How to kill your Wife (Unedited)
malik khar May 26, 2003
#74 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on June 5, 2003 11:27:14 pm
I remember seeing Khar on Indus back in Karachi last year and being all emotional over his daughter not speaking to him. Farah Shah was pouring out da love ``She`s a lovely girl. She`s achieved so much. I`m sure she will forgive you.``
How a woman can stand next to that man and say those things are the qualities of a true actress.
How a woman can stand next to that man and say those things are the qualities of a true actress.
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#73 Posted by Naqshbandi on June 5, 2003 9:45:26 pm
zeeshan...yeh i found blasphemy to be a piece of ridiculous, over-the-top, monodimensional-character-ridden, trash too.
**
gosh isn`t it strange for a powerful landlord like mustafa khar in a society like pakistan where models/actreesses are generally considered no better than whores/kanjariyaan to let his daughter become one?
**
she is cute though---and probably much w over too!
**
gosh isn`t it strange for a powerful landlord like mustafa khar in a society like pakistan where models/actreesses are generally considered no better than whores/kanjariyaan to let his daughter become one?
**
she is cute though---and probably much w over too!
#72 Posted by stuka on June 5, 2003 3:48:57 pm
Samina:
``
Interesting how being a temporary/permanent homemaker is an ``option`` for men, but not for women...
And since you brought up the concept of social responsibility, why do men feel they have none when it comes to the domestic sphere? ``
Could you point out where I made either of the above points?
When did I say it is not an option for women? All I said is that don`t diss those women who choose to be a permanent homemaker. If you want to draw preconcieved conclusions, don`t use me as a tool. You may have this secret hankering to dictate the rules to the world. But you as an individual have the right to make only your own choices as do others.
``If a man wants to be a homemaker, that`s his choice. `` This is what I said. Pray tell, where did you dream up your own conclusions of my opinions?
``
Interesting how being a temporary/permanent homemaker is an ``option`` for men, but not for women...
And since you brought up the concept of social responsibility, why do men feel they have none when it comes to the domestic sphere? ``
Could you point out where I made either of the above points?
When did I say it is not an option for women? All I said is that don`t diss those women who choose to be a permanent homemaker. If you want to draw preconcieved conclusions, don`t use me as a tool. You may have this secret hankering to dictate the rules to the world. But you as an individual have the right to make only your own choices as do others.
``If a man wants to be a homemaker, that`s his choice. `` This is what I said. Pray tell, where did you dream up your own conclusions of my opinions?
#71 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on June 5, 2003 3:07:34 am
Tehmina Durrani as understood after reading Blasphemy:
Horrible piece of shit. Too old to be cute or forgiven for her unamusing opinions.
Aminah Haq is indeed Mustufa Khar`s much wanked over daughter.
Horrible piece of shit. Too old to be cute or forgiven for her unamusing opinions.
Aminah Haq is indeed Mustufa Khar`s much wanked over daughter.
#70 Posted by Naqshbandi on June 4, 2003 10:02:52 pm
A question about Khars: In our region of the Punjab with its Potohari dialect we have a saying which I have heard: a crazy, angry, person or one who loses his temper/does something outrageous is called a ``khar dimaagh`` (khar mind/brain).
I might be barking up the wrong tree but is the etymology of this phrase linked somehow to the Khars? ie has their crazy behaviour become proverbial?
***
As for the book My Feudal Lord by Tehmina Durrani--I read the English version (was it a translation?) and it was a good read which at the time elicited a lot of sympathy for her in my mind...but the book was one-sided although Mustafa Khar did come across as a total wanker. There is also an Urdu version called Maida Sa`eeN--is it the same book in all details? Maybe she spiced up the English version to get sympathy from a West eager to hear of the latest atrocities by mysoginistic Muslim males! I don`t know.
**
BTW Tehmina Durrani was cute...and her younger sister was VERY cute! No wonder Mustafa Khar fell for her too...
BTW I don`t have a problem with his marrying multiple times--his wife-beating i DO have a problem with..
**
Is it true that the model Amina Haq is Mustafa Khar`s daughter?
**
#69 Posted by tahmed32 on June 4, 2003 8:46:25 am
pakfin #64 Let me then try to reconcile your saying that you do your own cooking and cleaning and maintenance of a picture perfect house with your earlier statement that ``But on the other hand if she wakes up at noon and watches TV or chats on the phone all day long and then expects her husband to come back at 7 pm and help out with housework, then she is sadly mistaken.``
You are either unmarried and are compelled by your neatness to keep a picture perfect house. But that would not be typical of a bachelor. Most fellows I have seen living as bachelors have alien life forms growing inside their fridge. Or else you are married to a gorgon who threatens to turn you into a pillar of salt unless you get down on your knees and start mopping the floor as soon as you come back from work.
You are either unmarried and are compelled by your neatness to keep a picture perfect house. But that would not be typical of a bachelor. Most fellows I have seen living as bachelors have alien life forms growing inside their fridge. Or else you are married to a gorgon who threatens to turn you into a pillar of salt unless you get down on your knees and start mopping the floor as soon as you come back from work.
#68 Posted by Saminasha on June 4, 2003 8:46:25 am
Zahra,
Lol...it never ceases to amaze me that women keep coming up with new ideas and men seem to be trying to hold on to whatever ground they have...as Mr.S and I are not perfect, we have our share of conversations...although, should he hang out with my brother, he develops a mysterious case of not knowing where the dishtowel is...while I and my sister in law get dinner on the table...I have to be honest, it annoys me, since all four of us work...
Lol...it never ceases to amaze me that women keep coming up with new ideas and men seem to be trying to hold on to whatever ground they have...as Mr.S and I are not perfect, we have our share of conversations...although, should he hang out with my brother, he develops a mysterious case of not knowing where the dishtowel is...while I and my sister in law get dinner on the table...I have to be honest, it annoys me, since all four of us work...
#67 Posted by ZahraJ on June 3, 2003 9:55:51 pm
Samina,
Only a cruel/miser husband regardless of his origin will ask his wife to pitch in. A true knight with his beautiful shining armor will NEVER EVER do that.
On a relatively serious note, I agree with your suggestion on individual accounts. There are way too many marriages that break up because of financial chupqalash.
On another note, let`s not put the South Asian Men on the spot here. Fine, this article was written by a Pakistani or of Pakistani Origin, but in this day and age there are many successful mixed marriages that are all around us. So, the rules of the game ought to be the same for all and sundry.
Personally, having a good number of first cousins bred in the US and married to all categories: non-Pakistanis, non-Muslims and converts, I love to be part of an international family; and have a leaning in that direction. I think with globalization there will be a better understanding of the issues of this world and its various facets vs. sticking to your own little field. Diversity Zindabad!
But again it`s a challenge that many under take and have to stick to it. It ain`t everyone`s cup of tea.
P.o.l.i.t.e W.i.s.h.e.s
Only a cruel/miser husband regardless of his origin will ask his wife to pitch in. A true knight with his beautiful shining armor will NEVER EVER do that.
On a relatively serious note, I agree with your suggestion on individual accounts. There are way too many marriages that break up because of financial chupqalash.
On another note, let`s not put the South Asian Men on the spot here. Fine, this article was written by a Pakistani or of Pakistani Origin, but in this day and age there are many successful mixed marriages that are all around us. So, the rules of the game ought to be the same for all and sundry.
Personally, having a good number of first cousins bred in the US and married to all categories: non-Pakistanis, non-Muslims and converts, I love to be part of an international family; and have a leaning in that direction. I think with globalization there will be a better understanding of the issues of this world and its various facets vs. sticking to your own little field. Diversity Zindabad!
But again it`s a challenge that many under take and have to stick to it. It ain`t everyone`s cup of tea.
P.o.l.i.t.e W.i.s.h.e.s
#66 Posted by ZahraJ on June 3, 2003 9:55:51 pm
uRsTrUlY,
Theek Hai, I will wait.
Just an FYI: Kindly keep in mind that I am not a patient person, in spite of all the efforts in the direction of self study and re-evaluation. I may disappear fairly soon since there is a lot in life by the Grace of God to keep me active and involved. And aside from lacking in patience, my mercurial self loses interest in archaic and repetitive topics.
Take Care.
Theek Hai, I will wait.
Just an FYI: Kindly keep in mind that I am not a patient person, in spite of all the efforts in the direction of self study and re-evaluation. I may disappear fairly soon since there is a lot in life by the Grace of God to keep me active and involved. And aside from lacking in patience, my mercurial self loses interest in archaic and repetitive topics.
Take Care.
#65 Posted by Saminasha on June 3, 2003 1:43:50 pm
Pakfin,
As well you should...
and I agree; not only should both partners share equally-in proportion to their salaries, but that each spouse should have a separate bank account in addition to a joint couple account...
As well you should...
and I agree; not only should both partners share equally-in proportion to their salaries, but that each spouse should have a separate bank account in addition to a joint couple account...
#64 Posted by Pakfin on June 3, 2003 11:24:53 am
#38 by Saminasha on May 29, 2003 10:08pm PT
Stuka, Pakfin,
So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right?
That would be an individuals choice. As far as I am concerned, even if I did not have to work for a living, I would still work.
The issue here is not whether a woman should work or not, but the problem is when a woman is not willing to share the expenses, but wants the man to share in doing the housework.
Stuka, Pakfin,
So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right?
That would be an individuals choice. As far as I am concerned, even if I did not have to work for a living, I would still work.
The issue here is not whether a woman should work or not, but the problem is when a woman is not willing to share the expenses, but wants the man to share in doing the housework.
#63 Posted by Pakfin on June 3, 2003 11:24:53 am
#30 by tahmed32 on May 28, 2003 7:23pm PT
pakfin #27 spoken like a true slob.
Tahemed, talk about yourself. Not only do I work full time, I also do my own cooking and cleaning and maintain a picture perfect house.
pakfin #27 spoken like a true slob.
Tahemed, talk about yourself. Not only do I work full time, I also do my own cooking and cleaning and maintain a picture perfect house.
#62 Posted by Saminasha on June 3, 2003 7:28:53 am
Stuka,
Interesting how being a temporary/permanent homemaker is an ``option`` for men, but not for women...
And since you brought up the concept of social responsibility, why do men feel they have none when it comes to the domestic sphere?
Interesting how being a temporary/permanent homemaker is an ``option`` for men, but not for women...
And since you brought up the concept of social responsibility, why do men feel they have none when it comes to the domestic sphere?
#61 Posted by Urstruly on June 3, 2003 7:28:53 am
Zahraj # 60
I have discussed the Islamic society in detail in the article as well. I guess you have to wait a little bit.
I have discussed the Islamic society in detail in the article as well. I guess you have to wait a little bit.
#60 Posted by tahmed32 on June 2, 2003 8:08:21 pm
ZahraJ: you write ``It`s slightly skewed and weird too. Ouch! Just like the typical Traditional South Asian Men are. No Pun Intended!``
No pun made either, I think.
No pun made either, I think.
#59 Posted by ZahraJ on June 2, 2003 8:08:21 pm
uRsTrUlY:
``I am far from evolved.``
Far above or below ?
I will look forward to your write-up.
What is an Islamic Society? And, where does it exist?
Please care to clarify when you have a moment. I will reserve my other remarks till the article is on the horizon.
``I am far from evolved.``
Far above or below ?
I will look forward to your write-up.
What is an Islamic Society? And, where does it exist?
Please care to clarify when you have a moment. I will reserve my other remarks till the article is on the horizon.
#58 Posted by stuka on June 2, 2003 8:09:43 am
Saminasha:
``1. No one is belittling homemakers. ``
Okay. As long as that is clear.
2. Should men be given options of being homemakers? Why/why not?
Given? What do you mean by ``given`` an option? A lifestyle/career choice is taken by an individual. No one gives it. If a man wants to be a homemaker, that`s his choice. The question of why or why not beyond personal choice does not exist.
3. Why is homemaking not an option for you, if it is such a noble career?
Social work is also noble. So is being a brain surgeon. There are loads of noble options out there. What does that have to do with my perrsonal choice?
``1. No one is belittling homemakers. ``
Okay. As long as that is clear.
2. Should men be given options of being homemakers? Why/why not?
Given? What do you mean by ``given`` an option? A lifestyle/career choice is taken by an individual. No one gives it. If a man wants to be a homemaker, that`s his choice. The question of why or why not beyond personal choice does not exist.
3. Why is homemaking not an option for you, if it is such a noble career?
Social work is also noble. So is being a brain surgeon. There are loads of noble options out there. What does that have to do with my perrsonal choice?
#57 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on June 2, 2003 5:59:04 am
Reply # 47 ZahraJ
I confess that it is an incomplete assertion. While living in the West, she has to do all the house work to the extent of picking up the last spoon from the floor.
While she decidely has a much reduced workload while in South Asia.
It was general observation. I have a daughter-in-law who lives in the West. When we visit there for a month every year, my wife also works. That is the only physical work that my wife does in the whole year. Initially, she gets tired and then gets used to it. This one month of exercise makes her fit and active.
#56 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on June 2, 2003 5:59:04 am
Tipu Sultan:
I think what are referring to is called ``The Stand.``
I think what are referring to is called ``The Stand.``
#55 Posted by Urstruly on June 2, 2003 5:59:03 am
Zahraj
I am far from evolved. I will consider my evolution only begining when I will be able to keep my stare down after the first one.
Coming back to the topic under discussion, I think our social structure is changing at an alrming pace. It is not evolving, it is degenerating because of the economic pressures and globalization that are gnawing at the very roots of our moral values. I have recently submitted an article to chowk on the subject. I would be very interested in your opinion since you are a working woman yourself. Here is an excerpt:
``Thus the position and worth of woman in Islamic society is not only equal to men but also slightly exalted if it is seen through the paradigm of ethical values, rights and responsibilities. It is an undeniable fact that no two human beings have identical capabilities, face identical social circumstances, or have identical intellectual level; some excel others. This is the law of nature and it is true for women also. Not every woman can become a business executive nor every woman could or would want to give up her family life either. Demanding a uniform code for all women is thus restrictive and unfair. Islam on the other hand recognizes the gender differences and establishes social justice and equity among genders based on that recognition. If a Muslim woman faces a dilemma as to what her preferences and priorities should be, she seeks answer to the question first as to what her responsibilities and duties are. We must benefit from the history and experience of the West. Instead of following them blindly we must try to avoid the mistakes that they have made. We must create an economic and social system, which does not strip women off the very essence of their womanhood. Islam, by securing the financial rights of woman provides a platform to her from where she can soar higher. It gives her the wings to fly and man is right behind her not to clip her wings but to be the wind beneath her wings.``
#54 Posted by Tipu on June 2, 2003 12:11:40 am
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#53 Posted by ZahraJ on June 1, 2003 8:08:43 pm
oN rEaDiNg PoSt 47 AgAiN:
It`s slightly skewed and weird too. Ouch!
Just like the typical Traditional South Asian Men are. No Pun Intended!
It`s slightly skewed and weird too. Ouch!
Just like the typical Traditional South Asian Men are. No Pun Intended!
#52 Posted by aicha on June 1, 2003 6:51:05 pm
sorry i think 47 is not only incomplet but outdated too - no offense!
#51 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on June 1, 2003 5:22:28 pm
Bad Mother and Absent mother are two very different things Bakerman.
I didn`t read Misery or watch teh Reiner adaptation but I respect the King.
Hitchcock for his outdated glory is another director I can respect.
Cheers.
I didn`t read Misery or watch teh Reiner adaptation but I respect the King.
Hitchcock for his outdated glory is another director I can respect.
Cheers.
#50 Posted by Studebaker on June 1, 2003 3:14:10 pm
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#49 Posted by Studebaker on June 1, 2003 3:14:10 pm
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#47 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on June 1, 2003 7:24:51 am
South Asian wives living abroad get the best of the both worlds -
They enjoy the laid back house-wife life style of the East with no financial responsibilities -
While also enjoying the feminine freedoms/rights and economic legal wife-rights of the West.
#46 Posted by ZahraJ on May 31, 2003 8:41:07 pm
Urstruly,
That`s indeed a commendable point. Something you read made you see things differently or realize their importance. Well, we evolve throughout our life as long as we are recptive to the very obvious. When it comes to mothers, it goes without saying that there is a very special significance of their role in all phases of a child`s life and the child`s outlook towards life. Often times, whatever we see while growing up leaves a lasting impression on our mind and that`s the route we end up taking to certain extent no matter how accomplished, modern and liberal and etc etc we end up being.
I don`t want to write something for the sake of it. So, I will lie if I state that oh, I can see the role of a woman as a 100% housewife. Personally, I cannot imagine that. To me, women are 2 in 1 or 3 in 1. That`s what I have seen mostly. It`s a tougher role vs more or less important. It`s very hard for me to envision women without any identity aside from certain roles that nature has granted them.
In a way, you are right that women who stay home and raise kids can be taken for granted. And, interestingly, one of my friends who has been working for almost 8-9 years, as a research engineer, happened to quit after having her baby daughter last year. Her logic was that she always believed in giving 100% to her career and everything in life. So, now since she has gotten into a new role, she wanted to be fair and be there for her daughter 100% in the first few years. But this is her personal choice. Every women should have the right and autonomy to have a personal choice. I also have a friend, whose wife, a doctor, was at work after one week of her delivery. Her in laws lived in the same city, but she would not leave her baby boy with them. Simply, out of question! In fact, her son was with the day care from the very first month of his life. All the more reason, since the mother, a doctor, happened to be very assertive, sensible and brilliant woman, the husband did not debate much on how she wanted to raise their child. She was back at work fully after her baby was one month old and would take time out to feed the baby even while she was working since the baby was at the same premises within reach, at the same hospital. So, she planned and managed her whole schedule accordingly, but held a different approach.
In the former case, the approach was quite different. And, there is no right or wrong. It`s just individual preference. Now, do not get me wrong, both women have a strong identity, but they have a different way of handling matters pertaining to their life. And, here`s what is real important: self worth. You cannot lead your life how others perceive you. You have to lead it how you perceive yourself and where you want to be.
That`s indeed a commendable point. Something you read made you see things differently or realize their importance. Well, we evolve throughout our life as long as we are recptive to the very obvious. When it comes to mothers, it goes without saying that there is a very special significance of their role in all phases of a child`s life and the child`s outlook towards life. Often times, whatever we see while growing up leaves a lasting impression on our mind and that`s the route we end up taking to certain extent no matter how accomplished, modern and liberal and etc etc we end up being.
I don`t want to write something for the sake of it. So, I will lie if I state that oh, I can see the role of a woman as a 100% housewife. Personally, I cannot imagine that. To me, women are 2 in 1 or 3 in 1. That`s what I have seen mostly. It`s a tougher role vs more or less important. It`s very hard for me to envision women without any identity aside from certain roles that nature has granted them.
In a way, you are right that women who stay home and raise kids can be taken for granted. And, interestingly, one of my friends who has been working for almost 8-9 years, as a research engineer, happened to quit after having her baby daughter last year. Her logic was that she always believed in giving 100% to her career and everything in life. So, now since she has gotten into a new role, she wanted to be fair and be there for her daughter 100% in the first few years. But this is her personal choice. Every women should have the right and autonomy to have a personal choice. I also have a friend, whose wife, a doctor, was at work after one week of her delivery. Her in laws lived in the same city, but she would not leave her baby boy with them. Simply, out of question! In fact, her son was with the day care from the very first month of his life. All the more reason, since the mother, a doctor, happened to be very assertive, sensible and brilliant woman, the husband did not debate much on how she wanted to raise their child. She was back at work fully after her baby was one month old and would take time out to feed the baby even while she was working since the baby was at the same premises within reach, at the same hospital. So, she planned and managed her whole schedule accordingly, but held a different approach.
In the former case, the approach was quite different. And, there is no right or wrong. It`s just individual preference. Now, do not get me wrong, both women have a strong identity, but they have a different way of handling matters pertaining to their life. And, here`s what is real important: self worth. You cannot lead your life how others perceive you. You have to lead it how you perceive yourself and where you want to be.
#45 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on May 31, 2003 3:35:42 pm
Homemakers play one of the most significant roles in our society.
A disgruntled homemaker is something no one wants.
Nothing wrong with men wearing that cape though but an absent mother does worse than an absent father. Unless of course the children are homosexual. That`s my opinion. Feel free to disagree.
A disgruntled homemaker is something no one wants.
Nothing wrong with men wearing that cape though but an absent mother does worse than an absent father. Unless of course the children are homosexual. That`s my opinion. Feel free to disagree.
#44 Posted by Saminasha on May 31, 2003 10:23:31 am
Stuka,
1. No one is belittling homemakers.
2. Should men be given options of being homemakers? Why/why not?
3. Why is homemaking not an option for you, if it is such a noble career?
1. No one is belittling homemakers.
2. Should men be given options of being homemakers? Why/why not?
3. Why is homemaking not an option for you, if it is such a noble career?
#43 Posted by Studebaker on May 30, 2003 1:27:24 pm
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#42 Posted by stuka on May 30, 2003 12:21:15 pm
Samina:
``So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right``
I totally would have a problem. But that is my choice. If a woman chooses to stay home and raise family as opposed to working, she should not be blamed/criticized for doing so.
ZahraJ:
``If someone is a house-wife, it`s their prerogative to have a coffee party or milad or any other social event at their place. How can you dictate anyone on that? Isn`t that what a home is meant for?``
The point I am making is of division of labor. If the husband and wife both work, both are supposed to contribute to housework as well. Similarly, if a woman chooses to stay home, she should assume responsibility for housework. They can have coffee parties etc in their spare time, as long as they show some productivity as well.
``So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right``
I totally would have a problem. But that is my choice. If a woman chooses to stay home and raise family as opposed to working, she should not be blamed/criticized for doing so.
ZahraJ:
``If someone is a house-wife, it`s their prerogative to have a coffee party or milad or any other social event at their place. How can you dictate anyone on that? Isn`t that what a home is meant for?``
The point I am making is of division of labor. If the husband and wife both work, both are supposed to contribute to housework as well. Similarly, if a woman chooses to stay home, she should assume responsibility for housework. They can have coffee parties etc in their spare time, as long as they show some productivity as well.
#40 Posted by taimurmalik on May 30, 2003 7:36:40 am
``...You tell me Sain, if one Khar does something wrong, should the entire Khar tribe be labeled bad?” (last line of the Author`s latest article in TFT.)
#39 Posted by Urstruly on May 30, 2003 7:36:40 am
ZahraJ # 37
What is inconsistency in my arguments?
Anyway recently I read a book by Ann Crittenden titled ``The Price of Motherhood`` and I realized that I never appreciated my mother enough, ever the way I should have been. Women in households do a tremendous job which is thankless, and unpaid. Now I bebelive that mothers do have heaven under their feet. Before, I only knew that, but now I believe that.
#38 Posted by Saminasha on May 29, 2003 10:08:26 pm
Stuka, Pakfin,
So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right?
So if your wife made more money than you two did, you`d stay at home, raise the family, keep the house and have noooooo problemo with it, right?
#37 Posted by ZahraJ on May 29, 2003 10:08:16 pm
I wish Urstruly is consistent in his interpretation of arguments. I wish Urstruly jots this down in his navy blue book vs. the black one!
No one is belittling the housewives. In fact, it`s a woman`s prerogative whether she wants to work or stay home. At times, some have the option and some don`t.
Pakfin`s comments were more on the lines of sharing responsibilities vs condemning what women want to do in their spare time. But Pakfin`s comments are also applicable to a certain % of women vs. being applicable to all and sundry. What is the % of working women in the East ?
I partly disagree with post 34`s argument. If someone is a house-wife, it`s their prerogative to have a coffee party or milad or any other social event at their place. How can you dictate anyone on that? Isn`t that what a home is meant for? A place where you have the freedom to walk upside down nangae paon or look like a clown with a clay/mud mask on your face and hair tied in a hot towel with fragranced oil for deep conditioning treatment.
The main point is if a 100% housewife expects her spouse to pitch in the household chores then she needs to be fair. If one person is working 100% outside, and the other person is 100% staying at home then things need to be balanced out. It`s the same thing, if a woman has a full time job that does not mean that she is living in a hotel kind of an environment. She still believes in maintaining a nice and cosy place and would like her spouse to share that responsibility. Well, if that does not happen then it can be very frustrating. And, one person may say well I am better off living on my own than baby sitting the other person. The guy may not think that way since hopefully he would have read Rumi and his poignant thoughts on women 100 times. In case of women, they can get really ticked off by the aloofness of men in the household matters. I strongly feel, if the couple can afford, they need to get help ``maid-service`` specially if there is a leaning towards perfectionism. If both are working and they cannot take care of their basic comforts then that money is not worth it! But, it`s all on individuals and their leanings.
No one is belittling the housewives. In fact, it`s a woman`s prerogative whether she wants to work or stay home. At times, some have the option and some don`t.
Pakfin`s comments were more on the lines of sharing responsibilities vs condemning what women want to do in their spare time. But Pakfin`s comments are also applicable to a certain % of women vs. being applicable to all and sundry. What is the % of working women in the East ?
I partly disagree with post 34`s argument. If someone is a house-wife, it`s their prerogative to have a coffee party or milad or any other social event at their place. How can you dictate anyone on that? Isn`t that what a home is meant for? A place where you have the freedom to walk upside down nangae paon or look like a clown with a clay/mud mask on your face and hair tied in a hot towel with fragranced oil for deep conditioning treatment.
The main point is if a 100% housewife expects her spouse to pitch in the household chores then she needs to be fair. If one person is working 100% outside, and the other person is 100% staying at home then things need to be balanced out. It`s the same thing, if a woman has a full time job that does not mean that she is living in a hotel kind of an environment. She still believes in maintaining a nice and cosy place and would like her spouse to share that responsibility. Well, if that does not happen then it can be very frustrating. And, one person may say well I am better off living on my own than baby sitting the other person. The guy may not think that way since hopefully he would have read Rumi and his poignant thoughts on women 100 times. In case of women, they can get really ticked off by the aloofness of men in the household matters. I strongly feel, if the couple can afford, they need to get help ``maid-service`` specially if there is a leaning towards perfectionism. If both are working and they cannot take care of their basic comforts then that money is not worth it! But, it`s all on individuals and their leanings.
#36 Posted by m_souza on May 29, 2003 10:08:15 pm
Most of the Paksitani women ..even in UK and Australia donot go out to work.
Their Indian counterparts not only go out for a decent job but also do most of the household work. And I have heard some of them saying jokingly: ``Wish we were like the Paki women..jo din bhar palang tortee hain``
Of course they don`t ever want their wish to come true..they would rather go out..otherwise their kids would not be proud of them and start comparing them to other `smart mums` who have a career..
Their Indian counterparts not only go out for a decent job but also do most of the household work. And I have heard some of them saying jokingly: ``Wish we were like the Paki women..jo din bhar palang tortee hain``
Of course they don`t ever want their wish to come true..they would rather go out..otherwise their kids would not be proud of them and start comparing them to other `smart mums` who have a career..
#35 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on May 29, 2003 5:03:17 pm
Absolutely.
Someone`s gotta stay at the house and at least pretend it`s house if they are unable to make it one.
TO THE KITCHEN THEN! ; )
Someone`s gotta stay at the house and at least pretend it`s house if they are unable to make it one.
TO THE KITCHEN THEN! ; )
#34 Posted by stuka on May 29, 2003 1:49:44 pm
Pakfin says the truth. There is nothing wrong or deranged with staying home and looking after the house. But to stay home and go for kitty parties is useless.
#33 Posted by Urstruly on May 29, 2003 5:55:43 am
I wish that people stop disrespecting stay home moms and stop belittling the value of the household work they do.
#32 Posted by ZeeshanMahmud on May 28, 2003 8:31:47 pm
The writing is fairly middle of the road and tbe sarcasm may work in the writer`s head but on paper it`s quite colourless and bland. I wonder if it`s even sarcasm.
I couldn`t care less about the name if I dont know the guy. Saleem Elvis, Johnny Khan or Michael Khar (Hmmm...Herr is similar to Khar) whatever.
After all....all blackbirds are birds but not all birds are blackbirds.
The writing I can judge. It`s fairly mediocre. Has no beginning, middle, end or point. That may work if you`re one charming dogf*cker.
But you`re not.
It also has the scent of misogynism. For men like myself, misogynism is forgivable if, again you`re one charming dogf*cker or can mask your primitiveness with a biting sense of humour or black wit. Or have a point to make. I mean you`re no Sam Peckinpah or Dave Sim...let`s leave it that.
I couldn`t care less about the name if I dont know the guy. Saleem Elvis, Johnny Khan or Michael Khar (Hmmm...Herr is similar to Khar) whatever.
After all....all blackbirds are birds but not all birds are blackbirds.
The writing I can judge. It`s fairly mediocre. Has no beginning, middle, end or point. That may work if you`re one charming dogf*cker.
But you`re not.
It also has the scent of misogynism. For men like myself, misogynism is forgivable if, again you`re one charming dogf*cker or can mask your primitiveness with a biting sense of humour or black wit. Or have a point to make. I mean you`re no Sam Peckinpah or Dave Sim...let`s leave it that.
#30 Posted by Roshan on May 28, 2003 7:23:40 pm
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#29 Posted by Roshan on May 28, 2003 7:23:39 pm
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#28 Posted by ZahraJ on May 28, 2003 7:23:39 pm
Pakfin,
A typical South Asian Woman``with the features you have identified`` is as deranged as a typical South Asian Man. And, I think they deserve each other - nothing less and nothing more. And, yes, I 75% concur with your analysis.
A typical South Asian Woman``with the features you have identified`` is as deranged as a typical South Asian Man. And, I think they deserve each other - nothing less and nothing more. And, yes, I 75% concur with your analysis.
#27 Posted by Pakfin on May 28, 2003 3:30:22 pm
#24 by Saminasha on May 28, 2003 7:55am PT
``Btw, help your wife with the housework and stop complaining. ``
A lot of Asian women end up in the West and start complaining about their husbands not helping out with the housework. However, they forget that a major diference between them and western women is that the typical western woman works while the typical South Asian does not. As long as the wife is helping out in meeting household expenses, she can demand that the husband helps out with household chores. But on the other hand if she wakes up at noon and watches TV or chats on the phone all day long and then expects her husband to come back at 7 pm and help out with housework, then she is sadly mistaken. No wonder people are writing articles like this one.
``Btw, help your wife with the housework and stop complaining. ``
A lot of Asian women end up in the West and start complaining about their husbands not helping out with the housework. However, they forget that a major diference between them and western women is that the typical western woman works while the typical South Asian does not. As long as the wife is helping out in meeting household expenses, she can demand that the husband helps out with household chores. But on the other hand if she wakes up at noon and watches TV or chats on the phone all day long and then expects her husband to come back at 7 pm and help out with housework, then she is sadly mistaken. No wonder people are writing articles like this one.
#26 Posted by Urstruly on May 28, 2003 12:35:30 pm
Poor grammer and weak sentence structure has ruined this write up. It also becomes quite mediocre at the end.
#25 Posted by dullabhatti on May 28, 2003 10:44:29 am
guys..I think he said somewhere in the article that he is ``the`` Khar not ``a`` Khar. I agree if he is only ``a`` Khar he should not be bound by the deeds of other Khars but if he is closely related then some people are going to take it with a pinch of salt and call it ironic. In either case his attempt to highlight the issue is admirable...I think he is probably honest about it too.
#24 Posted by Saminasha on May 28, 2003 7:55:03 am
Dark and funny.
Btw, help your wife with the housework and stop complaining.
Btw, help your wife with the housework and stop complaining.
#23 Posted by Paigham on May 27, 2003 7:20:23 pm
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#22 Posted by SameerJB on May 27, 2003 5:15:40 pm
dullabhatti: I agree wth hamidm. The stories about 2-3 ``bad`` Khars should not be used against Khar as a tribe. It would be same if 2-3 bad Sandhus, Manns or Reddys are used to stereotype all of them. There are tens of thousands of Khars around a place called Kot Addu in district Muzaffargarh. Some believe that they are the southern branch of Kharral tribe of the north (Mirza Jatt and Rai Ahmed Khan Kharral of 1857 mutiny fame) although Kharrals call themselves Jatts but Malik Khar seems to be calling himself a Rajput.
P.S. I am not sure if tehmina daultana is same as one of Khar`s wife, tehmina. I believe her name was Tehmina Durrani or something like that. Tehmina Daultana is PML(N) leader and daughter of famous politician Mumtaz Daultana from Vehari.
P.S. I am not sure if tehmina daultana is same as one of Khar`s wife, tehmina. I believe her name was Tehmina Durrani or something like that. Tehmina Daultana is PML(N) leader and daughter of famous politician Mumtaz Daultana from Vehari.
#21 Posted by m_souza on May 27, 2003 5:15:39 pm
#16 by dullabhatti on May 27, 2003 10:02am PT
``If Wiji really does the house chores herself, kudos to her. nai te saaday desh `ch te keeRiyaN nu vi zukaam hoyea piya ay...chaudraaniaN hath hila ke raaji nai. ``
hahaha
you are talking abt paki women I suppose?
``If Wiji really does the house chores herself, kudos to her. nai te saaday desh `ch te keeRiyaN nu vi zukaam hoyea piya ay...chaudraaniaN hath hila ke raaji nai. ``
hahaha
you are talking abt paki women I suppose?
#20 Posted by taimurmalik on May 27, 2003 5:15:39 pm
Shahnawaz:
Lets not be held hostage to our family names!!
I have read this before in the TFT as well and I have to admit that I have mixed feelings. And admittedly, I await your reply to the different opinions/remarks posted on this board. That should be interesting :)
Regards.
Lets not be held hostage to our family names!!
I have read this before in the TFT as well and I have to admit that I have mixed feelings. And admittedly, I await your reply to the different opinions/remarks posted on this board. That should be interesting :)
Regards.
#19 Posted by stuka on May 27, 2003 5:15:39 pm
I agree with HamidM. What the hell logic is this that because he is a Khar he should not write satire about spousal abuse? Maybe all Desais are forbidden from talking about urine??
Anyway, this was a pretty good piece of writing. I really enjoyed the run on commentary.
Anyway, this was a pretty good piece of writing. I really enjoyed the run on commentary.
#18 Posted by hamidm2 on May 27, 2003 2:16:49 pm
.... i think it is quite unfair of the readership to ridicule this fine piece of satire simply because the author`s last name is khar ........... for god`s sake guys, ghulam mustafa khar is not the only khar around - there must be hundreds, if not thousands of them .............
........... and in any case, what was so wrong with what gmk did? ......... so he married six or seven beautiful women in succession - but as far as i know he, unlike some other great men, had only one wife at a time ............. and come on, do you really believe verything that is in that terribly written kiss and tell book by tehmina dautana - a lot of it is probably ranting and raving by a jilted ex-wife ........... it is national enquirer stuff ........... i don`t have the foggiest idea what the real story is, but you can`t go on berating everyone with the last name khar ...............
........... and in any case, what was so wrong with what gmk did? ......... so he married six or seven beautiful women in succession - but as far as i know he, unlike some other great men, had only one wife at a time ............. and come on, do you really believe verything that is in that terribly written kiss and tell book by tehmina dautana - a lot of it is probably ranting and raving by a jilted ex-wife ........... it is national enquirer stuff ........... i don`t have the foggiest idea what the real story is, but you can`t go on berating everyone with the last name khar ...............
#17 Posted by soysauce on May 27, 2003 10:31:50 am
I think you have the difficult task of pulling off the saracasm with a readership that you know will probably miss it because of the unfamiliarity, etc. Hence the various bits of paranthetical remarks to bring the readers up to speed. Because of that, the piece, trying to reach high, falls down on itself. Not your fault really. As Shandana said it might work with TFT, if you keep out the editorial comments.
#16 Posted by dullabhatti on May 27, 2003 10:02:46 am
This article could have been just an attempt to highlight the problem in society using humour, if it was not written by `a` Khar. If what I have read about Khars in the past is true, Malik sahib you should have been more careful approaching this subject. Anyone else takes it lightly....is probably ok..but if you talk about this subject you better be serious..very serious. See now it looks like not only Khars(you may be an exception) treat their wives badly but also laugh over it. Not good. Very much against what you were trying to say.
If Wiji really does the house chores herself, kudos to her. nai te saaday desh `ch te keeRiyaN nu vi zukaam hoyea piya ay...chaudraaniaN hath hila ke raaji nai.
If Wiji really does the house chores herself, kudos to her. nai te saaday desh `ch te keeRiyaN nu vi zukaam hoyea piya ay...chaudraaniaN hath hila ke raaji nai.
#15 Posted by Studebaker on May 27, 2003 9:19:23 am
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#14 Posted by Studebaker on May 27, 2003 9:19:23 am
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#13 Posted by Studebaker on May 27, 2003 9:19:23 am
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#12 Posted by Studebaker on May 27, 2003 9:19:23 am
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#11 Posted by nvp2003 on May 27, 2003 7:32:07 am
What is with the surname ``Khar`` and divorcing/beating/raping/killing wives?? Does all the Khar clan`s DNA match with the direct decendents of Ivan The Terrible or something?
#10 Posted by slink on May 27, 2003 6:52:54 am
now why didn`t you send this one to tft instead?
shandana
shandana
#9 Posted by septran on May 27, 2003 6:52:54 am
i like the true story.i shall tell you there isverse case,in which wife slow poisioned her husband.in those there was an epidemic of ``hasa``.she used to give him posion in banana.doctors could diagnoised properly,till poor gay lost his kidney.after his death poision was tected in his bones.
as far women are concerned that is a routine matter.
as far women are concerned that is a routine matter.
#8 Posted by FarzanaVersey on May 27, 2003 6:52:23 am
Nice bit of sarcasm here. But a li`l fact: most women fantasise about killing their partners -- either because the men are offensive, useless... or, some just for the kick of it, a sexual sadistic delight.
#7 Posted by nasah on May 27, 2003 6:52:22 am
that`s why the `good` Muslims are in such bad shape - they have strangled their better half with a piece of a head scarf -- and show it proudly in public.
#5 Posted by tahmed32 on May 27, 2003 6:52:22 am
You almost have a sense of humor. However, it is not enough to make one laugh at the idea of killing women.
Coming from an ordinary boor, such ``humor`` would be gross in any case. Coming from one from the landlord class which has abused countless women (their own and that of ``their`` peasants) through the ages, it is disgusting. And coming from one from a family where Mustapha Khar is known for his brutality towards his own wife, it indicates a lack of any shame.
You seem to be trying to be a nice guy at least. That is all I can say.
Coming from an ordinary boor, such ``humor`` would be gross in any case. Coming from one from the landlord class which has abused countless women (their own and that of ``their`` peasants) through the ages, it is disgusting. And coming from one from a family where Mustapha Khar is known for his brutality towards his own wife, it indicates a lack of any shame.
You seem to be trying to be a nice guy at least. That is all I can say.
#3 Posted by Ras on May 26, 2003 9:35:21 pm
Women hold up half the sky and more than half the household.
Without that support, the house, country and culture can collapse.
Ras
#2 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on May 26, 2003 9:35:21 pm
Khar Saheb
Men with a fuedal mindset do worst than killing. Killing will be doing a great favour to their wife.
The wife is kept like a living dead in home. And treated worst than servants and dogs. Sex is forced upon her whether she likes it or not. I do not think that the fuedals know the delicate nuances of a foreplay.
She is given food and shelter and stays in the house only to satisfy the base instints of the husband.
The moment the husband gets bored with her, a new younger wife enters the house. The older wife is by now fully into the religious mode and simply waiting for the life hereafter.
#1 Posted by SameerJB on May 26, 2003 8:07:26 pm
Khar Saheb:
Why are you bent upon turning women into endangered species and likely to be extinct in 10,000 years at this rate? Your part of the world has already 52 men for every 48 women. I believe that about 10 percent of Pakistani men can be charged under section 302 easily.
By the way, I liked the sarcastic style to highlight one of the biggest evil in our society.
Why are you bent upon turning women into endangered species and likely to be extinct in 10,000 years at this rate? Your part of the world has already 52 men for every 48 women. I believe that about 10 percent of Pakistani men can be charged under section 302 easily.
By the way, I liked the sarcastic style to highlight one of the biggest evil in our society.
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