Terrorism, Sectarianism and the Military

oye arjum_n:

what are your brothers doing associating with us losers? and what are you trying to gain by reading news papers of countries ranked 130 places below india?

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_19-7-2003_pg7_9

``Meanwhile, Sri Lanka on Friday arrested more than 100 migrants from India and Pakistan, accusing them of using the island as a transit point to Italy. 112 Indians and six Pakistanis were arrested after a raid on three separate hideouts.``

Good to see Bi Partisan support for India. That is why I emphasize that Indian Americans must not limit themselves to one Party. Look at the Jews, Republican or Democrat, every admin supports them. We should aspire to have similar political reach in the US.


Indians, Jewish Americans join hands in fight against terrorism

Aziz Haniffa in Washington DC | July 18, 2003 01:03 IST
Last Updated: July 18, 2003 01:43 IST


For years, the Indian American community envied the Jewish community, particularly their ability to organise the community politically and influence decision making at the highest levels.

This week, it joined hands with the Jewish community in the fight against terrorism marking the coming together of the peoples of two nations bearing the brunt of the menace.

A nascent yet politically enterprising Indian American group joined two powerful Jewish American groups and played host to some US lawmakers, who supported the development while expressing their support to the fight against terrorism.

The theme at the event, touted as the coming of age of a partnership between the two communities, was `Standing for Democracy, Standing Against Terrorism`.

The venue - the Senate Dirksen Office Building Room on Capitol Hill.

``This reception marks the beginning of a long and enduring partnership for the two communities to work together on issues of mutual concern and interests and to leverage each other`s strengths,`` the organisers said.

Over 100 Jewish and Indian American community leaders attended the event, hosted by the US-India Political Action Committee, the American Israeli Public Affairs Committee and the American Jewish Committee.

According to a joint statement by the organisers, the two communities `share a deep commitment to democracy, pluralism, strong families and entrepreneurship`.

``The partnership between these two communities is reflected in the growing ties between the US, India and Israel,`` the statement said adding, ``This partnership also strongly advocates and supports a vigorous US response to global terrorism.``

``This reception for United States` elected leadership will demonstrate that the Indian American and American Jewish communities are united in their support for democracy and opposition to the threat posed by global terrorism.``

Among the lawmakers present were Congressman Frank Pallone (New Jersey, Democrat), Tom Lantos (California, Democrat), a Hungarian-born Jew and Holocaust survivor, Senator Ron Wyden (Oregon, Democrat), Congressman Mark Kirk (Illinois, Republican), Congressman Mark Foley (Florida, Republican) and Gary Ackerman (New York, Democrat), whose daughter-in-law is Indian American.

Speaking on the occasion, Pallone, former co-chair of the India Caucus, recalled that when he founded the Caucus over 10 years ago, ``one of the first things I would hear was - how we (Indian Americans) can emulate the Jewish community, particularly the American Israeli Public Affairs Committee, in terms of their lobbying abilities, their ability to organise the community politically.``

A decade later, Pallone said, he was of the opinion that `the Indian American community has been very successful at emulating the AIPAC and empowering themselves politically, becoming a really major political force across the country and in Congress.``

#94 stuka


[quote]
LOL!! He has retracted today. :) Check out the times of India.
[end-quote]

What do you expect ? He may not be able to return to Pakistan if he suggests any reasonable compromise. The problem is not with whackos like this guy; they are crazy fanatics anyway. The problem lies with their educated brethren who believe that ``just cause`` entitles them to support mass murder of civilians and attacks on indian schoolchildren.

And then these clowns complain that indians are bugging them ! Hah ! We haven;t even began to bug them.

I was hoping Chowk was slowly reaching a stage where we would start seeing some knowledgeable critique of the military. Nazar Hayat`s article was a pretty good step in that direction.

However, this article brings us back to yellow journalism and emotions. I am not quite sure how useful venting of frustration, based on conspiracy theories, can be. It doesn`t do anyone any good. It presents false information. It polarizes groups, since false information can easily be countered, and it provides no constructive criticism, which may lead to progress.

It is very easy to see criticism coming from someone who understands the organization they are criticizing, and that coming from someone who doesn`t. The former`s criticism is healthy and does good to the organization being critiqued. This article offers nothing new in that direction.

Perhaps Chowk Staff should present articles that have more content and less emotion.

Ahmadzai:

`` Pakistani Punjabis are much better off than their Indian cousins, ``

What the hell are you talking about?? Per capita income of Indian Punjab is much higher than Pakistani Punjab. Indian Punjab has outstripped Pak Punjab in agricultural output per hectare. Where the hell do you get your facts from?

Maharana,

In terms of India sending Jehadi fanatics to fight in its disputed region with China... er, what? Is there a subjugated population there that I missed? With refugess having flooded into India, and coming across every day? Last time that happened, the Indian army packed them into training camps and called them `Mukhti Bahini`. And hey, later RAW got itself involved with those characters called the Liberation Tigers of something, didn`t they? And for a long time, the LTTE were the world masters of the suicide attack. Aint that something. Come to think of it, where does the LTTE even now get its donations and equipment?

Outlook magazine (hey, I read an Indian magazine?? Well, sometimes..) mentioned one of RAWs greatest successes as being the infiltration of the MQM. Who, by the way, enjoyed a great rep for murdering other ethnicities. I imagine that RAW was encouraging them not to attack policemen and murder Punjabi labourers, but to focus their energies on summoning inner peace and harmony for the betterment of Karachi and Pakistan as a whole.

Funnily, India had bases for Tibetans to train in guerilla warfare someime in the 50s and 60s. India has also provided bases for Nepalese guerillas against the Nepalese monarchy (communist guerillas, I think they were).

Darn straight the Indian government doesnt encourage the Bangladeshis to go against Pakistan. What, exactl, would they ask them to do?? Well, maybe ask their PM to make not-very-subtly-veiled comments against Pakistan at the UN. Besides, with your border guards shooting up Bangladeshi villagers and border guards pretty frequently, to say nothing of your services moaning about how Bangladesh is an ISI haven, I think theres some work to go.

Your comment about the undying belief etc.. so where does this come from exactly? What does the average Indian Hindu think of the Muslim? After 50 years of non-indoctrination and harmony? Even in a cosmopolitan city like Bombay? I think we found THAt out a few years back.. Post Babri there were indeed anti Hindu riots in Pakistan. Temples were burned. And, yes, one poor soul was killed. In the terrorist attacks going on these days, the attackers have to kill or be killed by police and security forces. In the Punjab church attack they killed the police guard on duty. In Murree they killed the outer guard, and then were engaged by the Muslims inside.

And most donations given to Islamist organizations are for general welfare work. Heck, even the Hezbullah has more people involved in social work than in blowing themselves up!

And most parents send their kids to madrassahs because they provide free food, free board and the chance for the child to have a future (as a mullah.. well, not MUCH of a career!). And yes, most of them are shocked when they find out that the child has ended up in a jehad somewhere. And yes, some of them are proud. But most.. are not.

Cheers, AK

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Assad: I live in the states dude and have travelled widely in the UK. The term Paki is an epithet in the UK and used for all South Asians. In the states it is a contraction. In any case, its a racial epithet and u have to be a mite too sensitive if a brown skinned desi is referring to another brown skinned desi as a Paki and that too in reference to nationality and not race.

You`re right about some American apologizing, after it was made awre that the word has an unpleasent connotation in the UK. Indian newspapers routinely refer to Pakistan as Pak and Pakistani players as Paki players. I don`t think the Pak embassy has ever brought it up nor the media.

Faisaluno:


``one of the strongest and most fearsome paki mullahs has gone to india and pretty much echoed 90% of indian line on kashmir (hear hear)``

LOL!! He has retracted today. :) Check out the times of India.

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hnasir: Excellent post. One cannot claim to love Pakistan without demanding the right to a free and fair election process which is the right of any free people. By imposing the mullahs on pakistan through tinkering with the elections as you point out, and by imposing his personal views concerning kashmir on the rest of the nation, musharaff has taken away the freedom and dignity of all Pakistanis. He still has time to undo the destructive path he put this country in when he meddled with the recent elections out of fear of the mainstream parties coming back in power.

As a proud Pakistani myself, I deeply resent this hijacking of the basic political rights of Pakistanis. The fact that mullahism is a sure-path to jehaaliyat and oppression makes this even worse.

Stuka,

re: Paki as epithet vs contraction

I very much doubt that the term Paki would be used by anyone familiar with it, as anything but an epithet. After all the term became popularized by the skinheads. And so its use now is pretty much using it in the same context.

Come to the States and go arround referring to niggers (or even negroes) or Yids, and see where that gets you.

Didnt the Americans have to apologize for use of the term `Paki` in public by some official or the other? And at that time it was used in general ignorance of its implications - about as harmless as calling someone a Brit or a Yank. But its not, is it...

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Hasan,

Perhaps if you did some reading etc you could, for instance, see the depths of government involvement in, say, Gujrat. Perhaps in your worldview the VHP/RSS are really not as virulent as the SSP/etc of the world. Heck, the Gujrat massacres allowed them to get voted back in in greater strength. But, despite its government being hand-in-glove with fascistic, murderous thugs - delivered unto power by the ballot, mind you - India doth bestride the world like a colossus. So perhaps your perpetual diatribes attributing all ills of Pakistan to Musharraf are a trifle narrow minded. Noone, including myself, denies the armys role at various times in leading to Pakistans current position. But how does 30 years rot become reversed in 3?

You have to make up your mind. Is Musharraf a machiavellian master or an incompetent improvising at every step? After all, your accusations seem to present him as both!

And the references to the SAT are beginning to come thick and fast, I see! I`m sure you are eagerly awaiting their print issue with the `Musharraf noone knew`.. except that heck, b/n you, Sameer and Shaheen Sehbais crack team, all thats left to show us is how Musharraf was cloned in a vat with the DNA of Attilla, Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot!