Unraveling Pakistan: Taming The Shrew-Mare

Finally, someone has done something more than criticism. I liked the idea of citizen`s coalitions. This is a viable solution which may definitely work in the long run.

However, idea of defanging of army seniors also do not seem far fetched. Why do you think the army is at the borders for the past six months. But you cannot hold army there forever. I am surprised at Hindus who do not question their government, how is infiltration possible with one million men standing on guard with their hands on the triggers. May be they know the answer, may be they don`t.

Tu na waaqif-e aadaab-e ghulami hai abhi..........(From Zerqa)

Ras Siddiqui

``...let a moderate vibrant confident pakistan emerge...a real independent Pakistan not an Army-occupied Pakistan...help us get there first...``

The Indians can help, but only if you want to be helped. I don`t want to sound condescending but sometimes our ``Bania`` mentality helps in international relations..more so than a severe ideological approach.

Look at the similarities of India and Pakistan and compare them to the Indo-Chinese equation. Even the war between India and China occured in 1962, the last confrontation actually took place in Sumdorong Chu as recently in 1986. It was after the Sumdorong Chu glacier face off that Deng invited Rajeev Gandhi and proposed a status quo type solution to the border issues while focusing on building relationships in other areas. In the Indo-Chinese case, mind you it is India which is the weaker party and also considers itself to be aggrieved. Even though the idea came from the Chinese, Rajeev Gandhi, to his credit recognized the reality of the situation and agrred to transform Indo-Chinese relationships.

Now I wouldn`t call India and China friends because of the Pakistan issue, but at least economic co-operation is increasing exponentially. Indian companies are opening manufacturing plants in China. The Chinese consider India an excellent source of knowledge enhanced software products. A similar model can be set up with India and Pakistan as mutual beneficiaries, but the change has to come from within Pakistan. This is what the Lahore yatra was about, and this is what we were hoping for in Agra, but we got a lecture on national TV on what we already knew about Pakistan`s stated policy on Kashmir.

If the start and end of Kashmir is the issue then we don`t come close to a solution ever, because there is absolutely no common ground. At all.

So why not look at the problems we can solve rather than one we cannot?

Zafar:

``HaaN ji, and what if the Indian Army suddenly decides that it gets the same salaries and perks that officers of the Pakistani Army get, then what?``

Heh heh heh, ussey kahengey Soney pey Suhaaga. After all if our jarnails get some compensation for 30 years of kick starting their Bajaj scooters, usmey kya kharabi ho sakti hai? ;)

#11 by aisha_sarwari:

[...Because the power structures today are so deeply ingrained and almost impossible to correct or change, it is naiveté to hope that some sort of Marxist, Socialist reform will balance power. The draconian laws, the religious chains can only be countered from within...]

---if the last 55 years are any indication at all then the only logical conclusion that can be reached is that change cannot be implemented from `within` as you suggest...the army has to be removed from the equation...

and 12 by aisha_sarwari:

[...Its Election eve in Pakistan. Can`t we have some good wishes, hopes and plans?...]

---why?...if we have not learned anything by now we do not deserve empty platitudes and wishes...tell you what...if we are still around...let us re-visit these `elections` and any changes that emanate from it one year from now and see who is proven right?

#13 by godot:

[...No offence, t, but this article is insane. You sure can`t be serious...!!!]

..shhhhhh!...bhai bhari mehfil main kuch tou humara bharam rakh liji`aye! Aisi baataiN khaamoshi say kehtay haiN...waisay aap nay bilkul sahi pehchana

#14 by Essensaur:

[...The jazbaati psyche of Pakistanis has been a problem throughout for it own good, and has been harnesed by the religious, political a well as military leadership for short-ighted goal and narrow objectives....]

---thanks for you kind words!...

...if we can highlight one lesson from the Raj we desis have learned and improved upon it will have to be `divide and rule`...the british left us in high school and we have doctorates in the art of divide and rule...the Army and its vested cohorts have excelled in this...is this jazbaati psyche?...

[...Your proposed CC and the recommended action plan seems to presume a widepread enlightened consensus, or a charismatic leadership perhaps more powerful than Mr. Jinnah. How do you see it coming about, and how soon?..]

---who knows?...

...the only thing that is widespread and existing at the moment is the frustrations of the `ordinary` people...they have not much else to lose...hence...everything is possible....sooner or later...

#17 by nooralain:

[...But i really do have to question the notion of selling our `ideal` to Uncle Sam, and expecting them not to get involved for the long haul...inviting Uncle Sam to help us with anything involves a price...a price that many other countries have had to pay dearly for...]

---what is the alternative for a country that has nuclear weapons?...we have to get US and others onboard if this clean-up and good-riddance operation has any chance of success...

lve, rgds.

temporal

t:

There were supposedly 12 Ceasers and their stories span everything from infanticide to patricide to rebellion. You name the intrigue and they had it. But the common man`s plight was little changed by what went on inside the walls of their palaces. Did the populace really care or more importantly did they really care what happened to them?

Pakistan is a modern day Rome where the Ceaser of the time allows his gladiators to fight amongst themselves with HIS set of rules. The public watches the gory spectacle and goes home to its miserable existence day in and day out. These things can last for a long long time. In the meantime watch your diet, exercise regularly and read Conrad. Oh and keep some cash in the mattress.....just in case if Armageddon comes about during your lifetime........

later
-sac

Reply Pmishra2 #5

“And what of LK Advani? Your proposal will leave him bereft of any agenda, he can no longer just sit on his ass and grumble all day about the bad, bad Pakis.”

You, Sir, exemplify the best of the Gandhian tradition – concern for every living thing, no matter how base and apparently vile. I am in awe, we all have much to learn from you.

Salaam e dua.



Reply Stuka #4

“ Since comparisons to India are made at every stage, let there be a comparison of military perks as well. The people of Pakistan should demand that senior military officers get the same salaries and perks that the officers of the Indian Army get...”

HaaN ji, and what if the Indian Army suddenly decides that it gets the same salaries and perks that officers of the Pakistani Army get, then what?

Comparisons zara khatarnak ho sakte haiN, na…



Reply Aisha

Aishaji - most of us from iss paar on Chowk actually DO wish the Pakistani people well - but our own experience of personality cult politics has left us with a distrust for them - good institutions, no matter how unglamorous, always outperform good individuals - not least because good individuals are still only human, and hence corruptable, and with great power are greatly corrupted. Regards (and yes, good wishes and good luck for the election.)

temporal,
A bold article with some original ideas. I am not sure however, if it is not wishful thinking. I dont see genuine national level leadership in Pak that can rally people against the army and the ruling class. Someone like a Gandhi or Nehru or even an Indira Gandhi... possibly ZA Bhutto before he was hanged could have been that rallying point. As others have pointed out, it will be very difficult for civilians to take on the army.
India is not going to risk a nuke attack to `free` Pakistanis, US and China would not like the instability and uncertainity that an overthrow of the army would bring.
I think it would be better for Pakistanis to take small steps, like capping spending on defence, undoing some of the changes made to their Constitution by the army, reducing `Islamization` of the army and so on. But everything depends upon good leadership and some kind of grass roots movement - unfortunately I dont think neither is on the horizon.
Best case scenario for Pakistanis is if the US puts Pakistan on the `axis of evil` and gives the ruling clique a bambu up its ass. This would pave way for a US owned democractically elected PM, lots of US dollars, a solution to its problems with India etc. Only the US can take on the Pak army, not India.

temporal miaN u r 100% right -- Musharraf`s army is THE problem -- not THE solution --

the wild mare has to be broken -- the rogue kid has to be taught table manners -- the dog has to be inoculated against rabies -- the unpredictable cat has to be belled --

the old 64 dollar Question is -- who will bell the crazy cat --

temporal mian you ARE a supremely optimistic man -- u deserve the credit for thinking loudly the unthinkable -- what most people are wondering silently -- all over the world.

where on earth -- a soldier/robber can go so beserk -- as to grab an ordinary democratic government -- at gunpoint -- and run away with it -- in broad day light --

and then -- has the audacity to come back as the CEO/President of that stolen property -- renaming it -- as an extraordinary ``real`` democracy``!!!

- no doubt THAT cat burgler has to be collared -- and kicked back in the barracks --

the question is who and how --

when the Thief is the Chief -- and the Chief Justices are Thief`s chelum orderlies -- where the CC will takes it case -- in whose court?

Anyway -- you ARE a very courageous man -- temporal miaN -- for thinking the unthinkable -- bless you -- and more power to your pen and your dreams --

Indeed -- right now -- it`s the corrupt Pakistani army -- that needs to be REFORMED -- real urgently -- and much more extensively -- than the corrupt Pakistani politician. Period.

and thanks for the honor.

hasan

Ref Salwar #12

[What have nukes got to do with anything? We don`t have to fall prey to the racism that somehow suggests Pakistan, or even India can`t take care of thier weapons, while the rest of the world can.]

With two missile tests in less than a week, one would think that Pakistan is rattling the saber. With about 800 dead in Kashmir, one could think that the policy of a thousand cuts has not been put aside.

By the way, Lee Kwan Yew of Singapore made the comment that the Chinese are not irrational, they won`t use their nukes first; the Indians are not irrational, they won`t start a nuclear war. What and why he left unsaid about Pakistan should give pause to all.

[Its Election eve in Pakistan. Can`t we have some good wishes, hopes and plans?]

Let me see; when Musharraf called the elections in Kashmir a sham, I asked how many Pakistanis would like to see it conducted under the rules in place for Pakistani elections. There were no takers.

It is not that I don`t have good wishes for the PEOPLE of Pakistan but this election ain`t the way to get to democracy (read, people`s will).

What you have is the rubber-stamping of military rule.

PS. Did you watch ``The Daily Show`` with Jon Stewart? Both yesterday and today, Pakistan was featured prominently.

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Trying to de-fang the Pakistani army?

The people will need to first to remove the venom first. Until they are obsessed about Kashmir they will be in conflict with India and they will need a big Army. Only too desperately. Desperation to save them when India counters. De-vemonize, Pakistan; teach your kids economics instead of Jihad, and then you wouldn`t need the fangs to deliver the venom.

temporaloo..
the whole idea behind this essay was for people to discuss ways and means of implementing something other than the status quo of the occupying army...instead you appear to be receiving the verbal stone-throwing of a `majnoon`. I will try not to cast any stones myself.

Yes, this is idealistic, but you do say that this is in the nature of a probe. I like the ideal of a Citizen`s coalition, grass-roots organizing, it may seem radical and revolutionary, but i think such a coalition is vital in re-energizing the qaum.
But i really do have to question the notion of selling our `ideal` to Uncle Sam, and expecting them not to get involved for the long haul...inviting Uncle Sam to help us with anything involves a price...a price that many other countries have had to pay dearly for. Need I give you examples? I think you know quite a bit of `history`. Reading this reminded me of going to a forum regarding Iraq, and listening to a lovely Iraqi-American woman articulate how it should not be up to America or any other country to determine who should be in power in Iraq...it must be up to the Iraqis themselves. The same applies here to some extent. The citizens of Pakistan alone must determine who is to govern their nation...whether it is in the form of a coalition, or not. I`m not advocating isolationism here...I just feel that while we may make our intentions known to US..the coalition will back up its words by its actions for all the world to see that we are NOT a threat, nor do we want to be a threat to anyone...we want our country to be free of the yoke of military occupation, and we want to see it grow and flourish. There must be other ways to do that without too much involvement from the empire.
Dunno if this is making any sense...but my atthani worth, for now.
love,
noor

temporal mian,

....... i read your treatise very very carfully, but i still don`t know what am i supposed to do .......... where is this country club (CC), and how do i become a member? .......... you see, we all know what the problem is, we don`t have the foggiest idea what the solution is? ........ i am one of those simple minded people who think bb and ns and the nawabzada were doing just fine .............sooner or later they would have worked it out if only the army had stayed out of their dirty business ......... now musharraf thinks he can make turkis out of us, but like i said to this turkish bawd, `` zabaan e yaar e mun turkie, wa mun turkie nami danum``............actually i really love the next line which proves that amir khusro invented french kissing .................

... what the heck am i talking about ...........che khush boodi agar boodi zabanash dar dahanay mun...... ..........

Temporal:

The army is the problem- not solution. The statement to that effect says it all.

Aisha sarwari:

KSE? You cannot be serious to use THAT as a predictor of economic well being???!! PTCL and HUBCO and another company (maybe Dewan Salman) is all KSE is. Those three companies have the majority in trading volume. THREE. That`s IT. Since I have forgotten the exact figures, it should not boggle your mind to find out that KSE`s rise has correlated with the truce between the govt/WAPDA and the international power companies who were given a red carpet reception to rule the electricity utilities. WAPDA (and KESC also i think) had agreed to buy ALL the electricity produced by those power companies at those towering rates. We`ve ended up with a surplus but due to the signed contracts the laws of demand are defied (the prices cannot be brought down) and we`re stuck with uneccessary electricity at uneccesarily high prices.

HUBCO can`t lose. KSE will rise and rise. But please don`t gloat over it. If you were the one having to pay the monstrous electricity bills, you would not be happy.

No, the faujiz aren`t directly responsible for this. But behind every other sham lurks a parasite in an ugly green khaki.

Dear Temporal Sahib,

Your are a poet and an idealist; you are a radical revolutionary yet have humanitarian biases; you are a pragmatic realist and yet believe in miracles; you love your people that you left behind voluntarily; you have the clarity to go to the gist of problem, yet you display a disdain for apparently insurmountable obstacles; you want to cater to the concerns of the world vis-a-vis the nation you want to fix, but you also want to change the cherished preferences and myths of it citizens...

But having read your lines over the years at Chowk, I refuse to call these inner contradictions. I call it thinking out of the box. Loved it ... thank you.

Without meaning to brusqulely critique something you mut have agonized over for very very long, I want to say something that occurred to me when I read your article.

The jazbaati psyche of Pakistanis has been a problem throughout for it own good, and has been harnesed by the religious, political a well as military leadership for short-ighted goal and narrow objectives. Your proposed CC and the recommended action plan seems to presume a widepread enlightened consensus, or a charismatic leadership perhaps more powerful than Mr. Jinnah. How do you see it coming about, and how soon?

Sincerely,
E