Breaking News: Suicide Bomb in Karachi

re: Who is a true muslim?

So, we have another controversy brewing in India. Dr Rafiq Zakaria says Abdul Kalaam, the President-elect is not a true muslim. I should have expected someone to say that but not this man. According to him, Kalaam is not a muslim because he does not say namaaz 5 times, does not involve in community work blah, blah, blah.

The following is a rebuttal.

http://www.rediff.com/news/2002/jun/22sai.htm

Let some chowkiwallahs (muslims of course)enlighten me as to how Kalaam is not a muslim while Osama Laden, the guy who signs death warrants of innocent people with impunity, is.

Truely, Islam is at cross-roads today. If good souls like Kalaam are not muslims, we will be happy to call them hindus. People like Dr Zakaria should be thrown across the wagah border to the ``land of pure``. After all, did not Mushy complain one time Pak does not have enough PhDs. Here is one for you, Mushy. Take him and his ilk. We in India are better without him.

Sridhar

RE ROOHI 342

I personally think that Haroun is perhaps Rushdie`s finest work...it is an allegorical story that works on many levels. And after that, I thought the Moor`s Last Sigh was simply brilliant. I wasn`t too much of a fan of Midnight and of course, Satanic Verses were lesser books and the latter got famous because of all the hoohahs. the most recent one was brilliant only in patches...

RSaxena:

``you dirty basta$d pakistani...you dirty basta$d indian...pakistani, i`ll nuke you and your beard...indian, i`ll nuke you and your dhoti...

...how`s that?...``

Dude...you forgot...

``you cunning Brahmin....you backstabbing Baniya...you kattar Muslim...muh mey Ram,Bagal mey Choori waala Hindu...Non Toilet Paper using Pakistani..(ok, I made that up, but seriously, they don`t..1 guy I know actually had a brass pot in his dorm room)``

Waisey, I have noticed that all abuses against Hindus seem to be directed against Brahmins and Baniyas...the Khatris seem to actually be exempt from a lot of ire...can anyone tell me why we are so exempt from the abuses that the Brahmins and Baniyas get?

saminashah #337
Save us from what?

Don`t be indignant, whatever it is. And rsaxena is right, though he would have many more friends if he hadn`t been so kunjoos in sharing Zafar`s advice. btw, hope the knitting is coming along fine :).

re: sameer

{Since the next matches are on tuesday and wednesday, lets get back to Jinnah/Gandhi or Kashmir debate!!!}

...yes, i`ll start...that stupid half naked fakir gandhi...that stupid power hungry maniac jinnah...stop your jehadi terrorists from killing babies in kashmir...stop your army from violating human rights in kashmir...you dirty basta$d pakistani...you dirty basta$d indian...pakistani, i`ll nuke you and your beard...indian, i`ll nuke you and your dhoti...

...how`s that?...

re: saminashah

{No Pakistani will come to save you?

Oof, what am I, chopped liver?}

...but you`re an honorary indian citizen, so you don`t count :)...

Reply #: 278 Zafar Al-Talib

You asked:

[1. If you asked the Sectarians, wouldn’t they say that their efforts to have Shias declared non-Muslims was a jihad of sorts?]

[2. How do they decide where Jihad is to be fought? If the answer is “anywhere Islam is in danger” (I’m guessing, is that it?) then isn’t their current peacefulness in Pakistan conditional on the GoP toe-ing a particular line?]

Above questions portray a very common misconception. Jihad doesn`t mean a battle to protect the Faith itself from danger, rather, it means trying to protect the followers of that Faith. This is a very important distinction to make.

To explain this further, the inspiration for `Jihad` is drawn mainly from Sura`a Al-Baqra. The relevant sections are quoted below (at the risk of criticism of relying on old texts .. but there is much profundity to be found in these old texts)from Yusuf Ali`s traslation:

``Quote:

190. Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

191. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there;

But if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

192. But if they cease, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

193. And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

Unquote``

This is Jihad. Make your own judgement but it seems clear enough to me that Jihad is ordained only as a `reaction` to oppression and turning out of people from their land; and certainly not as an unprovoked war in fulfilling any religious duty or to spread the Faith. I think the Jehadis understand that perfectly well.

Thus, the GOP has neither cracked down on the Jehadis as they do not threaten the State and in fact completely loyal, nor were they responsible in any concievable manner for the happenings in Karachi. It is true though that the Jehadis have been asked not to put the State itself in jeopardy by their actions in Kashmir, and they have obviously acceded. If you recall, the main Jehadis i.e. Lashkar-e-Tayyaba were based right outside Lahore in Muridke but when asked, they quietly moved to Azad Kashmir last year.

The crackdown has been on the Sectarians as they are enemies of the State so its killing two birds with one stone, as most people cannot tell the difference.

Reply #: 279 Romair

[Your remarks are getting more interesting by the day. Either you have had a change of mind on certain issues, or I have had one :-)]

I take that as a compliment although I have no idea as to which issues you have referred. However, I think neither of us has changed .. but indeed the world .. after WTC.

Regards

Pankaj #336 On books, if you like the selfish gene (which I have not read), you will like Genome by Matt Ridley (I read it last year). Each chapter is devoted to one of the 23 separate pairs of chromosomes, and within each chromosome he focuses on one or two ``interesting`` genes. Looks at things like intelligence, conflict, sex, death, memory, from this new perspective.

Have also read a lot of good things about Stephen Gould`s swan song ``The Structure of Evolutionary Theory``, which is considered an enhancement to the traditional Darwinian Theory and which reflects 150 years of experience with fossil study following Darwins Theory. This book is not considered to be primarily focussed on the general public though, so I am not sure how far I will go in it (once I start, which I have not).

Pankaj #334 The US team played very well (I watched the game). Had possession of the ball most of the time, and almost scored 3 or 4 times in the first half. The Germans were lucky to get one in.

All right! Both Turkey and South Korea made it. Since the next matches are on tuesday and wednesday, lets get back to Jinnah/Gandhi or Kashmir debate!!!

Pankaj #334, ``Okay guys, since most of us have been bitten by World Cup bug, let us disclose our favourrite teams. I am rooting for Brazil, now that England is out.``

i don`t know about the teams, but the players are so damn cute esp. the ones with the wild long hair and awesome legs........

A show of hands on how many of you have read ``Haroun and the Sea of Stories`` by Salman Rushdie ? What NONE ? Shame !!!

The Guppies of Chowk should know of the fearsome war of the Guppies against the Chupwalas in the land of Kahani !! The Guppies led by Prince Bolo,King Chatterjee, General Kitab, the brave page Miss Blabbermouth (of the Pages of Gup) and ofcourse young Haroun and his Dad, the Shah of Blah - save Princess Baatcheet and the Ocean from the evil designs of the Chupwala`s Cultmaster Khatamshud (of the cult of Bezabaan including the order of the Zipped Lips).

Must read guys - I cannot help laughing every time I read it !!!

Jun-21-02 14:19:37 EST Reply #: 318

Zafar Al-Talib]

Thanks....good jokes always hurt(ache?) the abs.

And why do I have this eerie feeling that we (you & me ,& not P & I) could never hurt each other in any friendly-fire.Not that I am any lesser or greater equipped------only that I`m made of sterner(tougher?) stuff...(my mom always called it dhittai,chiknaa gharra,motee khaal vaghaira vaghairra...Of course she knew I do not need extra attention & would somehow manage to fend off the school/mohalla bully.AllhamduLillah how right she haS been!)

So as a reward to you and as a tribute to Biharis:

Mirza Ghalib:

``Ch.....N kee kamee nahee Ghalib

Aik dhoondo,hazaar miltay hain

jitnay chaaho Bihaar sey lailo

Lutf yeh hai--Udhaar miltay haiN!``

MahaAtmaa Buddh got his gayaan(is word origin Gaya?--the place) and Dhayaan(Zen?) in Bihaar.Isn`t it worth investigating why Buddhoo is used for someone stupid in hindi(sanskrit?)...when really Budhhi is brain/intellect.Do you see the hand of Pandits/Pandas in this to revile Buddhism and perpetuate the four-caste play(Nautankee) written,directed and staged on Bharati soil by the Pandits.

Just asking just asking---no joke this.

PS:Are you aware of any more Mahatmaas,other than Gandhi & Buddh?

Pankaj: Funny, I have read both of the books of Richard Dawkins you mentioned. There are several interesting advances in palaentotlogy, Genetics and Evolution of life as we know of. You should have watched a recent program on PBS about ``Life on Earth``. Anothe voluminous book out recently is by late Stephen Jay Gould with plenty of information and cross references. Another recent book is ``Future of Life`` by the famed Harvard Biochemist who previously wtote ``Consilience``. Have you read ``Chaos`` (about the unpredictability, due to exponential increase in the effect of finite changes, of extrapolation of non-linear equation as in fluid dynamics) by James Glick and my favorite ``Guns, Germs and Steel`` by Jarrod Diamond.

I am supporting Turkey-Korea final right now, although less likely. It would be fun to see two Asian countries from two corners of Asia fighting it out. However Korea has little chance against Germany, if they first win again Spain. I think tonight Turkey will muscle past through skinny guys of Senegal. In many ways Turkish team looks like Germans, tall and muscular - an advantage during corner kicks and in air. I support for Africa but not against Asia. I think India and PAkistan should try to prepare a joint team for the next world cup, may be even a Punjabi team, like Scotland who likes to field a separate team.I guess in India, Bengal has the best soccer players and in Pakistan, little known Makranis from the coast of Balochistan whose ancestors came from East Africa.

Harpeet, anNy, Sub, Zafar

Whoops, wrong lit board-check out Dissing Ideologies for my book list!

Rsax, Sadna

No Pakistani will come to save you?

Oof, what am I, chopped liver?

indignantly yours,

-S

re: pankaj

{since most of us have been bitten by World Cup bug, let us disclose our favourrite teams.}

...senegal`s challenged to take on the indian and pakistani teams at the same time...they`re not afraid, since neither is ranked in the top 100 :)...