Kissinger of Death

shankar bhai #56, ``beauty pagents are necessary for pretty women...
where else can a pretty girl stand on stage in front of millions & say things like ``if i get crowned `miss world`, i will work for world peace!``-- & be taken seriously!?:) ``

it`s painful to see that. someone should do a study on how many beauty pageant winners actually went on to do something substantial....except for vanessa williams with her lovely voice.

``afterall, pakistani women are the leaders of world morality...the most efficient breeding machines in the world...thanks to their men who have trained them so well... ``

i don`t think anyone said that, you`re just causing trouble :) as usual.
considering the population of India, we might say Indian women are the most `efficient breeding machines.` ;)

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Pankaj #58
No question, everyone must have the inalienable right to their individual choices and we must uphold it, but the environment and social conditioning in which these choices are made are also someone`s responsibility.

For example, my very talented cousin who grew up in white suburban US would relate how girls didnot like to ask questions in class in high school because the teachers and their classmates tended to `stereotype` such girls as nerds. I doubt that sort of negative connotation was associated with the prom homecoming queen. Thats undoubtedly one reason why for example, fewer girls choose to go for the science and engineering disciplines in the US. Whereas in India, education of ANY kind is still viewed in the middle class as making a girl more fit to tackle an uncertain future (often more fit merely to be married off), so often half the engineering class is female. Which individual choice/social conditioning is `better`?

As far as holding beauty contests or Valentine day celebrations are concerned, I regard it as a fundamental privilege of participants. Everyone has a personal sphere of activities and a public sphere of interactions with the society. Any act which does not harm any other person directly or interfere with anyone else`s freedom is a ``personal act``. I resent any interference in this ``personal sphere`` by the ``thekedars of morality``, be it Mullah, VHP or any one else. If somebody wants to participate in a beauty contest, she is making a personal decision that doesn`t directly harm the others. If you dont want to watch a paegent or consider it a depravity, change the channel and watch some thing more ``moral``. Let me define according to this view what constitutes immoral. If you cheat your partner in a business or accept a bribe, it is a ``public act`` since your act directly harms someone else. Such kinds of acts would be called immoral. Most of these ``thekedars of morality`` are mired in corruption and they have some temerity to ban Valentine`s Day Celebration/beauty paegent calling it immoral !!! The right thinking people need to get together to defend the liberties of a person in this ``personal sphere`` before the thekedars of morality take over.

# 55 AAMIR
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Its one thing Madison ave .would like us to belive that but Elizabeth Taylor marrie many men for other reasons including a Construction worker Larry Fortado (?)Financillay independent women dont care for degree of wealth.
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In which Madrassa did you learn your english. Your posts are almost impossible to understand.

So now Liz Taylor represents the ``Financillay independent`` woman........Now I really want to know which madrassa you went to.

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scouty,

beauty pagents are necessary for pretty women...
where else can a pretty girl stand on stage in front of millions & say things like ``if i get crowned `miss world`, i will work for world peace!``-- & be taken seriously!?:)

wow..mullah urstruly actually went to a pakistani beauty pagent?!...
tauba tauba...
if pakistani women start doing these things, then i`m afraid the world is going to the dogs...
afterall, pakistani women are the leaders of world morality...the most efficient breeding machines in the world...thanks to their men who have trained them so well...

hassann #51 You may also credit Kissinger with being Nixon`s agent in engineering the rapprochement with China. This was a strategic move that made the world a safer place for everyone. Also it seems that during these times Kissinger made full use of the limelight to, shall we say, enrich his personal life (it used to be said that he was ``Kissinger by day, kissing her by night``). Poor Clinton tried to pull off the same trick with disastrous results. Credit Kissinger for being strategic in both foreign policy and in personal affairs, or you may consider him merely lucky he did not have political enemies who were as ruthless as the Gingrich republicans. Either way, Clinton got fried, while Kissinger became a celebrity for doing the same thing.

Rehan:

Your observations are factually wrong and flawed although I believe that Kissinger is not the best man for this job. Kissnger does have a sense of history and he alongwith Nixon in fact changed the course of history.

Kissinger was not the person who started the Viet Nam war, nor he was the person who brought the peace to the Middle East. The so called Domino Theory was not his invention. The left leaning liberals of Kennedy era including Robert Mcnamara started this Viet Nam War.

Kissinger and Nixon started reducing the forces in Nam gradually to save the honour and prestige of the USA. Read and you will find that his efforts were mainly to negotiate orderly withdrawal.

You may not like it, but he is strategic thinker of the World affairs and there is hardly anyone who has come along to guide American foreign policy.

I will say that Clinton in his second term emerged as a president with a first hand knowledge of World. He followed centrist policies.
I know that some readers will condemn his personal character but that would be an immature and idiotic response.

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hamidm2 #47
``they seem to have their heads screwed on right when it comes to beauty paegents ``

IMO, the Indian attitude is rather schizophrenic. Amitabh Bachchan`s co suffered huge losses because protests in Bangalore forced the Ms World event to leave India and his company is reportedly still paying off its debts.

On the other hand the Indian Ms Worlds and Ms Universes are celebrated as heroines and minor beauty pageants are proliferating.

A few `culture-preservers` got the UP govt. to ban pagaents and there is always an uproar about Valentine`s Day. But I have never heard these pious folks holding any protests against dowry or foeticide or degrading stereotypes of women in Indian movies !

I am schizophrenic too and cannot support this proliferation of pagaents but if an Aishwarya Rai or any other Indian woman speaking confidently for herself on world TV can get many Indians to view daughters as potential achievers more than potential dead weights, I cannot oppose that totally either. There is a fine line between celebration and objectification of womanhood!

Coming to poor urstruly, IMO, career Islamists and beauty contests both get the women angle wrong. The career Islamists want to hide women and commercialism of the west wants to display them, both for the same reasons, because they both think women are sex objects. As for meaningful ways of respecting women, the West at least counterbalances its objectification with real measures unlike the orthodoxy.

scout ....

..... it is not an ``either/or`` thing - as long as she gets a minimum of 1400 on her SAT (which she did), she can do anything she wants ......... and really, it is not a question of what you or i or urstruly think is right and proper - we all have the right to do or not do something, we simply don`t have the right to tell other people what to do and then if they don`t do it go on a burning and killing rampage ........

........ and, oh by the way, mrs hamidm watched the entire victoria`s secret fashion show, even though i got thoroughly bored after the first five minutes and wanted to switch to cnn..........and here is a woman with enough brains for a clan of mad mullahs and their harem of virgins .........

P.S. ........ sadna, as horrible as the hindoos might be, they seem to have their heads screwed on right when it comes to beauty paegents ..... other than that idiot who set himself on fire - goes to show there is an idiot in every tribe ..............

might as well appoint sharon to implement a u.s. mid-east policy:

``_ _ _ But Mr. Abrams`s selection this week as President Bush`s director of Middle Eastern affairs at the White House plunged him into one of the sharpest disputes in the nation`s capital — the one in the administration over how to deal with the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Mr. Abrams`s appointment thrilled those who had criticized the administration for being too tough on Israel and too deferential to the Palestinians. But it dismayed those, especially at the State Department, who want Israel to ease its crackdown in the West Bank and Gaza.

An administration official said Mr. Abrams`s ascension had created ``serious consternation`` at the State Department. It was seen there, he said, as likely to impede the efforts of Secretary of State Colin L. Powell to work with European nations to press Israel and the Palestinians to adopt a staged timetable leading to creation of a Palestinian state in three years.

_ _ _ Mr. Abrams comes to his new job trailed by a cloud of controversy, most of it having to do with his pleading guilty in 1987 to the charge that he withheld information from Congress on the Reagan administration`s efforts to assist antigovernment guerrillas in Nicaragua.

He was pardoned by the first President Bush in December 1992. At the time, plenty of people around Washington said Mr. Abrams would never be back as a policy maker``

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hamidm2 #32
Are you feeling quite well? Thanks. Your posts have this let me see, addictive? quality, so I hope chowk realpolitic will continue to dictate references to horrible hindoos :).