Chowk P Room June 13, 2002
#436 Posted by saminashah on June 27, 2002 1:09:22 pm
Pankaj, Soy, Fuzair
oh, and instead of linear, think spatial, mapping more than straight lines.
oh, and instead of linear, think spatial, mapping more than straight lines.
#435 Posted by saminashah on June 27, 2002 1:09:22 pm
Soy, Pankaj, Fuzair,
Okay, how I understood the para Pankaj posted:
According to the author of this paragraph, there are no clear binary opposites between consecutive, symbolic connections and early/ancient mediations AND the infinite numbers of systems of meanings.(i.e. Supertheory`s contention that an infinite number of systems exist simultaneously)
The dual theoretical constructions that were a cornerstone of certain movements do not adequately represent the nature of our immeasureable systems of how we make meaning (ie think the Internet, the infinite meetings of cultures, languages, interactions, globalization- Hawthorne and the many interpretation one could make in reading The Scarlet Letter), therefore I (says author of para) am right in throwing out the idea of binarism. The process (the middle) is what needs to be examined more closely-binarism excludes what happens in between- the continuum of what happens in early narratives and our latter day constructions?
Just an initial grappling...could be off...or maybe not...
cheers!
Okay, how I understood the para Pankaj posted:
According to the author of this paragraph, there are no clear binary opposites between consecutive, symbolic connections and early/ancient mediations AND the infinite numbers of systems of meanings.(i.e. Supertheory`s contention that an infinite number of systems exist simultaneously)
The dual theoretical constructions that were a cornerstone of certain movements do not adequately represent the nature of our immeasureable systems of how we make meaning (ie think the Internet, the infinite meetings of cultures, languages, interactions, globalization- Hawthorne and the many interpretation one could make in reading The Scarlet Letter), therefore I (says author of para) am right in throwing out the idea of binarism. The process (the middle) is what needs to be examined more closely-binarism excludes what happens in between- the continuum of what happens in early narratives and our latter day constructions?
Just an initial grappling...could be off...or maybe not...
cheers!
#434 Posted by saminashah on June 27, 2002 1:09:22 pm
Any comments on the ten Pakistani soldiers killed by al-Qaeeda? I would like to know more about them and their famillies.
Fuzair
Thanks for clarifying the Sokol Hoax. The more serious underlying issue being debated in the discipline of Composition Theories is whether social action has a role in writing; i.e. how and when does critical thinking occur in the actions of reading and writing, what are genres, the efficacy in teaching genres, experimenting with interdisciplinary theory in Composition to lead students to enact critical thinking and linkages.
Interestingly enough, there is a committed group of Composition people out there who have applied scientific methodology to how thinking, composing and recomposing takes place. I`m fortunate enough to be working with a couple of them now!
ana
Thanks! I`ll look it up! Will be grateful for further tips. Hows summer treating you?
Aicha
Tell me about weddings! No one seems to have a wedding during the cold, dark weeks of December! Hope you are well. And yes, Lets aim for dinner- I`m thinking Scoutie Begum as well. But, won`t be free till August...how is that month for you?
Subroto
Started a book called Life of Pi by Yann Martel. The narrator is a young Indian boy adrift on a sea with a small ship filled with animals. One is a tiger named Richard Parker.
`` I wish I could describe waht happened next, not as I saw it, which I might manage, but as I felt it. I beheld Richard Parker from the angle that showed him off to the greatest effect: from the back, half raised, with his head turned. The stance had something of a pose to it, as if it were intentional, even affected, display of mighty art. And what art, what might. His presence was overwhelming, yet equally evident was the lithesome grace of it. He was incredibly muscular, yet his haunches were thin and his glossy coat hung loosely on his frame. His body, bright brownish orange streaked with black verticle stripes, was incomparably beautiful, matched with a tailor`s eye for harmony by his pure white chest and underside and the black rings of his long tail. His head was large and round, displaying formidable sideburns, a stylish goatee and some of the finest whiskers of the cat world, thick, long and white. Atop the head were small, expressive ears shaped like perfect arches. His carrot orange face had a broad bridge and a pink nose, and it was made up with brazen flair. Wavy dabs of black circled the face in a pattern that was striking yet subtle, for it brought less attention to itself than it did to one part of the face left untouched by it, the bridge, whose rufrous lustre shone nearly with a radiance. The patches of white above the eyes, on the cheeks and around the mouth came off as finishing touches worthy of a Kathakali dancer. The reseult was a face that looked like the wings of a butterfly and bore an expression vaguely old and Chinese....``
The best part of this scene is yet to come. :) Martel spent several years in India and worked in wildlife reserves. I won`t tell you the plot of the book, needless to say, I`m signing off now to continue reading it!
Fuzair
Thanks for clarifying the Sokol Hoax. The more serious underlying issue being debated in the discipline of Composition Theories is whether social action has a role in writing; i.e. how and when does critical thinking occur in the actions of reading and writing, what are genres, the efficacy in teaching genres, experimenting with interdisciplinary theory in Composition to lead students to enact critical thinking and linkages.
Interestingly enough, there is a committed group of Composition people out there who have applied scientific methodology to how thinking, composing and recomposing takes place. I`m fortunate enough to be working with a couple of them now!
ana
Thanks! I`ll look it up! Will be grateful for further tips. Hows summer treating you?
Aicha
Tell me about weddings! No one seems to have a wedding during the cold, dark weeks of December! Hope you are well. And yes, Lets aim for dinner- I`m thinking Scoutie Begum as well. But, won`t be free till August...how is that month for you?
Subroto
Started a book called Life of Pi by Yann Martel. The narrator is a young Indian boy adrift on a sea with a small ship filled with animals. One is a tiger named Richard Parker.
`` I wish I could describe waht happened next, not as I saw it, which I might manage, but as I felt it. I beheld Richard Parker from the angle that showed him off to the greatest effect: from the back, half raised, with his head turned. The stance had something of a pose to it, as if it were intentional, even affected, display of mighty art. And what art, what might. His presence was overwhelming, yet equally evident was the lithesome grace of it. He was incredibly muscular, yet his haunches were thin and his glossy coat hung loosely on his frame. His body, bright brownish orange streaked with black verticle stripes, was incomparably beautiful, matched with a tailor`s eye for harmony by his pure white chest and underside and the black rings of his long tail. His head was large and round, displaying formidable sideburns, a stylish goatee and some of the finest whiskers of the cat world, thick, long and white. Atop the head were small, expressive ears shaped like perfect arches. His carrot orange face had a broad bridge and a pink nose, and it was made up with brazen flair. Wavy dabs of black circled the face in a pattern that was striking yet subtle, for it brought less attention to itself than it did to one part of the face left untouched by it, the bridge, whose rufrous lustre shone nearly with a radiance. The patches of white above the eyes, on the cheeks and around the mouth came off as finishing touches worthy of a Kathakali dancer. The reseult was a face that looked like the wings of a butterfly and bore an expression vaguely old and Chinese....``
The best part of this scene is yet to come. :) Martel spent several years in India and worked in wildlife reserves. I won`t tell you the plot of the book, needless to say, I`m signing off now to continue reading it!
#433 Posted by semipreciousme on June 27, 2002 1:09:22 pm
zafarsaab:
``There you go young semi, that?s my first ever chowk poem, albeit referential to a fault ? and all in answer to your post! I feel confident that you now understand about the silver jeans``
...ahh...explains it all...but zafarsaab 37 is too young to be going through all this...what will you do when you really get to be over the hill??...
#432 Posted by subroto on June 27, 2002 3:03:26 am
Re Sadna #415
Regarding tiger tales has anyone read the book ``Tiger for Breakfast`` the biography of Boris Lissanevitch (I cheated here, could`nt remember his last name so googled). Its the story of this extremely colourful Russian - a soldier in the white army, a ballet dancer, big game hunter, friends of the maharajas and the man who first pioneered tourism in Nepal. Been years since I read it but memories still remain.
On a different path who has read `A Search in Secret India` by Paul Brunton?
Regarding tiger tales has anyone read the book ``Tiger for Breakfast`` the biography of Boris Lissanevitch (I cheated here, could`nt remember his last name so googled). Its the story of this extremely colourful Russian - a soldier in the white army, a ballet dancer, big game hunter, friends of the maharajas and the man who first pioneered tourism in Nepal. Been years since I read it but memories still remain.
On a different path who has read `A Search in Secret India` by Paul Brunton?
#431 Posted by saminashah on June 27, 2002 3:03:26 am
Soysauce, Pankaj,
Um, I guess the language of liberal arts academia has been developing all along; why can`t it be as metaphysical or as complicated as mathematics? (just saw A Beautiful Mind)...I agree that the Postmodernists have some complicated stuff, but some of them, like Joan Didion, an imagistic political/social critic is as a ``Supertheory`` thinker as the rest of them. A social scientist like N. Luhrmann`s work in which he constructs an argument about how critical thinking is achieved is represented by Didion in a more narrative, layperson manner. And no jargon, besides the ``insider code`` in which she delineates the political weather in Washington at pivotal moments. My point? I like Didion plenty, but I wouldn`t kick Luhrmann out of my bed (as nighttime reading OF COURSE). And Luhrmann has been accused of being inaccessible to the grad student of average intelligence-his answer? Slog thru it, and make your connections.
Scout
Sweetie!
Aicha
Haven`t heard the gardening one...pretty euphemistic! Any more?
Drumz
Why don`t YOU put up yer pics, g? I`d be lying if I said I wasn`t curious about your current hair situation...are you dred? do you have something shaved into your buzzcut? I`m not hearing anything about no Rick James weave....
Um, I guess the language of liberal arts academia has been developing all along; why can`t it be as metaphysical or as complicated as mathematics? (just saw A Beautiful Mind)...I agree that the Postmodernists have some complicated stuff, but some of them, like Joan Didion, an imagistic political/social critic is as a ``Supertheory`` thinker as the rest of them. A social scientist like N. Luhrmann`s work in which he constructs an argument about how critical thinking is achieved is represented by Didion in a more narrative, layperson manner. And no jargon, besides the ``insider code`` in which she delineates the political weather in Washington at pivotal moments. My point? I like Didion plenty, but I wouldn`t kick Luhrmann out of my bed (as nighttime reading OF COURSE). And Luhrmann has been accused of being inaccessible to the grad student of average intelligence-his answer? Slog thru it, and make your connections.
Scout
Sweetie!
Aicha
Haven`t heard the gardening one...pretty euphemistic! Any more?
Drumz
Why don`t YOU put up yer pics, g? I`d be lying if I said I wasn`t curious about your current hair situation...are you dred? do you have something shaved into your buzzcut? I`m not hearing anything about no Rick James weave....
#430 Posted by aicha on June 27, 2002 3:03:26 am
samina - summer is no better tahn spring. Lots of weddings coming up - other than that cant complain too much. I thought we would be meeting up for lunch soemtime. Let me know wehn.
#429 Posted by ana on June 27, 2002 3:03:26 am
Speaking of Mahashweta Devi, there is a short story by her called `Draupadi`, methinks, in this anthology of South Asian and Middle Eastern women writers called `Blood into Ink: South Asian and Middle Eastern Women Write War.` It`s very vivid and telling in terms of how a female political prisoner is treated by the police authorities. She turns her dehumanization into ..well, I`ll let you read it for yerselves, but it is a very interesting working of mythology.
#428 Posted by fuzair on June 26, 2002 11:37:01 pm
Thats the famous Sokal Hoax. Sokal is an old-time, self-awoved leftie who despises the Post-modernists for being useless poseur dilettantes who use scientific jargon they do not understand to try to sound more learned than any one else and criticize modern science for being too authoritarian, fixated on discovering scientific laws, intolerant of theories that are not confirmable by testing, etc. What he is against are those Post-modernists who try to argue that advances in modern physics ``prove`` that everything is relative and reality is a social construct. I guess, in a way, Sokal is a Platonist of sorts who is convinced that somewhere out there there exists the Ideal Form. He is not quite jaded and self-obsessed enough to think that nothing matters in this world. Like Mulder, he knows that the Truth is out there!
As he says: ``I`m an unabashed Old Leftist who never quite understood how deconstruction was supposed to help the working class.``
Check out his homepage for various articles, pro and con, on his ``hoax.``
http://www.physics.nyu.edu/faculty/sokal/
As he says: ``I`m an unabashed Old Leftist who never quite understood how deconstruction was supposed to help the working class.``
Check out his homepage for various articles, pro and con, on his ``hoax.``
http://www.physics.nyu.edu/faculty/sokal/
#427 Posted by rsaxena on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
re: spout
{as for what Chowkies actually look like, i met one so far and it was a scary sight.}
...u saw shrinker somewhere?...yuck...i don`t know who to feel sorry for more...
{as for what Chowkies actually look like, i met one so far and it was a scary sight.}
...u saw shrinker somewhere?...yuck...i don`t know who to feel sorry for more...
#426 Posted by rsaxena on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
re: zafar
{Beta, a jhola can be used in any number of imaginative ways...that?s the trouble with young people these days, they don?t use their initiative...}
...umm, the jhola`s fine, but the ones who carry them are a diff. matter...be careful, they`re dangerous women...hoodlums even...look at what they do at WTO meetings...and greenpeace...if u didn`t sew your own clothes, they`ll smack u with that jhola for promoting child labor in third world countries...
{expect everything to be handed to them wrapped in Issey Miyake...life is STRUGGLE, you know...mere zamane mein tho?}
...issey miyake?...nahi nahi...woh bechara to 1990s ka hai...
{Bufu ka naam bhi math lena chowk pe?}
...bufu nahi fubu...
{Beta, a jhola can be used in any number of imaginative ways...that?s the trouble with young people these days, they don?t use their initiative...}
...umm, the jhola`s fine, but the ones who carry them are a diff. matter...be careful, they`re dangerous women...hoodlums even...look at what they do at WTO meetings...and greenpeace...if u didn`t sew your own clothes, they`ll smack u with that jhola for promoting child labor in third world countries...
{expect everything to be handed to them wrapped in Issey Miyake...life is STRUGGLE, you know...mere zamane mein tho?}
...issey miyake?...nahi nahi...woh bechara to 1990s ka hai...
{Bufu ka naam bhi math lena chowk pe?}
...bufu nahi fubu...
#425 Posted by soysauce on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
#406 saminashah
I agree with you to some extent - all disciplines are jargon laden. OTOH, unless it is absolutely necessary, it is best to avoid jargon. That can actually be done in the sciences to a large extent. In the social sciences, however, obfuscation appears to fetch a premium and therefore jargon is a part and parcel of it. You must have heard of the little article that a scientist managed to publish a year or two ago in a social theory journal. He had made up the whole thing and the article was printed since - one can only guess here - the reviewers and editors did not want to appear to be dumb by admitting that they didn`t understand what the guy was writing.
I agree with you to some extent - all disciplines are jargon laden. OTOH, unless it is absolutely necessary, it is best to avoid jargon. That can actually be done in the sciences to a large extent. In the social sciences, however, obfuscation appears to fetch a premium and therefore jargon is a part and parcel of it. You must have heard of the little article that a scientist managed to publish a year or two ago in a social theory journal. He had made up the whole thing and the article was printed since - one can only guess here - the reviewers and editors did not want to appear to be dumb by admitting that they didn`t understand what the guy was writing.
#424 Posted by DRUMZ on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
I think it would be a great idea for one of u with too much time ya hands to make a website with pics of chowk posters. It will provide for hours of amusement.
#423 Posted by roohi on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
sadna - thanks, I love Kipling too! The language is still hard for the bubs (or ``best beloved`` as Kipling puts it in ``Just So Stories``). They do like ``The Cat that walks by himself`` - nice that Kipling is smart enough to know that it was the Woman who tamed all the wild things :-).
#422 Posted by Nagnatheshwar on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
NOTHING LIKE REAL LIFE DRAMA, SUFFERING, AGONY & PAIN OF LIFE OF HARDSHIP
UNKAL JAY CONDOLENCES TO YOU & YOUR BUDDIES DOWN SOUTH.
http://news.sify.com/cgi-bin/sifynews/news/content/news_fullstory_v2.jsp?article_oid=11665932&category_oid=-20607&page_no=1
232 succumbed to rat fever in Kerala
Thiruvananthapuram, June 24
As many as 232 people had died of rat fever in Kerala since 2000, Health Minister P Sankaran informed the State Assembly.
Replying to questions by VD Satheesan (INC) and others, he said rat fever (Leptospirosis) was reported from all districts, especially from Kottayam, Idukki, Alappuzha and Thiruvananthapuram.
During 2000, there were as many as 2,225 confirmed cases of rat fever, of which 87 people had died.
In 2001, the number of affected rose to 3,965 and the death toll to 119. Till May this year, 26 people had died of the disease.
Stating that all taluk and district hospitals in the State had been provided with adequate drugs to treat the affliction, Sankaran said seriously affected patients were treated in the Medical College hospitals.
People working in water logged areas had been advised to take doxycycline as a precautionary measure.
When a member complained of inadequate facilities in the Primary Health Centres and Taluk Hospitals, he said the Government was considering a Secondary Hospital Development Project with external assistance at a cost of Rs 810 crore.
When this was implemented, the peripheral hospitals would also be benefitted.
#421 Posted by Pankaj on June 26, 2002 4:37:58 pm
saminashah#406
``Right guys, I actually understood the para Pankaj posted. Try reading some Sara Sulieri and get back to me...
While I empathize with those who question the academic jargon and impenetrability of certain critical genres, I`d like to remind you that every discipline and field of study has specific, jargon laden languages.
``
Wow, you must be a genius to understand that. I read it two times and realised that if there was anything useful in that passage, it would have been said in an easier language. Science works to simplify the essentially complicated things while post-modernists etc work tirelessly to complicate it and make it inaccessible so as to pass off as intellectuals. It`s not the jargons I am referring to but the lack of content per se. I know about the origins of post-modernist thinking that was basically inspired by the 20th century advances in physics, especially uncertainity principle and quantum physics. In this context, I would recommend you the award winning book, ``The dancing Wu Li Masters``. And if confined to a specific domain, this kind of thinking has its validity. But people try to overgeneralise it without any regard to its applicability and usefullness in that domain. And some other people purposefully obfuscate the issue by using inaccessible language to pass off as intellectual imposters.
PS I have not read Focault. May be I will do sometime.
``Right guys, I actually understood the para Pankaj posted. Try reading some Sara Sulieri and get back to me...
While I empathize with those who question the academic jargon and impenetrability of certain critical genres, I`d like to remind you that every discipline and field of study has specific, jargon laden languages.
``
Wow, you must be a genius to understand that. I read it two times and realised that if there was anything useful in that passage, it would have been said in an easier language. Science works to simplify the essentially complicated things while post-modernists etc work tirelessly to complicate it and make it inaccessible so as to pass off as intellectuals. It`s not the jargons I am referring to but the lack of content per se. I know about the origins of post-modernist thinking that was basically inspired by the 20th century advances in physics, especially uncertainity principle and quantum physics. In this context, I would recommend you the award winning book, ``The dancing Wu Li Masters``. And if confined to a specific domain, this kind of thinking has its validity. But people try to overgeneralise it without any regard to its applicability and usefullness in that domain. And some other people purposefully obfuscate the issue by using inaccessible language to pass off as intellectual imposters.
PS I have not read Focault. May be I will do sometime.
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