Bitter, Not Sweet

Ref Analyst of All Things #13
[I have always felt that the people flying the F-16s and protecting Karachi, while risking their lives, making 1/20th the salary that you (and I) make are doing far more for Karachi than you are.]
Is this something like they were doing in the US? You have F-16s patrolling the skies over Karachi to protect against airliners flying into tall buildings?
[go stand at the border and risk your life to protect Karachi against an Indian attack.]
We don`t want Karachi. In fact, we don`t want Pakistan. The more I reflect, the more I agree with that dear boy Yasser Latif Hamdani that Jinnah was the best friend India ever had. I mean, here was a guy who understood perfectly what an Islamist thug would be like and chose to take a very large number of them out of India. How can one be not grateful for that? After seeing exactly what is happening in Pakistan, most Indians (including Advani) are saying: ``There, but for the grace of God, go I``.
[Why don`t you try to reform Islam from the inside, instead of declaring yourself a Buddhist and then hurling abuses at Islam...]
Can you say ``blasphemy``?
[I know judges and soldiers and police officers who are in situations where they can be killed in Pakistan, but that doesn`t stop them from serving their country.]
Particularly, when serving the country means handing out death sentences for blasphemy. This seems to be the current legal trend in Pakistan.

AllahDitta: Drought? What drought? The people here are obsessed with other issues. All you need is resume that states “once served in military” and tell everybody to shut up. The magic stick is risking your life by serving in the armed forces and all past, present and future sins are forgiven. No matter they fail to see sarcasm in ``who cares about Karachi`` from a Karachi-born with part of his skin buried in Karachi. No matter that they have repeatedly used abuse for elected representatives with 2/3 majority, referring to them as ``bari tind and choti tind`` but if another person uses mf, ah and bc for two real and one imaginary well-deserving generals, their patriotism, morality standards and what-not wakes up.
Who has said anything about F-16 pilots or their salaries? But the careless recycling of the same two-pages over and over ignores relevance or irrelevance. It has to be two pages, 10 paragraphs else not worth posting. Why it hurts so much to label Zia and Musharraf something that few others disagree? Is it not true that Zia got 2 squadrons and Mush is asking for 4 squadrons of F-16s? Who were/ are they accountable to, for spending?
The quagmire we are in is primarily of these peoples’ making. The 40 percent of the budget is chewed up every year and 70 percent of the debt is due to military spending and purchases of the past. Yet it is intolerable for resume-waving people to even take any criticism in least word count abbreviations. What would you call a person who takes revenge from employer for suffering humiliation for being fired? Is ah such a bad term for this individual. And what did Zia do to be respected? Serving the nation and Islam in order to make billions for him? If serving and sacrificing once is the only criteria then BB`s father has sacrificed his life - the ultimate sacrifice - and daughter of a shaheed deserves much better respect, much better than Musharraf or Zia.

ummm... I dont remember... I`ve never been good with names... but, I think whoever wrote it died from dehydration a long time ago.

Adnan (or anyone else. . .)
Who wrote those lines you quoted in #22?

For Karachi:

Jo Ubur yuhaan say uthay gaa, woh saaray jahaan peh bursay gaa
Yeh sheh`r humeshaa tursaa hai, yeh sheh`r humeshaa tursay gaa

I don`t understand. What are you trying to say? A four year old child was brutally shot to death practically in front of your house and you are pointing out things about which country has suffered how much? Forget the countries. What did you as a human being do about the child? How can people recover from such shocks so quickly? The first instinct is not to attend to the burials of the innocent or leave the house and help the victims in the next building - ask if they need tea, coffee, food, blankets...but rather log on to the internet to pour forth a diatribe ... against whom? And for what purpose?

How can you see clearly who is to blame, when the tears in the eyes have not dried up yet? Or did you not cry at all?

**I`m sorry, this is brutal what I`ve written, but I mean it...Sitting so far away, I am in shock. How can u be immune?**

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Romair # 13...

I dont disagree with much of your criticism on sameerJB`s post. People who feel that their articulation skills give them the right to cirticise whatever they like can only be put in the category of educated bigots. Plus it is more than valid that a person who has done something to try solve a problem has the right to be its critic. I dont believe that he or anyone of his ilk have even raised a finger to help anyone except their own ........

however, you repeatedly try to acquit the pak army from the ills inflicted on pakistan. An f-16 pilot or a soldier manning his post may not be indicted. But the policies pursued by the army brass have brought nothing but problems for Pakistan. I dont need to reiterate our army`s conduct for the past 50 years. Their crimes are very well known. They have turned pakistan from an state with an army to an army with a state... practially the definition of a banana republic. Whenever the generals have tried to take matters into their own hand, it has back fired onto them. But they never seem to quit making the same mistakes again and again. The army should stick to its job of protecting the country from any aggressor and let the politicians do their job of running the country. Its a very simple matter.

It must refrain from trying to use its military wisdom to solve a nations problem. It will never work.. never has..

Shut up already!
This their party - you can come if you really want to - but don`t expect their gratitude, their affection, their anything - This is about their world, in their play, they play all the major roles, the bit actors are generally grateful for the work - so shut up, already. - Go mouth off about ``soverngty of Parliament`` or ``English democracy`` support the democractic struggle of the heroic tennant farmers taking industrila action against owners and rulers or some such lunacy, get a few lines of mention as the bit player - the review is usually not about bit players. Either way, a little gratitude from the likes of yuo will go a long way.

Romair #13,

That was a brilliant summation; I agree with everything you wrote in that article 100%--even though a lot of the criticism is valid for me too as I am also not living in Pakistan. BUT I really do want to go to Pakistan after finishing my PhD insha Allah and help it and also to live there.

***
Bina,

Nicely written piece as ever. Yet I can`t help thinking that the Americans dont care about the deaths of others--especially Muslims so no matter HOW much Pakistan helps it (which in my opinion is a mistake which we will pay heavily for) in its so-called fight against ``terror`` (read Islam and especially political Islam) we will never get the thanks for it other than occasional lip-service.

The person I feel sorry for is the little girl and her parents.

And I have no sympathy whatsoever with the misguided fanatics who did this shoot-out. What purpose did it serve? How did it help Islam?

***

Ref # 4.. sameerJB

I cant think of one reason, why you always have to bring Islam and muslims in the mess that politicians create. That verse from Iqbal is not meant for zia ul haq or for that matter musharraf. It represents and ideal human bieng according to a faith, that u happen to resent. Islam has been abused by all who have lived in pakistan for 50 years. The leaders have used it to satiate their hunger to play king makers and wht not and the public has used it to vent its fury of despair. Bigorty, intolerence and self righteousness are symptoms of a disease called ``collective frustration``. They have acquired the name of Islam in pakistan.

In your blind appreciation of all that is western, you easily forget that Islam and its empires have provided a stable mode of goverence and social structure to the people of this world for centuries.

Only thing wrong with this era is that muslims never had a chance to evolve to accept challanges of modernity. And that is only because of constant meddelling of those western powers in their affairs since the world war. Why dont they just leave the miserable people of this religion alone. They have installed, nourished and supported the most tyrinical and oppressive regimes in these countries for more than half a century.
(The big bogey man, Osama bin ladin.... was brought into the lime light... none other than the CIA during the afghan war. Saddam was SUPPLIED and encouraged to use chemical weapons in its eight year war against Iran.)

Yes, Imperialism, profanity, decadence, pornography, alcohol, pork, .... are denounced by anything Islamic and for good reasons. I dont believe that any civilization needs the above as its corner stones. (these might be your personal predilictions!!)

As for liberalism, western culture, godless science.... they can be viewed in an skeptical light and can be assimilated to some extent into an Islamic society. But such a transition would take a long time to come about. Specially with people like.. arafat, mubarak, musharraf, various kings of the arab world.. choking the very life out of their subjects.

Romair

Sir Ji

Rabb Tuade Khair kare.

The protector of the Watan is not able to solve the problem of farmers in interior districts who are dying of drought and poverty.
If miltary reposnible for country then they need to take care of people`s problems. Protecting the country not excuse for looting country.

Bina
One must seek answers to your questions with a sincere heart. If helping Afghans is being considered a sacrifice ask the generals who made zillions out of it. Afghans could have been helped by setting up universities , schools and hospitals. Why did that not happen?

You cannot surely lose sight of the puppets that are willing to be played by puppetters for small change, big pocket money and some toys. Do not blame others for what has passed?

Get rid of the puppets and try to be on your own for a change.

Khuda Hafiz

Sameer #4: ``a mf general...ah general...bc general``

One should not use abusive language. You are slowly turning into a fanatic. It is the conflict between the religious fanatics and the fanatics of your variety, that is destroying Pakistan.

``parked facing Mecca. Who cares about Karachi...Don`t we appreciate verses like, ``tu shaheeN hey basaira ker pahaRoN kee chatanuN maiN``? ``

The people who care about Karachi are living in Karachi, trying to do something to solve the problems. Others like yourself (and me, for that matter, though I did serve my country for twelve years) have the luxury of sitting on the sidelines cursing them. Instead of cursing, perhaps you should go to Karachi and help out. I have always felt that the people flying the F-16s and protecting Karachi, while risking their lives, making 1/20th the salary that you (and I) make are doing far more for Karachi than you are. I am not sure why you think you have the moral highground to crticize them. If anything they should be criticizing you, for getting an education at the country`s expense, and then abandoning it.

I would be interested in finding out how long you have ever worked in Pakistan for the government or how long you paid taxes there in a private enterprise. Since I think people like yourself, who don`t do anything, except abuse others for the problems of Pakistan, are infact one of the biggest problems of Pakistan.

How about doing something constructive for a change? Pakistan is, after all, in great need of Physics professionals. Instead of just going on and on with destructive abuse on Islam and anything else that doesn`t suit your fancy, why don`t you go to Karachi, settle down there, and work with the Edhis and the Cowasjees and the Imran Khans and Gen. Sabeehs, or go stand at the border and risk your life to protect Karachi against an Indian attack.

Why don`t you try to reform Islam from the inside, instead of declaring yourself a Buddhist and then hurling abuses at Islam (if you are Buddhist, then just leave Islam alone; who gave you a right to make fun of it, or of Pakistanis who follow it.) Only a sick mind makes fun of other religions. So what if someone will try to kill you if you try to constructively reform Islam. I know judges and soldiers and police officers who are in situations where they can be killed in Pakistan, but that doesn`t stop them from serving their country. Or at the very least, live in Karachi. Only then do you have a right to launch your abuse.

Whether Pakistanis go to Mecca or to anywhere else, what difference does it make to you? You have used that country, and are now living comfortably in the US. At least, have the courtesy of not abusing the religion they follow and the people who are their working for the country.

The more I read habitual critics, specially abusive ones with an axe to grind, who are unwilling to jump into the arean and spend their own time to solve a problem, the more I am begining to realize that they are part of the problem and not part of the solution. Anyone who really loves Pakistan would honestly work for it, in Pakistan. Then, they (like Hoodbhoy) have a right to be habitual critics. Everyone else, in my opinion, is trying to get cheap popularity, at Pakistan`s expense, and trying to turn themselves into a hero. This is what separates the likes of you from the likes of Hoodbhoys, Farzana Varseys and Arundhati Roys. This is also why, while, I don`t agree with much of Hoodbhoy`s criticism, I do respect him greatly. And while the two above-mentioned ladies critize many things in India (occassionally going overboard), I have never seen them criticize and abuse a whole religion or a whole profession or use dirty abusive acronyms for individuals they do not like. And they live in the system they are critical of, and are trying to fix it.

Rest assured, Sameer, a Pakistani F-16 pilot is doing a hell of a lot more for Pakistan than you ever have and will. I know some of them, and they are there in Pakistan, working for their country, dedicated to the core. And they would have the decency to not abuse you or abuse Buddhism. I would take them over someone with your thoughts, any day.

Since you have already disassociated yourself from Pakistan (physically) and Islam (emotionally), perhaps the best thing you could do is to now stop hurling abuses, at the complete group of peole who did honesly serve their country as F-16 pilots or as honest police officers or as honest shopkeepers and want to continue doing so, and at people who do happen to like Islam (like myself). Just mind your own business and let them mind their own business. They are not abusing you, why are you abusing them?

Ever heard the phrase about the chickens coming home to roost?

ferozk im afraid what your saying about khi is crap -- u say u left the city in 1981 -- i suppose that makes u eminently qualified to comment on what the city is like today ! hahhaah