Imran Khan Needs Money

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#51 by GhalibZaman on December 23, 2002 6:59pm PT
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AAh Haan!

I know i should leave some for you


My nick is NOT from the Credit card .Chk my Profile for answer

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Hi Ayesha,

I went through your article, would like to mention here that positive criticism should have been much better. Article seems tilds more towards the personal criticism, rather then giving your opinion and advise what can be acheived in future by Imran as a politican and for his political career.

Most of the people who have not supported any political parties before are coming up and supporting Imran, reason being that Imran gives HOPE to the people that our overall system is going to get better, Inshallah. Though the things in Pakistan may not look bright now, future uncertain, but there is always a hope.

One of the dreamers, dream would be to attain politican system without corruption. Hopefully Imran can acheive this immpossible to be.

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hamidm2...I totally agree with what you suggested i.e.
>>.....wouldn`t it be better if muslims of all shades and persuasions were >>accepted as being muslims without trying to excommunicate or >>marginalize people who don`t meet the strict criteria set by the ultra >>orthodox?
I think a lot of Islam is the way one interprets it which maybe vastly different than for example Moududi`s tafseer...doesnt mean one is right or one is wrong. At the end of the day each of us will be judged by our deeds and by the clarity of our conciense.

FJ..so sorry that you are only going to the great city of London for a few days. From your previous email I was under the impression that you would be in London the first week in Jan? If we cannot hookup in London maybe we can meet in Florida instead...where its nice and warm

#25 by shankar on December 21, 2002 11:57pm PT
+++++++
If I`m right....I`m sure glad there actually are some Pakistani shernis, who have metaphorically ripped off their burkha & said ``fuks`` in public!
Way to go! Hon!..
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hmmm.... what exactly are you cheering??!!

My understanding of Pakistani politics is little. But is there any collective long term vision within pakistan as to how it should progress.. Last time I heard about some thing like this was Bhutto with his thousand year war.

Seriously. In India the current economic acctivity is lead by the IT industry, The pharma industry,to some extent the consumer goods Industry and may be few heavy industries like petrochemical Industry.

However before the private sector could exploit the opportunites presented before it Nehru had a vision(Much maligned though now a days) he laid the foundation of the Large industries in all sectors and harped much on self reliance. By late sixtes with imported soviet technology India was a asian leader in quite a few industries notably steel etc.

however a failure to adapt and nehrus death and subsequent political trumoil with Indra gandhi coming to power and the oppositon by the other older leaders and subsequent disastrous growth of personality politics because of Indra Gandhi`s isolation just about pushed the economic and growth agenda to pure politics. This led to a nearly 2 decade of downturn in all feilds. Then came the balance of payments cricis and Manmohan Singh and his liberalisation.

This gave rise to increased contact with the MNC`s as well as investments in new industirees till then probhited both by indian entrepruners as well as MNC`s. However in my opinoin this would not have benifited India had it not been the avaialbity of Skilled Manpower available in the much Public sector Bemoths as well as Indians abroad and those churned out by the IIT`s etc.


For Instance most of the key personall in the Private Pharma companies (a very profitable Industry for India) were from the govt sector IDPL in Hydeabad. When Texas Instruments became the first MNC in software to set up officein bangalore in 1986 they recruited heavily from the IIT`s , when Motorola set up office in 1996 they recruited heavily from the public sector BEL (which has a semiconductor fab and and was a major defence contractor for electronics). Onther other hand companies such As HCL/NIIT , Infosys were driven by returning Indians started in early and mid 80s and mind you the going was not easy for them HCL wanted to import computers but had to settle for importing texas instument calculators. Infosys had to wait one and half year to get a telephone. While wipro had to do the unglamarous job of selling computers and networking before it could make its software unit viable which was initially populated by BSC and Bcom graduates with some training in IT. The present wealth and hope in India is because the middle class Indians have rallied around these industries and have benfiited directly or indirectly by them at least in hope of a better future.


My point is before all this happened there was a vision of Development by Nehru and a plan that he had which he put in action. I do not have much knowdlege of what happened in Pakistan but it looks like kashmir happend and put the Military firmly in seat and subsequently that seems the only vision that is there.. Has it been worth it in rertospect for both pakistanis as well as kashmiris?

I meet many pakistanis here they crib about the political stability as well as govt interference and may be that might be true but how many are willing to go back and set up business there?? Not many I guess.

We have many on these boards on both sides of the divide (the only line of defintion is for Islam and against islam and those sitting on the line ie the moderates) Have you considered that sponsering the education of 5 pakistanis back home will cost less than the cost of sherry(for those who drink) and less than the cost of insurance for your car.
Shouldnt you be discussing more of that instead of what is discussed here? Culture also encompasses economy.

But for the economy we too have the same type of politicans in India, The Vajpayees, modis, laloo`s , jayalalitha, sonia, etc have very little development agenda. It seems to me that the people of India(atleast a section of us)have long abandoned any expectation of help from the political elite and have taken up task for themselves.

So what exactly is your collective Vision??

yusufkhan, pleasure will be mine. How do we get in touch? My visit is dec 29th - Jan 2nd.

Fahim

[I know since the day you were born on CHOWK. O sayyen , O mulaamtee soofees you are right there in the pantheon of those mulaamtee soofees like Quaid-e-Azam, rehmut-allah illayh. They never advertised their sajdaas to earn brownie-points with the fundos and at the same time never appeared i public with a glass in hand to convince the slaves in suit-& -ties.]

Sir,
Can you translate it in English ?

#43 hamidm2

``Qafas mein mujhh sey roodaad e chmn kehtay na dr Hmdm(2)
giree hay jiss pey kl bijlee, voh meraa aashyaaN kyoon ho?``

I know since the day you were born on CHOWK. O sayyen , O mulaamtee soofees you are right there in the pantheon of those mulaamtee soofees like Quaid-e-Azam, rehmut-allah illayh. They never advertised their sajdaas to earn brownie-points with the fundos and at the same time never appeared i public with a glass in hand to convince the slaves in suit-& -ties.

With ALL our faults and shortcomings we are all simply MUSLIMS. Never ever worry what anyone considers us across the apparently great divine-divide.

``Aur kuchh din yeh dastoor e maikhaana hai, tishnaa kamee key yeh din guzar jaayeNgey
mairay saquee ko nazraiN uthhanay tO dO, jitnay khaalee hain subb jaam bhrr jaaeNgey``

wassalaam.

hamidm #43:

posted this sometime back on another board...the moderate or whatever you choose to call muslims have to stand up and be counted...if they don`t...others will decide their fate...perhaps to their dismay...

__________________________________

NO LOGO MUSLIMS


I

Becoming a muslim is simple. Defining one is impossible.

There are self-serving definitions floated by Richard Perle and his handlers, or Modi, Sharon and their handlers…

And to muddle the poodle further we have no dearth of muslims who throw aspersions on other muslims. For Asif I may be not a muslim. For me Sameer may not be one. Over a billion muslims: over half a billion definitions of a muslim.

II

Tahmed you do not like the nomenclature moderate. Hamidm has his usual gripes. Sameer has an all-sweeping broom when it concerns islam. Asif has his ‘rightful’ and ‘proper’ take. Everyone has their copy-righted perch. And of course everyone would like to think they are the embodiment of the moderate, middle of the line, no-frill no-logo muslim

III

These days everyone, from well-wishers to enemies is joining the chorus.

“All right, so you are not the violent type. You cannot differentiate between a pistol and a gun. TNT and cocaine are both white powders to you. You grimace if you kill a fly. You are against all forms of terrorism. You do not agree with those who speak on your behalf. You say the orthodox fanatics have hijacked your religion”

and…

“Why don’t you speak up? Stand and be counted?”

IV

Most no-logo muslims keep to the silent middle ground, lead their lives simply, do what good they can, mind their own business, and are loathe to get involved.

This lethargy is their undoing.

We can learn from history. A majority of people in most countries and societies form the largest bloc --- that of the ever-present and aptly named the silent majority.

Under normal conditions they carry on their lives with minimal fuss. Only in exceptional and critical times in their nation or culture’s history do they abandon their hereditary lethargy and assume an active stance with mixed results.

Mixed results? Yes, here in the US the Silent Majority stepped in to stop the unilateral flow of body bags from Vietnam. Over in Gujrat they latched onto the devil’s tail and went on a barbeque spree that shook India. And the world.

V

Post September 11, Islam/Muslim bashing has reached a global crescendo. The no logo muslims have no choice now. They have to abandon their lethargy and be more pro-active. They have to stand up and discard the mantle of lethargy.

If they fail to do it themselves it will be done for them. That alternative may not be pleasant.

No-logo temporal

ghalib, yusuf

.......... this is a serious question .....wouldn`t it be better if muslims of all shades and persuasions were accepted as being muslims without trying to excommunicate or marginalize people who don`t meet the strict criteria set by the ultra orthodox? ........ look at the jews - the reform/liberal jews are the ones who are the real backbone of judaism ...... the orthodox jews cause a lot of trouble and contribute very little .......... same is the case with christianity and hindooism - guys like jerry falwell and modi are an embarrasment to the mainstream .........

............... so how about giving us ``moderate`` muslims a chance - it might be better for islam ...... and don`t worry - a lot of these drinking stories are exaggerated to make a point ...........

the Pitrus of Chowk -- hamidm miaN --

what can we do --

merey junooN ney mujh ko kaheeN bhi nu dee panaah/maatoob-e buut hoN kushta-e purwardigaar hooN --

thanks to that -- True Enemy of Islam -- osama bin laden (CBUH)

RE: #36 by hamidm2 wrote:
``.........i can understand them checking urstruly`s shoes and ghalibzaman`s underwear for explosives - they probably look like the brothers running around the hills of tora bora with sheets on their heads and singing off-key arabic ayahs ............but what about me? ......... after years of drinking the white man`s whiskey and eating prosciuto on melon and wearing penny loafers, i thought i was at least as white as michael jackson .........so i was really surprised when the immigration man waved through my partner, bubba from alabama with his red neck and size twenty shoes, and insisted on asking me who i had met with in japan .. ``

We should move this discussion back to the Beynaam Badshah article because that is where it really belongs.
We are already very familiar with GhalibZaman and are trying to figure out where YusuKhan is coming from at the moment.
But once again hamidm (original or #2?) has hit the nail on the head.

Where do those who always opposed the bearded boys stand in America today? Merlot in hand or Cabernet if you will, where do some of us
hybrids fit in? The thought of consuming sweet lassi made by heejras on old monkey road in Karachi is no longer appealing. But will we be forced to make a choice in the near future?

Ras

Iss qadar pyar se na dekh `usay`
phir `kamina` khaRa na ho jaay

#36 hamidm2:

HaaN, Kaalia teraa kyaa banay gaa?
Now that is the `kaun banaygaa karore-phuttee`` question. Congratulations on the epiphany. Hallelujah!

Yusufkhan:
He IS the genuine Baghlol on the net. He is the nightmare which gives goosebumps to every nihilist and anarchist in the world. Only the relevant agencies cannot detect & pick-up because he can pirruete his way through the turnstiles as De-Mock-rat.

There are certain khusras of between-the-lines and heejraas of his dots.coms who try to ingratiate and endear themselves to him because of the melon-merlot disappearing act. Poor adolescents in aged bodies.

Ghalib hoodwinked his way out of the clutches of the goraa by pleading being an adhaa-muslamaan. The perrenial definition of a `moderate`....Sharaab peetaa hooN sooer naheeN khaata. But the Brittos were on home-soil and had spent a lifetime with the slaves. The Amreekans have no desire to learn . Why should they? when their president need not be embarrassed to say that Canada`s PM is Putin.

Oye kaliyaas, ubb tumhaara kyaa banaigaa?

``Lo voh bhee keh rahay hain kay bey nang O naam hai
Yeh jaantaa ugar, tO jalaataa naa ghur ko meiN.``

hamidm2...the answer is simple...no matter how hard you try to assimilate you will always be one of ``them``. Although..you should try eating pigs feet as the last resort...if that doesnt work then take the next flight to Kandahar - a bearded guy on a Honda 125cc will be waiting for you.

FJ....I will be in London in January also...why dont you meet me also. I am from Peshawar would love to meet someone like you for dinner.