Observations of an American Expat in Europe

The dyslexic American Administrations will never learn – despite 9/11

after what US did for the rabid Islamization of Afghanistan’s and its worldwide repercussions -- we are once again embarked on the Islamization of another secular country – Iraq.

Herre is what a Christian from Iraq has to say to a Washington P{ost correspondent -- about the greatest friend of Islamists extremists -- the United States of America --


By Anthony Shadid
Washington Post Foreign Service
Saturday, March 15, 2003;

BAGHDAD, March 14 -- Under the shadows of shimmering white crosses stretching like a rampart along his Baghdad neighborhood, Nabil Jamil fumbled his keys as if they were worry beads.

With the nostalgia that so dominates Iraq, he recalled the days in the 1970s when President Saddam Hussein`s Baath Party kept religion out of political life, delivering a measure of space to the country`s religious minorities.

The veil (hijab) was an uncommon sight in Baghdad back then, bars flourished in some neighborhoods and the government appealed to a secular Arab identity that it hoped would arch over the country`s tapestry of faith and ethnicity.

Glumly, Jamil said he fears less and less of that tolerance remains.

On the eve of an expected war, religious sentiment is overshadowing the secularism that once defined Iraq.

Through speeches, symbols and slogans, Hussein`s government has increasingly turned to Islam in its search for legitimacy, playing down the Arab nationalism that once served as its ideology.

Many of its people -- Shiite Muslims and Sunnis, along with a small Christian minority -- have turned to faith, desperate for respite from the misery of war and more than a decade of sanctions.

The forces of faith, Jamil said, are a wild card in the future of an apprehensive country, shaping the fears of what might come after a war.

``To be honest, this is our biggest worry from the attack that is coming,`` he said, sitting with his wife at the St. George Greek Catholic Church in the neighborhood of Karrada.

``Our fear is that whatever comes next will not be tolerant.``...(WP)
_________________________________________

it would not be the height of cynicism to say -- that the history repeating -- almost cyclical events of past three decades have shown --

that the greatest ENEMY of Muslim Secularism and Muslim Progressivism -- is none other than -- the United Sates of America --

between the Peanut Farmer, a B Actor, a hyperthyroid and his coke sniffing, brain-damaged son -- this country has made a Shish Kebob of democracy and modernity in almost every Muslim country--

and as always -- is ever ready to HELP and OBLIGE -- the Extremist Islamist Hyenas -- to feast upon the dead carcasses of Muslim secularism in Iraq -- now

in 2003 -- folks get ready for another Mulla Omar and – for the second coming of Ayatollaa Khoomeany in Iraq and Middle East -- courtesy -- Texas OIL minister -- the Reverend Georgetulla Bushmeany.

hi tahmed,
i really enjoyed it.

Samina #29
``My def. of transnationalism is not one that in any way excuses or condones the use of terroristic or military invasions.``

I know that already :). To clarify, mine was a general comment on this thread, not a particular response to your post only.

tahmed #28

Very funny, couldn`t stop laughing...

TAhmed: It is funny but I am sorry to burst your bubble. It`s a rip off on future of India that was dreamed by some techies during the boom of 2001...no doubt those chaps are back to programming in Bangalore or Hyderabad which were the cities quoted in the original one.

#18 by sadna:

good for you!…we all do…just as we always speak the truth…don’t we? or hold opinion? (you do discern between holding opinion and being opinionated?)


the noblest pursuit:
the pursuit of truth


the sages found
and fought over it
now the mirror of truth
lies shattered
each piece valued
and possessed

rgds.

t

ps: oh!...wrong again!...i am not a preacher;)

Sadna,

My def. of transnationalism is not one that in any way excuses or condones the use of terroristic or military invasions. I refer you to Will Kymlicka for a definition that makes transnationalism a way of protecting undocumented workers in countries that discriminate against them.

Wait a minute. For the left, transnationalism should be upheld in the US but opposed in Iraq? Hey not recognising national boundaries is exactly what GW Bush is doing. Whats the left`s problem?

btw, the Islamic right ALSO believes in transnationalism, that the Muslim Ummah has a right to fight for the interests of Muslims any where in the world. Hey thats what GW Bush also believes, namely that the US has a right to fight for the interests of Americans anywhere in the world.

The positions taken by left are thus very curious.

The left never protests the transnationalism of the Islamic right, they even seem to support it, Arundhati Roy being one prime example. She objects to US campaigns to fight in another country, but doesnot object to jihadi campaigns(even state sponsered) to fight in another country.

Even in the US, the left seems to support Islamic transnationalism, by protesting at everything that tries to come its way, such as extra scrutiny of Muslims from countries where the concept of Islamic transnationalism has wide currency, or the US campaign against prominent Islamic transnationalists of inhuman tendency, the Al Qaeda.


Western transnationalism however is a big nono for the left, whether military like the Iraq or Aghanistan war, or economic like globalization.

The left and the Islamic right in fact seem to have become allies, because they have a common enemy, the capitalistic West.

The primary dislike the Indian left has for the BJP comes not from the BJP`s hate philosophy(Islamic transnationalists propagate A LOT OF hatred too and leftists have never protested this), but from the BJP`s alliance with the US.

Sab ke sab lafangey as Ahmed Madani would say :)

samina/stuka/nazar/temporal/veeresh and any other normal person on this board - I got this on the internet for your reading pleasure:

THE FUTURE PAKISTAN
Two Top American Executives at IBM, USA

Alex: Hi John. You didn`t come to work yesterday
John: Yeah. I was at the Pakistani Embassy trying to
get my visa.
Alex: Oh, really? What happened? I`ve heard that
these days they have become very strict
John: Yeah, but I managed to get it
Alex: How long did it take to get it stamped?
John: Man, it was a long queue. Bill Gates`s Grand son was waiting in front of me and they really gave him a hard time. The poor guy even brought the property papers for his house in Seattle to show them that he will return to USA. I went there at 4:00 a.m. to get in the queue and there were tons of people ahead of me.
Alex: Really? In Pakistan, at the US Embassy it only takes an hour to get a visa for USA.
John: Yeah! But that`s because no one in Pakistan would want to come to USA, except Americans who have taken Pakistani nationality and want to bring their kids here.
Alex: So, when are you leaving?
John: As soon as I get my tickets from the company in Pakistan. I`m so excited. I will be getting a chance to finally fly with the world`s fastest growing airline, Pakistan International Airlines (PIA). Sort of dream come true, you know.
Alex: How long are you planning to stay in Pakistan?
John: What do you mean ``how long``? I will try and settle in Pakistan. My company has promised me that they will process my Green Book as soon as possible.
Alex: Really? Man, you`re a lucky one. It`s very difficult to get the Green Book in Pakistan. Last year my cousin and his family went there on a tourist visa and they`re not coming back now.
John: Yeah. That`s why I`m planning on marrying a Pakistani girl there and then sponsoring my parents and my brother and sister
from New York to Pakistan.
Alex: But I hear you can find lots of good American girls in Karachi and Lahore.
John: Yeah, but I prefer Pakistani girls. They are so
much more superior to our girls, and what great brunette complexion they have!
Alex: What city are you going to?
John: Karachi. The company has an office in downtown
Saddar. Yeah, the salary is good but the cost of living is quite high because of all the people flocking to this high-tech mecca.
Alex: I hear the exchange rate is now $100 to a Rupee! That`s just too much. What about Quetta and Peshawar? What are they like?
John: No idea. But they are cheaper than Karachi,which is the world`s headquarter for information technology now.
Alex: I hear the quality of life in Pakistan is incredible.
John: Yeah, man. You can buy a BMW for Rs.30,000, and
a Mercedes for less than Rs.45,000. But my dream is to purchase a Suzuki Turbo FX-800 which costs roughly Rs.90,000. But what a sweet design, great curves, and it purrs to the touch.
Alex: By the way, which company are you gonna work
for?
John: Haji Jalal Puttarjee & Bros. Technologies, a pure Pakistani conglomerate specializing in embedded software.
Alex: Man, you`re so lucky to work for a pure Pakistani company. They are really intelligent and unlike any American body shops
that have opened their fly-by-night outfits in Pakistan. The Pakistani companies pay you even when you`re on the bench. My friend, Paul Allen, used his bench time to visit the Makran Coast, the most gorgeous resort in Pakistan, I hear.
John: Yeah, man, you`re right. I hope the US learns
something from them and follow in their footsteps. It seems all we do is borrow more and more money from the Askari Bank.
Alex: How are you going to cope with their language?
John: I`ve been learning Urdu since my school days. I always dreamed that one day I`ll head for Pakistan ever since my uncle
bought me that T-Shirt from Islamia College. At the Consulate they tested my proficiency in Urdu and were quite impressed by my score in TOUFL(Test Of Urdu as a Foreign Language).
Alex: Boy! You`re so damn lucky.
John: Yeah. I`ll be travelling in the world`s fastest train, Tezgam. I`ll be visiting the world`s largest theme park in Changa
Manga, and I`ll be visiting the famous Lollywood where I might meet the sons and daughters of movie legends like Nadeem, Sultan Rahi, Anjuman, Reema and the gorgeous of all, Madam Babra Sharif.
Alex: You know, the Pakistani President is scheduled to visit USA next year and I hear that he may increase the number of employment visas.

John: That`s very true. Last month, their Labour Minister, Naswar Khan Pakhtoon, visited the White House and donated Rs.20,000 for the re-development of the World Trade Centre at Silicon
Valley, and has promised more if we follow the models of the fast
developing high-tech cities, Gujranwalla and Raiwind. Bill Gates was lucky to have a chance to meet him. Very lucky person.
Alex: Will you be calling on Dave? I hear that he has made it big there and has a beautiful house on the Lyari River in Karachi.
John: Yeah, I`ll be meeting him.
Alex: Anyway, nice chatting to you, John. Good luck, you lucky guy.
John: Yeah, and the same to you, Alex. By the way, don`t ever go to the Pakistani Consulate in shalwar-kameez because they will think you`re too Pakistanised and may doubt that you will ever come back, and your application will be rejected. And yes, don`t forget to say to the Visa Officer politely: ``As`salam-o-Alaikum, aap kaisay hain?`` It will show them you`re a cultured person.

Mr. Doe,

Welcome to Chowk. What kind of dissent against US policy viz Iraq have you been privy to in Europe?

Saima and Stuka

Saima seems to be looking at citizenship through a post nationalist interpretation, one way of ``globalizing identity`` and one response to the kinds of nationalisms that mandate that working people like you, Stuka arent given a hard time in the US, just because you are an immigrant.

And you do know that just because you have no problem with the growing invasive policies towards our civil rights-we do. This country has a chance at working because those rights were guaranteed us in our Constitution. I caution the people who are agreeable to these alterations of our Constitution to think about the process that has prevented questionable alterations from taking place before-this process has been bypassed. This is a serious issue which any honest Rep, Dem, Ind. would acknowledge has ramifications for the US`s future.

Nasah:

I agree with you 100% but those very rights that we take for granted exist because the United States has been strong enough to fight of totalitarian forces.

Of what use is my right to privacy if it allows terrorists to infiltrate and weaken the very foundation of this country. I would rather sacrifice my right to privacy than watch the horror of Sep 11, 2001 again. You may call it puerile patriotism and maybe that is what it is. However, it is a tradeoff I am willing to make.

There are people out there who hate this way of life and their unknowing and unwilling allies are the leftists of this country who provide a camouflage for these enemies to operate in. The ``liberals`` of today remind me of the leftists of the 60S and 70s who marched in the West for detente with the Soviets, not realizing what fate would have awaited them if they did the same back there.

Saima:

``Dissent should make an impact--people in power have to listen for it to work. It seems to many that the US administration isnt listening anymore. ``


So your grouch is not about freedom of speech and the right to dissent. It is that the administration is not listening to those who disagree with it.
To you, a country has ``freedom`` only if the administration always listens to those who disagree. If that is not intellectual fascism I don`t know what is.

The members of the KKK also disagree with the government in many ways. Should the administration listen to them?

Or is dissent considered only the holy grail of the left?

The rise of ``police state culture`` in US is indeed worrisome, but at this point of time I don`t see any other alternative to eliminate the menace of Islamic terrorism.

At this time - it is clear that US and the World needs some heavy-duty actions to contain terrorism.

“I would willingly give up some right of privacy to protect this system which gives me more dignity as a human being than the country of my birth.”(STUKA)

My dear young man – there U R -- talking like an inexperienced newly arrived -- neophyte immigrant – with justifiable pangs of puerile patriotism.

this country and its SYSTEM is -- NOT PROTECTED -- by ‘giving up’ -- your right of privacy –

this country IS BASED upon-- “protecting your rights of privacy” – unlike other countries – or at least it DID – until it was hijacked by a cabal of Texas RED NECKS – alias OIL Thugs – albeit temporarily.

Contrary to mr. aschcroft beliefs --

this is not a fascist or a communist country – where rights of the individuals are taken away -- to “protect” -- the Party designed “rights” -- of the community -- or the State –

this is NOT a country where -– rights of 99% are curbed to “protect” them from the crimes of 1% -- US system is NOT based upon this totalitarian premise.

this is a country where the rights of the INDIVIDUAL reign supreme – over the rights of the State -- to make both the community and the State -- truly FREE – and truly representative.

that’s the SECRET of the success of this economic GIANT – not the vice versa

And remember young man – don’t EVER give up your precious -- Right of Privacy –

your true DIGNITY comes – from KEEPING them – NOT by giving them up --

NOT EVEN -- ‘some” of them.

Welcome to CHOWK ``John Doe``.

Man this Patriot II thing is even scaring the Red White and Blue!

``All we are saying is, give WAR a chance``

My how times have changed.


Ras

temporal #16

I recognise that your preaching to me ``it is all right to learn from any and every where`` is a masterful way to cover up the fact that there is ABSOLUTELY NO discussion let alone activism among expat Pakistanis about the extremist organisations in the US preaching hatred like Jamat Ul Faqra or about expat Pakistani funding of jihadi organisations back home.

So I`ll trust my own judgement about balance, thanks.