Shalom or Salaam

shalom/Namaste

International Conference of Genocidal Maniacs and Religious Nuts.

Venue: New Delhi

Invitation: All anti-Muslims and anti-Humans who beleive in injustice and cruelty are chordially invited.

This article does not mention what strategic value India can gain from the Palestenians.

The story of the Palestenians is very sad, along with that of the Hutus, Tutsis, Cambodians and every other displaced group. So what?

More than 50 years have passed by. The Ppalestenians could easily have settled down in various Arab countries but they choose to live in refugee camps. Approximately 50 years ago, Punjabis from West Pakistan too were living in squalid refugee camps, for no fault of their own. But, they made it. There are plenty of tragedies in history.

As a third world country, we need to look after our own interests and solve our own problems. Not worry about those who have a higher standard of living then quite a few of our own people.

In fact, he can even announce, “We control America”.

I don`t know what the author had in mind at the time of making this statement? However, an interesting thought comes to one`s mind if one were to ``follow the money.``

Perhaps it would have been more accurate to use the word ``own`` rather than ``control.``

The US Federal Reserve that ``owns`` the US ``money`` is a privately held entity. A cartel of International private banks ``owns`` the US Fed. The names of the majority of the stockholders of the US Fed are unusually Semetic. The top ten of those stockholders are the following:


1) Rothschild Bank of London,
2) Warburg Bank of Hamburg,
3) Rothschild Bank of Berlin,
4) Lehman Brothers of New York,
5) Lazard Brothers of Paris,
6) Kuhn Loeb Bank of New York,
7) Israel Moses Seif Banks,
8) Goldman Sachs of Italy,
9) Chase Manhattan Bank of New York,
10) Warburg Bank of Amsterdam.

Remarkable...

...SR

Quite a nicely packaged re-hashing of the victimhood saga of Palestinians that blames the Israelis and Americans. Clearly ignored are the following facts:

1. It was the ARABs, not the Jews, who rejected the 1948 Partition plan and attacked to wipe out Israel.

2. After 50+ and 3 generations years as refugees, no Arab country (except Jordan) has given citizenship rights to their `bretheren` Palestinians.

3. For every Deir Yassin, there was Kfir Shamona i.e. wartime atrocity in 1948 was not one sided

4. The only Middle Eastern country(apart from Jordan) where a Palestinian Arab can vote, become a judge, and elect his own choice of member of parliament is Israel.

5. Far more Palestinians have been killed by Syria and Jordan than by Israel.

6. Yasir Arafat, the `non-terrorist` was in charge when his stromtroopers massacared the entire Lebanese village of Damour during peacetime. Ditto for Achille LAuro. Ditto for Munich. Ditto for Entebbe. And so on.

7. India and Israel are democracies, very imperfect but democracies still, who face not only the same kind of shadowy enemy but often these days the SAME shadowy enemy. Both LeT and Islamic Jihad, among others, draw sustenance from al-Qaeda`s network.

And after all this, Indians are still expected to be nice to a thug and nasty to the prime minister of the only democracy in the Middle East? Obviously Brajesh Mishra doesn`t quite think so. Hopefully neither does his boss.

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Farzana

``````Under the UN resolution of 1947 Palestine was to be divided into Arab and Jewish states, with Israel being granted 57 per cent of the total land when that under their possession did not exceed six per cent, and they constituted only a third of the population. The Palestinians rejected the partition plan. But within six months, 78 per cent of the land had come under the Israelis, exceeding the UN stipulation, dispossessing its inhabitants and replacing them with Jews from Europe and other parts of the world. This is the only country created by the UN defying the UN. In 1967, the West Bank and Gaza were taken over and the inhabitants were under an oppressive military rule. They were treated as refugees ````


Can you explain how this might have been possible? Did Israel invaded Palestine and occupy all that territory ? Why wait for 20 more years to occupy the other parts then?

Thanks,
-V

we must rolled red carpet for sheron.if we invite supperterrorist like mussaraf who had blood in hand of indians and father of terrorist fazrul rehman then what problem with sheron.his country is gr8 ally of us.isrial is gr8 arm supplier of india.i had to advise indian muslim to think for banifit of country not for so called remote ummah(i already know this advise in knock on dumb ears) because our muslim bro more think of patastinin muslim then indian kashmiri pandits.even some of them already get a pain for supplied indian arm may be use againts pakistani bro.but everyone must know wht chanakya said :nothing in constant in international politices only national intrest is constant.and we can get some good from isrial.what we can get from poor hungry and terrorist palastine.anyone must think what difference between isrial and palastine at 1947.even jews had problame.their community wipe out by hitler and lot of tragedies they got.but they had hardworking and gut to do miracle and they do it.but this palastinies do nothing except create more problames for new born jews state.they get this from Quran which told never take jews and christian and jews as friends.and why we think palastine is uniqe problame.see allaround the world u cant find single country where muslims live peacefully with other religion.even if they live in muslim majority states they kill eachohters.and they get one uniqe vertu is that for every shortcoming of their blame others.and always live in dreamland of conspircy theories.

The Ppalestenians could easily have settled down in various Arab countries but they choose to live in refugee camps.

First you kick someone out of his house, then after a while start blaming the victim himself for not finding another home and choosing to live in refugee camps; this confounding heartlessness can only stem from hatred and disdain for -- I`m guessing -- anything Islamic.

A made it. B didn`t make it. Therefore it is all B`s fault, and no one else should be held responsible for it. This syllogism, shows up in countless arguments ranging from the state of Civil Rights to international relations. This enunciation of social Darwinism -- which is the hallmark of right wing politics almost worldwide -- finds its most ardent advocates among the newly priviledged and enriched who hold the fallacious view, that if they made it, everyone can. With this conceited view -- drawing general universal conclusions from your own experience -- comes a disdain and contempt for the poor and the oppressed, and wide-eyed admiration for raw power, even cruelty, as a sign of victory in a Darwinian contest. It is no wonder then, that the strident nationalists of BJP, VHP and RSS can barely hide their admiration for Hitler -- or Ariel Sharon. Sharon gets the added kudos because he fights a common enemy -- Islam. Thinking of it as ``Islam``, ``Islamic Fascism``, ``Terrorism``, or some other ponderous abstraction leaves one conveniently unburdened with -- god forbid -- empathy for those dozens of innocent men, women, and children that have been butchered through his orders, as a soldier, and then, as a politician.

Coming back to the Palestinians...
Those Palestinians who CAN go and settle somewhere else, have done so. A recent poll showed that an overwhelming majority of the Palestinian diaspora is not looking to come back. Those 3 million living in refugee camps don`t really have a choice. You can sermonize all you want that this or that country should take them, but you really have no right to do that unless you offer YOUR country as home.

re: this article
By and large a non-controversial article but the author has skirted a lot of issues.

I am not going to join this debate if Palestinians` struggle is right or wrong. Each of us has his/her own version. But what is terribly wrong is the way it is being waged. Much of the muslim world sees Yasser Arafat as a hero. I see him as a terrorist. He is a scoundrel if you ask me. He is seeing an entire generation of young Palestinians blow themselves up. He is blessing these martyrs and the world is silently watching with horror.
It is not as if Arafat had no choice. Early on in his career, he had a clear choice. He could have started his movement in a non-voilent fashion or he could have chosen violence. In choosing the former, he had the precedence of Mahatma Gandhi in front of him. Gandhi had liberated an entire nation by peaceful means. His techniques are well known and were followed by people like Martin Luther King Jr. So, Arafat could have chosen a non-violent means of struggle. But he chose violence.

There is something in Islam that attracts all young revolutionaries (as Arafat was when he started his career) towards violence. It probably has to do with the fact that all their role models, Salhaddin downwards, have led violent protests. Muslims cannot think of anything like a peaceful form of protests. Those who have tried such protests in Kashmir in the past have been labelled unislamic.
So, due to their religion and historical precedents, muslims seem to naturally gravitate towards violence. So did Yasser Arafat. Now, violence is usually met with violence. There is no other way. And, if the adversary is as powerful as Israel, then it was inevitable that Palestenians would suffer a great deal.
So, when the author says
``Its people constitute the highest number of graduates and professionals in the region and their literacy rate exceeds 96 per cent. This did not happen overnight.``
I do not know whether to praise them or condemn them. Of what use is such an education if it is not used in building a society but helps in destroying it. What are these highly educated Palestenians upto? Why are they not questioning their leader? Why do they not condemn the acts of suicide bombers? Suddenly we find that over such matters, religion takes precedence. This is Jehad, these educated men and women are told. That shuts them up. Some of them willingly voulnteer to become a suicide bomber. This is replicated all over the world. The destroyers of Twin Towers in New York were highly educated muslims. The perpetrators of bomb blasts in Bombay recently were educated graduates. Am i missing something here? It is crystal clear what we are dealing with. It is not education, stupid. It is all about religion and ideology.

As i said, the other choice would have been to keep protesting peacefully and meanwhile build a society. Build schools, colleges, give economic opportunities to Palestenians even while making it known to the world what they felt about Israeli occupation. World would have perceived Palestenians in a different light if their struggle had been peaceful. Palestenian leaders cannot complain of atrocities by Israelis if their young men strap themsleves with bombs and kill innocent civilians while killing themselves.
There is another thing that is bothering me. It is the way muslims in India are reacting to Sharon`s visit. Israel has been helping India on security and military matters. It is well known today how Israelis helped IAF fit Laser Guided Bombs onto the Mirages that helped tilt the tide of Kargil war. They are helping in training Indians fight against terrorists and help in the security of India. So, my question is why are some people in India complaining? And, why most of those complaining are muslims? For eg, what is bothering this idiot Imam Bukhari? Why does he say that Sharon`s visit will fuel terrorism? Whose side is he anyway? India`s or Pakistan`s? How long is India going to tolerate such A$$HOLES.

It is tragic that muslims in India yearn for secularism even while flouting every norms of secular behaviou at every opportunity. A religious muslim leader has no business to take a political stand. Growing relationship between India and Israel has a lot to do with fighting terroirsm and stabilising the region and is not anti-Islam unless some bright guys out there are saying Islam and terrorism are the same. Let educated muslims including this author think over these matters.
Sridhar

#1 by Urstruly
//..Invitation: All anti-Muslims and anti-Humans who beleive in injustice and cruelty are chordially invited...//

Sounds like a party. But we are missing some of the very deserving individuals who must be invited to this party for it to be truly representative of all anti-muslim anti-human mass murderers.

1. The person(s) who commited anti-muslim anti-human mass murder of 3 million Bangladeshis.

2. The person(s) responsible for mass graves they have uncovered Iraq recently - the victims are all muslims.

3. The ``students`` who butchered muslims (shias) in Afganistan when they took over the contry a few years ago.

The list goes on....

sigalph235:

...welcome back:)

...since you are so well informed can you help guide me to an official and final map of state of israel?

..t

rsridhar

...since you have such varied interests, opinion and time...(judging by your interactions)...why don`t you ever pen an article or two here?


...t

MNIPhirsay:

``First you kick someone out of his house, then after a while start blaming the victim himself for not finding another home and choosing to live in refugee camps;``

We did not kick anyone out. ``We`` as in refugees from West Punjab were kicked out.

``this confounding heartlessness can only stem from hatred and disdain for -- I`m guessing -- anything Islamic. ``
Nope. This heartlessness comes for all whiners who cannot do anything to stand on their feet..oh yeah..UNLIKE US!!!

``finds its most ardent advocates among the newly priviledged and enriched who hold the fallacious view, that if they made it, everyone can. With this conceited view -- drawing general universal conclusions from your own experience --``

Damn right we are newly privileged and proud of it. Victims of Indian partition were rotting in refugee camps around the same time as Arabs. What we have made with our lives is thanks to our own grit. No sops, no oil, just forward thinking, putting the past behind us and working. And why should we not draw conclusions that hard work and looking ahead pay off?

The point is we don`t need to sympathize with Palestenains or any other unfortunates. We got plenty of our own to worry about.

Oh yeah, not that I see too many Muslims crying about the misfortunes of Sri Lankan Tamils or Tutsis...so..put your money where your mouth is or leave the hypocritical crocodile tears at home.

MNIPhirsay:

``You can sermonize all you want that this or that country should take them, but you really have no right to do that unless you offer YOUR country as home. ``

Yeah? Assuming you are Pakistani, maybe you can start by offering a HOME to those Pakistanis still stranded in Bangladesh.

Temporal:

You have asked the question before and it is an unfair one. Israel accepted a ``full and final`` frontier in 1948. It was not accepted by the Arabs who attacked.

The ``occupied territories`` are exactly that. Nobody is saying they are part of Israel, not even the Israelis. But, if Hamas and IJ refuse to even accept the existence of Israel, why should the Israelis play nice?

Let Hamas and IJ accpet the nation of Israel with defined borders. Then one can call Israelis bad guys. Till then they are in the same Hamam..naked.

I have nothing for or against ordinary Palestenians. I don`t give a rat`s arse about their religion. If they were the stronger party and could provide military knowhow and technology transfer, I would be totally advocating relations with them. My loyalty is to Indian interests, not to some percieved victim group regardless of religion.

If MNIPhirsay and his ilk think I am Anti Islamic, they can go ahead. I or India for that matter does not owe them an explanation.

stuka

...the plight of partition refugees cannot be fairly compared to the ongoing holocaust of the palestinians...in no small measure compounded by their dumb leadership...but then both of us are digressing;)

..t