Documentarians Hope to Enlighten Americans about Prophet

#126 by Ralph on December 27, 2002 1:49pm PT

And how would you know that? The Kashmiris came and told you? Ha

Well at least a few kashmiris did tell me that. I happened to visit Kashmir in 1985 for a few weeks. Almost whereever we went they would refer people(ie tourists) as coming from India.
Nearly a decade later I studied in a college in Bangalore where we had nearly 300 Kashmiri students, mostly muslims but a few pandits too. Four years of interaction with them left us (both hindu as well as muslims) with a reasonable idea that they more or less rejected the present political arrangement. They consider the orignal treaty that India signed with Kahsmir (which gave them a great deal of autonomy to them to manage their affairs)as the only way they will accept union with India. They are ambivalent about Pakistan(they wish it was a better place and more just) but they did not demonise it like most Indians do. A great many of them did not mind kashmir going with pakistan in case the orignal agreements were not honoured.

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Ummm, and you O Intelligent One would love to talk about UN resolutions of 1948 but
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You people are interested in real estate
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Your people killed Abdul Ghani Bhatt
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If they want to be independent of you, that is their problem and yours, not ours.
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``Retard is one who compares even his shit with what the pakistani shat``

You`re being way too metaphysical for me here

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Looks like you have spent the holidays in a druken binge or else your state of mind is a natrual retarded state.

First I did not bring up the UN resulution you did and when I commented on it I did not make any opinon on it. Now you are attrubuting it to me. Now is that clever?? may be 5 year school kids will regard it so or else people who are a bit retarded.

Lastly your whole arguments seem to be only on what the pakistanis did or did not (there is no reasoning with the actual facts or opinoins of the parties involved ie the Kashmiris.) do so my last comment still stands.

Fact briefly are that Sheik Abdullah the then commonly accepted leader of kashmiri people accepted union with India mainly on two considerations. He thought that kashmiris had a better future with India (which included Hindus and others ) and the rights of muslim kashmiris would be protected by having a Union with India but having a great deal of Autonomy (in all areas except foregin affairs, Defence and currency). Obviously he kept two points in mind when he decided to go with India. one pressures one from the Hindu monarch second was the possibility of (what he then smart solution)keeping the unique kashmiri identity intact (because assimiliation with pakistan may be without conditions and he could attach conditions if he acceded to India)
Thus the union with kashmir was attached with some conditions to be met ie a great deal of regional Autonomy. India agreed to these condtions at that time and even for a period of time Nehru wanted to come up with his side of the bargain. However this did not materialise on the ground. Paksitan occupied a part of kashmir and the Indian govt took this as a licence to shy away from the agreed points. Subsequently the various govts while not deniying the agreements have tried to subvert these promises and thus the disenchantment of kashmiris.
Pakistan did exploit this disenchantment just like India did in Bangladesh.

So here you have two govts who suppressed people and in both countries they refuse to aknowledge the wrong and correct the mistakes.
In pakistan there is a bleated recognition of the wrongs done in bangladesh by a small section of people. India too a similar view is taking place in some of the leadership and is clearly reflected in a acknowledgement in parts of the media and people who influnce policy makers.

I wonder if your retarded mind will be able to see the truth.

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I, like the Indian government, am all for negotiations as long as they are within the parameters of the Indian constitution.
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The Indian Constituion would of course mean honouring the agreements signed by the leaders and of course honouring the wishes of people. and adhering to the various articles like A 370 etc.

I have a fair idea that this is not your take on the constitution.

For you it is only what pakistanis did and how to show them up.

#127 by ssdhillon on December 27, 2002 7:51pm PT
#126 by Ralph on December 27, 2002 1:49pm PT

Spare me the pity. Intresting views you guys have... if any one doesnt agree with you he is destined for Guantanamo Bay.

You worry about the sucide squads of Bal Thakakery.

great democrats showing their feathers...

Perhaps you could try some intelligent conversation some time..

Samina,

PS. Soz I forgot to mention, check out the charity commision UK:
http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/

Do a search on the registered charities and speak to them. Sometime, however, the best info comes from the small unregistered charities but there is a chance of bias.

Sorry for the late post.

Umer M.

Arjun, Dhilla,

Bwa hahaha haaaarrrr - cough cough - har har. Someone`s been sniffing turmeric for too long. Wait, wait, wait, you used the word `tried`. What makes you think it`s an event of the past. Number 2, just how do you know the exact number of this raggy bunch anyway? I think you`re trying to evade the issue.

Now, for your next statement, A$$ munch, I want you to look at your ugly, hateful self in the mirror without cracking it and say the following:

In UK are the following ethnic minority communities:

Kurds
Turks
Pakistanis
Indians
Bangladeshis
Sudanese
Eriterians
Greeks
Arab group
Somalians
The Eastern Europeans
Africans - Nigerians, Ghanans
Caribbean - West Indies, Jamaicans, Trinidad
Chinese
Hong Kong
Koreans
Sri Lankans
Nepalese

And Pakis are the most backward group? Are you out of your fcuking mind? Define backwards to me? Show me the prison reports. Go on, shabaash, get one of your chums to do a little search. Go on, fork out a little report from that black suit case of yours which you`re always carrying around. Go on batche, do a little work on the BJP search engine and come out with an Internet address. Or could it be that you’re just talking out of your ar$e.

And this next one, oh my, this just has to be the best one. Some Falana guy from falana street posted something falana about Pakis. Everyone can do statistics. I mean, Did you know that a bag of sugar has 0% fat but it still doesn’t mean you don’t put on the pounds? Hunh? And did you know that in the year 1996, Pakistani boys came out at the top of their school leagues? Hum? Hum?

Also, if you stop your engines, you`ll notice that dhillon mentioned and focused upon UK Muslims. It is separate issue from being a a Pak or a Banger. There are 2 million Muslims in UK. Now why don’t you give me the number of Muslims (not Pakistanis but Muslims) in UK who have been sent to Guantanamo Bay? While you’re at it, do us a little statistic or send us an internet addy. I`ll help you out by naming you three: Sheikh Omar and the two d!icks from Tipton. You can do the rest.

Now personally speaking, I don’t give a monkeys about the BNP thing because the people who done the deal with the devil were an absolute minority and in no way reflect the majority. I think we all know that but going by your warped sense of perspective and imagination, I`d probably end up leaving the country. This is what I mean when I talk of democracies and when I talk of the British trying to drag the Raj into civility. Give people like Arjun and dhillon a little taste of power and they`ll start using your ethnic information to put you down.

Dhillon, I can be bothered to reply. There is a possibility that what I wrote was misunderstood by you but I would much rather like to think that you are thick.

Under the British law, you can be done for witholding terrorism related information so let me just say this that I know nothing. But wouldn’t you say that it`s entirely possible that there are Indian citizens (of the Non-Muslim persuasion) sponsering terrorist/freedom (call it what you must) movements inside India or even other parts of the world ):-) Are you that naïve to think so otherwise. ):-)

Umer M.

PS. I couldn’t think of a captain of a losing team (Oh and Nasser Hussain is not a Muslim terrorist and there are three more Muslim players who`ve played for England btw) but for now I`ll suffice with that greasy immigrant, Lord Nazir. He happens to be a Paki.

Samina,

As AAnsari said, English/Urdu newspapers and meeting the right people at the right time.

Umer M.

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#128 by UmerMurtaza on December 28, 2002 7:54am PT

So the British muslims in Guantanamo bay were fighting against racism at home. Sheikh Omar made a career out of terror to protest the BNP!!!

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Fellas, I think you should concern yourselves with the Hindu-Sikh-British National Party alliance occuring in UK where the
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So because Sikh and hindu youth did not join in the rioting they are Nazis!!!.

As far as racism by the right wing groups....that exists everywhere. Only UK muslims are fighting it by burning their own cities. You know very well what the truth is....There are a ton of unemployed muslim youth hanging around. They have been brought up on a steady diet of Jehadi propoganda. These goons are no better than the racist right wing thugs.

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. Now what do you suggest they do? Turn the cheek and sit down and do a Satyagraha.
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Aha ``Muslims brave , rest cowards. I muslim = 10 non-muslims`` argument. Stop kidding yourself that muslims are the only ones doing something against racist bias. One the other hand these guys only justify the anti-immigration policies of the right wing. Here in the US too every immigrant group had to face bias(Irish, Polish, Italaian and now Asians). The worst thing you can do is play into the hands of the right wingers.......burn down your own cities.

UK muslims are lucky that the politics in England is very liberal. Imagine an immigrant group doing this in the US. They would be in deep shit.

UmerM,

Where can I get info on these events in the UK?

Much appreciated,

Is it just me or do some of us practise double standards. When Mushy talks of the plight of the minorities in India, he is told to mind his own business and clean the $hit in his own yard. And that`s a fair comment...

But then we have guys like Ralphy and dhillon popping their heads to score a few brownies. Fellas, I think you should concern yourselves with the Hindu-Sikh-British National Party alliance occuring in UK where the hateful minorities are willing to group with their Nazi fascists enemies. And why? Just so that they may kick out the Muslims. Oh, what happened? Cat got your tongues?

As for the town trashing, you might as well include the Southall riots during the 80s by the Sikhs and Hindus against the Nazis. Because I`m sure it doesn`t matter to you that they were protecting their homes from the Nazis, just like the Pakis were protecting their own homes and retaliating to racism. Oh but wait, I forget that people like dhillon are hate-filled corrupted little perverts who have some twisted agenda to fulfill.

You have no idea what it feels to be part of a racist attack. Such attacks are a common place in the Northern areas such as Leeds and Burnley. I`ve seen one of my best friends become a cripple because he was `shit skinned`. When such things are an everyday event and no one seems to help the process and they didn`t have enough cheeks to turn the other way (to quote from Ralph), then the final option, for them, was to slap their opponents in place. I don`t like what happened but I can understand the frustration they must have felt. As for the benefits, in those areas, they`re aren`t any benefits. There was no functional economy or jobs. No politician or police was helping the place out. That`s why the hatred had been simmering for some time and recently, three councillors from the BNP were chosen. So who`s to blame?

To give an example, it was widely broadcast that Pakistani youths had designated certain areas as No-White-Man-zones. Everyone went ape $hit and for the right reasons. But no newspaper ever mentioned that this was in retaliation to the racist White youths initiating this activity in the first place. the final picture was a very biased one. Now what do you suggest they do? Turn the cheek and sit down and do a Satyagraha.

Sometimes I`m so grateful that the English systematically finished off the Mughals and tried dragging the Raj into civility. Alas, they failed on many fronts. Give power to people like Dhillon and see what happens...well it`s happening right now in certain parts of the world isn`t it.

Go enlighten the cowardly Middle Class families all around the world who are offering terrorist support to the Bharati Janta Pu$$ies. You concern yourselves with your scum and we`ll see to ours.

Umer M

#126 by Ralph
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Ali87 doesnt have to be from Pakistan. UK and Michigan are giving Pakistan a run for its money as new centers of Islamic backwardness.
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I think UK muslims can give everybody else a run for their money. After all the benefits of growing up in the UK.......these guys end up in Guantanamo Bay. Not to mention rioting Pakistani and Bangladeshi youth destroying their own towns in the UK.

stuka #125

Ali87 doesnt have to be from Pakistan. UK and Michigan are giving Pakistan a run for its money as new centers of Islamic backwardness.

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Stuka:

Retarded who doesnt even reads the posts properly or cant digest the fact that Im not from pakistan.

How the hell do I know where you`re from? You expect me to believe that you are just a 3rd party neutral with views that just happen to coincide with the Paki establishment? Right!!!

``Retarded one who just jumps to what Kofi Annan said or did not say but disregards what is belived all over the world that it is a disputed territory. The UN resolutions may apply or not what is a fact is that the majority kashmiris dont want to stay with India on the present terms. ``

And how would you know that? The Kashmiris came and told you? Ha!! Please don`t even give me the bull abt Pak being concerned about the welfare of Kashmiri Muslims. Your people killed Abdul Ghani Bhatt when he started talking about negotiations with Indian government. His own son believes that. You people are interested in real estate, plain and simple. As the Butcher of Bangladesh Tikka Khan said, `` I am interested in the land and not the people`` (Pls read the latest issue of Defence Journal, a Paki military magazine for reference. Your attitude is the same for the Kashmiris that it was for Bengalis.

``And what will you say when Mufti Mohhammed Sayeed starts negotiating with the militants and asking for political negotiations just like the Farook Abdullah of National Conference asked. ``

I, like the Indian government, am all for negotiations as long as they are within the parameters of the Indian constitution.

Retard is one who belives he is right regardless of all evidence available and grasps the straws of what Kofi said or not said about UN resolutins.

Ummm, and you O Intelligent One would love to talk about UN resolutions of 1948 but would disregard the fact that NOT ONE COUNTRY outside of Pakistan (which being an interested party does not count) has called for their implementation in the past 20 years. Kofi Annan represents the very UN you keep parroting about.

``Retard is one who cant even take the opinon of migrant Mirpuris(from kashmir across the border)in UK who show no love for India while they would like to be independent of pakistan if possible they surely wouldnt like to go back to indian control. ``

Why the hell would we bother about Pakistani Kashmiris? If they want to be independent of you, that is their problem and yours, not ours. I am a descendant of West Punjabi refugees. Would my or my parents opinion count for what happens in Pakistani Punjab???

``Retard is one who compares even his shit with what the pakistani shat``

You`re being way too metaphysical for me here.

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