Whose Iqbal — Ours or Theirs?

The reality is that Iqbal does not belong to any particular nation. Its because his message is truth and truth is no one`s property. He belongs to the ages. However, Pakistan, being an embodiment of his vision, has every right to claim him as her representative.

semipreciousme,

...i e-mailed you my two cents on the post below...got tired of scrolling around all over :)...

rsaxena:

“ssshhh....not so loudly..didn`t you know, even indians were involved... :)”

….as the estimable hamidm would say….it’s all the horrible hindoos’ fault…:)

“...yeah, that was a weak example, but the middle east stuff was right on... ...actually the article kept mixing the issues of the reach of the media and globalization”

….globalization aside, when you get pummeled with images of people and children being killed, houses being destroyed day after day after day, it’s bound to play on your psyche….

“...but then again, who am i to criticize NY Times writing...”

…lol…btw, did you did read the article i mentioned?…what’d you think?…

“...i wonder about these people sometimes...are they just too stupid to see what they are doing?...do they really believe their own nonsense?...or do they derive some perverse pleasure from the misery they propogate?...what motivates them as individuals?...are they all just hungry for power?...”

….yes, yes, yes, ‘divine’ inspiration and yes….

“...wanna make a bet?... :)”

…tsk, tsk…you’re not dissing women power, now are you?…:)

“...i guess the answer is clear...that`s evil...(but i agree)...”

…actually, she’s gotten much better over the years…i remember when clinton first got elected, there were so many cruel jokes about her doing the rounds…and looks aside, she’s one up on intelligence as compared to bumbling bush’s offspring….

“...so usually what is there to discuss that can`t wait till later?... :)”

…sigh…you wouldn’t understand even if i tried…like never shopping alone, it’s a girl thing…

“perhaps if i show up on a motorcycle, clad in purple, and pull off some bollywood movie stunts (fly over cars, jump from rooftop to rooftop, etc.), she might be compelled to reconsider? :)”

….actually, you might be on to something with that motorcycle thing…ali owns a bona fide harley davidson…

“...so you do dig over the top desi movies?...come on, just fess up...lol...”

…..who wouldn’t dig women kicking men’s butt (in heel no less), waking up with flawlessly applied makeup and salon perfect hair and owning delicious looking jewels and a wardrobe that would put zsa zsa gabor to shame?…:)…but honestly, this is the third pakistani movie i’ve watched….my bravery extends only so far:)….

“never know...some girls think pillsbury doughboy is cute... :)”

….yeah, that hat’s a real turn on…:)

“and now my fav baseball player - Mets catcher Mike Piazza - seems to be experimenting with the rainbow of hair colors...lol...”

….what, is he trying to give dennis rodman some competition?…

“and what`s with jordan`s mr. clean (you know, the bald cleaning man with funny earring) look? ;)...”

….i’ll have you know he looks tres hot….and it’s helluva better than the rainbow-colored hair-enough-holes-in-your-body-to-serve-as-a-spaghetti-strainer look…

…..my em’s ahaque2000@hotmail.com….

semipreciousme,

{…..you mean 9/11 wasn’t a jewish conspiracy?!?…:)}

ssshhh....not so loudly..didn`t you know, even indians were involved... :)

{{i read that article in the nytimes…it was good but i don’t agree that the war in sierra leone can be in some way blamed on globalization….when ppl are disenfranchised to such an extent, it doesn’t take long for them to pick up a gun and join the rest… }}

...yeah, that was a weak example, but the middle east stuff was right on...actually the article kept mixing the issues of the reach of the media and globalization...the latter is so much more than media coverage...i think the two should be treated separately...but then again, who am i to criticize NY Times writing...

{….i totatlly agree…what pisses me off so much about fundos like omar sheikh and co is that they think by killing/kidnapping jews/americans/whatever, all the problems of the muslim world are going to be solved…they’re the ones screaming bloody murder and urging all these illiterate people to go fight jihad when they won’t do as much as to lift their fat a sses off their plush sofas….how many of these fundos have actually gone to kashmir/palestine/chechnya and ACTUALLY educated/helped/fed the muslims there?}

...i wonder about these people sometimes...are they just too stupid to see what they are doing?...do they really believe their own nonsense?...or do they derive some perverse pleasure from the misery they propogate?...what motivates them as individuals?...are they all just hungry for power?...

{….it pisses me off to no end and i could also rant on and on but then i’d bore you:)…..}

nah, rant on... :)

{{….lol…so asking a guy if he’s a shaved taliban is a new pickup line?…must try it sometime:)…}}

..lol..no no...you had to be there to understand...between her silly grin and way too much unnecessary conversation while the queue grew longer and longer, my colleague just wondered...now if she was attractive, i might have felt flattered...but no such luck :)...

{….hmm…i don’t know…i seriously think if hillary decided to run in 2004 she’d have a chance….}

....wanna make a bet?... :)

{{“...are you implying chelsea looks like an elephant?...lol”

…..lol….no comment….:)}}

...i guess the answer is clear...that`s evil...(but i agree)...

{{….haven’t you ever been out with a bunch of women at a restaurant or smt and notice that if one decides to go to the bathroom, a couple always go along with her?…. and it’s not even to use the bathroom…more like a gossip-fix-hair-clothes-makeup session……..it pisses of my guy friends to no end and is the butt end of many jokes….}}

...hmm...i dunno...perhaps they`ve done it, and i`ve never really noticed it and naively just assumed they all had to regulate at the same time...lol...so usually what is there to discuss that can`t wait till later?... :)

{…actually, i think she’s really attractive….but like i said her and ali azmat are more or less married so you’re outta luck there….}

...forget ali shali, but her? :( ...lol... how much time till the actual marriage?...perhaps if i show up on a motorcycle, clad in purple, and pull off some bollywood movie stunts (fly over cars, jump from rooftop to rooftop, etc.), she might be compelled to reconsider? :)

{...the one undergoing the myriad dress changes was zara sheikh and the one riding ski boats and kicking butt was meera….yeah, it was a pretty hectic 3 hours:)….}

...so you do dig over the top desi movies?...come on, just fess up...lol...

{….as much as they dig guys in all white…:)}

never know...some girls think pillsbury doughboy is cute... :)

{…lol…yeah, between their rainbow colored suits and tons of chunky gold jewelery, you really do being to wonder where all those millions are going….wait….now that i think about it, i vaguely remember seeing the air god in a red suit or smt….no way!…it couldn’t be…..}

...and now my fav baseball player - Mets catcher Mike Piazza - seems to be experimenting with the rainbow of hair colors...lol...(i shouldn`t make fun of him after some stupid Malaysian barber with poor English managed to accidently put a streak in mine)... i think these dudes get sick of wearing their uniforms, and so when they don`t have to, they express their individuality through gaudy clothes...and what`s with jordan`s mr. clean (you know, the bald cleaning man with funny earring) look? ;)...

btw, what`s your e-mail address?

rsaxena:

“...but that doesn`t mean i see sinister designs and conspiracies in the whole thing...”

…..you mean 9/11 wasn’t a jewish conspiracy?!?…:)

….here’s an articles that captures exactly what I’m trying to say…really good read:

http://argument.independent.co.uk/commentators/story.jsp?story=285777

…

i read that article in the nytimes…it was good but i don’t agree that the war in sierra leone can be in some way blamed on globalization….when ppl are disenfranchised to such an extent, it doesn’t take long for them to pick up a gun and join the rest…

“we have so many illiterate and poor people, and all these idiots can worry about is religious nonsense and stopping valentine`s day celebrations in bombay...losers...and then our PM becomes an incompetent, indecisive, babbling idiot...”

….i totatlly agree…what pisses me off so much about fundos like omar sheikh and co is that they think by killing/kidnapping jews/americans/whatever, all the problems of the muslim world are going to be solved…they’re the ones screaming bloody murder and urging all these illiterate people to go fight jihad when they won’t do as much as to lift their fat a sses off their plush sofas….how many of these fundos have actually gone to kashmir/palestine/chechnya and ACTUALLY educated/helped/fed the muslims there?….it pisses me off to no end and i could also rant on and on but then i’d bore you:)…..

“...lol...it`s funny you say that...a colleague of mine who witnessed this thought the woman was trying to `chat me up`...yuck... :)”

….lol…so asking a guy if he’s a shaved taliban is a new pickup line?…must try it sometime:)…

“...right on...but i don`t think america is ready for a female pres...it will take many decades before that happens...”

….hmm…i don’t know…i seriously think if hillary decided to run in 2004 she’d have a chance….

“...isn`t it ironic that desis, despite their otherwise horrid treatment of women, have had many female heads of state?...”

….yeah, it seems to amaze ppl to no end…why do you think benazir has such a big fan following in america?….it’s def. NOT her dress sense….

“...are you implying chelsea looks like an elephant?...lol”

…..lol….no comment….:)

“what?!!...who goes to the bathroom as a posse?...weird :)...”

….haven’t you ever been out with a bunch of women at a restaurant or smt and notice that if one decides to go to the bathroom, a couple always go along with her?…. and it’s not even to use the bathroom…more like a gossip-fix-hair-clothes-makeup session……..it pisses of my guy friends to no end and is the butt end of many jokes….

“...umm, but i`d be willing to trade both of them for that vaneeza ahmed woman you all have...interested? :)...i know she`s not considered anything great in pakistan, but WOW :)....”

…actually, i think she’s really attractive….but like i said her and ali azmat are more or less married so you’re outta luck there….

“umm, what`s a paindu? :)...(“

….that’s the american equivalent of a hick…

“...what`s the heroine`s name?...”

...the one undergoing the myriad dress changes was zara sheikh and the one riding ski boats and kicking butt was meera….yeah, it was a pretty hectic 3 hours:)….

“...i mean do desi girls secretly dig zebra-patterned turbans and purple suits? :)...”

….as much as they dig guys in all white…:)

“...and why do injured NBA players have the same purple suits when they are on the sidelines?...i mean with their millions, can`t they find a decent suit somewhere?...”

…lol…yeah, between their rainbow colored suits and tons of chunky gold jewelery, you really do being to wonder where all those millions are going….wait….now that i think about it, i vaguely remember seeing the air god in a red suit or smt….no way!…it couldn’t be…..

semipreciousme,

{{…..gasp!…don’t tell me you’ve bought into that pakistan/islamist inspired myth…:)}}

...oh dear, i better get myself checked out :)...no no...it is the truth...jews run Wall St...jews run the media...they are wealthy, but also active politically...but that doesn`t mean i see sinister designs and conspiracies in the whole thing...

{….neither would most gujrati muslims…i watched an interview of that guy somewhere and it was scary…not much difference b/w him and ppl like fazl-ur-rehman…it’s funny how these hindu/muslim/christian/jewish fundos hate each other but don’t realize how sadly alike they are….}

...i think all sane indians find him disgusting...gujarati muslim or not...in india, until now, the hindu fundos were largely a civil nuisance, nothing more...other than their ayodhya stunt, no one really cared what they did...but gujarat was nasty, and i fear for the country...we have so many illiterate and poor people, and all these idiots can worry about is religious nonsense and stopping valentine`s day celebrations in bombay...losers...and then our PM becomes an incompetent, indecisive, babbling idiot...uhhh, i`ll stop now before i bore you :)...

“...(i hope that is the reason and not that i really look like a shaved taliban!)......this immigration woman demanded to know why i had an indian passport...lol…how do you answer that”

{.should’ve told her you were and asked is she was interested in becoming wife # 4…:)}

...lol...it`s funny you say that...a colleague of mine who witnessed this thought the woman was trying to `chat me up`...yuck... :)

{{….one woman i really admire….i mean can you imagine going through what she did after the whole lewinsky fiasco?….i have all bets on her becoming the first female pres….and she’d do a HECK of a better job than that unholy alliance of bush, fundos and co who prob. think laissez-faire is some is some place to be bombed in afghanistan…}}

...right on...but i don`t think america is ready for a female pres...it will take many decades before that happens...isn`t it ironic that desis, despite their otherwise horrid treatment of women, have had many female heads of state?...

{{….just goes to show….put an elephant on a pedestal and it’d have desis following it in droves…:)}}

...are you implying chelsea looks like an elephant?...lol

{….i guess shopping in droves is a girl thing….kinda like going to the bathroom as a posse…:) }

what?!!...who goes to the bathroom as a posse?...weird :)...

{…yeah, i’ve seen both…and yes, nice eye candy both of them…too bad you can’t say that for most of the male actors in b-wood….}

...umm, but i`d be willing to trade both of them for that vaneeza ahmed woman you all have...interested? :)...i know she`s not considered anything great in pakistan, but WOW :)....yeah too bad about b-wood actors...i have no problems admitting if some guys are eye-candy, but surely none of the b-wood losers make the cut...i particularly don`t understand the big shah rukh khan fuss...he`s quite unattractive, and doesn`t have much of a personality...and he`s a shorty (not that there`s anything wrong with being short)...

{…..believe it not, one of the heroines went from being a paindu gaon-ki-larki to wearing miniskirts in the span of ONLY 3 hours….i lost count after seeing her in seven different chooridars….}

umm, what`s a paindu? :)...(i can say i know about pakistan after learning important stuff like this...lol)...what`s the heroine`s name?...

{no, thank god, none of the guys were dressed in purple….although during one song, one of them was wearing all black with a black-n-white turban…..yeah, you heard right….but that said, the cinematography was really nice…crisp editing….and no shrieking/wailing being passed off as singing….infact, very much like a b-wood film…:) }

...i always wonder, exactly whom are these films targetting with their funky outfits for men?...i mean do desi girls secretly dig zebra-patterned turbans and purple suits? :)...why else would the directors put them in there...am i missing something here? :)...and why do injured NBA players have the same purple suits when they are on the sidelines?...i mean with their millions, can`t they find a decent suit somewhere?...

rsaxena:

“...just reaffirms the power of the jewish-american lobby...”

…..gasp!…don’t tell me you’ve bought into that pakistan/islamist inspired myth…:)

“...(i wouldn`t shed a tear if someone assassinates that guy..really!)...”

….neither would most gujrati muslims…i watched an interview of that guy somewhere and it was scary…not much difference b/w him and ppl like fazl-ur-rehman…it’s funny how these hindu/muslim/christian/jewish fundos hate each other but don’t realize how sadly alike they are….

“...(i hope that is the reason and not that i really look like a shaved taliban!)......this immigration woman demanded to know why i had an indian passport...lol…how do you answer that”

….should’ve told her you were and asked is she was interested in becoming wife # 4…:)

“...true :)...actually, hillary`s quite the mover-n-shaker in new york these days...i attended some gathering where they both showed up, and she had a bigger crowd around her!...i went and joined the crowd around bill lest he felt lonely :)”

….one woman i really admire….i mean can you imagine going through what she did after the whole lewinsky fiasco?….i have all bets on her becoming the first female pres….and she’d do a HECK of a better job than that unholy alliance of bush, fundos and co who prob. think laissez-faire is some is some place to be bombed in afghanistan…

“...and chelsea was/is dating some indian dude at stanford - apparently the maharaja of jodhpur`s son or something - and so she`s got a fan following in india it seems...hilarious...”

….just goes to show….put an elephant on a pedestal and it’d have desis following it in droves…:)

“...but making shopping a social event is what makes it painful :)...lol...i went shopping with my sister all of once, and swore to never, ever do that again...then i made the mistake of letting a colleague convince me to go with her during lunch...never again :)...”

….i guess shopping in droves is a girl thing….kinda like going to the bathroom as a posse…:)

“...like aishwariya rai? :)...(actually, i think sonali bendre is better eye-candy...seen her?)...”

…yeah, i’ve seen both…and yes, nice eye candy both of them…too bad you can’t say that for most of the male actors in b-wood….

“good luck :)...what`a pakistani filum (filum!) like?...do they do 5 songs with 5 dress-changes, including dudes in purple suits, too?...”

…..believe it not, one of the heroines went from being a paindu gaon-ki-larki to wearing miniskirts in the span of ONLY 3 hours….i lost count after seeing her in seven different chooridars….no, thank god, none of the guys were dressed in purple….although during one song, one of them was wearing all black with a black-n-white turban…..yeah, you heard right….but that said, the cinematography was really nice…crisp editing….and no shrieking/wailing being passed off as singing….infact, very much like a b-wood film…:)

sempreciousme,

wow, check this out :)

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semipreciousme,

{{…..i don’t think anybody’s decrying them from being cold-blooded…far from it…infact, i think there’s a growing number of americans, esp. after 9/11, who realize that they just can’t stay insular anymore…but how long that goes towards actually changing the biases in the mainstream media is anybody’s guess….it’s not that some of the media isn’t trying…..i was just watching on cnn on what these journalists, from papers like usa today, wash. post, la times, went through after writing articles that were perceived to be ‘pro-palestinian’…..one received 30,000 (yeah, that’s 30,000) emails mostly all from jewish-americans, complaining about his point of view, calling him a terrorist and even sending death threats….the one from the wash. post had both of his cars fire bombed…one even had a funeral wreath sent to him….scary stuff… }}

...just reaffirms the power of the jewish-american lobby...

{{…..i’ll def. read up on it….but if they’re talking about the arab media, well, that’s pretty much hopeless….}}

...it talks about the media in general...how it was supposed to drive globalization and unite us more...yet it often seems to do the opposite...here`s the link to it:

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/21/magazine/21WWLN.html

{{…tough questions is right…but in the long run, reporting the truth is what it’s all about…for eg..the recent gujrat riots….the media did an excellent job with their and those horrific pictures, imho, stopped the riots from spreading beyond ahmadabad….}}

...well, i must say i just read details of the the riots (on www.tehelka.com) and it made me sick to my stomach...i can see how it might compel certain types of people to more violence...also, from what i read, the riots did not spread because govts in other states took effective preemptive measures...the nazi butcher chief minister of gujarat did nothing...(i wouldn`t shed a tear if someone assassinates that guy..really!)...

{{...let me guess…your turban gave you away?….:)}}

lol...no no...no turbans here :)...it`s just that since the only indians most malaysians have ever seen are south indian, northies like me confuse them...(i hope that is the reason and not that i really look like a shaved taliban!)...this immigration woman demanded to know why i had an indian passport...lol...how do you answer that?...i was speechless...

{{“(bill)?...”

….is there another kind? :)}}

...true :)...actually, hillary`s quite the mover-n-shaker in new york these days...i attended some gathering where they both showed up, and she had a bigger crowd around her!...i went and joined the crowd around bill lest he felt lonely :)...and chelsea was/is dating some indian dude at stanford - apparently the maharaja of jodhpur`s son or something - and so she`s got a fan following in india it seems...hilarious...

{{….well, much more likable than that bumbling idiot, bush….although, i ACTUALLY believed him when he denied ever having “sex with that ms.lewinsky woman”….stupid me…his stature never was the same for me after that…}}

...i`ve struggled with that one...on the one hand, i only care about how he ran the country and not his personal life...to be fallible is only human...but then i guess it isn`t becoming of a president to lie about it the way he did....also, i have a confession: i have this huge weakness of becoming enamored with Yale Law School-types, which is what bill and hillary are :) ...

{{…trust me….big hair and big pants notwithstanding, i would’ve known MUCH better than to dress in ALL white….:)}}

...ok, i`ll accept that you`d know better than that :)...but you would`ve been awfully tempted before your good judgement finally prevailed...lol...

{{….shopping alone is no fun…but i, for the life of me, can’t shop with my mom….too diametrically opposing tastes….}}

...but making shopping a social event is what makes it painful :)...lol...i went shopping with my sister all of once, and swore to never, ever do that again...then i made the mistake of letting a colleague convince me to go with her during lunch...never again :)...

{…..pure eye candy and little else….}

...like aishwariya rai? :)...(actually, i think sonali bendre is better eye-candy...seen her?)...

{{…honestly, no….only when a really good movie comes around….although, that said, i’m going today to watch this new pakistani film that’s been much hyped about…wish me luck…:)}}

good luck :)...what`a pakistani filum (filum!) like?...do they do 5 songs with 5 dress-changes, including dudes in purple suits, too?...

rsaxena:

“well, i think the more important question then becomes why do american people not want to hear the palesteninian point of view...surely they cannot all be cold-blooded and biased...and surely they have access to the same information through the Internet that you and I do...”

…..i don’t think anybody’s decrying them from being cold-blooded…far from it…infact, i think there’s a growing number of americans, esp. after 9/11, who realize that they just can’t stay insular anymore…but how long that goes towards actually changing the biases in the mainstream media is anybody’s guess….it’s not that some of the media isn’t trying…..i was just watching on cnn on what these journalists, from papers like usa today, wash. post, la times, went through after writing articles that were perceived to be ‘pro-palestinian’…..one received 30,000 (yeah, that’s 30,000) emails mostly all from jewish-americans, complaining about his point of view, calling him a terrorist and even sending death threats….the one from the wash. post had both of his cars fire bombed…one even had a funeral wreath sent to him….scary stuff…

“...having said that, i must confess that i`ve changed my stance on the responsibility of the media...largely because of an article that will appear in this Sunday`s Times Magazine...it talks about how satellite TV has made the divides in the Middle East even greater...”

…..i’ll def. read up on it….but if they’re talking about the arab media, well, that’s pretty much hopeless….

“...how images from TV can provoke hatred in people far away, even if the images are real...i guess journalists do have a responsibility, but it is a complicated task...does it make sense to show riots in one place to people in another if it can provoke even more riots?...but then isn`t journalism supposed simply about reporting the truth?...tough questions...”

…tough questions is right…but in the long run, reporting the truth is what it’s all about…for eg..the recent gujrat riots….the media did an excellent job with their and those horrific pictures, imho, stopped the riots from spreading beyond ahmadabad….

“...i guess better than being accused of being a `shaved taliban` by some malaysian immigration woman the other day...lol...”

...let me guess…your turban gave you away?….:)

“(bill)?...”

….is there another kind? :)….well, much more likable than that bumbling idiot, bush….although, i ACTUALLY believed him when he denied ever having “sex with that ms.lewinsky woman”….stupid me…his stature never was the same for me after that…

“...bad enough...it sometimes frightens me that if countries like the US can`t keep people like that out of positions of power, what chance do we desis have, coming from a culture of corruption and dirty politics...”

…tell me about it….what with asscroft, pickering, abhorrence with anything genetic, stopping desperately needed health aid….you really wonder where this administration’s going…..

“..no no...if you were around, you would`ve donned the bell bottoms and big hair just the same :)...lol...you wouldn`t have known any better...”

…trust me….big hair and big pants notwithstanding, i would’ve known MUCH better than to dress in ALL white….:)

“people should shop alone...i find shopping for myself fun, even if it takes a bit of time...it`s just irritating being dragged around by someone else :)...”

….shopping alone is no fun…but i, for the life of me, can’t shop with my mom….too diametrically opposing tastes….

“...silly asians...that stuff is horrible...lol..it really is...”

…..pure eye candy and little else….

“...do you really watch that stuff?...”

…honestly, no….only when a really good movie comes around….although, that said, i’m going today to watch this new pakistani film that’s been much hyped about…wish me luck…:)

re: semipreciousme

{{….so just because their readers don’t want to hear about the palestinian point of view, they shouldn’t bother tackling it fairly?….}}

well, i think the more important question then becomes why do american people not want to hear the palesteninian point of view...surely they cannot all be cold-blooded and biased...and surely they have access to the same information through the Internet that you and I do...

...having said that, i must confess that i`ve changed my stance on the responsibility of the media...largely because of an article that will appear in this Sunday`s Times Magazine...it talks about how satellite TV has made the divides in the Middle East even greater...how images from TV can provoke hatred in people far away, even if the images are real...i guess journalists do have a responsibility, but it is a complicated task...does it make sense to show riots in one place to people in another if it can provoke even more riots?...but then isn`t journalism supposed simply about reporting the truth?...tough questions...

{{….sheesh…ain’t that the truth….insular to the point of absurdity….i still remember a friend asking me whether there were any houses in pakistan….houses, for god’s sake!….if only they could check out some of the mansions in defence or smt….}}

i`ve heard my share of `do-you-have-TVs-in-India` type questions...but expectedly, it has improved since i first moved to the US...and it is better in cities than in suburbs and in the heartland...don`t know if you`ve ever experienced this, but in the heartland some people have never seen a desi...some fellow once thought i was an illegal south american laborer...i guess better than being accused of being a `shaved taliban` by some malaysian immigration woman the other day...lol...

{{…yeah, and dan quyale with his p-o-t-a-t-o-e….and correct me if i’m wrong, but when the debates for the 2000 pres. elections were going on, didn’t bush think the taliban were some rock band or smt?….}}

i`m not sure if it was in a debate or some interview, but, yeah, i do remember reading that...hilarious...he has bunch of classic lines...lemme see if i can dig up where i read a compilation of them...

{{…that is a little extreme i admit…everyone’s got their drawbacks, i guess….bush, christain fundos & co aren’t exactly the epitome of sagacity….}}

...no, they surely are not...say, what do you think of clinton (bill)?...

{{…btw, re: asscroft…i did a google….sorry, he wasn’t a regular contributor to the magazine….he gave an interview to it and praised it….}}

...bad enough...it sometimes frightens me that if countries like the US can`t keep people like that out of positions of power, what chance do we desis have, coming from a culture of corruption and dirty politics...

{{…if it was, i’m glad i wasn’t around :)…}}

..no no...if you were around, you would`ve donned the bell bottoms and big hair just the same :)...lol...you wouldn`t have known any better....fashion is so much about trends...and trends are always a function of time...i bet you the modern 24th century man and woman, clad in his/her electronic-skin clothes will mock our fashion sense :)....

{{….lol…i, too, have yet to understand the phenomenon of watching cars go round and round and round and round…..}}

...it really is so silly...i mean toddlers enjoy fast things going round and round...it keeps them entertained because their other senses have yet to develop...but adults??...

{{…..suppose??…i’ll have you know that this is undeniably a feat….imagine going to a shoe store and competing with a dozen well-proportioned aunties with lungs that would put a newborn baby to shame harassing the poor salesmen till they’re literally spinning around in circles….}}

...lol...oh my, now i know why i make sure to never even pass through the women`s shoe section while navigating a department store...i`d probably be risking injury...people should shop alone...i find shopping for myself fun, even if it takes a bit of time...it`s just irritating being dragged around by someone else :)...

{{…actually, indian films are big all over asia from what i hear…if pak. ever let indian movies play in movie theatres, bollywood would be rolling in some mega $$$…..}

...silly asians...that stuff is horrible...lol..it really is...i can`t remember the last time i watched one of those things...do you really watch that stuff?...

rsaxena:

“...absolutely...but if their views consistently reflect biases that their readers vehemently oppose, wouldn`t they eventually suffer their fate and be marginalized?...”

….so just because their readers don’t want to hear about the palestinian point of view, they shouldn’t bother tackling it fairly?….

“...i still seethe over some of their writers` continued portrayal of the subcontinent as little more than some exotic snake charmer land...”

….sheesh…ain’t that the truth….insular to the point of absurdity….i still remember a friend asking me whether there were any houses in pakistan….houses, for god’s sake!….if only they could check out some of the mansions in defence or smt….

“...they`re def not the cerebral bunch...what with bush mumbling through sublimininimimial and all..”

…yeah, and dan quyale with his p-o-t-a-t-o-e….and correct me if i’m wrong, but when the debates for the 2000 pres. elections were going on, didn’t bush think the taliban were some rock band or smt?….

“...he basically wanted to go after all industries that produced large profits or did anything even remotely harmful to the environment....of course i wouldn`t like a company dumping nuclear waste in our waters, but you have to be reasonable about it...in effect, what he wanted was to shut down every large corporation...or maybe that was just his election platform?...”

…that is a little extreme i admit…everyone’s got their drawbacks, i guess….bush, christain fundos & co aren’t exactly the epitome of sagacity….

…btw, re: asscroft…i did a google….sorry, he wasn’t a regular contributor to the magazine….he gave an interview to it and praised it….here’re some of the links:

{Southern Partisan: ``Setting the Record Straight``

Attorney general nominee praised white supremacist magazine

http://www.fair.org/press-releases/southern-partisan.html}

{Ashcroft and Racism: Breaking the Code

http://www.commondreams.org/views01/0118-09.htm}

{The Triumph of Neoracism:

What John Ashcroft Learned from David Duke

http://www.commondreams.org/views01/0122-04.htm}

“...i know it was tacky, but supposedly isn`t that what the 70s were all about? :) …”

…if it was, i’m glad i wasn’t around :)…

“(disclaimer: personally, i don`t care much for the car thing...i was in malaysia last month when the nascar race happened ...i couldn`t understand what all the fuss was about...go to a crowded place, sit in the hot sun, smell burnt rubber, and watch the drivers have all the fun)...

….lol…i, too, have yet to understand the phenomenon of watching cars go round and round and round and round…..

“half an hour?...it`s comparatively reasonable i suppose :)...”

…..suppose??…i’ll have you know that this is undeniably a feat….imagine going to a shoe store and competing with a dozen well-proportioned aunties with lungs that would put a newborn baby to shame harassing the poor salesmen till they’re literally spinning around in circles….

“btw, re: amitabh bacchan, it seems he has a god-like following in malaysia...i was astounded as some of the people from a meeting i was in quizzed me for details of his personal life (not that i know or care)...they know his songs, movies, everything...i doubt they understand hindi/urdu, but they watch all the movies, and know all the songs....simply amazing...”

…actually, indian films are big all over asia from what i hear…if pak. ever let indian movies play in movie theatres, bollywood would be rolling in some mega $$$…..

semipreciousme

btw, re: amitabh bacchan, it seems he has a god-like following in malaysia...i was astounded as some of the people from a meeting i was in quizzed me for details of his personal life (not that i know or care)...they know his songs, movies, everything...i doubt they understand hindi/urdu, but they watch all the movies, and know all the songs....simply amazing...

semipreciousme,

{{…please….i could rattle off a bunch of periodicals that cover food/culture/fashion just as well…my beef is with their decidedly one-sided coverage sometimes…i mean when they’re one of the most influential/popular newspapers around…doesn’t that come with a caveat for responsible journalism?…}}

...absolutely...but if their views consistently reflect biases that their readers vehemently oppose, wouldn`t they eventually suffer their fate and be marginalized?...not to say that i personally agree with their positions or approach...i still seethe over some of their writers` continued portrayal of the subcontinent as little more than some exotic snake charmer land...but i view the paper less as an establishment and more as a collection of unique individuals....i`m too enamored with 2 of their writers on food & culture/fashion to let go :)...

{{…..you would THINK it’s common sense….but too much to expect from republicans, i guess…..}}

...they`re def not the cerebral bunch...what with bush mumbling through sublimininimimial and all..

{{….i don’t know about his views on the economy, but he makes so much sense when it comes to foreign policy (which the american voters couldn’t give two hoots about), judicial and educational reforms….}}

...his roots are in consumer advocacy...he basically wanted to go after all industries that produced large profits or did anything even remotely harmful to the environment....of course i wouldn`t like a company dumping nuclear waste in our waters, but you have to be reasonable about it...in effect, what he wanted was to shut down every large corporation...or maybe that was just his election platform?...

{{.don’t worry….he’s not getting elected any time soon…he barely got 5% of the votes last time..}}

...true... but it`s good that he adds the diversity of his views to the public debate by running...

{{…don’t get me wrong….he’s a great actor and all…but that’s still NO excuse for looking the pillsbury dough boy….}}

...i know it was tacky, but supposedly isn`t that what the 70s were all about? :) ...

{{…let me re-rephrase that….what’s ALL women’s fascination with precious metals?….it’s an inherent trait….just like men drool over anything that has wheels, women get excited over big rocks….}}

but at least you can drive the car...the rock just sits there :)...(disclaimer: personally, i don`t care much for the car thing...i was in malaysia last month when the nascar race happened ...i couldn`t understand what all the fuss was about...go to a crowded place, sit in the hot sun, smell burnt rubber, and watch the drivers have all the fun)...

{{…80 hours, huh?…and then men have the gall to whine about how long it takes for women to buy a pair of shoes or smt….:)…..(disclaimer:..i have never spent more than half an hour buying a pair of shoes….really…:))}}

lol...i think you misunderstood me...80 hours IS how long some women take to buy stuff...half an hour?...it`s comparatively reasonable i suppose :)...

rsaxena:

“ummm, nevermind my question below about liking the NY Times..lol...but politics aside, it is the very, very good when it comes to food, culture, etc..”

…please….i could rattle off a bunch of periodicals that cover food/culture/fashion just as well…my beef is with their decidedly one-sided coverage sometimes…i mean when they’re one of the most influential/popular newspapers around…doesn’t that come with a caveat for responsible journalism?…

“haha...i knew that was coming :)”

...yeah, that’s one of my sore buttons:)….

“really?..which magazine?..why didn`t the democrats jump all over that..”

…smt i read somewhere….let me do a google and see

if i can dig it up….

“...how stupid to not realize that forcing unwanted child births increase welfare rolls for a variety of obvious reasons...”

…..you would THINK it’s common sense….but too much to expect from republicans, i guess…..

“hmm...that fellow is a bit impractical, isn`t he?...he wanted to take on all industries at once...and force many to completely shutdown...fine, but then he never had a plan for restoring jobs that would be lost as a result”

….i don’t know about his views on the economy, but he makes so much sense when it comes to foreign policy (which the american voters couldn’t give two hoots about), judicial and educational reforms….

“...i worry he`d cause an economic crisis...”

….don’t worry….he’s not getting elected any time soon…he barely got 5% of the votes last time..

“be nice!...i used to watch only amitabh bachan movies when i was young(er) :)...i`ve seen all his bell bottom pants, shirts with big collars, funky sideburns, etc....i dunno...i think he pulled it off considering that it was the 70s”

…don’t get me wrong….he’s a great actor and all…but that’s still NO excuse for looking the pillsbury dough boy….

“ok, let me rephrase..lol..what`s desi women`s fascination with `precious` metals? :)...”

…let me re-rephrase that….what’s ALL women’s fascination with precious metals?….it’s an inherent trait….just like men drool over anything that has wheels, women get excited over big rocks….

“...(only if it doesn`t involve spending 80 hours looking for one article of clothing :)”

…80 hours, huh?…and then men have the gall to whine about how long it takes for women to buy a pair of shoes or smt….:)…..(disclaimer:..i have never spent more than half an hour buying a pair of shoes….really…:))

re: semipreciousme

{{…re:nytimes…like you said, good fish wrapping paper:)….}}

ummm, nevermind my question below about liking the NY Times..lol...but politics aside, it is the very, very good when it comes to food, culture, etc..

re: semipreciousme

{{….ahem….i could go on and on about how he improved the wizard from the worst record in the nba to a place where they were even talking about making the playoffs, but i WON`T…:)}}

haha...i knew that was coming :)

{{….did you know this asscroft guy used to contribute to a white supremist magazine?…and how he ordered some naked statue in a court to be covered up?…the most aggravating thing that they’ve done is stop health aid to developing countries and organizations that allow/advocate abortion….i mean let’s not even get into the utter STUPIDITY of that…}}

really?..which magazine?..why didn`t the democrats jump all over that...i do know about that abortion thing...the republicans` stand on that issue is sickening...and these are the people who then harp on about eliminating welfare rolls...how stupid to not realize that forcing unwanted child births increase welfare rolls for a variety of obvious reasons...

{….ralph nader rules!…}

hmm...that fellow is a bit impractical, isn`t he?...he wanted to take on all industries at once...and force many to completely shutdown...fine, but then he never had a plan for restoring jobs that would be lost as a result...i worry he`d cause an economic crisis...

{{….i was watching this old amitabh bachan movie with my mom the other day….and would you believe he was prancing around some trees in a white shirt AND white pants AND white shoes???….almost barfed…..}}

be nice!...i used to watch only amitabh bachan movies when i was young(er) :)...i`ve seen all his bell bottom pants, shirts with big collars, funky sideburns, etc....i dunno...i think he pulled it off considering that it was the 70s (ok, maybe i`m being silly :) )...the trouble starts when someone tries to pull that off now..lol...are you a fan of the NY Times?..well, the Sunday Times has a huge section on just style and fashion...there`s a wickedly funny guy named Hal Rubenstein who sometimes mocks silly fashion trends for men...hilarious...you should check it out....

{{…have yet to figure it out….prefer platinum myself:)….}}

ok, let me rephrase..lol..what`s desi women`s fascination with `precious` metals? :)...

{{….or a couple of good books, or clothes….and that’s season tickets for the wizards, thank you very much:)…..}}

the books are cheap...the clothes, i actually agree with that as well...(only if it doesn`t involve spending 80 hours looking for one article of clothing :) )...wizards tickets??...sacrilegious!... :)

rsaxena:

“as much faith as you had in jordan`s comeback attempt :) .. lol”

….ahem….i could go on and on about how he improved the wizard from the worst record in the nba to a place where they were even talking about making the playoffs, but i WON`T…:)

“you mean like ashcroft?...totally hate that guy...the first thing they did when they got to office was funding some christian `faith-based` organizations with federal money...”

….did you know this asscroft guy used to contribute to a white supremist magazine?…and how he ordered some naked statue in a court to be covered up?…the most aggravating thing that they’ve done is stop health aid to developing countries and organizations that allow/advocate abortion….i mean let’s not even get into the utter STUPIDITY of that…

“i turned anti-republican at that very instant...but now i`ve got no party to support, b.c. i turned anti-democrat a year before that...”

….ralph nader rules!…

“yuck...drives me up the wall...all the grad students who were TAs for my science classes thought they looked pretty damn spiffy in their expensive dress pants and white sneakers :)”

….if there is one thing that looks nasty on men, it’s white pants and shoes….i was watching this old amitabh bachan movie with my mom the other day….and would you believe he was prancing around some trees in a white shirt AND white pants AND white shoes???….almost barfed…..

“...seriously, what`s desi women`s fascination with the yellow stuff?...”

…have yet to figure it out….prefer platinum myself:)….

“i mean, doesn`t it make perfect sense to buy season tickets at madison square garden with that money instead?...or mets season tickets”

….or a couple of good books, or clothes….and that’s season tickets for the wizards, thank you very much:)…..

re: semipreciousme

{{….but give it time…i have great faith in desi resiliency, as corny as that may sound…}}

as much faith as you had in jordan`s comeback attempt :) .. lol

{{….aargh…don’t get me started against that moron….he’s been hanging out with one christian fundo too many….}}

you mean like ashcroft?...totally hate that guy...the first thing they did when they got to office was funding some christian `faith-based` organizations with federal money...i turned anti-republican at that very instant...but now i`ve got no party to support, b.c. i turned anti-democrat a year before that...

{{..hmm…cricket…another subject i can talk about for hours:)….not to rub it or anything, but it has always surprised me that india hasn’t produced better fast bowlers anywhere near the caliber of wasim, imran, waqar and co (ok, i am rubbing it in: ))….esp considering the sheer numbers and the god-like status of cricket there…}}

oh dear, another VERY sore topic for me...you seem to be hitting em all...lol...i`ve been trying to answer that question myself, but i`ve given up...i`ll just accept that my countrymen`s forte is science and cheating each other out of money in shady businesses :)...

{{…yeah, but knowing the desi mind set, they’d prob. be taking shortcuts a mile into it:)….}}

no kidding...and they`ll stop running and start a business selling lemonade along the route to other runners :)

{{…hey….anything’s better than shalwar qameez with sneakers…)}}

yuck...drives me up the wall...all the grad students who were TAs for my science classes thought they looked pretty damn spiffy in their expensive dress pants and white sneakers :)

{{….ahem…my mom also seems to have deprived burundi of a fair share of their gold…but she does NOT wear it all at once:)….}}

...i`ve seen some aunties whose necks and ears start to stoop from the weight of that stuff...of course it gets even more irritating when they find it necessary to announce their latest acquisition along with its price...seriously, what`s desi women`s fascination with the yellow stuff?...i really, really don`t get it...i mean, doesn`t it make perfect sense to buy season tickets at madison square garden with that money instead?...or mets season tickets?...

harimau:

“I don`t know about the rest but there has been speculation about Harimau in the past. If you notice, PMishra was probably posting during the period April 1 thru April 8 when I was absent from Chowk for lack of access to the Internet. So I can categorically prove that I am NOT PMishra, though I like his style.”

….you think that’s inane? according to his/her nickness, hamidm and i are supposed to be the same person!….not that i mind, but the ludicrousness of it all….

rsaxena:

“yup...although they will need to break free from their parents` shackles...you may not believe this, but there are actually very wealthy desi parents who refuse to pay college tuition if their kids study something they don`t approve of...amazing...the first generation of desis came with ideals from the 70s that have not changed...even if the ideals of people living in their countries of origin have...it is so disgusting...”

….yeah, attitudes like that aren’t going to get you anywhere fast….but give it time…i have great faith in desi resiliency, as corny as that may sound…

“nice...gonna clone 12-head? :)”

…lol…as if there weren’t enough of him/her around…

“...actually if that idiot bush has his way, we`ll stop any meaningful progress on genetic research...”

….aargh…don’t get me started against that moron….he’s been hanging out with one christian fundo too many….

“..but see, as much as it pains me to admit this, at least you usually have a decent cricket team...”

….hmm…cricket…another subject i can talk about for hours:)….not to rub it or anything, but it has always surprised me that india hasn’t produced better fast bowlers anywhere near the caliber of wasim, imran, waqar and co (ok, i am rubbing it in: ))….esp considering the sheer numbers and the god-like status of cricket there…

“...why start running marathons up and down the mountains near your village”…

…yeah, but knowing the desi mind set, they’d prob. be taking shortcuts a mile into it:)….

“..have to credit their ingenuity :)”

….sigh…..if not the gold in olympics, maybe this’ll get us somewhere…..

“yah, but it`s mostly the super wealthy...even then, only a subset of them...the rest make the necessary adaptations...”

…yes, but trust me, it’s catching on…you’d be surprised at how ppl here are slowly becoming fashion conscious… (albeit an imitation of the west…but, hey….anything’s better than shalwar qameez with sneakers…)

“how many times have you seen a desi uncle with hair popping out of his 60s shirt with his wife carrying burundi`s national stock of gold on her neck and ears...”

….ahem…my mom also seems to have deprived burundi of a fair share of their gold…but she does NOT wear it all at once:)….

re: semipreciousme

{{...yes, but most desis are economic migrants….they came here to make big $…as time passes and they become more and more economically prosperous and integrated…and second generation desis come into the picture, they’ll start thinking about how to have their say in politics…}}

yup...although they will need to break free from their parents` shackles...you may not believe this, but there are actually very wealthy desi parents who refuse to pay college tuition if their kids study something they don`t approve of...amazing...the first generation of desis came with ideals from the 70s that have not changed...even if the ideals of people living in their countries of origin have...it is so disgusting...

{{…nothing so enlightened i’m afraid…although eng. was always one of my fav. subjects in school…}}

hmm..i was convinced it was English...

{{and i was pretty good at it too, if i do say so myself:)….}}

seems like it :)

{{majoring in bio, and will prob. go into either biotechnology or marine biology…}}

nice...gonna clone 12-head? :) ...actually if that idiot bush has his way, we`ll stop any meaningful progress on genetic research...

{{….groan…please, let’s not even get into how

pitiful desis are when it comes to the olympics….more than a billion ppl and only a bronze medal to show for it…p-a-t-h-e-t-i-c…}}

oh dear, another sore topic for me :)...but see, as much as it pains me to admit this, at least you usually have a decent cricket team...india has no sporting accomplishments to speak of beyond some fluke cricket victories here and there, and some `golden hockey era` decades before i was even born...

{{and it has nothing whatsoever do with facilities/money/blahblahblah….if countries like ethiopia and lithuania can do it, there’s no reason why we can’t…..it’s just that desis are prob. the most un-athletically inclined ppl in the world…}}

right on...the way a desi mind works, if you`re going to try like hell to achieve something, you might as well start some shady business to make money...why start running marathons up and down the mountains near your village (which is apparently how kenyan runners get started)...you`ll probably be called a psycho by people around you, and there are no guarantees that you`ll ever make it...(i shouldn`t complain about them being risk averse considering the road i`ve taken...but it`s just desi roots :) )

{{…ugh…i was reading that titanic was such a big hit in afghanistan (this was during the taliban), that barbers over there were even giving smt called a titanic haircut…..whatever THAT means….}}

hehe...when air jordan sneakers were all the craze in the US, i once saw a shoe shop in india with a functional imitation called something like `hava jordan`...have to credit their ingenuity :)

{{….true enough…..although, imo, lately ppl have started becoming pretty fashion savvy….one of the boons of globalization i guess…}}

yah, but it`s mostly the super wealthy...even then, only a subset of them...the rest make the necessary adaptations...and the desis in the US have particularly abhorrent fashion sense, regardless of how wealthy they are...how many times have you seen a desi uncle with hair popping out of his 60s shirt with his wife carrying burundi`s national stock of gold on her neck and ears...

Ref AAmir-Studebaker-Hydra #: 146

[I know this ``nick`` problem is my greatest flaw.I think i have to go for psychiatric help.]

Check out the Headshrinker. That way, you will go completely crazy and be shut up in a looney bin without access to a computer or the Internet.

[But then you might not realize ...Aakash & Stuka may be same or P Misra & Harimou Or Unkal Jay & R Desikan or SPM & Hamidm or Hobbyty & Urstruly or ...]

I don`t know about the rest but there has been speculation about Harimau in the past. If you notice, PMishra was probably posting during the period April 1 thru April 8 when I was absent from Chowk for lack of access to the Internet. So I can categorically prove that I am NOT PMishra, though I like his style.

rsaxena:

“at least you`re not a bandwagon fan :)...”

….no way….bulls fan and whatever-team-jordan-plays-for fan till life…:)

“i`m convinced some of my friends seem to become overnight fans of whichever team is winning that year...for example, what business does someone who lives in new york have liking the spurs just before they are about to win a championship?...crazy..and then they have the gall to deny it...”

…. blasphemy….

“my white friends seem to understand what i mean, but not the desis, who are still convinced that making mo money, mo money qualifies as the `achievement of a lifetime`...”

...yes, but most desis are economic migrants….they came here to make big $…as time passes and they become more and more economically prosperous and integrated…and second generation desis come into the picture, they’ll start thinking about how to have their say in politics…

“btw, are you a really a literature or English major or what?..”

…nothing so enlightened i’m afraid…although eng. was always one of my fav. subjects in school….and i was pretty good at it too, if i do say so myself:)….majoring in bio, and will prob. go into either biotechnology or marine biology…

“cool...in basketball?....i thought desis weren`t nearly tall enough to go there :)”

….he’s 16…and 6’3…(and growing)…..and def. in basketball…in fact, he’s a major air god fan, too….(wonder where he got that from?: ))…

“...i figured they would be relegated to taking home the odd badminton and archery olympic golds...”

….groan…please, let’s not even get into how

pitiful desis are when it comes to the olympics….more than a billion ppl and only a bronze medal to show for it…p-a-t-h-e-t-i-c…and it has nothing whatsoever do with facilities/money/blahblahblah….if countries like ethiopia and lithuania can do it, there’s no reason why we can’t…..it’s just that desis are prob. the most un-athletically inclined ppl in the world…



“hehe...i hope men weren`t running around with white shoes bearing kate winslet`s picture...”

…ugh…i was reading that titanic was such a big hit in afghanistan (this was during the taliban), that barbers over there were even giving smt called a titanic haircut…..whatever THAT means….

“i know people in india will wear the weirdest stuff if they`re convinced that it looks `phoren` enough...”

….true enough…..although, imo, lately ppl have started becoming pretty fashion savvy….one of the boons of globalization i guess…

re: semipreciousme

{{…..if you insist:)….but i can imagine how you feel….watching the bulls’ fall from grace hasn’t exactly been not painful….}}

at least you`re not a bandwagon fan :)...i`m convinced some of my friends seem to become overnight fans of whichever team is winning that year...for example, what business does someone who lives in new york have liking the spurs just before they are about to win a championship?...crazy..and then they have the gall to deny it...

{{….the african-american comm. has been around in america much longer than the desis….they have about a couple of hundred years on us….only in the last generation or so have blacks been rising/accepted in high positions….compare desis w/that and i don’t think we’ve done too bad…..}}

...i think desis have done very well as a group...my only problem is that they seem motivated by little else other than money...don`t get me wrong, i`m as much of a money-loving capitalist as the next fellow, but lately i`ve been feeling that that is insufficient...my white friends seem to understand what i mean, but not the desis, who are still convinced that making mo money, mo money qualifies as the `achievement of a lifetime`...

..btw, are you a really a literature or English major or what?..

{{btw, re: jordan….i have a cousin who’s def. going to be making waves….}}

cool...in basketball?....i thought desis weren`t nearly tall enough to go there :) ...i figured they would be relegated to taking home the odd badminton and archery olympic golds...

{{…lol…you don’t even want to know about all the titanic paraphernalia that came out when the movie was released….t-shirts, caps, belts, shoes (yes, shoes!)…i remember this one shirt saying….bari kashti ka bara pyar, or smt equally hilarious…}}

hehe...i hope men weren`t running around with white shoes bearing kate winslet`s picture...i know people in india will wear the weirdest stuff if they`re convinced that it looks `phoren` enough...

rsaxena:

“ouch...ok, next topic please :)”

…..if you insist:)….but i can imagine how you feel….watching the bulls’ fall from grace hasn’t exactly been not painful….

“...where are the desi colin powells?...the condoleeza rices (stanford phi betta kappa, youngest tenured professor, etc. etc.)?...the rudy giulianis?...the (ahem) jordans?...”

….the african-american comm. has been around in america much longer than the desis….they have about a couple of hundred years on us….only in the last generation or so have blacks been rising/accepted in high positions….compare desis w/that and i don’t think we’ve done too bad…..give it another generation or two….in fact, i think the desis and other minorities should be really grateful to martin luther king….he was instrumental in bringing the plight of the african-american comm. to light and hence opening the door for other minorities….btw, re: jordan….i have a cousin who’s def. going to be making waves….

“hehe...i remember when WWF started to become popular in india, kids were running around with t-shirts saying `hamaara macho` (as in randy savage)...”

…lol…you don’t even want to know about all the titanic paraphernalia that came out when the movie was released….t-shirts, caps, belts, shoes (yes, shoes!)…i remember this one shirt saying….bari kashti ka bara pyar, or smt equally hilarious…

re: semipreciousme

{{…tsk, tsk….my commiserations….i can only imagine the heartache of watching the air god and co decimate the knicks playoff after playoff:)…}}

ouch...ok, next topic please :)

{{…mostly cultural, imo….we come from pretty conservative societies where getting a good, dependable job and raising a family are on top of the priority list….risking all and then doing it AGAIN would be enough to give the parents a heart attack…not to mention the plethora of relatives ganging up on you…}}

i agree...but i think it became cultural because of the historically poor economic conditions in our countries...people were/are just looking for stability, because the alternative is downright horrible...in the US, there are safety nets like social security, medicare, unemployment insurance, welfare, etc. etc....no such safety in our countries...can`t blame people for being risk averse in an environment like that...but then it has become ingrained into our culture....and parents, relatives, etc. maintain that risk aversion even when it isn`t necessary...and it has seeped into our generation as well...how unfortunate...particularly when you realize that achieving anything `great` requires veering off the traditional path...else you`re just riding some bandwagon...you can make money, which a lot of desis are good at, but that alone is not `greatness`...

{{….no way….you’re living in the land of immigrants….where people have literally built whole empires out of nothing…..yeah, these days its more cutthroat…but no lack of inspirational stories, imo….}}

true, but i think the days of people arriving with a $1 in their pockets and turning it into millions are gone...for one thing, immigration will put you right back on the plane and send you back :)...what could be considered a `great achievement` even 10 years ago, is now rather `ordinary`...even all those desi dotcom millionaires turned out to have fool`s gold...where are the desi colin powells?...the condoleeza rices (stanford phi betta kappa, youngest tenured professor, etc. etc.)?...the rudy giulianis?...the (ahem) jordans?...

{{….in time, in time….doesn’t take desis long to replicate the west…i’m sure we’ll have a desi version of wf….characters (the patthar?) and all somewhere down the line:)….}}

hehe...i remember when WWF started to become popular in india, kids were running around with t-shirts saying `hamaara macho` (as in randy savage)...

rsaxena:

“no no...you don`t understand...i`ve never denied his greatness...it would be foolish...it`s just that i don`t root for him to win...because inevitably it comes at the expense of the team i support...and between him and reggie miller, i`ve had many a miserable playoff evening....”

…tsk, tsk….my commiserations….i can only imagine the heartache of watching the air god and co decimate the knicks playoff after playoff:)…

“true true...i think someone could do an interesting dissertation on why desis tend to be risk averse...is it genetic, cultural, socio-economic, or some combination of all...i know of very few desis who royally failed at something, tried again, and `rose from the ashes`...they either never try again after truly failing, or they never truly took a risk...know what i mean?...”

…mostly cultural, imo….we come from pretty conservative societies where getting a good, dependable job and raising a family are on top of the priority list….risking all and then doing it AGAIN would be enough to give the parents a heart attack…not to mention the plethora of relatives ganging up on you…

“not enough inspirational stories for us 20-somethings :(...”

….no way….you’re living in the land of immigrants….where people have literally built whole empires out of nothing…..yeah, these days its more cutthroat…but no lack of inspirational stories, imo….

“haha...kabbadi?...but there are no Rock-like characters raising the People`s Eyebrow :)”

….in time, in time….doesn’t take desis long to replicate the west…i’m sure we’ll have a desi version of wf….characters (the patthar?) and all somewhere down the line:)….

rsaxena:

“no no...you don`t understand...i`ve never denied his greatness...it would be foolish...it`s just that i don`t root for him to win...because inevitably it comes at the expense of the team i support...and between him and reggie miller, i`ve had many a miserable playoff evening....”

…tsk, tsk….my commiserations….i can only imagine the heartache of watching the air god and co decimate the knicks playoff after playoff:)…

“true true...i think someone could do an interesting dissertation on why desis tend to be risk averse...is it genetic, cultural, socio-economic, or some combination of all...i know of very few desis who royally failed at something, tried again, and `rose from the ashes`...they either never try again after truly failing, or they never truly took a risk...know what i mean?...”

…mostly cultural, imo….we come from pretty conservative societies where getting a good, dependable job and raising a family are on top of the priority list….risking all and then doing it AGAIN would be enough to give the parents a heart attack…not to mention the plethora of relatives ganging up on you…

“not enough inspirational stories for us 20-somethings :(...”

….no way….you’re living in the land of immigrants….where people have literally built whole empires out of nothing…..yeah, these days its more cutthroat…but no lack of inspirational stories, imo….

“haha...kabbadi?...but there are no Rock-like characters raising the People`s Eyebrow :)”

….in time, in time….doesn’t take desis long to replicate the west…i’m sure we’ll have a desi version of wf….characters (the patthar?) and all somewhere down the line:)….

re: semipreciousme

{{….aha!!…..i knew it!…..a closet jordan fan….finally decided to come out, huh?….}}

no no...you don`t understand...i`ve never denied his greatness...it would be foolish...it`s just that i don`t root for him to win...because inevitably it comes at the expense of the team i support...and between him and reggie miller, i`ve had many a miserable playoff evening....

{{..this’s the age when its done…now or never….(sheesh, sounds like smt dr. phil would say: ))….i was just watching this bbc documentary recently….they were showing what all the 20smts who had plunged gun, stock and barrel into the dotcom mania which had now gone bust, were now doing…they’d lost millions of $, but they were still upbeat and willing to risk everything all over again into smt new…brash maybe….but then they would’ve spent the rest of their life wondering what if?….ok, now i def. sound like dr. phil…..too much oprah…:)}}

true true...i think someone could do an interesting dissertation on why desis tend to be risk averse...is it genetic, cultural, socio-economic, or some combination of all...i know of very few desis who royally failed at something, tried again, and `rose from the ashes`...they either never try again after truly failing, or they never truly took a risk...know what i mean?...not enough inspirational stories for us 20-somethings :(...

{{….well, here you have the desi version….big, fat men in loincloth clawing and rolling all over each other in a dirt pit:)….}}

haha...kabbadi?...but there are no Rock-like characters raising the People`s Eyebrow :)

rsaxena:

“hmm...i`m not so sure that`s a wise decision, but maybe he`ll prove me and all the other naysayers wrong...i guess that`s what made him great in the first place...not giving up...risking it all...doing the impossible...”

….aha!!…..i knew it!…..a closet jordan fan….finally decided to come out, huh?….

“if only i could absorb some of that these days”

…..this’s the age when its done…now or never….(sheesh, sounds like smt dr. phil would say: ))….i was just watching this bbc documentary recently….they were showing what all the 20smts who had plunged gun, stock and barrel into the dotcom mania which had now gone bust, were now doing…they’d lost millions of $, but they were still upbeat and willing to risk everything all over again into smt new…brash maybe….but then they would’ve spent the rest of their life wondering what if?….ok, now i def. sound like dr. phil…..too much oprah…:)

“sadly, they don`t show much of WWF in Asia...not in southeast asia at least...”

….well, here you have the desi version….big, fat men in loincloth clawing and rolling all over each other in a dirt pit:)….

re: semipreciousme

{{....i guess like he said, he still had the drive in him....he`s gonna be back next season...let`s see how that goes....this comeback has cost him a lot...his knee, his marriage....}}

hmm...i`m not so sure that`s a wise decision, but maybe he`ll prove me and all the other naysayers wrong...i guess that`s what made him great in the first place...not giving up...risking it all...doing the impossible...if only i could absorb some of that these days...

{{...hmmm....but weren`t you supporting the yanks against arizona in the world series?...}}

no way...never...being in new york, i had to keep my support for arizona secret...else i risked getting lynched in that city...for me it was quiet redemption for what the yankees did to the mets in the 2000 world series...childish, i know...but it`s a bit of comfort :)

sadly, they don`t show much of WWF in Asia...not in southeast asia at least...

rsaxena:

``oh wow...didn`t know that...yeah, heard about the season-ending injury...frankly, i think he`s beyond his prime...he should coach and prove his brilliance off the court too...``

...age ain`t nothing but a number...ok, yeah, that`s a bit idealistic, esp. when it comes to sports....i guess like he said, he still had the drive in him....he`s gonna be back next season...let`s see how that goes....this comeback has cost him a lot...his knee, his marriage....

``but that is why i love watching WWF (even now)...it is a riot...but ironically, WWF realizes the frivolous nature of grown men reaching for their primal, animal instincts..hence it comes up with plots and twists...football somehow misses that and takes it way too seriously...``

....yeah, but football`s the real deal....no acting, no storyline....just pure animal instinct....wwf`s like a soap opera...with a lotta body slams...:)

``oh dear...this is a tough one to explain...i think it took on gravity after the 2000 mets vs. yankees world series...i think the new yorkers who like the mets have very different personalities from the ones who like the yankees....the yankees are old school...they are about tradition...about pedigree...about their obnoxious owner buying his way to glory...the mets are underdogs...newcomers...they play in queens, the heart of middle-class new york...they have played in the shadows of the yankees, until now...they play in flushing meadows, where the US Open Tennis championship is held...where the world`s fare was...``

...hmmm....but weren`t you supporting the yanks against arizona in the world series?...

re: semipreciousme

btw, what a curiosity .. 12-head seems to have disappeared

re: semipreciousme

{{...he had to sell all his shares before playing...and, btw, toronto and chicago were also interested in him....but, alas, he`s out for the season...:(}}

oh wow...didn`t know that...yeah, heard about the season-ending injury...frankly, i think he`s beyond his prime...he should coach and prove his brilliance off the court too...

{{....to know it is to love it....there`s just smt about watching grown men in tights shoving, grunting and pummeling each other over a piece of pigskin:)....}}

but that is why i love watching WWF (even now)...it is a riot...but ironically, WWF realizes the frivolous nature of grown men reaching for their primal, animal instincts..hence it comes up with plots and twists...football somehow misses that and takes it way too seriously...

{{...btw, what`s with this mets vs. yanks rivalry?...}}

oh dear...this is a tough one to explain...i think it took on gravity after the 2000 mets vs. yankees world series...i think the new yorkers who like the mets have very different personalities from the ones who like the yankees....the yankees are old school...they are about tradition...about pedigree...about their obnoxious owner buying his way to glory...the mets are underdogs...newcomers...they play in queens, the heart of middle-class new york...they have played in the shadows of the yankees, until now...they play in flushing meadows, where the US Open Tennis championship is held...where the world`s fare was...

rsaxena:

re:jordan

....he had to sell all his shares before playing...and, btw, toronto and chicago were also interested in him....but, alas, he`s out for the season...:(

re:football

.....to know it is to love it....there`s just smt about watching grown men in tights shoving, grunting and pummeling each other over a piece of pigskin:)....

...btw, what`s with this mets vs. yanks rivalry?...

re: semipreciousme

{{….make a comeback at 38 with the worst team in the nba just to get attn??….}}

he owned the team...where else would he go to play?...

{{….not much of a baseball fan…although i did catch the finale of the world series last season…whatta game…made me forget i was watching baseball :)….}}

how can you like football, but not baseball?...the latter is even more mindless...i was just happy to see the yanks get whipped last year...that was the most a Mets fan could hope for last year :)

rsaxena:

“maybe he just likes attention, and couldn`t bear to

be out of the public light?”

….make a comeback at 38 with the worst team in the nba just to get attn??….

“...please don`t rub salt on

our ny knick caused wounds :(“

….lol…yeah, even ewing, that ‘god’ of yesteryears, decided he’d had enough….

“...at least i am terribly excited about the Mets this

year...something to be happy about :)”

….not much of a baseball fan…although i did catch the finale of the world series last season…whatta game…made me forget i was watching baseball :)….

re: semipreciousme

{{...by that count he should`ve stayed retired the first

time...but he came back...and then again...and if he

had wanted to win, i`m sure he could`ve found a

team much more, um `winable`, then the

wizards...eik to u ny`ers...try as you, he`s still the

greatest....and then some:)...}}

maybe he just likes attention, and couldn`t bear to

be out of the public light?...please don`t rub salt on

our ny knick caused wounds :(

...at least i am terribly excited about the Mets this

year...something to be happy about :)

rsaxena:

``i thought he`s the type who gives a damn about winning...isn`t that why we retired the last time - to `leave at the top```

...by that count he should`ve stayed retired the first time...but he came back...and then again...and if he had wanted to win, i`m sure he could`ve found a team much more, um `winable`, then the wizards...eik to u ny`ers...try as you, he`s still the greatest....and then some:)...

re: semipreciousme

{{.....he`s the type who doesn`t give a damn about appearances....he just loves the game....}}

i thought he`s the type who gives a damn about winning...isn`t that why we retired the last time - to `leave at the top`

RSaxena:

``...btw, your `air god` should`ve stayed out...leave at the top, no? :)``

.....he`s the type who doesn`t give a damn about

appearances....he just loves the game....

re: semipreciousme

{{....supposed def. being the key word here....too much time on his/her hands to be married, imo...ah, well....it takes all kinds...}}

either that, or its spouse prefers that it stay away from him/her...btw, your `air god` should`ve stayed out...leave at the top, no? :)

RSaxena:

``nope...it doesn`t...sad, isn`t it?...and *it * is supposed to be a grown, married creature, far older than both of us...``

....supposed def. being the key word here....too much time on his/her hands to be married, imo...ah, well....it takes all kinds...

re: semipreciousme

{{``nice...well, i`ll stop before i either say something corny, or get 12-head excited.. :)``

....yeah....it doesn`t take much does it?}}

nope...it doesn`t...sad, isn`t it?...and *it * is supposed to be a grown, married creature, far older than both of us...

hydra:

“But then you might not realize ...Aakash & Stuka may be same or P Misra & Harimou Or Unkal Jay & R Desikan or SPM & Hamidm or Hobbyty & Urstruly or ... so there are tremendous potential of ``sleeper`` terrorist that can be activated in minutes!!!!!!!!!!!!!”3

……so not only have you accused me of trying to impersonate mrs.a, now hamidm and i are supposed to be the same person??!?!….the mind boggles….

RSaxena:

``nice...well, i`ll stop before i either say something corny, or get 12-head excited.. :)``

....yeah....it doesn`t take much does it?

re: semipreciousme

{{....i also watch cricket, tennis, volleyball, football (the amriki kind....don`t like soccer)for it`s worth....it has been know to happen you know:)....}}

nice...well, i`ll stop before i either say something corny, or get 12-head excited.. :)

RSaxena:

``sorry, i was just shocked at coming across a female who watches the Rock and basketball...def didn`t mean to be sexist...``

....i also watch cricket, tennis, volleyball, football (the amriki kind....don`t like soccer)for it`s worth....it has been know to happen you know:)....

re: semipreciousme

{{“....are you sure you`re a chick? :)”

….bonafide….and i’ll ignore that latent sexist remark :)…}}

sorry, i was just shocked at coming across a female who watches the Rock and basketball...def didn`t mean to be sexist...

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yasser

i accept your apology...till the next phadda then! :)

AAmir #140 ``May be i have multiple nicks b/c i am a batterd husband & henpecked!!!!Would you then excuse my negativity & admit me with the Angels permanently``

Seriously, you make more sense than a lot of people on chowk (except when one of your nicks disagrees with me, thus displaying a complete lack of understanding of the issue concerned), and you seem to be an amiable chap, not vicious like some others (including self too, I may add, but only when mad at someone else). But then you use one of your multiple nicks to send in the post to chowk and ruin it all - you may be a ``battered husband & henpecked`` in real life (and perhaps some long suffering chowkies would be delighted if that was true I am sure, although I bet you are not even married and dream about taking your cute schoolteacher out on a date), but on chowk you are more like a chicken whose perfectly fine eggs are ignored since the chicken sometimes claims to be a rooster sometimes, sometimes a duck, sometimes Fatimah, sometimes Bhardwaj...

anNy,

1) So it was a misunderstanding, I am sorry.

2) Go read Harimau the tolerant has been saying for over 2 years now. He deserved to be called what I called him... he is what he is. I am shocked that anyone would take umbrage for one`s calling a spade a spade.

3) Sameerjb is sadly one of those people who have that pessimistic view of everything which is nothing but destructive for the nation. I admire his assessment of things, but it pains me to see a man like him without an discernible vision for the future of Pakistan. He is bad news despite his great potential.

What I have said, done, or propagated is NOTHING but the truth which is often a bitter pill to swallow... the Wisdom of my words will be understood and revealed to everyone as Time goes on.

As for myself, I am important not as an individual, there were many like me, there are many like me, and there will be many like me... but it is the importance of my message that makes me important and worthwhile. And there is none so great a truth that I have spoken now.

-YLH

rsaxena:

“you really watch hogan and The Great One--the People`s Champion--The Rock???...”

….i used to be a big wwf fan a while back….still watch it once in a while for the kicks if nothing else….ok, ok….also to ogle rock’s nice bod….(hydra, have you started hyperventilating yet?)…

“!...AND you like basketball??..”

…who wouldn’t with the air god playing? …

“....are you sure you`re a chick? :)”

….bonafide….and i’ll ignore that latent sexist remark :)…

hydra-at-it-AGAIN:

“Now its my hunch it is SPM who played that trick ..she gains by this post ,my post mentioned SPM to note her comment of mrs. being lucky might be corny coming from you .”

….seems like that nick-sprouting brain of yours has gone into overdrive aga

ylh

``Would you stop taking public shots at me?``

sweetie where have i done that on this board? point out EXACTLY where and the number of the post..i havent mentioned you here once also and me thinks u were going a lil wild and decided to pick on me for want of a better target...well you know what yasser? you dont pick on me betae..im going to kick your cute lil ass henceforth..JUST A MINUTE..are you saying you were stupid enough to think the mentioning of 2 budtameezyoung men to mrs.tahmed was reference to you? jeezizz...the refernce was to stuka and ali as everyone here will know...were i to mention you, it would conmtain egoistic, wierd, very strange, sadly unstable, highly rude and a potential etc etc..OKAY?

``Why do you think you are so damn important``

because i AM important...and so do you think sweetness..only you disguise it behind all those claims you repeatedly make (dont ask me to recount..dont have time or energy) while i make no excuses..i love myself and there are no excuses and explainations to be made for that

``.. I have only responded in kind to those who have done so with me, I have never abused insulted or harangued anyone who has maintained a peaceful posture. Even with the likes of P-Mishra,...``

do i look like i care?

``You are hell bent like an immature child to provoke me. And you have a number of buddhay bachay supporting you who have nothing better to do.``

if you speak to me in this manner again yasser, and especially when no reference has been made to you, youll be responsibble for what happens...mind how you speak to me, im not harimau who ignored your dog comparisons or smaeerjb who has the patience to ignore your ramblings. you want to shoot off, go do it with someone else, dont you dare behave like a spoilt little child with me on the basis of an interaction we had previously. if i say something to you, come right back. But fazool mae agar budtameezi karree hae aglee baar, acha nahin hoga, samajh ayee?