Regarding the Stupid White Men

re: Asim

{What this fellow did not realise is that its not about grades.}

...actually, it`s often about grades and all the other stuff you mention...depends on your situation...if you`re a grad student and your prof`s gonna direct-place you somewhere, it doesn`t matter..only the school`s rep and the prof`s name matters...but if you`re an undergrad, the top consulting firms and grad schools are notorious for screening first by GPA...(although they will deny it)...

YLH Sez:

USAF doesn`t lose 1 plane every week. That is just an

out and out lie. Please don`t get into the numbers.

USAF is 5 times the size of IAF and yet loses only half

as many aircrafts in a year.

PAF is roughly 1/3rd the size of IAF and PAF has lost

less than 102 aircrafts in the last 30 years. IAF is

criticized worldwide for its horrific flying record.



Surely you cannot be so idiotic. Did you miss the part in

my post that showed that 102 crashes were OVER

A TEN YEAR PERIOD?

Are you going to retract your statement now?

FWIW, check out http://www.jetsafety.com for USAF

crashes. Hint: when you train as hard and push your

airplanes as hard as US pilots do, crashes are a fact of

life.

PAF may have suffered fewer crashes, but PAF pilots

also fly a lot less than IAF pilots do. You guys can

barely afford to keep your planes flying and get no

more freebies from the sheiks of araby these days...

re: spout

{.....they might not run around in cliques and they probably won`t land those coveted top notch jobs (as Suxena rightfully points out),}

...did i give you permission to use my good name in your posts?...

{...it`s all a matter of individual perspective and the choices that we make....as long as the individual is satisfied, that`s all that matters...}

...so sweet...really...

``Ofcourse, that`s easy to do if all you planes are grounded in the first place...ahem..ahem.. but let`s not talk about inconvenient facts here. :)``

Stuka...

I am willing to talk about this new `fact` you have revealed... Please quote the source for such a stupid ad idiotic remark. Pakistan Airforce operates some 33 F 16s, 180 Mirages, 200 F 7ps and some 50 odd A 5s... Which of these are grounded? Your Kind dreams too much. I wonder, why all indians are prepared to lie to win an argument?

Tahmed is Right in my opinion. In any event, given that Islam had prescribed a way out of Ijtehad and Ijmah.. there is no doubt in my mind that had it been applied consistently we would have arrived at a situation which guaranteed equal rights for Hindus and Gays.

Asim: Peace! You went to stanford? This is great, now we can test my lil hypothesis regarding Knowledge, wisdom and ``education.``

You asked if i was consoling myself and I answered no. From there, u magically assumed i came from Pakistan in search of a better life, bla bla. Actually I was born in Toronto. Thats strike one. Now recall, I said ``I am damn sure that most of the people i know could absolutely embarrass any uppity azz, ivy league white boy.`` This is strike two (Im alluding to the fact that going to stanford clearly has not done u much good when it comes to dialogue).

These so called ``top notch`` schools really do not teach one how to think. Case and point.

The language one uses is indicative of his mindset. U label someone who doesnt go to harvard as a ``Have Not.`` Going to harvard or stanford will not help ones grey matter, it will just help him achieve his power and or status. If one is CONTENT, he doesnt need society to judge him. Not everyone is a follower. Ur debating skills are off, clearly. My point, as u so elequently demonstrated, was that ivy league schools do not teach someone how to think. You took that idea and magically introduced some scenerio about what would happen if i was given the opportunity. Opportunity??? All u need is a 90 average, and to get that all u need is to study a lot. Study a lot means u have to be good at memorizing and regurgitating data, NOT thinking.

Scout wrote :``now don`t go responding to this post with a bitter ``oh u couldn`t get into an ivy league school`` bull.... thankfully, i`m not in a profession that relies on alma maters.....if i was, i`d probably try my damned best to get into the top business/engineering schools.``

I am still trying my level best to comprehend the point you are trying to make here. I never said that my profession relied on alma maters. All i said was that i can get that ``leverage`` to propel me farther , quicker based on my academic credentials.

BTW its what is on paper that matters more in this inequitable world than what one truly is at times. That is what often defines opportunity in the first place, as in the interview process for jobs etc. I agree I was intentionally harsh on DRUMZ for his dismissal of academic excellence of Harvard with his ``all students get A- spiel``. What this fellow did not realise is that its not about grades. Its about the experience. I am assuming we are all grown up above the age where competition in terms of who scored the most A`s in O levels mattered. Its not the grades that matter, but rather the imparting of scientific knoweledge and the ability to interact with world class faculty that matters. I know Tahmed is not going to like it one bit, when i inform you that bases on a single 4 minute phone call of a professor a person could get a job. Ofteh the head hunters at these universities, need only approach the professor emeritus to ask them about who the best folks in the departmnet are. and lo and behold they will get job offers without even so much as a tem minute informal interview. Now think about that. Is it wrong? Yes of course, Does it mean it does not happen ? No. It very much does.

There you go! I apologise for my lack of a ``stellar`` attitude in discussionS about obvious truths, with people who will argue incessantly without having a real feel for the ground reality of doing business in the good ole USA. Most business deal are not conducted in the confines of awood-panelled board room anymore. Deals are conducted over Fancy dinners and golfing excursions in exotic faraway treats, or even country clubs.

We can either admit reality or deny it and live in a fool`s paradise hoping that hard work alone will get us there. It might depend a lot more on whom you know, just like in good ole Pakistan though at a much more sophisticated level.

Am I making sense to anyone? Please tell me to take a sabbatical if i am not!

semipreciousme:

``…before dec. 12 and the subsequent deployment of indian troops, when was the last major terrorist attack in india, not counting kashmir?….``

Excluding Kashmir, there was an attack on the Red Fort in New Delhi. Credit was taken by Lashkar E Tayyaba. Throughout the 80 s and 90s, there were random bomb blasts in Delhi. In fact, and this is actually funny, Delhi Transport Corporation buses had this stenciled on the back of the seats:

`` seat key neechey dekhiye

agar aapko bomb miley

shor machaiyey

inaam paiyey``

and ofcourse the English translation...

`` Look under seat, Find Bomb, Raise Alarm, Earn Reward``...

Being a Delhite, I can tell you, we faced all this with fatalistic good humor. The closest I personally came to a terrorist attack was in 1990 when I was going to Simla, the Kalka mail pulled out of Delhi station and a bomb exploded a few minutes later. We only found out in Simla.

Then ofcourse there were the Bombay blasts, which, in terms of damage to the national psyche were equivilant of the attack on Parliament.

BTW, I missed quite a few posts, so I was wondering about the context of your question.

``Last year the Mighty Indian Air Force lost a total 102 Mig aircrafts which is a new Air force record for any country. I suggest every Pakistani poster on this post get up from his or her seat and salute the brave and mighty Indian Airforce.``

And I suggest that all Indians salute the Pakistan Air Force for not having any crashes in the past year. Ofcourse, that`s easy to do if all you planes are grounded in the first place...ahem..ahem.. but let`s not talk about inconvenient facts here. :)

Rsaxena,

I have saluted the `brilliant` Pakistan Army for its anti-National activities many times. They are indeed the shame for the nation.

Glib,

USAF doesn`t lose 1 plane every week. That is just an out and out lie. Please don`t get into the numbers. USAF is 5 times the size of IAF and yet loses only half as many aircrafts in a year.

PAF is roughly 1/3rd the size of IAF and PAF has lost less than 102 aircrafts in the last 30 years. IAF is criticized worldwide for its horrific flying record.

dost-mittar #219,

but he`s half right, i`m half punjabi, half urdu speaking.

honestly, no matter how much i might disagree and argue with shankar bhai, i respect his views and straight-forwardness and i also know i get back at him with equal bluntness.

it`s all good :)

Asim Hayat

I have no idea what you are trying to say. As for me I have absolutely no political agenda as far as human rights are concerned. A human is a human, no matter what ideology he believs in, he feels the pain just the same, his dignity is hurt just the same, his life, his family, the future of his children is destroyed just the same. What good is an Islamic society, when it treats its members like dogs, and what good is a secular society when it does the same. The human dignity has no state, no nationality; its not bound by some borders; it is as absolute as God himself. State has no right to transgress the social contract that it has with the people. People try to find human dignity and respect in ideologies, where as it lies with in us. People do not understand that. If Islamic Saudi Arbia and Iran treat its people like dogs, then so does the secular Algiers, Turkey, Syria, Iraq and Tunis; so does the banana republics like Paksitan; and so do the arab dynasties.

CONGRATULATIONS FOR INDIANS:

I`d like to take this opportunity to congratulate my Indian brethren on a new World record their brave and Mighty Air force has set in the world!

Last year the Mighty Indian Air Force lost a total 102 Mig aircrafts which is a new Air force record for any country. I suggest every Pakistani poster on this post get up from his or her seat and salute the brave and mighty Indian Airforce.

-YLH

This lie was so easy to catch...



India lost 102 MiG-21 in 10 yrs

NEW DELHI: Indian Air Force, the world`s fourth largest, has lost 102 Russian-made MiG-21 fighters in crashes in the last 10 years, the country`s defence minister said on Tuesday.

George Fernandes, in a written statement to the Lok Sabha, said the IAF had also lost 39 pilots in MiG-21 accidents from April 1, 1992 to March 31, 2002.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow.asp?art_id=7788993



BTW, USAF loses about 1 aircraft a week to accidents. Would you say the Americans don`t know what they are doing?

Asim: ``Is that how you console yourself for your lack of opportunity of attending one of these A- handing top notch universities?``

Drumz wrote :``Peace. What u call an opportunity is infact a carrot dangling off a stick. Not everyone is a follower. ``

Tell me why did you come to the west to attend University. Clearly you know something about quality of an education vs the cost. U know it is incredibly cheaper to attend a paki university and still get a diploma saying BS, (not literally u must understand), and well still call yoursefl a graduate as many Pakistani folks do. What is the difference or the need for going to a canadian college or university. ``Perhaps better quality of education. Yep! US has soem 3000 odd universities starting from Mama Papa universities leading up to the heavy weights. Clearly the heavy weights offer more ``opportunity`` in terms of having a better education than the not so good ones or not so well known ones. Of course the price of attending those go up as well. Care to explain how I am saying anything different from yoursefl in the above argumnet. You came from the subcontinet to attend a US/candian college, granted a not so well known one. in search of a better education. Within US i chose Stanford for a better quality of education over say UT Austin. Its all a relative thing. Hope you see my point.

``The Have nots always appear to vote for contentment while given half an opportunity they would be the ones crying out fropm top of domehsaped mausoleums about how equitable the educational system is at these overcharging and underperforming universities.``

Drumz wrote :Firstly, im not a ``have not.`` Callin me a have not cuz i dont go to harvard is indicative of ur mindset. Secondly, ur debating skills need sharpening. U deflected the original criticism, and placed it in another context. I am CONTENT.

Pray do tell me what mindset is that. Could it be you are reading a lot more into my definition of ``have not`` than I anticpated. I suspect that is the case. Thanks for your tip about my debating skills or the lack thereof. I know I need to brush up my skills badly in a bid to match your bouts of oratory.

know you are content. In the absence of having had the opportunity to know the difference if you were not CONTENT, that would be a big problem.

Tahme wrote :``hamidm #176 you write ``..... if islam is secular why was it necessary to destroy the idols in the kaaba and turn it into a mosque? ... i am sure the kafirs did not see that as a secular act``

Good question. The answer is obvious, I think: The prophet himself was a human being, capable of making mistakes like all humans. He stressed as much, and indeed the reservation of divinity to God only is central message of the Quran. Nowhere is the concept of an Islamic State mentioned in the Quran - indeed, it is a pagan State, and one ruled by a woman (the state ruled by Queen Sheba, as I mentioned before on chowk) that is praised in the Quran (for the reason that the Queen consulted with her advisers before making decisions). ``

The above is the purest form of drivel I have seen written by an apologist of Islam in a long time. The concept of Idols in Islam signifying ``God`` is haraam. How about accpeting facts as they are rather than trying to distort these to suit our myopic agenda.Tahmed, give up your crusade to equate Islma dn secularism. I shall hound you till you stop mouthing off sad despicable lies about my religion.

tahmed

``The prophet himself was a human being, capable of making mistakes like all humans.``

... so you are saying that paganism should have been allowed to flourish inside the kaaba and the muslims should have built themselves a new mosque down the street? .... hobbyty and others might consider this blasphemous and declare you wajib-ul-qatl or something ...... but just imagine the possibilities if that had actually happened - two religions flourishing side by side, people singing and dancing in front of idols and then walking over to offer four fards and a special prayer for their favourite monkey-faced deity ..... allah could have been a super-god with many little gods taking care of minor things like unwanted pregnancies and global warming .....the world might have run more efficiently, and saudi arabia might have been a more fun place to visit ....alas, it didn`t turn out that way and we are stuck with hobbyty`s stern old god who controls our every thought and deed and demands that we abide by the looney pronunciations of the council on islamic ideology and the shariah court...

.... but did you read hobbyty`s post on secularism and islam? .... he is right - they are mutually exclusive ...... i know it is hard to reconcile common sense with blind faith, and you sincerely wish that it was true, but real islam precludes infidel concepts like secularism, humanism and equal rights for gays and hindoos ........sad, but true ..... now, if you want to be a token musalmaan like me and temper faith with horse sense, then of course, you can declare islam to be whatever you want it to be ....... heck, i can even justify drinking, pet dogs, interest bearing accounts, and hindoo friends based on my interpretation of the book ..........