Democracy is Like Virginity

Abrar:

first welcome to chowk…you are very kind when you say:

[…In reality, the much-hyped “continuity” is merely a codeword for the perpetuation of the hegemony of the military…]


...in Unraveling Pakistan I have written, “And those who think the coming elections would make a difference are in denial or delusional. Pakistan today is an occupied land. The Occupation Army has to be removed from the equation. Unless that is forced, nothing will change.``

rgds,

t

As long as Uncle Sam decides and Bubba applies the definition of virginity, Pakistani Democracy is on the way to sainthood.

Ras Siddiqui

I have read this one n South Asia Tribune. I do not know about Khmer Rogue analogy, but this time around, military establishment seems more determined than ever to colonize Pakistan. My feeling is that it has to do many factors.
The sacking of Musharraf before he could unleash 111 brigade on Islamabad was such a slap on COAS face that it waked them up to fast slipping away of hegemony. They want to make COAS sacking can impossible.
Musharraf, not being Punjabi or Pathan has to keep pleasing mostly Punjabi and Pathan generals, giving them more than they could get from a strong Pathan or Punjabi COAS. This is my guess and I know too well, who is going to challenge this statement. For example, Lt. General Mahmood Ahmed was retired, perhaps under pressure from US but he remained so strong even after his retirement to line up Tariq Aziz Warraich as Principal Secretary to the President, Mr. Randhava as Punjab chief secretary and Chaudharies of Gujrat from his jat baradri and changed Musharraf`s mind from propping up Imran Khan. Talk of influence of a retired Punjabi Jat general. Imagine another one who retired with him, Usmani, influencing Sindh or Karachi poltics.
His statement: ``to keep the Army out, you have to bring them in`` is like allowing the rapists to just walk in and have sex, so as not to be raped.
Third factor for Musharraf`s hardening stance has to do with going all out against BB and NS. He will be in serious trouble without power, if still in Pakistan.
Democracy has a set of principles as uts foundation. If foundations and compromised for the sake of power, it is no democracy even if it allows certain democratic principles such as freedom of press to continue.

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Ref AAmir #4
[Are bhay why not Pregnancy or dead,married,there are many things that is or NOT ......why choose Virginity .
DEMOCRACY is just the last antibiotic produced by the western masters.
We all know hoe ineffective penicillin has become in fact all the latest ones are useless too .Does that mean non westerners never treated infections with sulphur ,barks of cholchicine tree,or antimony against syphyllis.]
When you are willing to treat your syphilitic daughter or son with antimony, you can tell the masses that you will treat THEIR syphilis with antimony. So long as you want penicillin or some other antibiotic for yourself and your family, don`t tell the rest of the world that they should undergo bloodletting, cupping or some other 18th century practice.
[CHINA, TAIWANS,.Korea ,SINGAPORE (HONG KONG)have acjieved progress without Democracy .]
Of these, China, Singapore and Hong Kong will NEVER have democracy. Taiwan is democratic just to show the mainlanders what they are missing. Till a half-dozen years ago, Taiwan was as repressive a system as mainland China. Now that they want to remain independent of China, they are adopting democracy so that the US cannot sell them down the river.
[In the recent times, there exist no state that achieved prosperity through democracy starting off poor and backward.
The ones that that achieved prosperity through non-demcratic means can now make a smooth and effectuive transition to one: South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore, China etc ]
Per capita FDI into Pakistan was at least as great as that into China in the 1980s. That money never went into schools, factories, etc., but into buying opium and trading that in the international market to make more money for the generals, into F-16s and into madrassahs. You reap what you sow. Zia ul-Haq could have asked for factories to make Nike shoes but he didn`t. China has existed as a Communist country one year less than Pakistan and still is far ahead of Pakistan. There is NO hope for Pakistan if the current spending patterns are not mended. All India has to do is to double its Defence spending -- that would put it at par with Pakistan for Defence as a %age of total budget -- and Pakistan would go bankrupt. Pakistan has spent its patrimony for the last 55 years and there ain`t much left.
[The reasons are not hard to find. The freedoms associated with democracy becomes too wild for a population, that is uneducated, unindustrialized etc. You put instability on top of that, you have no chance]
Why don`t you try that on the illiterate and unruly UP bhaiyyas and Biharis in India? Last time, it was Indira Gandhi who tried it and we all know where it got her.

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Dear Author,
Without knowing anything about the Pakistan political scene here are some general comments. Musharraf is able to do what he does because there is no sizeable expression of consensus opposing him. It is difficult to have a functioning democracy if there is no wide and demonstrable consensus in favor of it.

Musharraf will have to respond if and when political parties can show that they can build up a sizeable and coherent body of public opinion on any issue of national/regional interest.

To begin with, it seems Musharraf will face a parliamentary consensus against himself and his amendments. But until the public opinion or nationwide consensus is not awakened to match this parliamentary consensus, he will be able to get away with manipulating parliament(arranging defections, having a puppet prime minister, paying off key members with favors, or outright dismissing parliament).

The same thing will happen in every matter in which the majority of elected assembly differs with him, unless the public is shown to support the majority of the elected assembly(and the usual method of engineering violence in the streets by party members willnot convince but will only be condemned).

So instead of banking on the strength of their elected members or their existing organisation(or solely on the rosy cheeks of their most famous leaders), before or after the election, political parties and leaders will need to start at the very beginning, ie go back and win the support and consensus of ordinary people, issue by issue, region by region, neighbourhood by neighbourhood.

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arjun_m,

Bhai arjun,
You are always right about Pakistanis and I am extremely impressed with your profound knowledge of that country and its people.But here you are being unfair to Pakistan. Mr Shah aka 12-head with 30 different nicks is an Indian.If you are intrested, proof can be provided on request.Now that it has been cleared,would you APOLOGISE to Pakistanis ?

Regards.

Ref Studebaker #11
[I have no problem EXCLUDING ALL pharmaceuticals .The payoff will be trillion$ to be invested in preventive medicine,home care ,nutrition ,& exercise like 5 times compulsory namaz....u think its crazy]
Man, you are the pill pusher here. If you don`t want to get paid for writing prescriptions, that is fine with me.

As to namaaz as exercise, may I pass? I don`t think the Saudis are all that healthy.

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dos-mitter sahib -- indeed Chief Musharraf thinks that -- by putting all his eggs in American basket -- all his five fingers are in ghee ---- his Indians are at bay -- and his politicians are in a dog house -- and his throne is personally gaurded by General Rumsy.

hence the ever increasing imbecile arrogance

But he is divinely delusional and congenitally concieted -- if he thnks -- it`s not all MAYA.

when the going gets tough for miaN Musharraf -- the American toughs won`t get going --

as the history of American promiscuity with regard to sleeping with ANY dictator suggests --

they will drop him lik a bad smelly egg with pinched noses -- just like that --

Mr. Musharraf will be a muhrless divorcee in a flash -- by only one `Tilaq diya` -- not three.

as Banjara sahib would like to remind Bey JahaaN Panaah Musharraf:

``sub thaaath paRaa ruh jawe gaa jub laad chalegaa banjara``...