Farzana Versey January 5, 2002
#1 Posted by Trojan Colt on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
My memory of 71 is so fuzzy ,excuse me ,if i seem too young for everyone else but
1/ was it Niazi who dropped the bomb on Kolai kund at the Army base in Barrackpore near Calcutta ?I faintly remember somthing like that
2/ Or was it that Pakistan at that time East Pakistan captured Birubari & triggered war?
3/ or they dropped a bomb on Howrah bridge ,that was very act of war ,must be why would india then bother to put its Son in the harm way .?
I think i ll never know why india ever was doing inside East Pakistan much before the 71 making Mukti Bahmini fight like the Americans did first with Taleban Then the Northern Alliance .
1/ was it Niazi who dropped the bomb on Kolai kund at the Army base in Barrackpore near Calcutta ?I faintly remember somthing like that
2/ Or was it that Pakistan at that time East Pakistan captured Birubari & triggered war?
3/ or they dropped a bomb on Howrah bridge ,that was very act of war ,must be why would india then bother to put its Son in the harm way .?
I think i ll never know why india ever was doing inside East Pakistan much before the 71 making Mukti Bahmini fight like the Americans did first with Taleban Then the Northern Alliance .
#2 Posted by chandan on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Nice article Farzana.
There is another struggle in our country where it seems our impotent and corrupt govt is basically working against victims of biggest corporate terrorism ever happened, yes thats Bhopal gas tragedy. Warren Anderson, Ex-CEO of Union Carbide is wanted on criminal charges related to Bhopal Gas tragedy, but our Americono-phile impotent govt does not even have guts to ask USA to extradite Warren Anderson. A court case is also being fought on behalf of victims in USA but the basic hurdle for them is that Indian govt itself is hindering the work of activists to get proper documents. Not surprisingly you would find many of our NRI bhais (who always hold moral high ground) working for Dow chemical (which acquired Union Carbide). I find this worse than working for D-gang.
There is another struggle in our country where it seems our impotent and corrupt govt is basically working against victims of biggest corporate terrorism ever happened, yes thats Bhopal gas tragedy. Warren Anderson, Ex-CEO of Union Carbide is wanted on criminal charges related to Bhopal Gas tragedy, but our Americono-phile impotent govt does not even have guts to ask USA to extradite Warren Anderson. A court case is also being fought on behalf of victims in USA but the basic hurdle for them is that Indian govt itself is hindering the work of activists to get proper documents. Not surprisingly you would find many of our NRI bhais (who always hold moral high ground) working for Dow chemical (which acquired Union Carbide). I find this worse than working for D-gang.
#3 Posted by sigalph235 on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
that is a haunting article. If even half of it is true and Pakistan refuses to have international authorities verify her denials, then India can morally have no second choice: get the men out no matter what it takes.
#4 Posted by shammi on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Farzana:
A very poignant and heart-breaking story. I commend you for taking the effort to highlight the plight of families for whom the world has moved on without any concern. You have done the nation a service by bringing attention to an issue that suffers from official and private apathy.
A very poignant and heart-breaking story. I commend you for taking the effort to highlight the plight of families for whom the world has moved on without any concern. You have done the nation a service by bringing attention to an issue that suffers from official and private apathy.
#5 Posted by Ansari on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
How do we respond to this, Farzana? You`ve raised a lot of sensitive issues and their resolution doesn`t come that easily, at least not for me. I don`t know what to say.
And that`s not because I am a Pakistani but as a Muslim, and I use that term as it is meant to be used, ie, someone who enjoins the right and forbids the wrong and has faith in God, I find it a horror to think that we have these people suffering in our jails for a politically-motivated crime that wasn`t theirs to begin with.
I am reminded of an incident in the early days of Islam, when the Muslims had successfully warded off the Meccan army in the Battle of Badr. The Meccan prisoners of war feared for their lives for these were real criminals who had perpetrated the worst cruelty against the Muslims in their early Meccan days. However, their anxiety was in vain. With characteristic generosity and largeheartedness, the Prophet of Islam ordered that they be treated with kindness and that the victors, the Muslims, share equal mouthfuls of food with their prisoners.
Naguib Mahfouz, the Egyptian writer who won the Nobel Prize, said in his Nobel lecture, delivered to a distinguished audience in Stockholm:
``...As for Islamic civilization I will not talk about its call for the establishment of a union between all Mankind under the guardianship of the Creator, based on freedom, equality and forgiveness. Nor will I talk about the greatness of its prophet. For among your thinkers there are those who regard him the greatest man in history. I will not talk of its conquests which have planted thousands of minarets calling for worship, devoutness and good throughout great expanses of land from the environs of India and China to the boundaries of France. Nor will I talk of the fraternity between religions and races that has been achieved in its embrace in a spirit of tolerance unknown to Mankind neither before nor since.
I will, instead, introduce that civilization in a moving dramatic situation summarizing one of its most conspicuous traits: In one victorious battle against Byzantium it has given back its prisoners of war in return for a number of books of the ancient Greek heritage in philosophy, medicine and mathematics. This is a testimony of value for the human spirit in its demand for knowledge, even though the demander was a believer in God and the demanded a fruit of a pagan civilization.``
Should you meet them again, please convey my deepest condolences to the affected families and loved ones.
Regards,
Aamir
And that`s not because I am a Pakistani but as a Muslim, and I use that term as it is meant to be used, ie, someone who enjoins the right and forbids the wrong and has faith in God, I find it a horror to think that we have these people suffering in our jails for a politically-motivated crime that wasn`t theirs to begin with.
I am reminded of an incident in the early days of Islam, when the Muslims had successfully warded off the Meccan army in the Battle of Badr. The Meccan prisoners of war feared for their lives for these were real criminals who had perpetrated the worst cruelty against the Muslims in their early Meccan days. However, their anxiety was in vain. With characteristic generosity and largeheartedness, the Prophet of Islam ordered that they be treated with kindness and that the victors, the Muslims, share equal mouthfuls of food with their prisoners.
Naguib Mahfouz, the Egyptian writer who won the Nobel Prize, said in his Nobel lecture, delivered to a distinguished audience in Stockholm:
``...As for Islamic civilization I will not talk about its call for the establishment of a union between all Mankind under the guardianship of the Creator, based on freedom, equality and forgiveness. Nor will I talk about the greatness of its prophet. For among your thinkers there are those who regard him the greatest man in history. I will not talk of its conquests which have planted thousands of minarets calling for worship, devoutness and good throughout great expanses of land from the environs of India and China to the boundaries of France. Nor will I talk of the fraternity between religions and races that has been achieved in its embrace in a spirit of tolerance unknown to Mankind neither before nor since.
I will, instead, introduce that civilization in a moving dramatic situation summarizing one of its most conspicuous traits: In one victorious battle against Byzantium it has given back its prisoners of war in return for a number of books of the ancient Greek heritage in philosophy, medicine and mathematics. This is a testimony of value for the human spirit in its demand for knowledge, even though the demander was a believer in God and the demanded a fruit of a pagan civilization.``
Should you meet them again, please convey my deepest condolences to the affected families and loved ones.
Regards,
Aamir
#6 Posted by veeresh on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Dear Farzana,
Sure, nobody should join the Armed Forces. How many soldiers does the Pope have?
regards,
Veeresh
#7 Posted by anarayan on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Assuming Farzana-ji is telling the truth...looks like at least Zia-ul-Haq understood the real worth of a pakistani soldier.
1 Indian = 5 pakistanis
What can we say when a commander has this opinion of his own soldier!
1 Indian = 5 pakistanis
What can we say when a commander has this opinion of his own soldier!
#8 Posted by anarayan on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Farzi,
``Does not the appeal, “Join the army” sound like a slap to the parents, since they have been told he is not in the records?``
That should not bother you, should it? Tell me if anyone in your extended family has ever worn a uniform...and I`ll have the smelling salts ready (when I feel faint).
luv,
t
(oops, sorry. scratch t)
``Does not the appeal, “Join the army” sound like a slap to the parents, since they have been told he is not in the records?``
That should not bother you, should it? Tell me if anyone in your extended family has ever worn a uniform...and I`ll have the smelling salts ready (when I feel faint).
luv,
t
(oops, sorry. scratch t)
#9 Posted by jay on January 6, 2002 1:12:45 am
Farzana,
Here is news for you. Indian POW issue was raised as late as six months ago with the great ruler of your friends country and he has said that there are none in that godforsaken country. May be war and occupation of pakistan is the only way to be 100
percent sure. That is exactly what the indians are planning. So what is your complaint, for once there is agreement with you.
Here is news for you. Indian POW issue was raised as late as six months ago with the great ruler of your friends country and he has said that there are none in that godforsaken country. May be war and occupation of pakistan is the only way to be 100
percent sure. That is exactly what the indians are planning. So what is your complaint, for once there is agreement with you.
#10 Posted by sadna on January 6, 2002 1:36:44 am
``The country stands silent. ``
http://www.flonnet.com/fl1815/18151280.htm
[Agra Summit in July 2001]
``...Vajpayee raised ``certain additional specific matters``. These related to the ``54 Indian POWs``, who India says are in Pakistani custody. Vajpayee also mentioned that ``some terrorists and criminals`` guilty of bomb blasts and hijacking were still present in Pakistan and should be handed back. Musharraf had earlier in the day vehemently denied that Pakistan held any Indian POW and suggested that this was one of the diversionary ploys of India aimed at shifting the focus away from Kashmir...``
http://www.flonnet.com/fl1815/18151280.htm
[Agra Summit in July 2001]
``...Vajpayee raised ``certain additional specific matters``. These related to the ``54 Indian POWs``, who India says are in Pakistani custody. Vajpayee also mentioned that ``some terrorists and criminals`` guilty of bomb blasts and hijacking were still present in Pakistan and should be handed back. Musharraf had earlier in the day vehemently denied that Pakistan held any Indian POW and suggested that this was one of the diversionary ploys of India aimed at shifting the focus away from Kashmir...``
#11 Posted by Trojan Colt on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
Anarayan # whatever
Dude smarty chapee
My family adorned the uniform of Indian Army
Are you here to score points.Has your family except for waving bjp flag & riding on Majoritism done ANYthing .Or its all yours b/c you happen to be Hindu ?
Who fought for independence ,Vajpayee was a brit spy against freedom fighter .
Killer of father of Nation was a Hindu like you .In fact from the same faction as you Sanghi Parivar.
You think wrapping your self in safron make you Indian?Its not the national flag you know .
From now on ,i will only consuder the Muslim,christian,Sikh ,Non SAnghi Hindu as real ndian
Dude smarty chapee
My family adorned the uniform of Indian Army
Are you here to score points.Has your family except for waving bjp flag & riding on Majoritism done ANYthing .Or its all yours b/c you happen to be Hindu ?
Who fought for independence ,Vajpayee was a brit spy against freedom fighter .
Killer of father of Nation was a Hindu like you .In fact from the same faction as you Sanghi Parivar.
You think wrapping your self in safron make you Indian?Its not the national flag you know .
From now on ,i will only consuder the Muslim,christian,Sikh ,Non SAnghi Hindu as real ndian
#12 Posted by ali1 on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
Dear Farzana,
There are no Indian POWs in Pakistan`s custody. There could possibly be some detainees.
I `ll try to explain the difference. Pakistan was fighting simultaneously against the Indian army and Mukti Bahini terrorists. A number of Indian Army and BSF personnel in civilian clothes were fighting with the Bengali terrorists. Such regulars if captured are never considered as POWs.
The govt. of India made a calculated decision to support the terrorist movement in East Pakistan with arms and merceneries and got rich dividends. This support was fully backed by the people of India, so all this whining now doesn`t make much sense.
PS. Do you know that a number of Pakistani pilots who ejected after being shot in `71 are missing even now. No remains, no bodies, no notes slipped by visitors from India or Bangladesh, no screams heard by the inmates of Tihar or Dhaka jails.
Some widows(?), orphans(?) and parents are waiting in Pakistan too. Let me give you a list: Wing Cmdr Mervyn L Middlecoat, Wing Cmdr Muhammed Ahmed, Squadron Ldr Aslam Choudhry, Squadron Ldr Peter Christie, Flt Lt Saeed Khan, Flt Lt Safi Mustafa and Flt Lt Shahid Raza.
Maybe someday, some lucky day, when you don`t have to prove your nationalistic credentials to your hindu compatriots, you will be able take up their cause on humanitarian grounds.
There are no Indian POWs in Pakistan`s custody. There could possibly be some detainees.
I `ll try to explain the difference. Pakistan was fighting simultaneously against the Indian army and Mukti Bahini terrorists. A number of Indian Army and BSF personnel in civilian clothes were fighting with the Bengali terrorists. Such regulars if captured are never considered as POWs.
The govt. of India made a calculated decision to support the terrorist movement in East Pakistan with arms and merceneries and got rich dividends. This support was fully backed by the people of India, so all this whining now doesn`t make much sense.
PS. Do you know that a number of Pakistani pilots who ejected after being shot in `71 are missing even now. No remains, no bodies, no notes slipped by visitors from India or Bangladesh, no screams heard by the inmates of Tihar or Dhaka jails.
Some widows(?), orphans(?) and parents are waiting in Pakistan too. Let me give you a list: Wing Cmdr Mervyn L Middlecoat, Wing Cmdr Muhammed Ahmed, Squadron Ldr Aslam Choudhry, Squadron Ldr Peter Christie, Flt Lt Saeed Khan, Flt Lt Safi Mustafa and Flt Lt Shahid Raza.
Maybe someday, some lucky day, when you don`t have to prove your nationalistic credentials to your hindu compatriots, you will be able take up their cause on humanitarian grounds.
#13 Posted by ali1 on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
Dear Farzana,
There are no Indian POWs in Pakistan`s custody. There could possibly be some detainees.
I `ll try to explain the difference. Pakistan was fighting simultaneously against the Indian army and Mukti Bahini terrorists. A number of Indian Army and BSF personnel in civilian clothes were fighting with the Bengali terrorists. Such regulars if captured are never considered as POWs.
The govt. of India made a calculated decision to support the terrorist movement in East Pakistan with arms and merceneries and got rich dividends. This support was fully backed by the people of India, so all this whining now doesn`t make much sense.
PS. Do you know that a number of Pakistani pilots who ejected after being shot in `71 are missing even now. No remains, no bodies, no notes slipped by visitors from India or Bangladesh, no screams heard by the inmates of Tihar or Dhaka jails.
Some widows(?), orphans(?) and parents are waiting in Pakistan too. Let me give you a list: Wing Cmdr Mervyn L Middlecoat, Wing Cmdr Muhammed Ahmed, Squadron Ldr Aslam Choudhry, Squadron Ldr Peter Christie, Flt Lt Saeed Khan, Flt Lt Safi Mustafa and Flt Lt Shahid Raza.
Maybe someday, some lucky day, when you don`t have to prove your nationalistic credentials to your hindu compatriots, you will be able take up their cause on humanitarian grounds.
There are no Indian POWs in Pakistan`s custody. There could possibly be some detainees.
I `ll try to explain the difference. Pakistan was fighting simultaneously against the Indian army and Mukti Bahini terrorists. A number of Indian Army and BSF personnel in civilian clothes were fighting with the Bengali terrorists. Such regulars if captured are never considered as POWs.
The govt. of India made a calculated decision to support the terrorist movement in East Pakistan with arms and merceneries and got rich dividends. This support was fully backed by the people of India, so all this whining now doesn`t make much sense.
PS. Do you know that a number of Pakistani pilots who ejected after being shot in `71 are missing even now. No remains, no bodies, no notes slipped by visitors from India or Bangladesh, no screams heard by the inmates of Tihar or Dhaka jails.
Some widows(?), orphans(?) and parents are waiting in Pakistan too. Let me give you a list: Wing Cmdr Mervyn L Middlecoat, Wing Cmdr Muhammed Ahmed, Squadron Ldr Aslam Choudhry, Squadron Ldr Peter Christie, Flt Lt Saeed Khan, Flt Lt Safi Mustafa and Flt Lt Shahid Raza.
Maybe someday, some lucky day, when you don`t have to prove your nationalistic credentials to your hindu compatriots, you will be able take up their cause on humanitarian grounds.
#14 Posted by FarzanaVersey on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
I am simply not interested in what you think of me with regard to this article. The issue is more important. If there are any Indians or Pakistanis, especially those living in these two countries who can tell me how to approach relevant organizations, I would be very grateful.
There is no need to tell me that this subject was brought up six months ago. I know. I have mentioned it. “… and during the Agra Summit the subject about the return of our prisoners of war was raised. But it seems it is one more carrot-and-stick game between the two countries”. Get it?
And for those who prefer to believe certain ‘authorities’, you may find the evidence in the 1973 records of the International Red Cross, Zee TV made a documentary on the subject in 1992, then there is Victoria Scholfied’s book ‘The Bhutto Trial and Execution’, M.L. Bhaskar’s ‘I Spied For India’, and ‘Time’ magazine did a story in its issue dated December 27, 1971. This is for those who are deeply interested in the facts while being sarcastic about the truth, which is about human emotions.
Aamir Ansari:
I would like to thank you for a heart-warming post. We have been interacting only for a short while, but my respect for you has been increasing each time I read what you have to say.
Regards,
Farzana
There is no need to tell me that this subject was brought up six months ago. I know. I have mentioned it. “… and during the Agra Summit the subject about the return of our prisoners of war was raised. But it seems it is one more carrot-and-stick game between the two countries”. Get it?
And for those who prefer to believe certain ‘authorities’, you may find the evidence in the 1973 records of the International Red Cross, Zee TV made a documentary on the subject in 1992, then there is Victoria Scholfied’s book ‘The Bhutto Trial and Execution’, M.L. Bhaskar’s ‘I Spied For India’, and ‘Time’ magazine did a story in its issue dated December 27, 1971. This is for those who are deeply interested in the facts while being sarcastic about the truth, which is about human emotions.
Aamir Ansari:
I would like to thank you for a heart-warming post. We have been interacting only for a short while, but my respect for you has been increasing each time I read what you have to say.
Regards,
Farzana
#15 Posted by semipreciousme on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
...if any proof was needed to show how pitiable and incompetent both the govts. of pak and india are, this is it...
#16 Posted by warpster on January 6, 2002 5:09:42 am
I am not sure what exactly Pak has to gain by keeping these 54 soldiers.
This appears somewhat similar to the American MIAs in Vietnam, who have never been found despite all sorts of evidence and claims.
The evidence of these persons presence in Pak seems sketchy at best; Surely we should have heard more from these folks through some channel or the other?
One conclusion we can come to is perhaps these MIAs (some of them) were in Pak at some point but met their end after capture.
It seems very unlikely we are going to see any of these folks in the future. Hopefully I am wrong.
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