To Kill the Mockingbird

Infact recall the Muslim objection to the use of the word infinite by the Bush Administration... in October 2001

Soyasauce:

In reference to Shahabuddin:

Shahabuddin may flee to Pak: DGP
PRANAV K CHAUDHARY

TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ MONDAY, AUGUST 04, 2003 07:30:38 PM ]

PATNA: Further tightening screws on absconding RJD MP from Bihar, Mohd Shahabuddin, the Bihar police on Monday evening sent an SOS to the police commissioners of Delhi, Mumbai, Chennai, Hyderabad and Kolkata to prevent the MP`s escape to a foreign country.
The Siwan MP is on the run after state police chief ordered his arrest in a kidnapping case a few days ago.

While apprehending that the MP might be planning to leave the country to evade arrest, Bihar Director General of Police (DGP) D P Ojha in a fax message to the police commissioners has alerted them to the MP`s plan and urged them to prevent it.

A letter has also been sent to the director general of the Central Industrial Security Force, which looks after the security at various airports, requesting him to arrest the MP if he is spotted.



The state police are in receipt of intelligence reports that the MP was on way to Pakistan via Dubai, police sources said.

Zafar,

Quite a lengthy article.
Why defend a medieval method of imparting education in the modern world? Don`t you think the same charities can work towards secular schools too?
Imagine a large number of people sending their kids to ashram style education and teaching them ancient books. What good would it do these kids. Their education and modernity would be anachronistic.

Adios

re: Mantolives # 74

That was very well said and we have to keep this in mind all the time. Islam is a not a monolithic entity and we should resist attempts to make it one.

Ciao

Stuka 73

That is the nicest thing anyone has said about me on chowk.

-Manto

Naqshbandi,

Where I agree with Rsaxena`s estimate of you, I don`t agree with his statement about you hastening your departure. I think you are man of conviction, and you shouldn`t be harrassed because of your conviction.

I wish though that you would read Sameerjb`s post once again, and I hope one day you will realize that the people that you admire like Sheikh Hamza Yusuf can hardly be termed as the friends of Muslims and Islam. With their retrogressive ideologies, they seek to undo all that the Modernist movement in Islam, speerheaded by men like Sir Syed, Iqbal, Ameer Ali, Jinnah, Namik Kemal and Mustapha Kemal, has achieved in the last 200 years.

Islam is not a stagnant faith. Why do you wish for it to become that?

-Manto

Yantra:68
Honourable Sir!

The slurs you hurl have lost their edge because of overuse. Please invent some fresh invective or revitalise the vitroil.

Destiny or Fate has never been an issue .The real worry should be to find the right astrologer. They never lie-- if you feed them the truth and pay their bill.

Yantric:

``Good idea of muslim mindset. ``

I find that phrase highly offensive. It is no different than equally ignorant phrases like ``cunning baniya`` or ``Hindu mentality``. How the hell do you expect 1.6 billion afherents to have one mindset? And Ii am a Hindu btw.

Manto:

Thanks for some very enlightening posts. I think you are a living rebuttal to what Jay keeps spouting about Pakistan. In fact, you do not have to prove him wrong by arguing with him because your existence is enough.

PS: Another sad fact is that the frontier Gandhi`s successors have always allied themselves with the religious parties against mainstream national parties like the Muslim League or the Pakistan Peoples Party....

1) In 1947 the Khudai Khidmatgars were found guilty of colluding with the Fakir of Ipi.

2) In 1970, Wali Khan formed the coalition government with Maulana Fazlu`s dad, Mufti Mahmood....

3) 1977, Wali Khan and his socialist secular party was part of the PNA whose catch slogan was `Nifaz-e-Nizam-e-Mustafa`, or the creation of a truly Islamic state.

4) Right now while they sit in the opposition in the NWFP assembly ... they voted with the government on the issue of sharia.

Another twist in the history of the politics of Pakistan.

Ooops point 2 should read in 1973 ... Wali Khan formed a coalition government with Mufti Mahmood in NWFP....

Echoboom

``Unless one is afraid of such zeal and determination there is no need to worry about their `welfare`. The criteria are different. ``

Good idea of muslim mindset. What is the zeal and determination for ........ To convert rest of the world to a bedoin relgion propogated by a paedophile. And if one can`t convert then kill. If can`t kill then die in a fidayeen attack.

Yes some of us pray to many godesses.......... it is because for us God is infinity and not one. Moreover we are not intimidated by women like you guys. I guess for you they are only sex objects. For God can come in form of a woman too.

Dear Stuka,

Sorry, I misjudged your question. My bad. :) Please ignore those two statements...

Anyway, you have pretty much the basic idea. Nationstates are evolutionary... You`ve already quoted the famous Jinnah speech on this, and I quote Faiz Ahmed Faiz.. who said in 1970s that `The Pakistani nation is not the same as the Muslim nation that fought for Pakistan` suggesting basically that Pakistan is determined by the Pakistanis and not by the past. In this respect 14th August 1947 suggested a break from the past, for Muslim minority nationalism was only valid in the broader all India context (and from the looks of it exists in India today eg ‘Qaum’ ), and Pakistan was and will always be a different and completely new identity. Hence the Jinnah speech you quoted.
If only the Pakistanis could read more.

Frontier Gandhi’s loss of popularity was due to the earlier perception of being anti-Pakistan. However as soon as his successors reconciled themselves with the idea of Pakistan , they reclaimed their traditional vote bank. Maudoodi on the other hand never got any popular electoral support… infact in 1970 his party got annihilated at the polls in his life time. MMA which is an alliance of 6 religious parties, 5 of which didn’t like Maudoodi very much in the past, has only won popular support because of its anti-American stance … which explains the defeats of the Bacha Khan and his followers in NWFP.

Religious extremists like Maudoodi will always have a nuisance value. Yet god knows for what reason, the Modernist Pakistanis are scared shi-tless of them… they try and appease them… by using words like Quran and Sunnah, and no legislation repugnant to Islam, but this is only giving them the foot in the door. Had the Pakistani Constituent Assembly in 1949 paid any heed to the brilliant advice of the Hindu members from East Pakistan, and stayed the course with keeping even the hint of religion out of the constitution, Maudoodi and his followers could never have become the nuisance they became later. As in the words of one Hindu MP from East Pakistan ‘Our Posterity will condemn us for this Objectives resolution’. I am the POSTERITY. I condemn the Objectives Resolution.

-Manto

re: Stuka # 64

Concerning your question, Maudoodi`s political fortunes were given a boost by Khawja Nazimuddin, who was the Governor-General after Jinnah`s death. Nazimuddin was a religious person and he gave heed to Maudoodi`s ideas and thus, cementing his influence.

Hope this helps!

Ciao

Manto:

Thanks for an informative post.

``Maudoodi by contrast doesn`t find any mention in Pakistani ideology or Pakistani History books, perhaps due to his opposition to partition which I am sure you know all about. ``

I am quite familiar with Maudoodi`s reference to the yet to be formed Pakistan as Napakistan. I am also aware of the dissonance of the Indian congress movement which was supposedly secular but chose to ally itself with the fundamentalist bloack. Gandhis mistake was his over-reliance on the Ali brothers and a backward looking Khilafat movement.

What I am unable to understand is that is Frontier Gandhi`s political standing collapsed even though he had ethnic roots in NWFP, how the hell was Maudoodi able to resurrect his political career in Pakistan. I mean, this guy did not even have a political base in the territory that went on to become Pakistan. Yet, he managed to raise his profile enough where he was a significant nuisance value to the establishment.

Manto:

``Your question made me think that you have an exaggerated idea about the Pakistani ideology whatever that is.``


I used the phrase only to clarify that I was interested in the ``official`` rather than your personal perspective of the situation. I know you are phenomenally well read so I do believe that your personal perspective may actually be more factual than a politically expedient ``official`` view.