The Panel of Vendettas at UC Berkley

``You are a passionate Paki but you will marry an Indian``

Wah bhai Khawab suhanay...! Indians do wish that would happen don`t they? Like Aisha said her mother was Kenyan, so her father didn`t marry an Indian.

As for Aisha ... let us quote from her own post:

`I would rather marry a Pakistani Hindu than marry an Indian Muslim`.

So becharay YLH ki fiqar naa karo.

Getting back to the original point of this article (what happens to us here on CHOWK?), I think that Sumit Ganguly should be taken seriously in spite of his public posturing.
It would be a mistake for Pakistanis to overlook his agenda.

Ras

Re; Sarwari #165

Ok now I get it. Your father was a passionate Pakistani but he married an Indian ... You are a passionate Paki but you will marry an Indian.. But YLH ka kya hoga ? bechara

To put the matter to rest. My nana and nani moved from Kokan when hey were 16 and 12 to Kenya. All their grandkids call themselves Indians essentailly because they have no identity and wear arab attire to a cricket match. In any event My siblings and I don`t because fortunately our father was a passionate Pakistani.

I haven`t been in Pakistan more than 2 years. Goes to show I will be Pakistani if when where I want to. And I am one. There should be no question about any Indianess in me. Its something I have surgically removed in a clean slate for various practical reasons.

Aisha

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Shah,

`Aisha is indian muslim by origin ...she is fromwestern Ghats of India .`

Oh so now you have taken it upon yourself to assume that. Boy you`ve done it now...

I wonder if say Aisha`s mom was from the Western Ghats of India, how does that make her (Aisha) an Indian Muslim?

suxena #159, ``if he doesn`t learn to look in the mirror and accept reality now, he will have a lot of problems when he grows up...``

that explains why you look into the mirror all the time. and you have to replace them quite frequently too.

``go back to watching levar burton and don`t bother me...``

awwwwwww, you remembered....do you usually remember and research my posts ;) i`m humbled.

re: spout

{relax, don`t bug yasser ok...bacha hai}

bacha hai tau seekhne do...uski bhalai ke liye hai...if he doesn`t learn to look in the mirror and accept reality now, he will have a lot of problems when he grows up...speaking of which, go back to watching levar burton and don`t bother me...

This board i s like Lou Reed song, Iam thinking.

OK, tata everybody!

Taking wal k on wildsi de.

(do do do dododo do do do dodododo dooooooooo!)

a society which has bred fundamentalism for the lack thereof democracy --- Pakistan.

a society which has bred fundamentalism exactly because of democracy --- Pakistan.

Chowk Staff #143,

(sigh) alright, i believe you

Raveena #146,

relax, don`t bug yasser ok...bacha hai

Lately we have become accustomed to hearing from the Indians that they are ``angry``, ``frustrated``, ``dismayed`` - perhaps now more Indians are coming to the conclusion that India needs to pursue polices with regard to Pakistan that are realistic and offer hope:- From ``The Hindu`` - an editorial calling for reason:

``Cold-shouldering peace

THE PREDICTABLY NEGATIVE response of the Vajpayee administration to the latest peace overture by the Pakistan President, Pervez Musharraf, suggests an absence of creativity in its diplomatic thinking. New Delhi`s stony attitude is bad enough, surely, as a baffling sign of inept public diplomacy. Much worse, in fact, is official India`s unwise inflexibility as policy towards Pakistan. Now, Gen. Musharraf`s new initiative is undeniably a question of subtle timing rather than anything intrinsically innovative. Yet, the truth is that there can be no forward movement towards the normalisation of India-Pakistan relations without a de-escalation of the present warlike tensions on the bilateral front. It is this aspect that Gen. Musharraf has deftly invoked while inaugurating a South Asian conference of Information Ministers in Islamabad on Thursday. At a basic level, New Delhi seems angry that he should have utilised a forum of the seven-nation South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation to articulate a formula to ease the escalating estrangement between India and Pakistan. In taking a dim view of this development, New Delhi is allowing itself to be guided by a blinkered vision of the technicality that the SAARC Charter prohibits any discussion of contentious bilateral issues. Lost sight of in the process is the substance of Gen. Musharraf`s offer.

Given the abnormally high tensions along the India-Pakistan frontier since the savage terrorist attack on Parliament House in New Delhi on December 13, Gen. Musharraf appears to have outlined his proposals in a noticeably non-provocative style. One of his suggestions, aimed at reviving the languishing people-to-people contacts on the margins at least of the bilateral front, relates to Pakistan`s stated readiness to restore air links between the two countries on a quick and reciprocal basis. In a sense, it is quite natural that the Pakistan President should have called for the restoration of flight paths whose absence had forced the SAARC Ministers, including India`s Sushma Swaraj, to take time-consuming alternative routes to reach Islamabad. The air transportation links in question were suspended in tit-for-tat decisions in the context of the terrorist strike on India`s Parliament House.

New Delhi has often found itself dismayed over what it tends to regard as Gen. Musharraf`s penchant for designer diplomacy. But the Vajpayee administration should know that the gravity of the current India-Pakistan standoff brooks no complacency on any count, real or imaginary. Anchored to the unexceptionable idea of a cohesive SAARC is Gen. Musharraf`s call for reciprocal withdrawals of troops from strike-threatening forward locations along the India-Pakistan border. In his reckoning, ``both sides have the potential to indulge in adventurism``. While this underscores the need for a military de-escalation by the two countries, he thinks that the pullback itself can be accomplished only through ``mutual understanding``. New Delhi`s response is a waffle in the form of Ms. Swaraj`s flat insistence that the ground situation remains unchanged. Within the past several weeks, the Vajpayee administration has consistently cold-shouldered all well-meaning calls from within India itself for a military de-escalation. Although New Delhi deployed military forces within striking distance of Pakistan in the wake of the outrage on December 13, several factors emphasise the need for an Indian pullback that might lead to a matching demobilisation by Pakistan. It is heartless to play a chess-game of ``coercive diplomacy`` by keeping troops in battle-readiness for long. A complete stoppage of cross-border terrorism from Pakistan — a stated objective of India`s military deployment — is a qualitative index that will take considerable time to measure. The way forward is to de-escalate and re-engage Pakistan, given Gen. Musharraf`s reported willingness to respond. His strategic moves are being watched by the international community, and this is a factor that New Delhi should not ignore.``

Sarwari #144

Here is a Sikh account of the events of 1947 in Punjab. It may help expand your understanding of the cost in human suffering for the creation of Pakistan. Apart from human suffering, the price for Pakistan has also been trust - between Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs - the current relationships between Hindus and the Muslim Minority in India seem to be, even now, directly impacted by the creation of Pakistan and the traumas of Partition. This is a book I would never ask any Indian to read - for fear that the muslims that two generations ago chose to put their faith in India would be unfairly held accountable for Pakistans crimes. But Sarwari, you might benefit from a different version of history than what you have been taught.

This is a link to the online text of a book called

``Muslim League Attack on Sikhs and Hindus in the Punjab 1947``.

It was compiled in 1947 by Sardar Gurbachan Singh Talib, Principal of the Lyallpur Khalsa College, Jullundur, and published in 1950 by the Shiromani Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee (SGPC).

http://www.bharatvani.org/books/mla/

Note : I am not a fan of Ram Swaroop or Bharatvani books but this book is an exception.

This is the original preface written in 1947 by Sardar Gurbachan Singh Talib. For the entire text, visit the link above.

PREFACE

This book is intended to reveal the grim and tragic story of the uprooting of more than seven million Hindus and Sikhs from their homes in West Punjab, in the North-Western Frontier Province, in Sind and in raider-occupied Kashmir. The outlines of this story are well-known all over the world, and have formed the subject of debate before the representatives of the major portion of mankind, assembled in the United Nations. This biggest mass migration of humanity in history under extreme duress has received the attention and active sympathy due to it from the rest of India, and the world is keenly aware of the existence of this large portion of uprooted humanity.

What, however, is not very well-known or fully borne in mind is the fact that this tragic migration was the last culminating episode in a conspiracy that had been under planning for more than a decade before it actually occurred-the conspiracy of the Muslim League in India to establish a Muslim State which should not be encumbered with any such non-Muslim populations- as, would be a likely factor in diluting to any extent its purely Muslim character.1 This conspiracy needs being unmasked by recalling the history of the Indian Muslim League over the period in which its inception and maturing occurred-so that responsibility for this tragedy is fixed where it properly belongs.

Muslim League propaganda has sought to blame the Punjab happenings of 1947 on the Sikhs and in a secondary degree on the Hindus. A distorted and fragmentary picture, drawn up with completely bare-faced lying, has been presented to the world of a Sikh “Plan”2 to attack and drive out Muslims from the Punjab. And for a time a part of the world swallowed the lie, and the Sikhs got an unenviable reputation. But the pendulum of opinion slowly swung round in the right direction, and the Sikh name now has been fairly cleared of the supposed crime of a “Plan” against Muslims. That the Sikh (and Hindu) attack on the Muslims in East Punjab was retaliation under terrible and unbearable provocation is now admitted to be a fact by all impartial people; though it is not known everywhere of what horrible nature, of what prolonged duration and diabolical character was the provocation offered to Sikhs by Muslims over a period of several agonizing months-beginning from December, 1946. There was a war unleashed by the Muslim population of the Punjab to cow down Sikhs, and as a means to that, to carry on among them a total campaign of murder, arson, loot and abduction of women. Sikhs passed through the experience of this war as a people for months; and not thousands, but millions of them were forced to quit their homes for safety in the process. Without a clear knowledge of this part of the story a just and balanced view of the situation cannot be formed.

The details of atrocities committed on Sikhs and Hindus given in these paces are not full or even a fairly large proportion of what actually befell. They are only representative episodes of what happened in a few villages and towns all over West Punjab and other West Pakistan areas. Imagine such things happening in thousands upon thousands of villages and hundreds of towns, and you will then be able to take in the proportions somewhat close to what the reality was-which, in the last analysis must, however, remain inexpressible in its full horror. The facts drawn upon are statements of sufferers of these horrors, recorded from complaints made to the authorities, from reliable press reports and from statements recorded with scrupulous fidelity and signed by those who made them, in the refugee camps in East Punjab.

Sikhs left behind their homes, the richest land in the Punjab, their factories and prosperous businesses, their holy shrines, schools and colleges-all under the pressure of the Pakistan terror, so that according to unbiassed estimates 40% (and these perhaps the most enterprising section of the community) were rendered refugees. They came out of their homes-hammed, despoiled and in unending trudging caravans. This vast human tragedy is too large even for the imagination to take in without the help of facts presented in a telling way.

This record is intended in the first place to rehabilitate the Sikh name, maligned by false propaganda of the leaders and press of Pakistan, and secondly to serve as part of the material for anyone who should set out to write a full history of the Punjab of these terrible 1947 months.

COMPILER

Ms. Sarwari:

This is just FYI, not meant to rub anything in the face of Pakistanis.

[From hinduonnet:

Gang-rape accused get jail term doubled, on appeal

By Our Staff Reporter

CHENNAI March 7. The sentence awarded to six of the 10 persons, charged with gang-raping a teenaged girl at Tuticorin in 1990, has been enhanced from five-year rigorous imprisonment to 10 years by Justice M. Karpagavinayagam of the Madras High Court. It was the accused who had come on appeal against a lower court verdict.

``It is an irony that while we are celebrating women`s rights in all spheres, we show little or no concern for their honour. A rapist not only violates a victim`s privacy and personal integrity but also causes serious psychological and physical harm in the process,`` the judge observed.

The case relates to the rape of Kalaiselvi (19) by 10 persons when she was returning home from the Esakkiamman temple festival at Tuticorin on April 13, 1990. The assistant sessions court found all of them guilty and awarded each of them five-year RI on July 2, 1999. The sentence was confirmed by the principal sessions court of Tuticorin on December 9, 1999.

When six of the accused moved the High Court, Justice R. Balasubramanian issued suo motu notices to all petitioners asking why the sentence should not be enhanced to 10 years, minimum award for those found guilty of charges punishable under Section 376(g) of the IPC. On receiving the notice, the petitioners offered to withdraw the appeals but the plea was disallowed.

When the appeals and the suo motu notice proceedings came before him, Mr. Justice Karpagavinayagam, said, ``the offences under Sections 366 and 376(2)(g) are clearly made out. Consequently, the conviction is liable to be confirmed, and accordingly confirmed``.

Rejecting the lower court reasoning for awarding the accused only five-year RI, the judge said the point that the offenders were youngsters could not be concluded as an adequate or special reason.

``The facts of the case are such that they would not permit this court to show any sympathy to the accused.

Hence the petitioners are liable to be sentenced for 10 years, and pay a fine of Rs. 1,000; in default they would undergo a sentence of one-year RI``.]

Perhaps the Pakistani judges could cite judgments of various Indian High Courts and Supreme Courts as precedents in awarding appropriate punishment to rapists and ignore the Hudood ordinances. After all, the Criminal Procedure Code of Pakistan is derived from the CrPC of India and I am sure that pre-1947 judgments are used in Pakistan as precedents. Why not use post-1947 judgments as well particularly to protect the honor of Pakistani women?

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Chowk editors,

It appears that you read posts only on this board. I am reproducing two posts from your ``featured item`` board, would you care to read them