Shubh kamna.

``Pakistani Troops and Taleban Fighters Clash on Border VOA News

10 Oct 2001 05:52 UTC

Pakistani border guards are reported to have fought a brief gunbattle with Afghan Taleban fighters at a remote border area in northwestern Pakistan.

News reports quoted witnesses as saying the gunbattle that lasted more than two hours erupted in Pakistan`s Bajaur tribal district Tuesday, when soldiers stopped a group of Taleban fighters trying to enter Pakistan.

At least four Pakistani troops were wounded in the fighting - the first reported border clash between the Taleban and Pakistan since the U.S.-led military strikes in Afghanistan began on Sunday.`` (www.pakistandaily.com)

Pakistandaily.com is a good source of information.

If these were troops of the Pakistan Army, then I am afraid the Taliban have made a big mistake. Whatever sympathy they had within the Pakistan Army will be finished. Once a soldier of one`s own Army is wounded by another, then all sympathies tend to go out the door, amongst the other soldiers. Call it tradition or call it brotherhood, or call it craziness. But it is taken very seriously.

There has been an interesting debate going on Canadian television (quite a bit more mature than US television on international affairs) on the anti-terrorism resolutions/policies passed by the UN.

I think any country that wants the world to look at terrorism should not hesitate to cooperate with these anti-terrorism resolutions. It should work under these resolutions, and ask the UN to take a look at alleged terrorism being carried out in its areas.

If it is unwilling to do so, then I don`t think anyone will take its claims serioursly, and it should keep its mouth shut.