A Time for Renewal

Re: Dost-Mittar

``How many of the 19 people suspected of the 9-11 hijacking have been indicted in a court of law?``

Dost, you don`t indict dead people in any court.

AReply #: 677

semipreciousme

from whitman`s world: (sorry i keep switching boards but by the time i got around to replying, it was off the main)

bhardwaj:

``If Anny & Semi has boyfriends they better not be seen alone with him.Isnt it crime under Hudood to go out as unmarried couple.?``

…..looks like you’re a little out of touch….

IAM S H O C K E D !!Evenwhen80$% akistani are Osama-Taleban according to Sadna,Jay,..u know who else brigade??

anNy:

{``….hey stuka, this burger thing is getting pretty insulting :(`` }

”haan burgers bohat losers hotae hain...so, how would you classify our brand though? crazy? or is there a more eleqouent way around it?”

….more eloquent than crazy?….’fraid not….

“p.s: Semi please excuse the liberty i just took- experience tells me that this mattter needs to be killed right here unless you wish to be stalked and harassed endlessly.”

….lol…..not at all

I DONT THINK U UNDERSTOOD ,before you agreed!

Stuka

semipreciousme:

”mujhe maaf karo please. Arrey, no insult intended, I swear. From reading the earlier interacts, I was getting the idea that any English speaking westernised person was called ``Burger`` as slang. That`s all.”

….maaf kiya…burger here translates into one word: wannabe…and confused (ok, that’s 2 words)….so now you know why it’s kinda insulting….: )

SIMPLE BOLO NA ABCD(american born CONFUSED desi ke tarah

Re Eklavya #673

I wonder why you started your list of places in trans-gomti Lucknow with I.T. College. There is more to you than meets the untrained eye. Just kidding, of course.

Dost-Mittar:

If you will have a nice pumpkin pie, well-made samosas, and properly made chai[with milk] ready for me then I may look into it. Batayaen? ( *_ *)!

TAhmed:

Take Care!

Edhi is one Pakistani the whole subcontinent can be proud of -- and emulate.

Faiza #471 And one last thing,the last post was a joke. You know, as in :-)

Cheers

Faiza #471 And one more thing to my previous post: replacing my respectable suffix of 321 with 420 wont make you right either.

Faiza #671 You write: ``May be you dont know living in well known as Paindoo ,``

I honestly cant figure out what you are saying. Could you please repeat in English what you are trying to say.

I read the piece from Ms. Rai, and see that she too (like some other folks on chowk as well) thinks that the US should not go after the terrorists since this will breed more of them. I think she needs to understand that there is a threshhold beyond which one stops being enlightened and becomes a doormat. After the violent attack of September 11, when 5000 people going about their everyday business were brutally slaughtered, not only does is the US have what it has every right to do, from a longer perspective the US is also doing the right thing.

I am all for Gandhi`s non-violence, but there comes a time when one has to stand up and fight. Or lie down and become a doormat that every thug can wipe his dirt on.

It is we South Asians who need a lesson from the US on when to be tolerant and when to stand up and fight. Not the other way round. Much as we like to believe otherwise. And those goes for intellectuals like Ms. Rai and self-indulgent morons (sorry if this offends you) like Imran Khan.

Faiza,

``I have problem witth the word SECULAR ,it does not mean as 99 % of indian thins equality,freedom & human rights .See English is 2nd language to indians of any religions.Indian chose Secularism to mean all that but in language SECULAEISM means DEVOID of any religion.Why does other western democracy have EQUAL RIGHTS,HUMAN RIGHTS,AFFIRMATIVE ACTION ,LIBERTY,LIFE & PURSUIT OF HAPINESS instead??``

What do you care the word literally means? You should care for what the Indians take the word to mean.

``I told you to read previous posts to Eklavia & Saxsena ,you did not & you jumped in between the discussion.``

I read your posts to RSaxena and Eklavya. You haven`t agreed that US harps about being secular all the time. Much more than Indian, in fact.

BTW, you still haven`t answered my question on why shouldn`t Indians wear secularism on their sleeves.

``I ll give you example of friendship between theocratic state ISRAEL & democratic U.S.A. So tell me EVEN IF PAKISTAN IS THEOCRATIC why not India be friends with it ???Its not SECULARISM or any such thing IS IT?``

India will be friends with a theocratic country as long as it doesn`t harm India`s interests. Are you out of your mind? Comparing US/Israel with India/Pakistan? India is friends with Saudi Arabia and Saudi Arabia is a theocratic country.

``I still insist take any actress hindu for opinio n on Hindu matters.Shabana gave opinion about filming WATER movie you hindus conveniently bashed he as anti Hindu ,now you want to USE her to rail road muslims??``

Are you really dumb or do you like acting dumb? Kajol is not a social worker. And mind you nobody solicited Shabana Azmi`s opinion. If Kajol volunteers a statement I am sure it will appear in the newspapers.

What is this about bashing Shabana Azmi for anti-Hindu opinions? Who did that? Did Hindus on chowk do that? Or are you confusing RSS/VHP goons with people on this board.

``At least by profession he has to be a practicing muslims.I did not say Bukhari represented muslim opinion.AGAIN YOU DID NOT READ THE DICUSSION EKLAVIA & SAXSENA`S POSTS .Thats your problem.I said he has right to voice his opinion as citizen& NOT be threatened with DEPORTATION OR JAIL!!``

If Bukhari has a right to voice his opinion then so does Shabana Azmi. Just because Shabana Azmi said he should be dumped in Afghanistan doesn`t mean that the Indian govt. is going to do so.

What kind of idiotic statement is ``Bukhari is a practising muslim``? Shabana Azmi is not?

Are you a practising Muslim? Shabana Azmi represents the liberal section of the Indian Muslim society and Bukhari represents the narrow minded section of the Indian Muslim society. Which one do you belong to?

re drumz 660

Reassures me what we have known for the longest time: amongst the most ungrateful people in the world, one is likely to find a large number of Canadians and French.

Reply Banjaara # 655

“Since when one is identified from the maternal roots,I was under the impression that it was the paternal side that took care of the origin of a person.”

Vaisai Faiza Begum bahuth scientific ho rahi hain, mathlab mitochondrial DNA 100% maternal side se inherit ki jaathi hai na…

Zafar

Reply Saminashah # 657

“Hold on to that little corner of insistence, Saxi; it will be all the more enjoyable to watch when you eventually meet a fetching tree hugger...”

Wearing which designer label? Lemme guess, an Osho spinoff.

But I agree, and it’s more than likely to happen in Scandinavia…

from whitman`s world: (sorry i keep switching boards but by the time i got around to replying, it was off the main)

bhardwaj:

``If Anny & Semi has boyfriends they better not be seen alone with him.Isnt it crime under Hudood to go out as unmarried couple.?``

…..looks like you’re a little out of touch….

anNy:

{``….hey stuka, this burger thing is getting pretty insulting :(`` }

”haan burgers bohat losers hotae hain...so, how would you classify our brand though? crazy? or is there a more eleqouent way around it?”

….more eloquent than crazy?….’fraid not….

“p.s: Semi please excuse the liberty i just took- experience tells me that this mattter needs to be killed right here unless you wish to be stalked and harassed endlessly.”

….lol…..not at all

Stuka

semipreciousme:

”mujhe maaf karo please. Arrey, no insult intended, I swear. From reading the earlier interacts, I was getting the idea that any English speaking westernised person was called ``Burger`` as slang. That`s all.”

….maaf kiya…burger here translates into one word: wannabe…and confused (ok, that’s 2 words)….so now you know why it’s kinda insulting….: )



“You do have a way with words, and I mean that as a compliment. That`s why, when you came up with that Punjabi ditty about Benazir and Nawaz (which was absolutely hilarious I might add), I was a bit surprised…”

….oops….um….guess i didn’t make it clear….that was a punjabi saying….had no part in inventing/making it up….

“Didn`t really think of you as the Punjabi speaking type…”

….unfortunately, i don’t…i mean i do…i mean i try…but…..

DRUMZ

“...So this thread has nothing to do with the Whiteman`s world”

….after the first 3 and one-fourth posts, do the rest ever have any relevance to the subject?…..

samina, i know you’ll find this interesting….

http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/oct2001-weekly/nos-

21-10-2001/instep.htm

Rocking reality Reading today`s reality into

yesterday`s song,

Muniba Kamal keeps her fingers crossed for rock music

Since September 11, BBC CNN junkies have multiplied like victims of a deadly virus on the loose. Even as the world as world focus is on the War Against Terror, there is more introspection happening in America that its media lets on. Log on to any website from www.rollingstone.com, the home page of the music magazine for the MTV generation to www.salon.com, where feminists like Camille Paglia and intellectuals like Noam Chomsky air their opinions and you will find features on the WTC terrorist attack and the war it is propagating. Opinions are mixed and that is heartening.

In an uncertain world balancing precariously on the pinnacle of self-destruction through hatred, the urgency to communicate is overriding all other priorities. The media has gone into maximum overdrive and food for thought is dropping like bombs and bread. Reality is convoluted and the truth remains out of focus. So what we are left with is abstraction which doesn`t convolute truth like hard facts can. Hard facts make people do really stupid things. Case number one is the bombs and bread campaign which says: ``We will destroy your country, but we will air drop food supplies because we respect your right to live.`` It sounds worse than a load of bull especially when President Bush grieves for the people who lost their life in the WTC attacks and refers to civilian deaths in Afghanistan as collateral damage. And the perception of the United States is a real as reality gets - so much so that even nuclear powers toe the line.

The results of reality are harsh. It is dictated by the power of facts and facts are dictated by the powers that be. Humanity at large buys them and prospers or it disagrees with them and is oppressed. That is why the abstract ideas that dominate art, literature and music can be ominous portents of time s to come. Take the song Limo Wreck in Soundgarden`s 1994 release Superunknown which I listened to repeatedly after having my fix of CNN on 11 September 2001.

Tears of the feeble

Hands of the slaves

Skin of the mothers

Mouths of the babes

Building the towers

Belongs to the sky

When the whole thing

Comes crashing down

Don`t ask me why

Penned by Chris Cornell, the song is sung with a dragging fatalistic passion and over rides every instrument being played. The man has an absolutely great voice. Though Soundgarden were eclipsed by the enigmatic and destructive Kurt Cobain and his outfit Nirvana and the equally enigmatic but constructive Eddie Vedder and Pearl Jam, he is an infinitely better singer than either one of them. Unlike Eddie, this one didn`t need any lessons from Nusrat, but if he was a qawwal, what a qawwal he would have been.

Any how, with the arrival of Smells Like Teen Spirit, the grunge offering that relit all the candles on the altar of grunge rock, the stage was set for musicians who sang from the gut as opposed to the heart. New Kids On The Block couldn`t survive the onslaught of music that breathed in the angst of the nineties and exhaled redemption songs that became panacea for the young and restless.

The tragedy of the end of the nineties was that they saw the end of restlessness. Sex, drugs and rock and roll were not enough because they could no longer be the mantra of rebellion. All three became norms and norms are boring. The spirit of rock lay exhausted without rebellion. The prosperity of the Clinton years left no room for it. In a nutshell, the young remained, but the cause for restlessness evaporated in what seemed to be a perfect world. Though David Letterman and Jay Leno were inspired by cigars and unlaundered little blue dresses with presidential stains, rockers wilted down from Bob Dylan to Jakob Dylan and now they are virtually non-existent. Bands like Cold Play and Travis are carrying on and they sound good, but they are tame compared to the wonderful wild jungle that rock was not all that long ago.

However everything changed on 11 September. There will be enough introspection happening in America, Britain and the rest of Europe for quite some time to come. In 2001, rock will start seeing the fruits of discontent that have been sown in a region that has long been home to a decadent complacency.

Under the shelf

The shelf of the sky

Two eyes, two suns

Two heavenly blinds

Swallowing rivers

Belongs to the sea

When the whole thing washes away

Don`t run to me

Two eyes, two suns, two heavenly blinds that divide two civilizations standing daggers drawn as air strikes blaze across Afghan skies and the overt fear of covert anthrax stinks up the air far west. A couple of Caucasians have been killed in the Middle East; a couple of Asians in America. Fundamentalism is raising its head everywhere, while the fundamentals of every religion have been put aside in favour of jihad versus self righteous retaliation. The tragedy in Manhattan is being avenged by the tragedy in Afghanistan while those responsible for both sit tight. One smug and smirking, revels in his might. The other calm and controlled, revels in the plight of might. It`s perfect cud for rockers.

But what about rock musicians in the land of the pure? Rock is dead here and it`s going to be quite some time before it comes back to life. With Pepsi, Pantene, Mobilink and other brands promoting faces to sell their products, grunge is out of the question. Long haired delinquents are too risky to promote. Clean cuts poppers that won`t pop a damn thing are the order of the day. Haroon, Fakhir, Yasir, Georgie, Porgie, Pudding and Pie. Raking in the money and escaping taking all their escapist stars-in-my-eye fans with them.

The problem is the poetry we are accustomed to. People still listen to Ghalib, but only die hards know what is happening in the world of contemporary Urdu poetry. Urdu ghazal writers will never come out with rock anthems. Rock is the prerogative of the young as The Rolling Stones` dismal Voodoo Lounge proved. The young of Pakistan need to find a voice and then they need to wear stubborn blinders of self righteousness that will shield that voice from being struck dumb by the colour of money. And make no mistake, money is a dangerous thing.

Rockers need belief more than anything.

I`ll be going down

For the rest of the slide

While the rest of you

Harvest the gold

Just throw yourself down and hope for a safe landing. All will be fine. Just ask the Taliban about this philosophy. They have entered a dark tunnel hoping for a light at the end. As KFC is torched, effigies of Bush and Musharraf are burnt, the fire that envelops these symbols is their light. In their own ultra conservative and extremely misguided way, they are rebels against the greatest super power in the world. And horrific as it may sound, in them I see the same spirit of rebellion that has fed rock music over the years. Not given to emotion, they have a brutal singularity of purpose that is defying the collective efforts of the `civilised` world.

A handful of suicide pilots have brought a thriving economy to its knees. Camps are destroyed while terrorists hide in the hills. A ruined country is being bombed by the most technologically advanced super power in the world. The bread that accompanies these bombs are an antithesis of manna from heaven. The wrath of an arrogant super power and the five million dollar prize money on Osama`s head is not enough to catch him. It is an equation the powers that be can not understand.

This is a combination of Pakhtunwali, the code that Pashtuns value more than life itself. The same code of yore that keeps women away from education, work and men and whips and kills them when they resist their shackles is the code that keeps Osama safe. It is a code he promotes and values. It is a code that is a bitter pill to swallow, but it is what it is. It is not a sugar coated pill like the West is giving Afghanistan.

And the wreck of you

Is the wreck of you all

And the wreck of you

Is the break

And the fall

I`m the wreck of you

I`m the wreck of you all

I`m the wreck of you

I`m the break and the fall

Reads like the anthem of Osama Bin Laden doesn`t it? How things come to pass. The song of a Seattle grunge guy fits the life and times of the man whose name is anathema to some and sacred to others.

This unusual multi-millionaire chose a destroyed country as the base of his operations. He wears an army jacket like a man heading out for war, but he is no ordinary warrior. He is waiting for war knock on his doorstep. For pampered marines and secret service agents fresh from training to lock horns with war hardened Mujahideen turned Taliban. A man born with a silver spoon in his mouth who learnt how to fire a gun and more. A man who wants the ``infidels out of the land of Muhammad`` and who feels for the plight of the Palestinians and the Iraqis, but not for the plight of the Afghanis. He has taken over their land and he is using it for a greater, grander purpose. He is not going to turn himself in to save them.

Yet this is not an anomaly. Osama Bin Laden and the Afghans remaining in Afghanistan know embrace death the way the U.S. embraces life. They showed pictures of Kabul the day after it was bombed. It was business (whatever little there was) as usual. Four planes did far more damage in America than all their bombs can do in Afghanistan. Thousands of people have been laid off. Others suffer from airplane phobia and something tells me that the entire nation will soon be tested for anthrax. It is turning a clash of civilizations. Intellect versus belief. Science versus nature. Bombs versus a death wish. The end remains to be seen. And soon the music I so love will come back and maybe, just maybe, September 11 will become the day that rock returned to life.

Under the red

Break of the lights

Heroes in stretches

Inch to the site

Blowing the pieces

Belongs to the wind

When the whole thing

Blows away

I won`t pretend

Songs will probably be written even as this is read. It is time to burn the midnight oil and contemplate the use of ground troops that can`t go on land until the air force bombs the country they are invading to smithereens. Bombs that say `Bin Laden or Bust` speak volumes for the naivete of an army. They have been going bust so far. Despite having the fastest planes and the most sophisticated ammo, America could only get supremacy over Afghan skies after five days of bombing. And then they wonder why people hate them. Yes, the wise there will be searching themselves but America has always had a knack for searching itself silly. Ask Chris Cornell about it.

I`ll be going down

For the rest of the slide

While the rest of you

Harvest the souls

The dust will settle once all the bombs have dropped. Then we will have to harvest the crop of the collective soul of the world. It has so many scars on it that need to heal. Towers reduced to ashes. Countries used as a battleground. A stone hurled from a sling shot answered by Goliath gun fire that kills teenaged Davids. The terror of holy wars. The terror of infinite justice. The world seems to have become a bomb waiting to explode. Hopefully hearts will explode before doomsday and anger, logic, illusion and disillusion will roll out as one glorious ball towards a vision of reality that trespasses all boundaries.

Hopefully we will see it on MTV next year.

Behind the blood red break of the lights

Lies the wreck of you for the rest of your life

One can only hope that the blood red break of the world somehow becomes the great white hope of rock. And rock is not escapist. It tackles reality head on. That is why it is only as inspiring as reality itself. And reality is as real as it is harsh. Today as harsh as harsh gets.

Have I hijacked a song? Have I imbued someone else`s work with my own prejudiced meaning? But that is what songs are for - aren` t they? Anyway, nothing beats Ronald Reagan`s posthumous Star Wars program. I personally prefer the George Lucas version.

Aamir:

{THE WASHINGTON TIMES

“Pakistan`s leading Muslim cleric, moments after addressing the largest anti-American rally yet, said yesterday that an Islamic revolution had begun in Pakistan that would eclipse the 1979 revolution in Iran that brought the Ayatollah Khomeini to power.

It`s bigger, no doubt, than in Iran. Everything is prepared,`` said Qazi Hussain Ahmad, leader of Pakistan`s largest religious political party, Jamaat-e-Islami.”}

…..if this idiot leaves for his jihad (fat chance…) tomorrow, it wouldn’t be a day too soon….

Zahra:

“The other ironic part was, ``the abundance of alcohol,`` that was mentioned during her talk. She mentioned that she has never seen that much alcohol in her life that she came across in Saudi Arabia”

…..very true….a cousin, who’s lived almost all her life in s.arabia, has told me stories about the sheikh/prince/princess lot there that would put even the most free of spirits to shame….jean sassons’s books describe the imbroglio very well….