An Insight Into the Way Shiv Sena Functions

dost-mittar #88
``Alas, it`s the opposite, it`s the condemnation by vox populi of the kind of governance provided by the electoral system``

dost-mittar, governments and local councils get voted out of power in the bestest democracy there is, the US too. Does this mean US governments are not `for the people`? `For the people` encompasses more than just managing to avoid voter disaffection at election time.

Infact the voter turnouts in the US are in the 30-40%, even for Presidential elections, while they are always 50-70% in India. In terms of voter apathy, on the average Indians seem to have more hope for their system than Americans.

Secondly, if an eunuch can aspire to elected office and his supporters come out in full force to canvass on his behalf, isn`t he `of the people`?

I think the biggest gain for India from its democracy is that if some Indian politician had done no more than made a handsome speech like Musharraf, he would know for sure that he cannot be wowed simply for making speeches, that Indians have a healthy skepticsm about his subsequent delivery of the goods and have the power to hold him accountable he doesnot.

RE Pmishra2 #75

Having read your posts again I think I own you an apology - sorry.

Subroto

Dost-Mittar ji # 85

Just yesterday, NPR broadcasted a lengthy interview with an eunuch running for office in ``Cawnpore`` (Kanpur, for the rest of us). That candidate was quite certain of his/her victory, given that ``the traditional parties carry no credibility.`` There was real narabazi going on in background in support of that eunuch.

And the best was when the eunuch claimed that when he/she wins, he/she will force everyone to do his/her bidding by threatening to expose him/herself.

Long live Indian democracy! At least we get to laugh :)

P.S. No offense to eunuchs. They are better than those who sit on their haunches and complain about the world.

http://www.indian-express.com/ie20020217/top1.html

Calendar calendar on the wall, who’s the unfairest of them all?

» Red faces in Aizawl and Delhi as Mizoram students’ union publishes 2002 calendar with pictures of houses ‘illegally’ built by Govt, Opp politicians

now it gets interesting...what happened to all that hoohaa over Pokhran?...money talks, and the amercians will be damned if they let the british, french, and russians run away with all the juicy weapons contracts from india...

{{US to send LCA engines, radars to India

WASHINGTON: Jet engines for the Light Combat Aircraft and gun locating radars for the Army are on their way to India. The Bush administration has notified US lawmakers that it is going ahead with the supply a variety of arms and high-tech equipment to India.

The communication, which is Congressionally mandated, is sent to what is called the committees of jurisdiction — in this case the House International Relations Committee and the Armed Forces Committee. It is essentially a way of informing the Congress of an executive action, which usually takes place within 30 days of the notification.

With this executive action, Washington has effectively resumed a military relationship with India that, of a limited nature in the first place, was curtailed after the sanctions that followed the May 1998 nuclear tests. Such is the compulsion and momentum of Indo-US relationship that it now looks like the military ties may surpass anything seen before. }}

I donot see anything inaccurate in pmishra2`s posts about the RSS schools on this board. RSS`s overall intentions are VERY suspect and I donot like the idea of their running schools AT ALL, but given that they do, if the schools are CBSE-affiliated, CBSE is a national board, the curriculum itself is not different from thousands? of government schools, and doesnot leave a lot of room for preaching of hatred besides, though it can be managed. I suspect thats why the principal of one school made a comment about finding it hard to contradict their own history textbooks. Ultimately, people donot want a ideological education for their children, they want a board-certified education and IMO, CBSE offers a pretty good curriculum in that respect. One question is, are these schools recognised by the CBSE?

re: pmisra

...it is pointless to engage in any debate or meaningful discussion with many pakis on chowk...

...in their perpetual inferiority complex viz-a-viz india, they will either ignore facts completely (like mullah hayat is doing), or will resort to selective use of facts and revisionism (ylh, romair)...

...in mullah hayat`s case, he is struggling, rather pathetically, to find something in india which he can equate to the violent, islamic fundamentalist madrassahs in pakistan and to its international terrorists who hurt OTHER countries, including the US (Yousef Ramzi), India, and Afghanistan...neither of these exists in india...

..i`ve tried hard in the past to understand where this paki insecurity comes from, but i`ve had little success...

Reply Subroto # 74

``Asim Hayat, PMisra2 you are actually identical in your thought and blind hatred. The objects of hate differ thats all, are you sure you guys didn`t get separated in a mela at a young age? Yaad karo aaj say bees saal pehle....``

Subroto, it happened in 1947...

Reply Prem

re: suitcase party etc. - in Sydney a private citizen takes it upon him/herself to mark election campaigns by driving around the CBD with a very large papier mache turd strapped to the top of his car. True.

Breeding grounds for Harvard educated bigots and fanatics masquerading as liberals

http://www.dawn.com/weekly/books/books5.htm

12 February 2002 Tuesday 28 Ziqa`ad 1422

ARTICLE: Textbooks and the jihadi mindset

A report prepared by the Centre for Information and Research (CIR) at SZABIST, Karachi, is quite an eye-opener. Intrigued by the growth of intolerance and violence in a society which had at one time been home to peace-loving sufis, CIR undertook to investigate the factors which have spawned the ``jihadi`` mindset in the people - to use its director`s words. An evaluation of the social studies and Pakistan studies textbooks proved to be a revealing exercise. It is plain that from a very early age children are virtually indoctrinated in what has been claimed to be the ideology of Pakistan.

Without going into a discussion on what this is supposed to be, one can discern a pronounced bias in the textbooks that are being taught. Thus, the students are told that the cause of the downfall of Muslim power was the fading of the spirit of jihad. The young minds are in a very subtle manner also filled with prejudice against the non-Muslims, specially the Hindus in India, against whom, by implication, jihad is to be waged. Regrettably, no effort is made at all to instil in the readers tolerance and respect for other faiths. In the same vein, the textbooks manifest a strong bias against pluralism. Hence the country`s cultural diversity is not projected as a positive phenomenon. Equally disturbing is the anti-democratic and pro-authoritarian thrust in the contents of the books our children are studying in schools and colleges.

All this is besides the factual mistakes that proliferate in the textbooks. By distorting facts, a writer can easily give a twist to events to prove the point of view he wishes to project and reinforce. When exposed continuously to such negative messages, specially in the formative years of life, it is inevitable that the youth of our country grow up believing that all non-Muslims are the enemies of Islam and to survive we must take up arms against them. Similarly, by instilling in the minds of the students that India is the enemy number one of Pakistan, our textbooks make it difficult for the youth to think rationally about the imperatives of India-Pakistan relations.

The textbooks` failure to instil tolerance and acceptance of plurality in the students has led to violence in our society. On the one hand, the reader is taught unwavering discipline and unquestioning acquiescence to authority. On the other hand, he doesn`t learn the basic sociological fact that cultural and linguistic diversity enriches a society and a country. To live with people from heterogeneous backgrounds, it is important that every individual recognizes and respects the basic right of the other to his own cultural identity. This respect forms the underpinning of a democratic society in which `live and let live` should be the norm and a participatory method should be adopted to allow representation to all.

Unfortunately, our textbooks are sadly lacking in this respect. Although textbooks are periodically revised - every major change of regime ushers in a process of revamping the textbooks - no consideration is given to the basic approach. Attention is invariably focused on the political contents, the idea being to villify the ousted government and lionize the regime in office. The more immediate need is to revise the textbooks with the idea of making them a medium of imparting human rights education, tolerance, a breadth of vision and respect for human beings, be they men or women. Some NGOs have been doing a commendable job in this field. HREP, Simorgh, the Book Group and others have produced books which are designed to teach students humanism and libertarian values. One hopes the government will look into this matter as it embarks on its programme to reform the education sector.

© The DAWN Group of Newspapers, 2002

dost-mittar #73
The Election Commission says at least 500 candidates in the current UP elections have criminal records..

Dost-Mittar ji # 73

The iridescent theater of Indian politics is both impressive and absurd. Did you hear of the ``Suitcase Party`` launched by our inimitable Jaspal Bhatti, with the slogan:

Suitcaisan dee sarkar chaubees ghante khulla darbar.

and lifetime reservations for his wife and family members? :)

Or, the man who went around asking for votes, wearing a garland of shoes?

Also, read this:

http://www.ananova.com/yournews/story/sm_520960.html

Election candidate canvasses as resurrected corpse

An election candidate in India is canvassing votes by pretending to be a corpse that suddenly comes alive.

Supporters of Lal Bihari carry him around the Uttar Pradesh town of Azamgarh in a coffin until they come to a standstill.

He then sits up, throws away a cloth covering him, and screams he`s alive. He`s protesting that local records wrongly show 3,000 people are dead.

He is accusing officials of trying to transfer land to potential buyers by showing that the owners are dead.

A local court has ordered officials to correct their records, but he complains not much has been done.

``We have only seen a handful of dead people being revived. Justice can only be done when all of us are shown to be alive,`` he said.

As well as being an election candidate, Mr Bihari is president of the Mritak Sangh (the Dead People`s Forum).

subroto #74

I may be missing something, but could you please point me to a statement I made that is blind or hateful?

Asim Hayat #72

I realize that it is OK for your conscience to post hate speech towards hindus while at the same time complaining about the RSS or PN Oak`s nonsensical theories. This kind of mental problem is quite natural in a person of your background.

BUT, let me ask you this question AGAIN. You posted an article from an excellent indian newspaper (#39) describing a religous school run by the RSS. I have asked you TWICE to present FROM the article statements that were hateful or showed contempt for other groups. You are unable to do so because the article has no such statements. Instead, you are ranting on about various other statements about the RSS.

I have also asked the question: why should we treat a hindu religous school differently from a christian or islamic religous school? I wont discuss Islam because in your current state of juvenility you will take it as a personal attack. In a christian school you will learn:

(1) God had a son!

(2) the son was born thru a miracle

(3) etc. etc.

To me, as an atheist of hindu background, these statements sound very, very bizarre. Similarly, in a RSS school you will learn:

(1) Rama lived in Ayodhya 981000 years ago!

(2) etc. etc.

These sound no more bizarre than the statements above. So what is the fuss here? What is the difference between these two statements? Why is one acceptable and the other reprehensible?

Asim Hayat, PMisra2 you are actually identical in your thought and blind hatred. The objects of hate differ thats all, are you sure you guys didn`t get separated in a mela at a young age? Yaad karo aaj say bees saal pehle....

Re : Recent Brouhaha from the Indians on my having posted a few innocent articles exposing their fascist govt`s true colours.

Dear All,

The second article is written by H.K. Burki, a Harvard Educated Pakistani journalist.Granted the bow-tie clad journalist does not mince any words in his exposition of the Hindus, but The fact remains, the time for sugar coating reality is perhaps past. Who can deny that a pugilistic India is trying its bst to flex her muscles within South Asia, thinking of herself as possibly another United States.

Granted I might not agree with all tha the learned Mr Burki wrote, but the eseence of the articles still holds. This can be verified by the plethora of responses that have emanated from the children of the Sangh Parivar/RSS goons. My mistake was to have posted a single articles written by a conscientious and objective indian journalist who wrote of her own accord about the wrongs being taught at the RSS run scholls that Qutab Minar and Taj Mahal were Hindu temples, amongst a lot of other prevarications in the name ofan education. My Raison de etre for posting this own this site was to gauge the indian opinion when confronted with facts from an well respected indian newspaper, like The Hindu. The article clearly stated, that the children are being taught false ideologies about ``their`` history and origins in full defiance of the truth, and yet my dear indian brothers from across the border have the unmitigated temerity to suggest that it was alright, and were willing to turn a blind eye to such shameless distortion of young infertile minds so that they grow up tainted by the hatred which has held these very messiahs of liberalism captive for the longest time.

Pmishra, your conjecturing about your opponents education and qualifications is nothing but ``penis`` envy at its worst and perhaps puerility at its best. Do not ever underestimate your opponents, using such dismissivbe logic, as this is going to be your demise. The modern day moderate Pakistanis are perhaps better educated than your Indian Muslims, held back by a systematic apartheid. You may not be able to push us aroudn as easily as you can those icons of your ``democracy``. You ad-hominem attacks do not merit any further response.

However, feel free to condemn the RSS schools philosophy of teaching rubbish and petty jingoism to their poor and downtrodden. Though one does needs an iota of character and personal integrity to denounce an obvious wrong, howsoever painful it might be. Sadly, few men can rise above paltry natioanlism to do that.

Regards

Asim Hayat

Best of Regards

Shiv Sena and Valentine`s Day make good copy . . . but not as good as co-ed Madarsas.

Right said George.

Nice work, Harish.

PS:
dost-mittar, Manmohan Singh is currently leader of the Opposition in the Rajya Sabha.

soundmeister #67
Well, his comments on `Europe`s experiment with federalism` and Indians being able to `count 650m votes effectively` are worth a few electrical appliances :).

Reply Sadna #68:

``If you are a fan of Jaswant Singh:)

http://news.ft.com/ft/gx.cgi/ftc?pagename=View&c=Article&cid=FT3C16H5JXC``

Jaswant Singh has FANS? NOW i`ve seen everything :))))

If you are a fan of Jaswant Singh:)
http://news.ft.com/ft/gx.cgi/ftc?pagename=View&c=Article&cid=FT3C16H5JXC

dost-mittar #64
``It seems that Manmohan Singh was done in more by his own party rather than for an allegedly misquoted statement. It still doesn`t reflect very well on the kind of democracy we have in India. ``

dost-mittar, thats why I provided three references, so that you cannot say `misquote`. And there is no conspiracy against Manmohan Singh, the talents of people like himself and Jaswant Singh who cannot win in Lok Sabha due to party and/or voter disaffection are made available by their parties through the Rajya Sabha.

Manmohan Singh ought to have made a greater effort to garner support in his own party, and the Congress party should offer a structure for this sort of career advance, based on more objective vote-pulling criteria than mere vote-pulling dynasty/personality. Its no surprise that this sort of functioning has put the Cong at a disadvantage wrt the better (in comparison) organized and more democratic BJP.

There is no good democracy or bad democracy, there is only absence of democracy (which means you cannot answer for the future whatever you do today) or an evolving or regressing democary which holds some promise for the future. I think things are evolving in India.

Sena-BJP combine retains Mumbai, Thane civic bodies

Apparently cashing on the national security issue, Shiv Sena-Bharatiya Janata Party saffron combine have braved the anti-incumbency factor and retained prestigious Mumbai and Thane civic bodies, while ruling Congress and Nationalist Congress Party suffered a setback for entering the fray separately.

In the 227-member Brihanmumbai Municipal Corporation, out of the 223 results declared, Shiv Sena has bagged 99 seats and BJP 35 seats, while Congress managed 59 seats and NCP 11 seats.

Samajwadi Party got 10 seats and independents bagged 9 seats.

In neighbouring Thane, Shiv Sena bagged 44 seats, BJP 11 seats, as against 22 seats of NCP and 10 seats of Congress.

The decision of the Sena and BJP combine to give united fight paid rich dividends as the alliance wrested the Congress stronghold of Nasik.

Of the 81 results declared for the 108 civic body, Sena has made a significant gain capturing 31 seats followed by BJP with 20 seats, while Congress has so far picked up only 10 seats in a township hitherto known as its bastion.

NCP also could not make any dent in the constituency, from where party`s mercurial leader and Deputy Chief Minister Chhagan Bhujbal hails.

In Solapur, Congress has gained marginally in its stronghold bagging 41 seats followed by BJP with 29 seats, NCP with 12 seats.

Encouraged by its success in the December two municipal council polls, NCP, which had decided to contest on its own, has failed to make much of an impact barring Ulhasnagar.

The swing in satellite town civic polls in favour of NCP is also mostly attributed to the merger of Ulhasnagar People`s Party founded by TADA-accused Suresh (Pappu) Kalani.

In Nagpur, where saffron parties fought separately, Congress was able to put up a considerable fight.

Of the results available for the 136-member corporation, despite the scandals of alleged sex abuse which haunted the party leadership on the eve of the polls, Congress has notched up 16 as against 24 by BJP and one by Shiv Sena, while NCP has bagged four seats.

BSP has picked up three seats while SP bagged one. In NCP chief Sharad Pawar`s pocket borough Pimpri-Chinchwad, the party emerged as the single largest outfit with 36 seats.

Congress made substantial gains winning 31 seats followed by BJP with 13 seats, Shiv Sena 12 seats and independents two seats.

In Amravati, Congress has bagged 21 seats, followed by Sena 10 seats and BJP 12 seats.

In Akola, which went to the civic polls for the first time, Sena and BJP have forged ahead with 13 and nine seats respectively. Congress has bagged nine, while Bharipa Bahujan Mahasangh has bagged six.

Oh, the Heartache! They Want Cupid Banished

By SOMINI SENGUPTA



The Associated Press

A party member smashed an advertisement for a Valentine celebration.

The Associated Press

Facing threats from a radical Hindu political party over Valentine`s Day, card-shop owners like Kalyanji M. Chheda have produced ``Love Day`` cards, with no mention of Cupid or St. Valentine. The party, Shiv Sena, views Cupid as a symbol of the West`s corrupting influence.

http://www.sulekha.com/redirectnh.asp?cid=170510





MUMBAI, Feb. 11 — In the Indian imagination, this has long been the place where women could wear short skirts and dance with men. where lovers could take in the lights along Marine Drive and life could be like the movies.

Today, Bombay is called Mumbai, and there is a red rage brewing over Valentine`s Day.

The Shiv Sena, the radical Hindu political party that is a powerful force in the city and state governments, sees in Cupid the very avatar of Western culture, a symbol of its corrupting influence over traditional Indian society.

Last year, supporters of Shiv Sena — literally, the Army of Shivaji, the 17th-century Hindu king who warred against several Muslim rulers — stormed shops that carried Valentine`s Day greeting cards, overturned display racks and made bonfires on the streets.

This year, Sena leaders issued another death warrant of sorts against Valentine`s Day, calling it a frivolous occasion that sullies Indian values and gives young people another excuse to spend their parents` money.

Pramod Navalkar, a Shiv Sena man and the former culture minister of the state of Maharashtra, of which this is the capital, declared: ``Drinking, dancing. Drinking, dancing. These two D`s are destroying us. If our boys go and demonstrate in front of those shops, we cannot stop them. We have not asked them to demonstrate, but they might do.``

``What you need,`` he added, ``is to create some public opinion on this.``

Taliban of the Hindu right, guardians of Indian values, or killjoys of the Bombay spirit? Public opinion on the Shiv Sena here is by no means uniform.

What is certain is that their crusade against Cupid is merely the latest sign of a creeping puritanism that aims to make this India metropolis less freewheeling.

The passion over Feb. 14 is just the latest effort by the Shiv Sena, a coalition partner in the national government led by the Hindu nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party, to weigh in on Bombay`s cultural life.

In recent years, their supporters have raised a ruckus over a Muslim artist`s nude portrayal of a Hindu goddess, disrupted the concert of a Pakistani ghazal singer, and stormed movie theaters to protest a lesbian relationship portrayed in a film.

During his tenure as state culture minister, Mr. Navalkar campaigned against park benches that could encourage public cuddling; he urged that single seats be installed instead.

To hear Mr. Navalkar tell it, the Sena`s grievances cover a gamut of social ills.

Mr. Navalkar is opposed to the proliferation of Western clothes; soon, he fears, Indian women will have forgotten how to wear the traditional sari. He is also against the proliferation of restaurants, for fear they will deprive long-married couples of the one thing they have to talk about every day — shopping for fish and cooking.

``The lifestyle has totally changed,`` Mr. Navalkar lamented. ``Gradually this Westernization has grabbed the entire society.``

Such attitudes have more than a few detractors among those who regard the Shiv Sena`s latest vendetta against Cupid as a political gimmick. One of those is Kiran Nagarkar, a Bombay-born playwright and novelist, who has felt the wrath of Shiv Sena himself.

``Thuggishness is their primary objective,`` he said of the party`s campaign. ``They don`t have any causes left.``

Despite the Shiv Sena`s best efforts, Bombay remains, by many accounts, the most do-as-you-dare, most cosmopolitan of Indian cities, a place where women can, for the most part, safely walk the streets at night and order a gin without turning heads.

But card makers and sellers today cannot help but pay heed to the Shiv Sena campaign. Some in Bombay, as well as in nearby Pune and a few other Indian cities, have been forced to reduce or stop the production of Valentine`s Day cards altogether. One card shop chain, Archie`s, has asked the Indian Supreme Court to issue an order preventing a repeat of last year`s mayhem.

Kalyanji M. Chheda, owner of Satyam Collection card shop, in the heart of Bombay, around the corner from Eros Cinema, has mounted a smaller-than-usual Valentine`s Day spread this year. But he would not drop it altogether.

How could he? Last year, he sold 50,000 Valentine`s Day cards, just short of New Year`s Day card sales of 75,000; Diwali and Eid, the largest Hindu and Muslim holidays here, saw card sales of 50,000 and 25,000.

This year, to take some of the Shiv Sena heat off, the card-makers association has proposed thinly disguised Indian alternatives to Valentine`s Day.

There are new ``love cards,`` affectionate missives adorned with red hearts and pink roses but with no mention of that foreign interloper, St. Valentine, or his unclothed sidekick, Cupid.

Card-makers say they also hope their new invention, Prem Din Utsav, or Love Day Celebration, will soothe even the Sena`s hearts.

But the Sena`s threats have hardly erased the commercial promise of Valentine`s Day.

At least one nightclub is having a Valentine`s Day party. Newspapers are chock-full of ads for Valentine`s Day movie screenings, vacation packages and specials on Eric Segal novels.

The other day, at St. Xavier`s College, a hip and prestigious Jesuit-run school where the prom was recently banned, students leaned against the cool stone pillars and yawned at the Sena`s threats over Valentine`s Day.

``Maybe because we`re becoming more globalized they`re afraid of it becoming more American,`` said a fourth-year student who would give only her first name, Karen. ``This is their inferiority complex way of preserving it

re: asim hayat

{The writer is a well known journalist}

...yeah, that`s why his name isn`t attached...

you guys are pathetic...get a backbone and an identity...living in perpetual paranoia and inferiority complex viz-a-viz India isn`t becoming of a sovereign nation...

Re: Dost-Mittar

``...Are you certain that it is he who said this and not some of his underlings? ...``

Yes, indeed it was him. The electorate is not all that dumb after all.

Asim Hayat #56

Thanks for publishing this piece of hate speech. It is similar to the kind of articles the nazis wrote about Jews amd may even be a rewrite of one of those articles. The most amazing thing is that it is published in a major pak national newspaper on the OpEd page. You will never find its equivalent in any indian newspaper.

It shows that *educated * pakistanis are brought up to think of hindus as sub-human (or super-human!) but defintely not as plain human beings. The really sad thing is that these thoughts are coming from pakistanis with some education, though perhaps education has a different meaning in Pakistan. The final irony is that this poster has previously potrayed himself as a great democrat and broad minded thinker on this message board!

Re: Asim Hayat #56:

Just curious..... but is it necessary as a Pakistani to publicly announce your love/admiration/ hero-worship of one of your great leaders? Case in point: YLH and Jinnah. But at least YLH is on sound ground. This joker actually counts Bhutto Senior as one of his heroes!!! A man who led his country through a horrendous Civil conflict, not to mention a humiliating international war soon after, who was later overthrown violently and executed by his own countrymen for treason, is now a hero! Yaar, you guys better tell us which of your leaders is worth mocking. Till now it`s only Benazir, who for some reason is easy meat(I suspect it`s because she`s a woman but my opinion as a Hindian don`t count). Mushy is fun to make fun of, but Pakistanis get needlessly upset when we do that. Why can`t you be more like us and hate your leaders the way we do?

Asim Hayat #56

In which other country would a mainstream newspaper publish articles written by ``well known journalists,`` full of such bigotry against followers of another religion?

Ram, Ram, on the lips, a knife under the armpit.

Personal experience of inter-action with high caste Hindus.

Inner workings of the Indian mind.

Remove the provocation and the Lalajis.

``Like an enormous metaphysical boa, Hinduism.

That the boa constrictor.

Hindus baying for Pakistan`s blood.

Defence Minister in the jaws of the metaphysical boa.

Lala Vajpayee.

``Liberals`` of which other country would post such articles on a public forum?

Hindu carving knives are out!

The writer is a well known journalist

hkburki@hotmail.com

A new India is abroad. A muscular Hindu republic, overbearing, intransigent. It seeks to impose absolute domination over its South Asian neighbours and to assert itself as the big power. A bloodthirsty bellicosity, reflecting the transformation, accompanies the massive deployment of its forces on Pakistan`s borders. And it demands compliance with its wishes, or else.

Atal Behari Vajpayee and his RSS colleagues deserve credit for their candour. For decades, the Congress Party and its camp-followers had concealed with a smokescreen of secularism an essentially Brahmanic dispensation. It was a perfect rendering of the old saying: Ram, Ram, on the lips, a knife under the armpit. The BJP leaders have shed the mask of hypocrisy and come out in the open with a strident Hindu agenda. Ram, Ram is done with, knives are out. Little wonder, Kuldip Nayar, the veteran Indian columnist, has been driven to lament bitterly that communalism was now rife in the land of Gandhi.

Despite all the mayhem, Delhi`s designs have been frustrated thus far. Thanks primarily to General Musharraf`s firm response in the field, backed by vigorous, principled diplomacy. No one is indispensable and that goes for Pervez Musharraf, too. One shudders to think, however, what might have befallen the beleaguered country had it been blessed with the services of one of those fake democrats.

The Indians have been thwarted in the first round. Their forces are still poised on the border, however. Sabre-rattling and brinkmanship continue to be the predominant motifs. The big bully may, in fact, make a lunge. It is in the nature of the beast.

Not many people are left in this country with direct personal experience of inter-action with high caste Hindus in pre-partition India. The number of those in authority who have been exposed to the inner workings of the Indian mind in the turbulent years since the independence, has also shrunk. Fortunately, Pervez Musharraf`s Foreign Minister is thoroughly conversant with India`s deviousness and hegemonic aims.

There is no dearth of expert analysts, however. Brought up mostly on a diet of Indian statements and periodic pious declarations, they thrash about in shoals of ignorance, cocksure and assertive. All manner of weird panaceas and fanciful compromises flow from their prolix pens. Adopt Pakistan first policy, forget Kashmir is one prize exhibit. Remove the provocation and the Lalajis would leave us alone.

It looks pretty neat in print and original. There is just one small flaw. It is oblivious of Indian ruling elite`s mindset and barely concealed agenda. You can ditch the Kashmiris, yes, but it won`t buy you any relief, much less safety. For Delhi Kashmir is a nuisance, and it can remove the irritant at any time. All it needs to do is to let the Kashmiris exercise the autonomy already conceded in the Indian Constitution. No, in Delhi`s book, there is only one problem: Pakistan. Its very existence is taken as an insult to Mother India.

The BJP makes no bones about its plan to impose on all citizens, including Muslims and Christians, Hindu culture. That is one short step away from total absorption. It is in an old mantra, long familiar to Muslims, and also identified by a great Mexican writer. Octavio Paz who served as his country`s ambassador in Delhi for several years, noted Hinduism`s immense power of assimilation. ``Like an enormous metaphysical boa, Hinduism slowly and relentlessly digests foreign cultures, gods, languages, and beliefs.``

High-caste Hindus nurse a bitter, deep-seated grudge against the Muslims for having ruled over them a thousand years. That the boa constrictor has failed to digest the Muslims must rankle even more. Now that India has achieved great economic strength and assembled a juggernaut with nuclear teeth, the Hindus want to settle all old scores at one go. Here and now, Pakistan`s nuclear deterrent notwithstanding.

The weekly TV programme, ``Question Time India`` is an eye-opener. The panelists as well as the 150 selected questioners, predominantly middles class Hindus, have been baying for Pakistan`s blood for months. They think they are already a Super Power. If the US can attack Afghanistan to destroy terrorists why can`t India cross the Line of Control and do the same? No cricket with Pakistan they scream in unison. What defies comprehension is the craven attitude of Pakistan`s very martial cricket establishment. Why must it keep begging for fixtures? If the Indians don`t want to play, let them go to Timbuktu.

TV channels, the print media with some honourable exceptions like ``The Hindu``, even Bollywood films have all been carrying on a hysterical campaign against Pakistan, demanding condign punishment. One leading pundit of strategy has boldly gone forth to propose that Pakistan`s nuclear bluff must be called, as if it was a game of cards. Defence Minister George Fernandes, perhaps already in the jaws of the metaphysical boa, has boasted that India can absorb the first nuclear strike. Even as bluster, it borders on madness.

Clearly, the Indians think they have Pakistan at their mercy and can realise their dream of sucking it back into the lap of Mother India. Nehru and Patel had tried to snuff it out at its very birth. Nehru`s daughter came very close to destroying it in 1971. And she thought she had cut what remained of it down to size. She had overlooked the political genius and resolution of a man called Zulfikar Ali Bhutto. The dynamic leader, still much reviled in his homeland, picked up the pieces, restored Pakistan to robust health and launched a full-scale nuclear programme. It is time, the General stopped foul-mouthing the already much-wronged man and acknowledge publicly his contribution.

Another bid to fix Pakistan was made in 1998 with a series of nuclear tests. A K Advani, the arch Hindu revanchist, promptly declared that Pakistan was back in the situation it faced in December 1971, thereby hinting at the prospects of another surrender. Somehow the Indians concluded that Pakistan lacked nuclear capability or at least the will to demonstrate it. They were not too far off the mark. But for the military`s insistence, Nawaz Sharif would have obliged.

Then came a reversion to the Ram, Ram ruse. They worked on Nawaz, buying his sugar and offering economic openings for his family business. There was a well-orchestrated yatra by Lala Vajpayee to Lahore, signing a meaningless Lahore Declaration. To their dismay, however, Nawaz Sharif`s bid to become the all-powerful Caliph was nipped in the nick of time. In inter-state relations, one has rarely come across the kind of venom the Indians spewed against Pakistan for changing its government, purely its own internal affair.

Atalji was in good company. Bill Clinton, let us not forget, was equally incensed. The US President immediately imposed sanctions. And on his way back from his triumphant visit to India, he stopped over in Islamabad four hours simply to heap insults on Gen Musharraf. Those who claim that these gentlemen were acting in defence of democracy need to have their heads examined. Bill and Atalji were both furious because they had been deprived of a protÈgÈ they had cultivated assiduously. The leader of Pakistan`s sham democracy was to implement their agendas.

Some Pakistani scribes, more authoritative than yours truly by far, have been taking frequent swipes at Pervez Musharraf for his handling of the post-September 11 situation. One telephone call from George Bush and the country`s sovereignty was compromised. That is one charge against the General. Even more scathing is the question: What happened to the much vaunted deterrent?



One can`t help wondering in which geological stratum these gentles reside. What. Planet of the Apes? Who had ever suggested that Pakistan`s two dozen bombs were a deterrent against Washington? In the heat of self-righteous indignation, it is forgotten that Pakistan was a virtually bankrupt state and already under a dire threat from the east. How could President Musharraf risk denying staging facilities and over-flights to a wounded Super Power ready to pulverize all opposition to its war of revenge against terrorists?

Pakistan`s participation in the international coalition in which India, incidentally, is a more than eager partner, has exposed the country to certain dangers. It has brought, however, significant and much-needed immediate economic benefits. No less important, it has assured Western diplomatic support against a rampant India.

There is an unfortunate dimension to this latest jigsaw of international equations. The Western Powers in general and the United States in particular, do not understand or do not want to know, the true nature and aspirations of a resurgent India.

One of Washington`s long-standing obsessions is the containment of China. When Nehru`s forward policy resulted in a thorough drubbing by a battle-hardened People`s Liberation Army in 1962, Kennedy rushed to Panditji`s assistance. Arms for six mountain divisions were gifted and several ordnance factories followed. Now, once more, George Bush wants to counter China`s growing economic clout and military muscle. Agreements to transfer state of the art defence technology were signed by the Indian Defence Minister in Washington last month. Strategic cooperation is on the anvil. Since India already enjoys full access to Russian weaponry, it seems well set to buying its way into the super league.

In seeking a counter-weight to China, already a near Super Power, the United States will end up facing two Super States. For Washington does not seem to realise that India would want to operate as a world power with goals of its own and not as an American sidekick.

What would be the fate of Pakistan? Islamabad could throw itself at the mercy of Delhi, as some smart alecks amongst us are already hinting. In that case, Pakistanis must be prepared to accept the status of virtual untouchables, for the Hindu upper crust is not going to abandon its caste system any time soon. Even after three millennia of near serfdom, 200 million Dalits are still struggling to free themselves. There is an honourable alternative available, and it is rather Spartan. Maintain a minimum creditable deterrent, both in conventional forces and nuclear weapons. And, simultaneously, acquire economic strength. Not too tall an order, but it demands dedication.

dost-mittar #54
http://www.indiainfo.com/news/Sep-2-99/2di25.html
http://www.the-week.com/99sep05/daily.htm#34

``..RSS was involved in `84 anti-Sikh riots
The Congress candidate for the South Delhi Lok Sabha seat Manmohan Singh, has said that the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS), was actively involved in the anti-Sikh carnage in the capital 1984. Talking to reporters at the Press Club of India, Singh called the 1984 riots ``a black spot and the saddest event``. He asserted that the Congress had no role in it, he claimed. ``It should not have happened.`` He said that his winning the Padma Vibushan in the same year was proof enough that the Congress had no role in the carnage. The first information reports lodged at police stations in Delhi show that RSS men were involved in the riots, Singh said. ..``

----
Here it is implied that he lost mainly because his own party considered him `too strong` a candidate!

http://www.expressindia.com/fe/daily/19991007/fpo07076.html

``.. As the impression gained ground in the party that he would have greater acceptibility as the Prime Minister in case the Congress romped home, there were subtle efforts to scuttle his chances of victory. There were tell-tale signs of the party leadership not extending him the physical wherewithal for electioneering. Singh himself admitted before the people that he had no funds to fight back his opponent, BJP`s Vijay Kumar Malhotra.

Singh created media wave in Delhi with newspapers headlining his winning chances from the prestigious South Delhi constituency. This put Vijay Kumar Malhotra in his toes and the BJP-RSS cadres swung into action to counter the formidable Congress candidate.

Among a few supporters of Singh was Delhi Chief Minister Sheila Dixit who tried to help him in his campaign. But that was about all. The impression sought to be created around 10 Janpath was that whoever helped Singh was bound to incur the wrath of Sonia Gandhi. They may or may not be correct. But it had its repercussions.

According to party sources close to Singh, the former world bank economist realised the odds towards the later part of his campaigning. He then went about his job virtually alone with a handful of academic supporters. The party cadres , indeed, had distanced themselves.

Singh made one mistake on the penultimate day of his campaigning which, according to sources, proved costly. Addressing mediapersons at the press club here, Singh blamed the RSS for the 1984 anti-Sikh riots in Delhi and elsewhere in the aftermath of Indira Gandhi`s assassination. The BJP cadres exploited it to the hilt and managed to alienate a sizeable section of Sikh voters from Manmohan Singh. Singh sought to correct himself the next day by issuing a statement that he had not entirely blamed the RSS for the riots and that he had only referred to the FIR then which mentioned about the RSS. But it was too late. The damage was already done...``

Congress gets initial lead in Maharashtra civic polls

Press Trust of India

Mumbai, February 11: Congress is forging ahead in the elections for the various municipal corporations in Maharashtra, according to results available so far.

In Solapur, Congress has bagged seven seats followed by BJP winning six seats, while Shiv Sena won three and NCP two, sources in the state election Commission said in Mumbai.

Among the results available so far from the orange city Nagpur, Congress has won three seats.

In the neighbouring Thane, NCP has bagged four and Shiv Sena and BJP shared one seat each, sources said.

In Akola, BJP bagged one seat while the a local front bagged five seats and Bharipa Bahujan Mahasangh three.

In Amrawati municipal corporation polls, Congress has won four seats as against two seats by Shiv Sena.

Meanwhile, according to trends available for the Brihanmumbai Municipal Corporation (BMC Brihanmumbai Mahanagar Palika) polls, Shiv Sena is leading in 14 seats, followed by Congress in nine while BJP and NCP have established leads in two seats and one seat respectively.

Well, I guess I was off the mark when I had predicted that the Shiv Sena goons will restrict themselves only to giving moral lectures:

We will bash up Valentine`s Day couples: Sena

http://headlines.sify.com/563news1.html

dost-mittar #41
Without holding any brief for the `enlightenment of India`s middle class`, it needs to be pointed out that Manmohan Singh while campaigning last time asserted that his party the CongressI was not responsible for the 84 Sikh riots and that the RSS was. This created a major uproar and the riot effectees staged public protests against him. If he is as deserving of support as his professional competence seems to imply, he should stop peddling blatant lies on a sensitive issue like other politicians do.

re: Ferozk # 45

Feroze, in EACH case, the murderer was driven by a blind hatred of the ``OTHER`` group.

Yigal Amir, the Jew, who killed Rabin, did so because Rabin wanted to make peace with the Palestinians.

Khaled Islambouli, the Muslim, who kiled Sadat, did so because Sadat was trying to bury the hatchet with the Israelis.

Nathuram Godse, the Hindu, killed Gandhi because Gandhi sought to advocate the cause of Muslims.

James Earl Ray, the white Christian, killed the black Christian Martin Luther King.

The Jew loved all Jews. The Muslim loved all Muslims. The Hindu loved all Hindus. The white Christian loved all white Christians.

Except, none of them loved the simple Human Being.

Enormous love for `one`s own` and enormous hatred for `the other` are as closely tied as the two sides of a dollar bill.

Both have the same name - fascism. And Cruelty and Murder are fascism`s natural children.

Stuka:

``semipreciousme: (God !! pls choose a smaller handle..)``

...good exercise for your fingers....but if you insist on being lazy, semi`ll do...

re: # 35

...that`s better...

Asim Hayat #44

As a product of a extremist islamist state ruled by a military dictator, you have excellent credentials to carry the message of democracy to the world.

That aside, here is a simple request: produce from the facts in the *news report * (taken from an excellent indian newspaper) three statements that are hateful or reprehensible. I am not referring to your various beliefs that Vajpayee is a form of Hitler etc. I am referring to the actual contents of the news article you included in your message.

One point I had made in my message was that true ``believers`` accept all kinds of ``facts`` about their religous traditions. Christian belief includes ``facts`` far more startling than the idea that Rama lived in Ayodhya a trillion years ago. I wont bother you with my opinion of islamic beliefs, as you will certainly construe it as a personal attack. If a hindu religous school teaches such beliefs, well, its their problem. Needless to say all this subtlety is water off your duck back.....

re: Ferozk

{{Religion, in itself, is not bad; rather, it is we who have given it a bad name by our own misdeeds.}}

the nuclear bomb, in itself, is not bad either; it is the people who drop it on others. ditto for guns, poison gas and the AIDS virus...so let`s keep all those things around and pray that people improve?? or better to get rid of them so fools can`t use them to hurt themselves or others?...

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

Re: Harish et al

Has anyone considered the fact that it was a Jew who killed Rabin; a Muslim who killed Sadat; a Christian who killed Martin Luther King, Jr. and a Hindu who killed Gandhi...

Let us stop talking about ``cross-religious intolerance/terror``, because we have done more to malign our religions than any outsider could have done. Religion, in itself, is not bad; rather, it is we who have given it a bad name by our own misdeeds.

Ciao

Re : Pmishra2 on Madrassh system in India

Dear Sir,

Your impassioned appeal to support these purveyors of falsehood and hatred is indeed well noted. However, petty jingoism aside, your rush to defend these very madrassahs shows one thing that you are trying to bury your head in the sand in so far as being objective and ``truth`` oriented. I would have expected no less from an indian fellow whose sole purpose in coming here to Chowk is to possibly cast aspersions and slanber our nation;and yet one whoo does not even have an iota of impartiality to condemn the very wrongs being perpetrated in his own back yard in the name of an ``education``. Notwithstanding Pakistan`s history of poor leaders, one thing stands out, and that is the fact that we have never had such blatant bigots as rulers as Vajpayee who proudly associates himself as swayem Savek of RSS, which is clearly a fascist organisation and immulators of Hitler et al. These people are so self deluded not to mention oblivious of truth and objtivity that they would modify the truth and the history to suggest that the Taj Mahal was a Hindu Temple. Indeed, the goop being dished out at these places of learning to the infertile minds shall result in a class of people who shall not only be more biassed and bigoted but also anti Pakistan to their own detriment. Surely you do not think that the false ideologies being taught at your 2000 odd schools is going to provide another Gandhi!

Learning English is well and good, but learning a jingoims driven version of history when the so called facts being taught by your RSS goons can be refuted by any and every ``white`` historian is hardly productive.

You may continue to live and prosper in your ``democratic`` state as long as the Hindus are left to run the country as per the Sangh Parivar.Good luck to you my friend, and may your see the folly of your reasoning.

Asim

I was unaware of this good news. Now that rogue Thackeray will not be able to cars vote in civic polls. Good work Election Commission of India and VICTORY TO INDIAN DEMOCRACY.

http://www.timesofindia.com/Articleshow.asp?art_id=555763

Summary: ``Shiv Sena supremo Bal Thackeray, who was disenfranchised by the Election Commission (EC) for six years in 1995 could not cast his ballot for the prestigious BMC polls on Sunday, despite expiry of the ban period.

``

semipreciousme: (God !! pls choose a smaller handle..)

``....let`s not over-generalize, please..``

ERM, UH ...You`re right ofcourse. I actually had that thought on my own as well. Please refer to my post # 35, which I posted right after the one you are talking about. One has a habit of losing one`s temper and shooting of a post, to be filled with a general sense of regret and a desire to make amends.

Asim Heyat #39

If this is an indian madrassah, then I dont think we are in trouble at all.

From the article we learn that students are:

(1) learning English

(2) Competing well in public exams

(3) include students from ``non cow-eating`` backgrounds

(4) not taught to hate any particular community.

Like all religous schools these students are taught that their particular traditions are ``real``. Rama, the hindu god-king, truly lived at a certain time etc.

How is this different from believing that Jesus Christ was a historical figure? There is no historical evidence for this, nor is there any historical evidence for any part of the old testament. I would suggest you visit a Christian school and review their curriculum.

I won`t comment on Islamic beliefs, except that a whole lot of them seem to depend on whether the prophet did or did not do certain things. Sounds pretty irrational to me, but I have a feeling most muslims would disagree and view these issues differently.

How is the ideology of these schools differ from traditional christian and muslim religous schools? Leaving aside, of course, that conversion is a key part of christianity and islam but plays a very small part in hindu discourse.

Manufacturing believers

The RSS runs a network of schools country wide Anjali Mody looks at what is taught there.

Talk about the Indian variety of Madrassah educated elites!

http://www.hindu.com/stories/2002021000061200.htm

ON A cold January morning, the Union HRD Minister, Murli Manohar Joshi, told a captive audience of restive high school students from 12 institutions run by Vidya Bharati (the RSS` education wing) about the changes his Government had made to school syllabuses and textbooks. Pradeep (not his real name), a class 11 student from GLT Saraswati Shishu Mandir, in South Delhi who was there, summarised what he understood of the Minister`s message: ``He told us that although some people say that Lord Ramachandra never existed, that he did... He produced him in front of us... No... no... that`s only a joke... he said that there is this river which people say never really existed, but he has scientifically proven that it did exist, that Lord Ramachandra was born on its banks... so he also existed.``

The strange logic of this deduction would not have bothered the Minister. Nor, perhaps, Pradeep`s teachers. For they, like him and his classmates, are drilled in `sanskriti gyan` or `cultural knowledge` based on a series of workbooks devised by Vidya Bharati. Last year, the `history` section of Pradeep`s Sanskriti Gyan Pareeksha workbook would have told him: ``In Faizabad district of Uttar Pradesh where present day Ayodhya stands, there on the banks of the Sarayu river was ancient Ayodhya, capital of Suryavanshi Kshatriya kings. Manu and Maharani Shatroopa were reborn in Ayodhya as Raja Dasharatha and Kaushalya, and in their home sakshaat Narayana took incarnation (as Lord Ram). According to astrologers and the puranas the time of Shri Ram is believed to be around 8,86,000 years ago.``

This lesson in `history` is part of the `national education` that Vidya Bharati`s 19,741 schools around the country impart to their 24,00,000 students. Vidya Bharati is, says its head Dinanath Batra, one of the ``organisations through which the Sangh`s vichardhara or way of thinking is propagated``. Its aim is to provide an education which will turn out ``self-less citizens... suffused with the spirit of Hindutva``.

The first Vidya Bharati school was set up in 1952. Since then growth has been exponential. In just five years from 1998, the number went up from 13,000 to 19,741. These are by and large fee paying schools, started with private donations. Mr. Batra says Vidya Bharati has neither received, nor sought, financial support from the Government to run its schools. At Vidya Bharati`s schools across the country there is much talk of `sanskara`. This broadly includes prayers in Sanskrit, the Saraswati Vandana, teachers being called `acharya` and students who touch their feet. Respect for parents established by touching their feet. Some schools run tulsi planting campaigns as part of `environmental awareness`. Mr. Batra believes that it is the `atmosphere` of a school that makes the `difference`. With uncharacteristic flourish he declares: ``walls should speak, stones should sing``. The walls of Vidya Bharati`s schools do speak, to those willing to listen. They are lined with calendar art images of `mahapurush` — RSS gurus, M.S. Golwalkar and Baliram Hedgewar, Shankaracharya, Dayananda Saraswati, Vivekananda, Shivaji, Rana Pratap, Subhash Chandra Bose, Chandrashekhar Azad, sometimes Sardar Patel, but not Mahtama Gandhi.

A curious panoply of greats given that the majority of schools run by Vidya Bharati — variously called Saraswati Mandirs, Gita Niketans, Vivekananda Vidyalayas across the country — are affiliated either to the CBSE or the local state education boards, which still accept Mahatma Gandhi`s pre-eminence in the history of the nation. Mr. Batra dismisses this observations saying: ``We publish many pictures including a very beautiful one of Gandhi.``

Pictures apart, how do those who run Vidya Bharati schools balance their version of the truth with the facts and figures in the prescribed syllabuses and textbooks? Sitting in front of a life size portrait of Golwalkar, R.P. Vishvendu, Principal of the Shri Sanatan Dharma Saraswati Bal Mandir, in New Delhi`s Punjabi Bagh neighbourhood, admits it is a tricky business: ``When you are teaching a child to distinguish between good and bad... you tell them Shivaji was good... then how do you tell them that Auranzeb was also good... that there was a battle between two good people?... similarly with Subhash Chandra Bose... and Gandhi...`` He adds, ``if you pour water over concrete it simply flows off... But if you keep dripping water at the same spot then after sometime there will be a dent even in concrete... that is how we work...``

Clearly, Mr. Vishvendu hopes that the drip-drip of a compulsory regime of Sanskriti Gyan Pareeksha (the workbooks to which he contributes) from classes 4 to 12, with their own version of history, will do the trick. Especially since two-thirds of the over 70,000 teachers in Vidya Bharati`s schools have been `qualified` to teach the truth according to these books through a three-stage exam specially designed for them.

Sandeepji, the young clear-eyed history teacher at the Mata Ramrakhi Sanatan Dharma Saraswati Bal Mandir(MRSD), just north of Delhi University, whose students are drawn from the post-Partition resettlement colonies of north and west Delhi, has a far more sophisticated method: ``I present the truth as written in the textbooks. The textbook for instance says `In the end the Congress accepted the partition of India`. I tell my students to go home and talk to their grandparents who experienced Partition about whether there was any need to accept Partition, I then have a discussion in the classroom. And through the stories of their families and friends they understand that although Congress accepted partition it was not necessary.``

Teachers at Vidya Bharati schools are happy to share their teaching techniques. Mrs. Kulsreshta, the highly regarded English teacher at the Punjabi Bagh Shishu Mandir, says that ``in every lesson you can draw out the impact of Indian culture... from the Gita. I point out examples of this... I tell my students that even in this foreign author`s writing you can see the influence of the Gita.``

Veena Khanna, the Hindi teacher at MRSD, says, ``It is so hard to remove the wrong ideas from their minds... to teach them that it was not the Muslims who built the Qutub Minar, that Muslims peeled off the sculptures of gods and covered them with Arabic script... Prithviraj Chauhan`s sister used to look at Yamuna maiya from the top of the minar.`` With great feeling, and no sense of irony she pronounced, ``If you repeat a lie ten times it becomes the truth. It is even happening today``. At least in Model Town the lessons have had their impact. In sanskritised Hindi students of class 9 and 10 at MRSD deliver well-rehearsed lines. Manish: ``They said Hindus were cow eaters. This is wrong.`` Gaurav: ``They said Aryans came from outside. This must be changed.`` Neha: ``They have called Guru Gobind Singh a looter, when he gave his life for the nation.``

``You mean Guru Tegh Bahadur, don`t you,`` corrects Om Prakash, the principal who runs his school of 300-odd students from a building that also houses the local sanatan dharma temple. A soft-spoken man, he is very open about his long connection with the RSS. It was as a child at an RSS shakha in the 1950s that he learnt of the ``wrongs`` being perpetrated by modern school education. Before he joined the Vidya Bharati school network he was an RSS pracharak. Even today he keeps his eyes open for bright students whom he can point out to the local shakha as ``worth working on``.

A more thorough-going venture of ``propagating the RSS vichardhara through education`` is Sewa Dham Vidya Mandir.

A free residential school run under the guidance of Vidya Bharati by another RSS-affiliated NGO, Sewa Bharati, funded primarily by donations from the Sangh`s NRI supporters. Located on the Delhi-Uttar Pradesh border the school, with 285 students from 21 States, mostly from Scheduled Tribe and Scheduled Caste backgrounds, has results that many fee paying schools would envy.

The CBSE schools football trophy sits proudly among other sporting awards in the Principal, O.P. Sharma`s office. School exam results displayed on the notice board declare over 50 per cent first classes, and only a tiny number of thirds.

Mr. Sharma hopes that the school will produce future administrators, who will ``do work to improve their districts having learnt their sanskars here``. The school regime is a far more rigorous and unequivocal induction into the Sangh`s way of life than the Vidya Bharati schools in cities. Shakha attendance, complete with exercise and intellectual `discussion`, is built into the school`s tough regimen that begins at 4.30 in the morning and ends at 10 p.m., with television viewing permitted only on Sunday.

Mr. Sharma says the school has an open atmosphere and students can `think and speak freely` on any subject. They have a 10,000-book library, carefully selected to include books that ``speak of gauravata ki batein not gulami ki batein``. He says they may have to be taught, because of the existing textbooks, that the Taj Mahal was a mausoleum built by Shah Jahan, but there are enough books in the library, including many by P.N. Oak, which will tell them that it was not a mausoleum but a Hindu temple.

Mr. Sharma, whose academic discipline is economics, illustrates the focus of teaching in his school. He says, ``for example economics books tell us that India is a poor country... we will not teach this. We will teach children that India is a very rich country... it has had a green revolution... it has the best record in milk production... the best cows in Denmark have gone from India.``

Sewa Dham has its particular problems. It is not so simple, as it is at an average Vidya Bharati school, to assume that the students will find the fact that ``Hindus ate beef`` objectionable. Many of their students come from communities that do eat beef. Mr. Sharma who is something of a cow protection missionary and has a cow and calf tethered near his rooms on the school campus says, ``Christians working in areas like Arunachal Pradesh have said beef is the most nutritious... we have to convince these children otherwise... we tell them that the cow is our mother... that gods reside inside her... that breeze from the direction in which a cow turns her head is pure... that there is no other treatment for cancer but go-mooth (cow urine).``

Outside the formal school system, the Sangh`s affiliates are also involved in a variety of `educational activity`. Vidya Bharati, according to Mr. Batra, is to set up `Sanskar Kendras` in poor neighbourhoods and slums. Beyond city slums, he says, they are focussing on ``sensitive areas`` — the Northeast, Jammu and Kashmir, Bastar, the Bihar-Nepal border, with ``50 centres for primitive tribes``.

Mr. Batra explains the motivation: ``Take the Northeast, you can hear the voice of disintegration... there are a lot of Bangladeshi immigrants. These are areas in which Christian missionaries are very active.``

The Bihar-Nepal border, border areas with Pakistan? ``They are full of madrassas funded from abroad... Muslims must be taught that they are born in this country, nursed by this country and must live for the country.`` Bastar? ``It has naxalwadis and vanvasis.``

`Vanvasi` is the Sangh`s catch-all term for adivasis, devised to fit its thesis that far from being the original inhabitants of the subcontinent forced to the margins by later arrivals from central Asia, they are lost tribes of Hindus waiting to be reawakened.

Another Sangh affiliate, Ekal Vidyalaya Foundation, is already involved in running schools in adivasi areas with the hope that they will be ``awakened to their Hindu heritage``. The foundation runs some 7,000 one-teacher schools in ``remote areas where Government schools do not exist or are not being run properly``.

The three-hours-a-day school is designed to deliver reading and numeracy skills, `general knowledge` no different from the material in Vidya Bharati`s Sanskriti Gyan workbooks, `sanskara` — like Sanskrit prayers, touching the feet of parents — exercise and personal health and hygiene.

Seema Ajgaonkar, co-coordinator of the foundations Expert Committee, speaks with a missionary spirit about the activities of the school which ``unite the village youth``, give them a chance to throw off the ``dependence created by Government`` and ``awaken in them the knowledge that they are not adivasis but vanvasi Hindus``.

Stuka:

``This statement, made by a Paki Muslim, should be publicised among all Indian Muslims as a true representation of the love and affection Paki Muslims have for Indian Muslims. This statement is living proof that a Paki Muslim is happiest when innocent non Paki Muslims are slaughtered. I wonder why Paki Muslims were so unhappy when the throats of their own kind were being slit in Afghanistan?``

....let`s not over-generalize, please..

Mastram

``We might want to believe that Shiv Sena`s support base comprises only of `lumpen proletariat` but the fact remains that Shiv Sena has considerable support amongst middle class maharashtrians in Bombay.

``

No Sir, what you call support is, at best, a helpless realization that he is a ``necessary evil``. No educated man, whether he is a Bombayite or not, can defend the actions of Thackrey with a straight face. In the beginning of his career he collected a bunch of ruffians and harassed South Indians in the name of marathi chauvinism. Then he needed another sentimental issue to expand his base. This time he used ``communal agenda(I wont call it Hinduism)`` to do this. Afterall, if he such a staunch Hindu, why did he persecute his own Hindu bretheren, the South Indians. Believe me, he is neither a Hindu nor a Marathi, just a cunning mafia leader who wants to rule over people. He opposes ``Valentine`s day`` in the name of cultural corruption but his own son and relatives invite Michael Jackson, the paedophile, for a stage program so that they can gobble 4 crores from that show in their pocket. Actually the real story is that the Archies refused to bribe him and he therefore ordered his goons to loot Archies shops and harass people on Valentine`s day. All Indians Hindus or Muslims, and especially Hindus should see the true colors of this person and teach him a lesson.

Sincerely

A UPite

Actually, in my previous post, ``Paki Muslims`` should be replaced by

`` Paki Muslims who are Mohajirs of UP and descendants of Bhangis, and whose Grandfathers was given a boot up the Arse by Punjabi Hindus, and whose families are regularly slapped around by Punjabi Pak Rangers on the streets of Karachi, and who love to loiter around Chowk making obnoxious comments to prove their non existent manhood, and whose Chowk handles are inspired by lousy Hindi pictures starring Govinda and directed by David Dhawan such as Anari #1, Coolie #1 etc``

Reading the posts of my democratic, secular and progressives Hindu brethren -- against the Hindu Talibani vermins like Shive Sena, RSS, Bajrang dal and that scum of the earth VHP -- fills my heart with pride and joy.

What my father fought for was not in vain.

hasan

``Shiv Sena is the true representative of Hindustani people and Thackray is the best leader Hindus ever had.``

This statement, made by a Paki Muslim, should be publicised among all Indian Muslims as a true representation of the love and affection Paki Muslims have for Indian Muslims. This statement is living proof that a Paki Muslim is happiest when innocent non Paki Muslims are slaughtered. I wonder why Paki Muslims were so unhappy when the throats of their own kind were being slit in Afghanistan?

I talk to the Bombayites here, and they by and large support Thackeray. The ususal refrain is that Thackeray is evil but it is a necessary evil required to counter the Muslim fundamentalists who are a greater evil. Even otherwise rational and educated people (Bombayites) tend to think of Tackeray as some sort of savior of the city against an Islamic goonda onslaught, which to be honest, I don`t understand.

Shiv Sena may have supporters etc outside Bombay, but the political influence is negligible. In Maharashtra, the sugar belt area of Manmad etc is heavily Congress dominated, with the BJP having made recent gains. Similar story in Vidarbha, Konkan belt etc. The only area outside Bombay where Shiv Sena presence exists is Nasik, Shirdi etc etc, which are close to Bombay.

Outside Maharastra, I don`t think Shiv Sena has a single MP, though their slogan (Garv sey kaho hum Hindu Hain) can now occaisionally be seen uo north as well.

Plenty of grist for the mill coming up -- Sant (baba) Valenteen`s day is fast approaching --- time for the Thakeray brigade to start giving us moral lectures on right and wrong.

semipreciousme - ``will his arrest cause massive insurrection?…``

yes unfortunately it will be another reason for very violent communal clashes. Almost everything is nowadays!!

It is absolutely true that the educated masses support them. It is common knowledge (now - but chilling nonetheless) that during elections - the party members actually go around marking houses based on the religion of the owners/occupants - and distribute flyers - showing why the hindus MUST vote for the BJP in the upcoming elections. These are only left at houses occupied by Hindus and not by any other community.

aicha

MastRam:

“We might want to believe that Shiv Sena`s support base comprises only of `lumpen proletariat` but the fact remains that Shiv Sena has considerable support amongst middle class maharashtrians in Bombay”

….hmmm….i guess that does make it harder…but you have to tackle these extremists by the gonads…a lot of nuisance value but mostly hot air and false bravado more than anything else…. ….just look at qazi & co….

the stupidity, or shall i say a pathetic reach for parity, of some pakistanis continues to amaze me...of what relevance is thackeray to pakistan?...what has he done in pakistan?..NOTHING...or are you people just looking for someone to equate with your retards who launch attacks in other countries? (from yousef ramzi in new york to 100s in india to taliban-buddies in afghnaistan)...

thackeray cannot be equated with islamic terrorists from pakistan and the middle-east...thackeray is a criminal who should be tried for crimes in india...his crimes are committed in india and against indians...he is not an international terrorist...

good to see a nambiar contribution after quite a while. and it doesn`t disappoint. very interesting insight into the way these kind of people operate, though there were a few hindi words i didn`t understand at all :(

shandana

re Akash #22

``Thackrey doesn`t have any support base outside Maharashtra,Bombay to be precise. And that too amongst illiterate and fanatical people.``

This is not entirely correct. I have known a number of educated and otherwise rational people who support Shiv Sena (and by extension, Thackrey) in Bombay. People like Pramod Nawalkar, Sudhir Joshi, Suresh Prabhu or even Pritish Nandy don`t exactly fit the mould of illiterate and fanatic. We might want to believe that Shiv Sena`s support base comprises only of `lumpen proletariat` but the fact remains that Shiv Sena has considerable support amongst middle class maharashtrians in Bombay.

Akash:

``And that too amongst illiterate and fanatical people.``

Ignorance is bliss! I wish it was so but Thakreys power base is in middle and lower middle class Marathi speaking people of Mumbai. They are typically blue-collar or lower white collar workers and very definitely not illiterates!!!

wholly-precious-you

Actually BJP leaders may not be as impotent as we think. Vajpayee has refused squarely to let VHP construct temple when the matter is in court. A public interest litigation has also been put in the Supreme Court to keep Thackrey`s men from harassing teens on Valentine`s day. Victory to lovebirds. I must congratulate Vajpayee and his team for keeping the secular fabric of the country intact in their rule of 3 years.

wholly-precious-you

``can anyone tell me what bal thackery’s power base is like now?….despite being a thug par excellence, this idiot’s still roaming the streets….what’s the police scared of?...will his arrest cause massive insurrection``

Thackrey doesn`t have any support base outside Maharashtra, Bombay to be precise. And that too amongst illiterate and fanatical people. There is one thing scary about him. His loyal supporters are fanatical in nature. They may do anything, yes ``anything``, if he is arrested. He has a big nuisance value. Call it our impotence or whatever you wish, nobody dares to bell this thug. He is like a political mafia who has grown just too powerful to be undone easily.

Hopefully, if this dang democracy thing works, as it does in its own strange ways, time and again, the sena will receive a second kick in their rear ends.

Remember, they got booted out of the state govt. because the voters valued results over hatred and ideology. this will happen again in the next national elections when the voters will have to decide. Right now, there are three horrible choices--the stupid sena, Power-hungry Pawar and the congress cementheads. May the least of the evils win!

The only reason the incompetent cartoonist`s current capers is the thin-ice majority the coalition in power has. They have to look the other way at his moronic threats in order to survive. [do read Rushdie`s The Moor`s Last Sigh where he has fun with the dude].

dost-mittar #16
``BTW I had difficulty believing that Vajpayee threatened Joshi with ouster if he didn`t arrest the shiv sainiks; he refused to move even against Jayalalitha after she humiliated his own Minister.``

dost-mittar, just to put the record straight, Vajpayee stood up to Jayalalitha when she was a constituent in his government. He refused to dismiss the Karunanidhi government in TN as she demanded and refused to get the corruption cases dismissed, so she withdrew her support, his government fell and midterm elections were called.(To give a point of reference in time, it was in the period between her toppling the government and the holding of midterm elections that the Kargil conflict took place)

….can anyone tell me what bal thackery’s power base is like now?….despite being a thug par excellence, this idiot’s still roaming the streets….what’s the police scared of?...will his arrest cause massive insurrection?…

It is stuff like this that makes me lose faith in Indian style democracy. Now, I would totally love to see the Shiv Sena confront the Indian Army. The Shiv Sainik bodies would pile up higher than Nariman Point skyscrapers.

Being a Hindu majority country, we must lead by example of Hindus first. Finish these guys off, and then take on SIMI etc.

Valentine`s Day celebration gets new name in India



MUMBAI (Reuters) - Card shop owners in Bombay plan to promote a festival of love celebrating family ties after a hardline Hindu party said Valentine`s Day celebrations violated Indian social values and should be banned.

The Mumbai Card Manufacturers` and Dealers` Association will bring out special cards and gifts for ``Prem Din Utsav`` or the Festival of Love from February 10-16.

The association plans to place newspaper advertisements urging people to celebrate the new festival by exchanging good wishes, sweets and gifts.

``The cards will express traditional Indian family bondings,`` Hemant Parikh, secretary of the association, said. ``We feel love could be expressed between family members not necessarily among couples.``

Bal Thackeray, firebrand leader of the ultra nationalist Shiv Sena, has called for a ban of the February 14 Valentine`s Day celebrations.

``We call it cultural corruption. Our party opposes Valentine`s Day,`` Subhash Desai, a senior party leader, told Reuters.

Last February, hardline Hindus from the Shiv Sena, Bajrang Dal and Vishwa Hindu Parishad invaded gift shops, burned cards and disrupted lover`s day festivities in many parts of India.

``The disruption caused a substantial loss to our business,`` Kalyanji Chheda, vice-president of the association, which has over 500 members, told Reuters. ``We decided to change the name because we don`t want to hurt anybody.``

Despite the call for a ban, in the cosmopolitan city of Mumbai some shops windows were decorated with heart-shaped red balloons, Valentine`s Day cards, gifts and paper roses.

Harimau,

Your statement shows that you are a reflection of what your nation feeds you. First Pakistan is not Palestine, Musharraf is not Arafat and taking an issue with the seriousness it deserves can make a difference to the man on the street. Don`t be a slave to whatever the media rubs in your face.

Aisha.

sarwari #8

[begin quote]

The programme was arranged by Los Angeles World Affairs Council the other day and was co-sponsored by Council of Pakistan American Affairs (COPAA).

[end quote]

Indeed, these are very neutral sponsors. Why not also have a discussion also sponsored by the JeM and the LeT? I am sure they would come up with excellent suggestions.

[begin quote]

Wolpert, who is an author of over 20 books

...

on

Pakistan could not have a better leader than Musharraf.

``If he (Musharraf) is removed, Pakistan could either go back to the kind of narrowness of rule that it had before or it could become more militant in defying India, since there are a number of generals, who have been removed by President Musharraf, who are still waiting in the wings and would like very much to take a more vigorous action,`` Wolpert told an audience at the prestigious Beverly Hills Hotel, consisting of professors, researchers, politicians and students.

[end quote]

Pure nonsense and pure pandering. Musharraf is yet another pakistani dictator who has changed his tune for the west at gunpoint. Maybe if he behaves himself (remember Kargil! remember the coup against Nawaz Sharif! remember the ludicrous claim at Agra about ``freedom fighters`` vs Jihadis) in a couple of years the indians might take him seriously. Let him be replaced by another dictator. Wolpert might be unhappy but no indian should care.

[begin quote]

. The Indians, however, like to say there is no Kashmir problem, which they do for their own consumption

[end quote]

Thats right.