Admissions Open

thats is true, but in general i just dont understand onething. Why entrance exams to begin with! ? why cant we make a system of education where graduating from high school ( FSC/A levels) is good enough to ensure the eligibility of student to a particular univeristy.

I think it would be a good idea to have a standardized test for admission to universities of specific disciplines, something like a SAT exam... however in my opinion what we really need to concentrate on is the sham state of our HSC (intermediate and bachelors) educational system and institutions. Many do not pursue further education after intermediate level and it would be worth the while to give it a more holistic approach, including liberal arts and the like.

free thinkers..we need more of them. merely regurgitating 50 pages of upscale poetry by ghalib, iqbal, daagh and the like in an exam does not make u an art connesieur. or even a ``cultured`` or ``well-rounded`` individual.

re: Indian muslim students outclass others in Pune
I was so excited to read this news that i had to post this here. I believe this is the right forum.

http://www.sulekha.com/redirectnh.asp?cid=315591

``Changing face of Pune schools

By Jyoti Punwani

The Muslim community has broken the traditional monopoly over academic merit.

FAR AWAY from neighbouring Mumbai`s bomb blasts, a radical change is taking place in Pune, often referred to as the `Oxford of the East`. The Joshis, the Gadgils and the Abhyankars who glittered atop the State Secondary School Certificate (SSC) Board merit lists for generations, are being replaced by the Ansaris, the Mistrys and the Karigars. These are not children of the old Muslim elite, but are second, or even first, generation learners.

This year`s topper, Wajeda Karigar, lives in a slum with her parents, brothers, their brood and their sewing machines. The only one among four children to continue studying after school, Wajeda would rise every morning at 4.30 a.m. to be able to get two hours of study, uninterrupted by the blaring music from the neighbours` homes.

Surprisingly, even educationists in Pune are unaware that Wajeda is fifth in an unbroken line of Board toppers from the same institution: the Anglo Urdu High School. Three of her four predecessors are girls; all but one of them wear black burqas. They not only topped their district but also stood first among the girls from all over Maharashtra.

So how did the country`s educationally most backward community break the Pune Brahmins` century-old monopoly over academic merit? How did a 70-year-old Urdu school overtake some of the country`s most prestigious educational institutions?

It did not happen overnight. Wajeda`s success came after 16 years of continuous effort by the head of a trust which runs the school to prove to his community that it is as gifted as any other, and that if it puts its heart to it, no one can stop it from excelling.

P.A. Inamdar, who took over as chairman of the Haji Gulam Md. Azam Educational Trust in 1983, has little time for what he describes as his community`s ``persecution complex``. He prefers instead, to draw his community`s attention to B.R. Ambedkar`s triumph over poverty, educational backwardness and centuries-old prejudice, all of which he characterises as handicap faced by most Indians, not Muslims alone. What characterises Muslims, rues Mr. Inamdar, is a complete lack of drive because they have been conditioned to believe that the system is against them.

Changing this mindset is Mr. Inamdar`s mission. So in the sprawling Azam complex, Mr. Inamdar and his colleagues think of ever-newer ways to hunt out the brightest sparks in their community and prevent their potential going waste due to lack of self-confidence.

Convincing students that poverty cannot come in their way; challenging them to top the merit list; selecting the brightest for special training by guest teachers; pointing out that they are heirs to a centuries-old tradition of knowledge which began with the Vedas are just some ways in which Mr. Inamdar`s team aims to turn ``our children into assets, not liabilities, the way other communities have``.

In 1994, the first girl from the Anglo Urdu School figured in the Board merit list. In 1997, Tanveer Maniar, the child of school teachers in Sholapur (part of the Pune division), topped the entire State`s Board (this year, he won a gold medal in engineering). From 1998 onwards, the Anglo Urdu School`s students have held sway.

It is interesting to look at the fallout of this shift. As has happened with all other gradual changes within the Muslim community, this too has been ignored by the mainstream press. A few Pune academics welcome it, though they ask whether ``mastery over learning techniques equals mastery over knowledge.`` But most reactions range from the dismissive (``it is to compensate for the loss of the Babri Masjid``), to the suspicious (``let an Urdu examiner from outside Maharashtra revaluate the toppers` papers so that the mischief can be nipped in the bud``), and the envious (``they should have shared their method with all the schools``).

Mr. Inamdar has relied on the foolproof nature of the SSC Board results to convince his community that no examiner can deny a deserving Muslim student the marks due to him/her. The cycles gifted by the local Shiv Sena unit at special felicitation functions to toppers Zarine Ansari, Sadiqa Ansari, Bilal Mistry, Majida Roghangar and Wajeda are testimony to his belief.

Indeed, none of these students would have made it to the top had it not been for the contribution of Hindus. Mr. Inamdar makes it a point to declare that teachers from RSS-run schools have not only come whenever invited, as guest teachers for his special Merit List batch, but have also taught his students diligently. Most exciting is the impact on this generation. Already, one of them has convinced her parents to turn down an offer of marriage because she wants to pursue a career in medicine. Mr. Inamdar`s sight is now set on hand-picking the poorest and brightest Muslim students from all over Maharashtra, and getting them to live on his campus as they prepare for the medical and engineering entrance exams. As this ``Scholars` Batch`` practises public speaking after a pre-dawn exercise session (separate for boys and girls) which kicks off their day, Mr. Inamdar exhorts them that the luxuries of late mornings and long holidays are not for them, for they have a backlog of 10 generations to overcome. ``
Sridhar

My intention earlier was not to so wantonly use Chowk to promote my organisation as some might take it to be.
SZABIST does have a screening/filtering process for both its student intakes as well as faculty.
I would suggest a visit to the website(www.szabist.edu.pk) for those who want more details of what we have to offer.
For laurels: http://www.szabist.edu.pk/karachi/SuperStars.html
And recently we have been listed amongst Asia`s Top MBA schools.
yes LUMS too is on the list but how long did it take LUMS to make it on the list? SZABIST is quite new compated to that and already has three rankings under its belt.
When it comes to seeing Pakistan`s name in a listing of world class institutions, we are working our way towards it. Quality is what matters and what we concentrate on, all round.
If we quit bickering among ourselves and try to actually do something about the various issues confronting us, there is still hope. Let us not let go of that slim, shining thread.
And I agree with the last part, we need to weed out the fakes and mail order qualifications from within the academic ranks and take the bureaucratic bull headlong.

For #18 aaisha, I think it was brave on her part to have participated. However, I am afraid, she is not familiar with the ways of Pakistani education establishment - there is very little freedom. Here is one recent reason why I have this apprehension- COMSATS Institute of Information Technology making its Computer science professors to mark their attendance in a register.

I hope, aaisha, that you have not lost your job as yet at SZABIST and also that we will begin to have more representation from Higher Education in discussions such as this one going on at chowk.

I had sent this article to a number of my colleagues in Universities. Some of them have registered their responses with me. But I have not been able t convince even a single one of them to go public or represent their institution in this discussion in writing.

This is how you get and keep your high profile university teaching jobs in Pakistan. You keep your muth shut. That is precisely why Pakistani Universities, generally speaking, have failed to attract many professors worth the name.

HEC and every body else is looking for reasons fr this decline in all the wrong places. Getting professors to sign their time cards, as recently introduced at COMSATS Computer Sciecne dpt, explains how Higher education is being run in this country.

Yours Truly
Tayyab Rashid

#22, your active participation is highly appreciated.

#18 aaisha
``... But not all the allegations levied here hold true for all private institutes in Pakistan...there are some who are recognised all over the world, are ranked amongst the top 20 business schools in Asia...SZABIST (www.szabist.edu.pk) is one of these. ``

Quite true, some institutes in Pakistan are recognized the world over. And are even ranked amongst the top 20 business schools in Asia. Last I remember, from some BusinessWeek ranking, they had this ranking for Business Schools. SZABIST was at #27, but I believe this was for 2001 or 2002. Anyway, LUMS and IBA were also there. Not to forget giants from countries like China, India, Australia and Singapore too. So, one can imagine that the competition that we are facing is tough. Unfortunately, I would say that the contribution from our institutions to the list is very minimal.

And rankings aside, when you are surrounded by such giants, a handful number of world-class institutes don`t matter.
At the risk of diverging from the topic, I would like to ask ... whatever became of our M.I.T of Pakistan ... Ghulam Ishaq Khan Institute ? Is it still churning out graduates escaping off to greener pastures?

#17 by nazarhayatkhan

Nazar bhai, that is not a very wise suggestion. :-)

#16 by cmpp. Thanks. I remember that article by Pervez Hudhboy about importing indian faculty, which many of my colleagues thought of as a little too radical. Yes we need to start attracting our own brain. Some of our brain is also world class. WHen I said world class brain, i did not mean foreign brain. Thanks for helping me clarify my point.

#17 BY Nazar Hayat Khan is interesting statistics. I have been looking around for defence expenditure and these figures are not easy to find.

I would like to welcome aaisha to the discussion. It is lovely that finally, somebody from the Pakistani Higher Education scene cared. Would you like to enlighten us aaisha about how much SZABIST charges for admission forms?brochure?propectus? Application fee?

Does SZABIST use some form of standardised tests for admissions? When did SZABIST hold their admission test?

Are there any statistics available on what kind of laurels SZABIST alumni has won? What is the average pay oftheir graduates etc.?

How about Quality of their Faculty? I have visited Islamabad campus but that is all.

Frankly speaking, I do not know...

Ouch!!! I am working these days as the admission officer of a Pakistani University opening in Dubai. But not all the allegations levied here hold true for all private institutes in Pakistan...there are some who are recognised all over the world, are ranked amongst the top 20 business schools in Asia...SZABIST (www.szabist.edu.pk) is one of these. We sift through for quality and later groom and polish them, so that our alumni win laurels for us.
For anyone making decision about their academic futures, they have to do the proper groundwork, ascertain all the claims a university makes before actualyy enrolling an shouting foul later. One could go to the HEC website for a list of accredited institutes. If an institute does not bother updating its website, it should be marked off, that after all reflects on its quality and strides in tune with time...

#15 by dialogue/TR
``Lack of transparency / information and streamlined procedures has made our institutions breeding grounds of inefficiency. Inefficient admissions process in our universities is just one of the manifestations of a rotten academic administration. ``

TR, I agree with your prognosis, but here we aren`t considering that the brain drain or breeding of inefficiency and its proponents are all part of a much larger picture. The disarray, anarchy & entropy prevalent throughout this 3rd world country is all in some way affecting the likelihood of this system changing for the good.

``... Faculty members at the CS Dept are required to mark their presence and time of entry and exit from the office in an attendance registers``

It really is sad to hear about such retarded efficiency measures. But it again reminds us of how behind we are in introducing techniques and measures to streamline different business & government systems. It all seems like such an uphill battle.

``What we need is professional transparent management of education , positioning our universities to attract world class brain - teachers and students - ``

For now, we`ll have to position our universities to attract our own brain ... the world-class brain can wait. I remember reading Dr. Pervez Hoodbhoy`s article about importing teachers/professors from India since this was a cheaper option. For Pakistani teachers, well ...there weren`t enough of them on the planet.

Education is not important.

First, we have to save ``Islam` and ``conquer India``.

Last budget - 3 Billion rupees for Education and 160 billion rupees for Defence.

#6 by 87msa on August 12, 2003 3:03pm PT
[The only way that I see that this fleecing may be stopped is that public universities become competetive in the quality of education. At the end of the day, private unis will do what they want, like they do everywhere else. Asif]

Government is one of the biggest fleecers and violators of consumer rights. It has failed to deliver on its fundamental responsibilities. Private sector, civil society will have to take charge.

LUMS and Agha Khan University, both Private sector, are probably the best in Pakistan and sane places to teach and study at. Their fees are the highest but you cannot accuse them of fleecing because these places deliver a corresponding value for money.

At the same time, for two excellent private sector schools mentioned above, there are scores of rip off private sector schools. The value they are delivering is shaky just like tons of state run universities. As such, I do not know how they justify the huge fees they are charging to the naive studnets and their parents.

Lets hope that universities fix their house. Otherwise, gov. sevrants disguised as HEC are ready to attack them. Nothing will get fixed as a result of that assault.

From: tayyab rashid

#9 by Ansari on August 13, 2003 0:32am PT
[There were rumors a few years ago that the Aga Khan University may become a central examination authority for all of Pakistan, much like the University of Cambridge. I`m not sure how true they were and to be honest, I don`t see any of that happening in the near future but I think it was a good idea. ]

Mr. Ansari, We have to operate on rumors in Pakistan. Lack of transparency / information snd streamlined procedures has made our institutions breeding grounds of inefficiency as you mentioned in your post below. And as they say, sunlight is one of the best disinfactants.

Inefficient admissions process in our universities is just one of the manifestations of a rotten academic administration.

A recent retarded efficiency measure:There is a report from COMSATS Institute of Information Technology that Faculty members at the Computer Sciences Department are being required to mark their presence and time of entry and exit from the office in an attendance registers. This system will soon be replicated to the other departments.

I think these and similiar measures will effect push away the left over brain in our universities and Higher education will be left at the mercy of the babus.

What we need is professional transparent management of education , positioning our universities to attract world class brain - teachers and students - because in the end, this is what determines the quality of a university.

Right now, our universities are uniquely positioned to push brain away. We need less of babus and not more. We need less of HEC.

tayyab rashid

From: tayyab rashid

Ansari #11. Interesting and believeable. I Do not want to suggest that US admissions and university management is perfect. However, they have made some achievements like so many others which may be acknowledged here. I am sure they have their problems as the higher education sector is very large and functions with minimal state intervention.

Thanks for sharing this information though.

From: tayyab rashid

Here is a word problem
You can get 2% additional marks for Rs. 200 only!!! How much would 100% marks cost?

By our correspondent

SUKKUR: Controller of Examinations, Board of Intermediate and Secondary Education (BISE) Sukkur has announced that instead of Rs500 as announced earlier, a fee of Rs200 will be charged for the award of 2 per cent grace marks to the failed candidates of the SSC and HSC annual and supplementary examination of the year 1999 to 2002.

Source: The NEWS, Saturday August 9, 03
read at http://tinyurl.com/jmck