Trembling Camera Flare on a Column Within a Column

nasah: All good, zeeshan is a strong debater still.

thanks, DRUMZ:-)

zeeshan: Dont worry Im quite used to this treatment on chowk. Ppl love to talk sh1t but the moment u drop a gem on em they come up with 101 reasons why they cant continue debating...

LOL you actually retyped #68 which in my opinion is by far the stupidest post ive ever read in my life....

``I won’t reread my posts and reread yours each time you post again because you…``

LMAO!!! HAHAHAHA You have to reread both of our posts whenever i post? U have the attention span of sperm.

1) Is no contradiction you dumbfukk (why am i even explaining this?). When I say we will change their (EASTERN) thinking, where do u get the ASSUMPTION that we will implement a WESTERN one?

2) Why would i repeatedly call most of the ppl here stupid if i wanna be liked?

3. Congratulations, your questions actually get dumber with each point. I didnt admit to knowing nothing of the culture i said ``IF I know nothing.`` SOMEONE needs to read the definition of the word ``IF.``
Focus on READING COMPRENSION and my job wouldnt be this easy.

4. Um sorry to break it to you, YOU FUKKIN NERD, but not everyone gets hard on white authors. LOL what the fukk is a finnigans whale, haha.

Kid come up with something good next time, your boring the sh1t outta me.

I posted a reply nearly twenty hours ago. Seeing after this update that it isn’t up, I have no idea why it didn’t show up. I never save ‘em but I ought to. So let’s try this one more time.

--

Listen drumf*cker because I’m not going to repeat myself one more time. I won’t reread my posts and reread yours each time you post again because you…

1) You contradict yourself/lie.

Example: On eastern parents you said…
``And thats how it should be. If they dont change their idiotic beliefs, we will change them ourselves.``

Now you say…
``I nowhere suggested replacing the eastern way with the western way (this is your dualistic thinking). Why do u assume that the only thing which exists other then one extreme is the other extreme?``

I’d say you’re pants are down right about now. Dualistic thinking may sound a cool term to you but it doesn`t apply here. So use words that you actually understand.

2) Attention is what you crave. Calling me a spotlight lover is all the more funny considering your posts on unplugged and your desperate bid to be liked by making fun of me. It`s called loser`s compromise.

3) You admit that you know nothing of that culture therefore are a babbling uninformed fool who likes to hear his own voice. Example?

``Where i am from, has nothing to do with what i am writing. If i dont know about pakistani culture, it will reflect in what I write.``

So shut your f*ckin’ mouth you dumb uninformed piece of shit. There’s too many of you who just like to talk and egowank all day. With this and your lying, you are unqualified to share your opinion.

4) Close to being a woman? Were you really being funny? Because honestly I can’t tell.

Brevity may not be present in my posts below but I don’t ignore everything that I don’t like or can’t argue with much like you do. Your “whattaya mumblin’ boot?” shit may sound funny to third graders but from where I’m standing it’s ignoring the issue.

I never said that woman beating isn’t wrong you lying f*ck. Proof required.

And if you think “breathtakingly stupid” is clever/intelligent phrasing I’m James f*cking Joyce writing Finnegan`s F*cking Wake.

Now say what you like because a) I have proven you’re a liar b) ignorant c) unfunny. Come back when you read the posts and are able to answer them.

#67
Either you are Drumz on another screen name or a f*cking wannabe groupie loser. If you’re the latter, be very ashamed.

so finally cocky zee shan mah-e mud meets -- stocky aalee shaan DRUMZ -- and gets the DRUMMING of his 21 years long old life:-)

#64, was meant to be #62. #62 was meant to be #64.

The empty spaces were quotes.

What`s wrong here?

zee: No one has time to read ur whole damn life story (ironically its cuz u cant write for sh1t, lol). Brevity is an art you wannabee writers need to work on.

Not only are ur posts loaded (that aint a good thing), almost EVERYTHING u say is off on a tangent and is the product of numerous (INVALID) assumptions. (iss a loaded way of sayin ur stupid)

Message not the Messenger. Where i am from, has nothing to do with what i am writing. If i dont know about pakistani culture, it will reflect in what I write. The fact that i come from toronto is irrelevent to the topic at hand. And U should be the last person to accuse anyone of acting gora.

I nowhere suggested replacing the eastern way with the western way (this is your dualistic thinking). Why do u assume that the only thing which exists other then one extreme is the other extreme?

Someone can just as easily criticize you for speaking on womens issues and not being a woman (though ur damn close). And im sure theres some lovely souls sittin back and enjoying this azz whoppin, as well they should be...

What is this crap about way of life? Jesus why do u wimpy azz writers go on these long boring monologues like theres a fukkin spotlight on u. All i say is that the way many women are treated in pakistan is ``WRONG`` (yes thats a judgement call, very observant). You obviously cant argue with this, cuz even u are not that stupid, so u bring in foolish arguments to side track the debate (like where im from, or wether or not i favour the american system). And I think in black and white???

Instead of dealing with what i am saying literally, you extrapolate my statements to make some sort of pseudophilosophical observation. NO ONE CARES. ie If someone says beating women is wrong, you say there is no such thingas right and wrong.

What are u mumbling about guys admitin to being wifebeaters? What does this say about the marriage system when the woman knows nothing of the man? And whats the etemology of revolve-minus ur lil speech that i skipped.

CHOWK writers take note, Its not often youll see someone make an arrogant prick look this breathtakingly stupid.

Tut tut.
I was talking about the girl`s parents. I don`t remember anyone else mentioning the boy`s parents either. Try to stick to the point eh?

And perhaps you are unaware torontoboy that parents have always told their children what to do. Unfair as it may seem, seeing it in black and white is too convenient. Rebellion in the village and rebellion in Gulberg don`t amount to the same thing.
And Jesus...
How many guys admit to being wifebeaters before marriage?
None. So your question why a father would allow it is pretty stupid.



How touching. I`d be waving my hanky at you heroman if I didn`t know what that really meant.



My God! You have me discovered! I`m only ignoring the black and white look at the world just so people like you can call me ``my you`re deep.``
To be validated by those I am unable to see as my intellectual peers or even respectable people has always been a dream of mine.

Now let`s see....of the two kids who are studying for their science exam, which of the two is smarter?
One that only learns what he finds interesting or easy to agree with?
Or someone who actually looks at the uninteresting stuff and that brings complications?
You pretend to be this modern man but you look at things in a childish black and white way.

I think considering the greys was the right thing to do.



Ahem. No it really isn`t. And I know better because...I wrote the damn thing.
My definition of love isn`t one-note and simple. Love has no place here.
Maybe you`re looking at thigns in your childish b/w way again. Love or hate, gym socks or cologne etc etc.

I am not comparing the beaten women by their parent`s values.
If you think I`ll let you get away with that atrocious line you have another thing coming.

Pay more attention. I merely reminded everyone that we have parents to think of. All women don`t get beaten up for Chrissake.

You are being ignorant by suggesting a revolution. People who have recently been made familiar with the word have a tendency to go on about it. I can tell you`re excited but the foremost thing about revolutions is this.
All revolutions have a hole. It`s the people. People may huddle around an idea but that gaping hole is people because people are stupid, easily frightened etc. And those women with their startlingly high self esteem have all the confidence of starting off the next one. I`m sure you and everyone else isn`t used to this. You ignore all the parts that don`t fit in your hypothesis and chuckle your way to your knowing.

I don`t think this was schooling. But then most of my teachers at school were ignorant too.
I don`t see how recappi everything written on chowk is necessary. I don`t see how you know any more than me on this subject because you`ve read ``Happy Birthday`` at the top of the main page.

Please don`t talk shit next time around.

#60
You marriage crap is flowery but ultimately worthless.
You criticise them for enjoying an event like that but I could criticise you for being just as shallow and wanking off with your own ego with your beliefs. Whatever makes people happy boyo. Whatever gets it up.

Your love is abhored is even more cretinous.
Pakistan isn`t an Orwellian future. You may assume some mental power calling it that but it really isn`t. To understand the beauty of love and loving in Pakistani society one must either practice doublethink or mix/match from the west and the east.

And seeing your post how you criticise traditional beliefs in Pakistan how they`re ``azz backwards`` I`d ask you talk less and listen more. One culture is not right and the other is not wrong. When you`ve lived that very life or been very close to it perhaps then you will be qualified to comment torontoboy.
You have some nerve saying that parents should be ignorant while you stick your baby pecker in some tart. If you do think you want to live your own life without anyone butting in, go ahead. But saying that you will ``change`` their beliefs etc is fu*king stupid.
The American way of life where your parents don`t interfere may be your poison of choice but saying that the pakistani way of ``this is everybody`s business`` should be brought down is retarded. You don`t like it don`t choose it. Don`t live it. Some people eat shit for a living.
And some of them don`t even care if it`s right or wrong. Some people spend their whole lives serving everyone else and forgetting about themselves. There is no one way of life that the world should adapt. There is no one religion that everyone should embrace. No philosopher that all should hail. So as much as you are annoyed at the culture you won`t and can`t change it. And you don`t really care so stop pretending otherwise.

Don`t tell us that you belief deserves wider adoption because the same way you are having trouble looking at things from all sides, people have trouble living that very life you think is the right one.
Suggesting that the parents need to be ``enlightened`` is like saying that all people who follow any organised religion should be forced to accept that there is no God and they should quit the stupid faith act already.

Sell stupid somewhere else, we`re all stocked up here.

The attitude that pakis abroad have where they think everything in pakistan is unworkable and that the traditions should be completely thrown out the window and replaced by their western shite is just as retarded as what pakis say about desis abroad when they adapt the foreign culture.
``Aye haye. Wahan ja kay to gorown ka hogaya hai!``
(Translation: He`s become a white man`s bitch!)

I don`t mind if people start acting gora while abroad and tend to forget how they`ve lived all their lives or if culture/heritage means nothing to them but I certainly get pissed when they get judgemental about Pakistan and present solutions without understanding the problem.
Quit while you`re ahead Michael Jackson, Quit while you`re ahead.

#60:
[ ... Distant friends are invited, a masquerade is performed, fake crying, fake exchanges, gifts are exchanged (shouldnt the union be enuff), its all a show. ...]

I have attended many American weddings as well. Except for the crying part, I found them to be just as shallow and pompous as the desi ones.

Ansari: Desi marriages make a mockery of love. Parents like to see who can outspend whom. Rarely is there any genuine concern about the two people who are getting married (for usually they barely even know eachother). Distant friends are invited, a masquerade is performed, fake crying, fake exchanges, gifts are exchanged (shouldnt the union be enuff), its all a show.

Love, in my opinion is the closest mirror to the divine we have, yet almost all facets of desi culture abhor it. Why? It is pushed to the background of society. Men and women (especially in PAKISTAN) cannot even socialize alone because this STUPID generation of FOSSILS considers love to be EVIL.

Our brainwashed parents (I hope im not being SUBTLE) care far too much about what other people think. They expect men and women to somehow meet miraculously without socializing and then have the audacity to wonder why male/female relations are so fukked up.

Here im talking about desi`s in the west. We cant even kiss and hug infront of older desis cuz god forbid these ignorant dinosaurs find out that men and women kiss. Even in my relationship rite now, I was so surprised to find out that everyone had a vested interest our outcome. My friends thought i would leave them, her siblings wonder if they will be reincarnated as humans, her parents would kill a brutha, my parents are better but still are scared. Its like everyone has their nose in our business. Its interesting to know that none of this censorship crap works. In the west all the desis i know are in relationships and their ignorant parents dont know. And thats how it should be. If they dont change their idiotic beliefs, we will change them ourselves.

LOL im glad u asked this Q, gave me a chance to vent.......

LOL Your so damn defensive. Relax man this is only an internet site, no ones making any history here.

Giving parents the benefit of the doubt because they are ``old`` is a VERY BIG EXCUSE. Especially when it is these same parents that are the ones demanding dowry, the same ones telling their daughters and sons what their roles are and the same ones that are allowing their daughters to be married off to ignorant fools. (again not all, but a significant amount).

You explain to me how a father can allow his daughter to live with a wife beater because zeeshan doesnt think old people can embrace new ideas. Not having your daughter beaten is not a new idea. Ill tell u if someone lay a hand on even a female i looked at i would skin the muthafukka alive. If it was my daughter im takin out the whole village.

This nonsense about considering everyone equal in this will get u no where, no matter how deep u think u look.

What the hell are u talking about me sleeping? The whole article is about LOVE, rather desi misconceptions on LOVE (who cares what anyone else mentioned).

This is a CULTURAL issue affecting the mores and values of a civilization. It will be changed the same way change has always occured on a cultural scale (when the culture decides to adopt new mores and values). This REVOLUTION can happen from the bottom up or top down, but does not necessarily involve considering all parties as equals, for they are NOT. You cannot compare women who get beaten by men with parents who are worried about what others think of them.

If the issue of power was removed from the equation and we were dealing with merely IDEAS, you would be correct. However, one must consider POWER and STATUS because Pak/India are patriachal societies.

As for myself, I think i viable solution will be a result of the cooperation between govt and more importantly, the grass roots movements across paki/india.

PS: We will talk of comprehension after u no longer have the need to recap everything ever written on chowk. And my sincerest apologies for schooling you on your own thread.

Drumz,

``Why is it that EVERYTHING a desi man or woman thinks about LOVE is azz backwards 99.9999% of the time?``

Arrite mate, clue me in. . .

I`ve only talked about the parents once.
All I said was that they are old fashioned and you can`t expect the older people to throw out the old and embrace the new. They are suspicious of the new.
I don`t see how that is an excuse. Telling people how the parents feel once is called the truth, ignored pov if you will.
The article was about the woman. Parents were only introduced as supporting characters struck by tragedy.
Looking at things from all sides, if I recall correctly, is the correct and smart way of solving a problem or viewing it.
As I`ve said before ``liberate the woman and you break the parent`s heart.``
The relationships that have worked for generations won`t be dissolved by the modern way of things. You may have your future daughter choose her husband etc but you`re living in Toronto not Samnabad, Lahore.
Since love was never mentioned once by myself or anyone are you sure you haven`t been sleeping yourself?
Expecting them to wake the ``fukk`` up is all hip and modern and do you mind telling how they should do that and what you really mean by that if you mean anything?
And don`t give me a solution that works for one side. You have to bring both the sheep and the lion to the other side.
Reparse your post to introduce comprehension and maybe you can tell me how I`m ``azz backwards.``

You make far too many excuses for parents in this case. The excuses may fly if the parents are dirt poor, otherwise they are as responsible for the system as anyone. Parents need to wake the fukk up.

PS: Why is it that EVERYTHING a desi man or woman thinks about LOVE is azz backwards 99.9999% of the time?