General Musharraf – Caught Between a Rock and a Hard Place

Dear AhmadZai, on your long treatise on the various heads, here is a a line from a poem written by me.

Mera Raquib merey endher hai
Mera wajood mera dushman hai
Mein apney aap sey jang mein hoon
Meri halat merey watan si hai

I feel the biggest monster is ourselves,preventing the conglomerate from fermenting into a nation. There is too much hate, suspicion and self vulnerability in our assesments. We have to get out of it.

I would list the indicaters as;
1) Socio economic development on a fast track.
2) Political stability that ensures policy consistency and achievement of 1.
3) Dispensation of justice and social equity to the masses, a sense of well being.
4) Gradual erosion of the elites
Once these come, issues like sectarianism, violence, ethnicity and overbearing attitude of some states would wither away. Lets forget about Ummah and Co and just look after ourselves. It would be Highway to heaven.

I am sorry, but no silk route has thus far opened, nor will it till the Tiger in Pakistan is tamed. That is a stark reality and USA`s reliance on Pakistan a mere expediency. Mussharaf is trying intelligently to make the best out of the worst and he needs the nation behind him.
Khan Sahib delivered the enriched uranium but in the process also blackmailed the country. I feel, the President has been too kind to him. Just to have a feel this is a copy of my commnets on Hoodbhoy`s Article in a US newspaper.
I have followed Hoodbhoy`s pacificm in Pakistan for a very long time. He is indeed an avid PACIFIST and entiltled to his views but ought to also understand the meaning of independence. It ends where the other`s nose begins.
Just when this fiasco had just begun to unravel, I saw Hoodbhoy on a TV show hell bent on convincing that Pakistan as a State and Establishment were knee deep in Proliferation. Well there may be many who may think so but why damage the image of your country in the name of Value Neutrality. His solo in an internationally realist paradigm will neither do good to him nor to the motherland. It would have been more admirable if he had provided guidelines and inputs on how Pakistan should get out of this TWISTER.

I for one feel that the Government of Pakistan by admitting that its program was covert has taken a very bold stand. Declaring that the program is now ouvert means that Pakistan has commited itself to non proliferation rules of the game and hence scrutiny, which in any case was always there.

Perhaps many doomsday psuedos miss the point that Dr. Khan`s sole responsibility was enrichment and not weaponisation. That role was played by an entirely different organisation under the PAEC. Ouvert declaration perhaps also implies that Pakistan has also mastered the PU route and is now self sufficient. There was a big message when the President said that our capability has moved beyond the Minimum Deterrence.

I agree that the case is not closed and there will be tremendous pressure on Pakistan in the days to come. There will be caliberated, covert and coercive attemts to tame the Tiger. We as a nation will have to stand to it and not melt way like Saddam, Iran and Libya. I feel that given that Pakistan demonstrate responsibility and firmness on proliferation, route out of the woods would not be afar.

Here is one more gift to Mushy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/08/business/worldbusiness/08rese.html

Two conflicting News .

First one is from ``Jang`` of Oct. 8th.

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US agents to screen visas in Pakistan

WASHINGTON: Agents from the US Department of Homeland Security (DHS) are to deploy at US embassies and consulates in five Muslim nations to oversee visa issuance as part of a sweeping overhaul of immigration procedures, officials said on Tuesday.

DHS, which in August stationed officials at US embassies and consulates in Saudi Arabia, will early next year begin placing agents at missions in Egypt, Indonesia, Morocco, Pakistan and the United Arab Emirates, they said.

The countries were chosen because of the high volume of visa requests they process and the presence of members of al-Qaeda and other groups hostile to US on their territory or in neighbouring states, a DHS official said. ``These first officials and first postings will have regional responsibilities`` for visa oversight, said DHS spokesman Gordan Johndroe.

He said the deployment — an initial round based on the transfer of visa authority from the State Department to DHS which was announced last week — would involve about 12 agents but would likely grow. ``It really depends on the volume,`` Johndroe said.

Missions that will house DHS officers include the US embassies in Abu Dhabi, Cairo, Jakarta and Islamabad and the US consulate in Casablanca. The announcement comes days after the State Department ceded much of its visa authority to the Department of Homeland Security under tightened immigration laws.

---

and

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US reduces visa charges for Indians

http://headlines.sify.com/2506news4.html?headline=US~reduces~visa~charges~for~Indians

ahmadzai #41

`` Malaysia and Nigeria are called Muslim states as such by their people. Both are members of the OIC. They are defined as Muslim states in west`s policy papers, etc. ``

Let us be blunt. You called Malaysia a economic success story. The prosperity Malaysia enjoys is a function of the 30% wealthy Chinese minority. Give Mahathir some credit for inter-race relations.

Nigeria`s corruption, drug smuggling, riots have to do with the fact it is a multi-ethnic society. Not to mention all the oil is in non-Muslim areas. Most of the news articles in Western media on Nigeria will dwell on the above.

`` The votes they got increased from 5% to 11%, mainly in my province of the NWFP. I have written several times that it was sympathy votes on the basis of bombing news reaching from Afghanistan regularly reporting that innocent Pakhtoons were being killed. Also I am talking about the future. Please read my message again ``

Sympathy vote or not my guess is that some of the MMA constituents have made significant gains in the short to medium term.

AHMEDZAI
Quote
My original message was from the point of view of listing impending dangers to Pakistanis (and therefore, being his supporter, to President Musharraf). They are only for the consumption of Pakistanis. Pakistanis have to make a strategy to combat the monster. You have every right to feel other way. The monster may have been created by us in the past, it may be friendly to you or perhaps my analysis may appear incorrect to you. Those may be your views. Let us agree to disagree, but from Pakistani perspective, IMHO, these are the mega problems confronting us and we have to find a solution for them.
Unquote

Chowk is a unique place. It is nice to note that you are not interested in imposing your opinion on the rest of us here. It would be more benificial if people use this as a oppurtunity to broaden their minds and understand each other (U & Me included). In a global village, issues facing one country do effect others. Let me assure you that your monster doesnt befriend us. It doesnt sleep in our territory during day and prey on yours during nights! Fundamentalism and terrorism are nobodies friends.

Luv,
CC

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ahmadzai #42

A mature approach. We just hope the Pakistani approach is not rooted in ideology and behavior against India. When someone thinks and acts against you, you think and act against them. That creates bitterness. Just a thought - we are neighbors, so working together is a better option.

Babu at # 35:

I would like to respond to the following only:

``Malayasia is 55% Muslim. Nigeria is 52% Muslim. They are really multiracial socities. Stop calling them Muslim. ``

Malaysia and Nigeria are called Muslim states as such by their people. Both are members of the OIC. They are defined as Muslim states in west`s policy papers, etc.

``The groups that form the MMA never won more than 5% of seats in a Pakistani election (for what it is worth). After Sep-11 they get close to 30% of seats in parliament. It does not look like marginalization to me.``

The votes they got increased from 5% to 11%, mainly in my province of the NWFP. I have written several times that it was sympathy votes on the basis of bombing news reaching from Afghanistan regularly reporting that innocent Pakhtoons were being killed. Also I am talking about the future. Please read my message again

To posters other than Babu and Babu`s posts other than # 35:

I have read your messages and respect your views.

My original message was from the point of view of listing impending dangers to Pakistanis (and therefore, being his supporter, to President Musharraf). They are only for the consumption of Pakistanis. Pakistanis have to make a strategy to combat the monster. You have every right to feel other way. The monster may have been created by us in the past, it may be friendly to you or perhaps my analysis may appear incorrect to you. Those may be your views. Let us agree to disagree, but from Pakistani perspective, IMHO, these are the mega problems confronting us and we have to find a solution for them.

...good ole paki whining at its best....

Ahmadzai -

{I watched an Indian movie once in which the villan takes a ride on a cab owned by heroe`s friend and does not pay him the fare. When the taxi driver asks for fare, the villan tells him that he is the Goon of the area, how come he asked for fare. When the taxi driver insisted, the goon called in his friends and all of them made fun of the taxi driver. The taxi driver keeps insisting. He is finally beaten and sent packing. The last sentence from the bad guy `` bara akarta thaa saala``. }

what were you doing watching Indian movies? Aren`t you funding the anti-pakistan, anti-muslim country ruled by a democratically elected fundamentalist government? or did you think that it was okay as the money might actually be landing up in Dawood-bhai`s hand via the mumbai-dubai-karachi route?


you know, i actually saw another movie with similar characters..

no hero, no villain. a person takes a ride on a cab. the cabbie drops off the passenger at home, the passenger looks at the meter and pays the fare. cabbie asks for more money. passenger is confused, shows cabbie the meter, and says there is no reason to pay more. Cabbie begins by mumbling a few different reasons (maybe he just expected a little more) and then starts shouting at the passenger. The more the cabbie shouts, the more he convinces himself that he is right.

Passenger, having given his dues, ignores cabbie and goes home. The cabbie throws a few small stones at the passengers house and runs away. As he passenger goes about his day-to-day business, the cabbie keeps coming to trouble him and run. An odd time the passenger would catch this guy, slap him across the face and then let him go (was that a mistake??). That sobers the cabbie up for a bit but not for long... the original problem almost forgotten, the self-righteous cabbie`s main aim in life is to trouble this guy come what may - the fact that the cabbie has stopped eating and has become emaciated does not even enter his mind.


I didn`t this movie fully. Not sure if the guy realizes he has to focus on his own food to survive... or if he dies a slow and painful death.


Take good care of yourself ahmadzai. May god (irrespective of religion) bless you.

ahmadzai #33,

Perhaps you need to get a better understanding of how political lobbying works
in the US, and why it works that way. It is not an activity based on ethics but on
self-interest (enlightened self-interest mostly), and you may be surprised to know
that Pakistani lobbyists are no exception to that.

You mentioned that ``As a group, Indians are showing both anti-Pakistani and
anti-Muslim behavior``

You rationalize the anti-India stance of Pakistanis - Kashmir is seemingly the
reason. Is is unreasonable for Indians to adopt an anti-Pakistan posture for precisely
the same reason ? Any insights into why an anti-Muslim India is forging close
economic and military ties with Iran and Malaysia ?

Dear Ahmadzai ,

Let me first congratulate on getting 4/6 in Scyllas heads dead right!
But your other two are rather absurd candidates....
Let us look at it as 6 headed monster standing before Pak as a nation... or rather between Pak and its success as a nation....
Obviously your options 4,5 are the ones I would like to replace....

4) would be Musharaff himself as a representation/personification of over enthusiastic power mongering army crushing down the aspirations of people of its country by over throwing democratic governments time and again.. Army power mongering has been one of the gravest problems pak has been facing ever since it came into existance...

5) lack of awareness amonst the people of Pak (you for a typical example)... who rather than straining their softest tissues for a second in deciding what is right or wrong! ... leave it to those, who by a curse of heavens have come to earth with an empty cranium...
I think my #5 is rather difficult for any pakistani to digest or even for a moments consideration as it flares up egos....

Your #5 is absurd... jahan aag hain.. wahan dhuaa to hoga hi... pak intne itne ache kam karta hain..... uski dandora pitne wala to kaoi na koi hona chahiye.. hain ki nahin?

the Advani,... list at worst can risk the secular credentials of India... and your complaints of anti-pak policy are rather childish.. what else do you expect after 2 wars... and 10 years of ``struggle for freedom`` enacted by pakistani and afghan citizens played in streets of J&K... (that there is a real struggle for Kashmiriat is a fact I am not foolish enough to deny...)

Wake up... before it is too late... while the world races into the digital millenium... the 6 headed... is pushing you back into the dark ages...

Luv,
C C

ahmadzai #31

`` The western and especially US media is full of news that creates negative perception about Muslim countries. I mentioned Arab world and Pakistan as two regions that are associated with the Muslim world. Now add to it Iran and Nigeria. Does it not mean that it is only Muslim countries that are on the receiving end? Lately, the media has also been harsh on Indonesia. This leaves Malaysia alone as a major Muslim country remaining untouched. But not touching Malaysia, Gambia, Mali, etc. does not disconfirm the evidence. Arabs, Pakistanis, Iranians, Nigerians and Indonesians constitute over 75% of Muslim world. Even the successful example of Malaysia is not covered in the western world like that of e.g. South Korea or India. This also goes to prove the bias of western media against Muslims.``

Malayasia is 55% Muslim. Nigeria is 52% Muslim. They are really multiracial socities. Stop calling them Muslim.

Media has been harsh on Indonesia because they have been soft on Islamic groups responsible for the Bali bombing. Indonesia has been unstable for the past 5-6 years. They deserve all the criiticism they get.

Even if the Western media is biased what is your point ? I can cite countless examples of bias in the Pakistani media or any other media.

`` However, I would like to bring the attention of Indians back to what was my original point. I pointed to the stories being circulated in the west about Pakistan that are like one head of the Scylla for Pakistanis (and therefore, President Musharraf). This head will be quite difficult to squash. Another head that would be hard to squash would be the threat to us by the extremist and fundamentalist Hindu Government of India. The problem with latter is that its a democratically elected extremist party with a pronounced anti Pakistani agenda at home and abroad and a pronounced anti-Muslim agenda at home. The Indians as a group of people are very comfortable with its anti-Muslim agenda and have condoned it. Now I have absolutely no problem in an extremist Hindu Government next door, except when it declares an all out war on my country. ``

The extremist BJP has no problem expanding relations with Muslim states like Iran, Turkey and Malaysia. These states enjoy better relations with India than any time in history. Maybe the problem is with Pakistan or Pakistanis not Muslims.


`` The remaining 4 heads (i.e. Al Qaeda, Talibans, Mullas of MMA and BB-Nawaz nexus) are being slowly wounded and will be marginalized soon.``

The groups that form the MMA never won more than 5% of seats in a Pakistani election (for what it is worth). After Sep-11 they get close to 30% of seats in parliament. It does not look like marginalization to me.

ahmadzai #22

`` The 6 heads of this monster would be:

(1) Al Qaeda,
(2) Talibans,
(3) Mullas of Pakistan, ``

Who gave money, logistical support and weapons for these groups ? It would be not the Pakistani military by any chance.

`` (4) Hawks in Indian Government, the likes of Advani, Joshi, Sinha, Modi, Bal Thakray, who have declared a war on Pakistan.``

They were the ones to initiate Kargil.

`` (5) anti-Pakistan and anti-Muslim lobby in the USA, being led by hate mongering jews and Indian influentials and ``

What have the anti-Pakistan and anti-Muslim lobby in the USA done to Pakistan ? They did not cause illiteracy, poverty and corrupton in the land of the pure.

`` (6) The corrupt politicians who made 90s a lost decade for Pakistan i.e. BB and Nawaz, with their brainless followers, who will continue to sabotage the parliamentary proceedings of Pakistan, because their future is doomed if the current situation continues.``

Did BB and Nawaz ever control the budget of Pakistani state ?

Stuka at # 27:

You are the best person to respond to that.

However, it is the group that matters. As a group, Indians are showing both anti-Pakistani and anti-Muslim behavior. Please read my other posts on this matter, especially # 31.

Plats8 at # 32:

I regeret having missed your question inadvertantly. I got a bit occupied by some other responses, inferences and unrelated counter-questions.

Pakistanis are extremely focused on India. Reason is simple. Now you have every right to disagree with it, but we believe that India has illegally and unethically occupied Kashmir.

Now Indians may keep on raising the bogey of terrorism and other matters by Pakistan, for us, it means Kashmir has to be decided in accordance with the wishes of Kashmiris.

I watched an Indian movie once in which the villan takes a ride on a cab owned by heroe`s friend and does not pay him the fare. When the taxi driver asks for fare, the villan tells him that he is the Goon of the area, how come he asked for fare. When the taxi driver insisted, the goon called in his friends and all of them made fun of the taxi driver. The taxi driver keeps insisting. He is finally beaten and sent packing. The last sentence from the bad guy `` bara akarta thaa saala``.

Pakistanis lobbists may be termed extremists like Taxi driver who was asking for fare despite knowing that he is pitted against heavy odds. How do we classify Indians though? haven`t they ganged up against the taxi driver?

However, please recall that I had originally said that extremist Jewish and the Indian lobby is one of the 6 heads of the monster confronting Pakistanis (and therefore, Musharraf).

ahmadzai #31,

Why do some people always do this ? They say specific things in one post, and
when there is a semblance of them being countered, they immediately shift the
goal posts - now who is lacking focus here....

My point was very simple. Since you categorized the Indian lobbyists in the US
as extremists, are we allowed to label the Pakistani lobbyists as extremist as well ?
They do have a very aggressive anti-Indian agenda, in case you are wondering.
Or does their relative lack of success make them extremists wannabes, perhaps ?

As for drawing inferences from your posts, I have drawn my own. Would be much
obliged if you can clarify my query, though.

it hurts me to find my country in such ruins. rulers have weak eyesites and no forsight. only pockets full of money and room for more. the indians add salt to the wounds with their verbal assaults, coz partly it is all true.

but wat abt change? will it ever come? u always think all will be ok. until its too late. change always comes through the people, masses. but will the masses ever get up. bhutto was such a popular leader. he was hanged by a military dictator. y didnt the people rise? wen will they rise? will they ever rise?

I am amazed at lack of focus and unintelligent inferences of my Indian friends from my messages.

To clarify, I would say the following:

1. The western and especially US media is full of news that creates negative perception about Muslim countries. I mentioned Arab world and Pakistan as two regions that are associated with the Muslim world. Now add to it Iran and Nigeria. Does it not mean that it is only Muslim countries that are on the receiving end? Lately, the media has also been harsh on Indonesia. This leaves Malaysia alone as a major Muslim country remaining untouched. But not touching Malaysia, Gambia, Mali, etc. does not disconfirm the evidence. Arabs, Pakistanis, Iranians, Nigerians and Indonesians constitute over 75% of Muslim world. Even the successful example of Malaysia is not covered in the western world like that of e.g. South Korea or India. This also goes to prove the bias of western media against Muslims.

2. However, I would like to bring the attention of Indians back to what was my original point. I pointed to the stories being circulated in the west about Pakistan that are like one head of the Scylla for Pakistanis (and therefore, President Musharraf). This head will be quite difficult to squash. Another head that would be hard to squash would be the threat to us by the extremist and fundamentalist Hindu Government of India. The problem with latter is that its a democratically elected extremist party with a pronounced anti Pakistani agenda at home and abroad and a pronounced anti-Muslim agenda at home. The Indians as a group of people are very comfortable with its anti-Muslim agenda and have condoned it. Now I have absolutely no problem in an extremist Hindu Government next door, except when it declares an all out war on my country.

3. The remaining 4 heads (i.e. Al Qaeda, Talibans, Mullas of MMA and BB-Nawaz nexus) are being slowly wounded and will be marginalized soon.

plats8

When have Pakistani missions abroad focused on anything other than India and the dream of stitching together an anti-India international Ummah?

Should we call them `India focused extremists?`

No. We are a civilized nation.

:)

``1. That the lobby is mostly anti-Arab and anti-Pakistani is in itself a proof that its led by extremist Palestine-Israel focused Jews and extremist Pakistan focused Indians.``

Good. So you appreciate the fact that ``the`` lobby is not really anti-Muslim. By the way,
there is a pro-Pakistan lobby as well, that is essentially anti-Indian in its stance. Shall
we call the lobbyists ``extremist India focused Pakistanis`` ?

Ahmadzai:

`Can`t I be anti Pakistan but not Anti Muslim? Or are the two the same in your back?

The above is a rhetorical question btw.

arjun_m

Like any Indian you slander freedom fighters such as Jaish-e-Mohammed and Harkatul Mujahideen by calling them terrorists. They may have been caught this time by the barbaric, fundamentalist Pakistani government. Next time, inshaalla, they will succeed in their mission to kill a few hundred Pakistanis.

There are so many Pakistanis, killing a few will not matter to Ahmadzai. But the opppressed freedom fighters will draw attention to their principled stand. Sooner or later, they will force the Pakistani government, bootlicking stooges of America, to grant their just demands - establish the true Islamic rule as practiced by the Ahmadzai tride, kill or convert all Shias, drive out all Kanjars, gas all Ahmadis, in other words, bring Islamic heaven on earth.

``extremist Palestine-Israel focused Jews and extremist Pakistan focused Indians``

That is the first public admission by the AhmadZai variety Pakistanis that India`s `anti-Pakistan` activities are not anti-Islam.

First Musharraf`s admission that if India gave Pakistani army what it wanted, it would pull back its terrorists from Kashmir. And now, this.

When it rains, it pours.

Plats at # 23:

1. That the lobby is mostly anti-Arab and anti-Pakistani is in itself a proof that its led by extremist Palestine-Israel focused Jews and extremist Pakistan focused Indians.

2. Mahatir`s was just an example. Turkish and Canadian leaderships are 2 more examples.

ahmadzai #22

Two clarifications...one offered, one sought.

``(5) anti-Pakistan and anti-Muslim lobby in the USA, being led by hate mongering jews
and Indian influentials``

Welcome to the world of lobbying in US politics. I don`t think Pakistan is being held
back from creating a successful lobby of its own because of it`s ethical moorings. And
if this clique is so anti-Muslim, I wonder why it doesn`t hurt Indonesian or Malaysian
interests quite as badly.

``For example, it is Dr. Mahatir of Malaysia who asked him to speak for the Muslims.``

I have seen this fact being displayed here multiple times. Is it considered a badge of
honour of some sort ?

This is an excellent article.

President Musharraf`s Scylla is extremism and fundamentalism.

The 6 heads of this monster would be:

(1) Al Qaeda,
(2) Talibans,
(3) Mullas of Pakistan,
(4) Hawks in Indian Government, the likes of Advani, Joshi, Sinha, Modi, Bal Thakray, who have declared a war on Pakistan.
(5) anti-Pakistan and anti-Muslim lobby in the USA, being led by hate mongering jews and Indian influentials and
(6) The corrupt politicians who made 90s a lost decade for Pakistan i.e. BB and Nawaz, with their brainless followers, who will continue to sabotage the parliamentary proceedings of Pakistan, because their future is doomed if the current situation continues.

President Musharraf will continue to have support of all the moderates around the world. For example, it is Dr. Mahatir of Malaysia who asked him to speak for the Muslims.

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Arjun:

``But under heavy US pressure, PIA`s reservation system is now hosted in Texas through the Sabre Group, and the movement of each and every passenger is carefully monitored, as is the cargo.


There are a bunch of Indians working on the sabre system...they should have a lot of interesting information...after all, sabre isn`t classified. ``

Sabre is the biggest GDS system. I doubt that there would be anything interesting on there now because SABRE is completly open and accessible to anyone with an IATA number. Also, I am very surprised that they use SABRE to monitor cargo. Not too sure about that.

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``President Musharraf is also pursuing the prospect of contracts for Pakistani companies once reconstruction in Afghanistan gets under way.``

Spoken like a true shaheed, denying the fact that the taliban was largely pakistanis, killed by the uS and now being killed by mushys troops. Pakistanis are the most hated ones in afghanistan, well contracts, pakistanis do not need that, the jihadis already have their contracts with the god.
What is pathetic is the denial mentality of pakistanis like this author. There is no effort what so ever to understand the real nature of the pak problem. It is all others evil designs, pakistanis being the ones in the land of the pure. There were refugees in india, tibetans, east pakistanis, even tamils from sri-lanka. India was invilved in the mukti bahini, in the LTT, but the entire society did not become a terrorist society. The militants vanished, but not in the case of pakistan. The militants did not change the pak society, the militants resonated with inherent pak values seeking an expression.
To give an exampole, there are so many educated pakistanis on chowk, ranging from romair to tahmed, but no one dares to talk about the pakistanis killed in afghanistan or in kashmir. True to the pak values the killed were jihadis, and such they did not die, they went to heaven. It is this deep felt jihadic belef system that is preventing any progress in pakistan. Even the so called western education that the tahmeds claim to have did not alter their belef that jihadis do not die, they go to heaven and to the extend to talk of the pakistanis killed in jihad is blasphemy.
What is learned in the early syages, in the preschool days, in the mothers lap about the virtues of jihad cannot be changed, and it is this unspoken values that is guiding pak policy. The tragedy of pakistan is the failure of the educated, leave the poor dumb soldier alone.

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Pakistan is a prestigious country. The issue of sending troops to Iraq is not associated with money``, Foreign Minister Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri told BBC Radio. from indian express of today.
I am sorry, now that the minister has announced it, I retract my comments about pakistan.

{{What does one do? Musharraf, theoretically, could have told George W. Bush, “No. Absolutely not. Pakistan categorically states that it will not help the United States in it’s War against Terror. This is not our war”. A resulting scenario? Pakistan becomes a pariah nation, a cog in the Axis of Evil, shunned by the developed world, suffocated by sanctions.}}

The author hit the nail on the head.
Musharraf has no choice. Pakistan`s situation is so weakened that it has no choice but to NOT offend Big Uncle Sam.

Does Mushy have a choice? He can make peace with India...but on HIS terms...no point talking with such a person.
He made his intentions very clear in the UN. He continues his diatribe about Kashmir. The Pakistani public goes rah rah!; & India gets pissed off at him & the rest of the world doesnt give a cr*p.
Back to square one.

As long as Musharraf is in power; there is no hope for peace with India-whether Congress, BJP or a coalition is in power.
Not to underscore the point; then he publicly boasts how much better Pakistan`s military technology is better than India`s.
haha...win a war first ya` dope...then boast!

Mushy`s nuts are getting in a tighter vice...no ``wiggle`` room.
Serves him right. Thats what happens when a guy thinks he`s too smart & plays both sides. At what point will he realise that America ``likes`` him cos he serves their purpose?
There is nothing more cozy than a Republican administration & a Pakistani military dictator. Its a ``whore-john`` relationship. Everyone from Ayub to Yahya to Zia has been feted in Washington as ``America`s great friend``...& ultimately dumped... Its history repeating itself.

However, some things have fundamentally changed. The cold war is over. The muslim world basically doesnt give two hoots about Kashmir...let alone the rest of the world. India finds itself in a much stronger position. Also, Indian Americans are emulating American Jews...& the pro-India lobby is gathering strenght...that doesnt bode well for Pakistan.

OTOH, Al-Qeeda is gunning for him!
Which hyena will get him first...Uncle Sam?...some jehadi fanatical graduate from Binori madrassah...some fundamentalist Army Officer.....

ofcourse!...all Mushy is obssessed about is that that puny bania hyena should`nt take a bite out of him..

#12
Dear Nazarhayatkhan,
{
Mussharaf is not the solution - he is the problem & also a liability
}

QUITE TRUE INDEED

{
It would be also advisable if he mouth shut - most of the time.

And let Jamali speak out on national issues
}

Is it that you hate Musharaff`s voice to such an extent that you want Jamali to Dub his Dialogues... Wake up.. smell the coffee.. Jamali never was is or will be anyting more than Musshis pet ### ;-)

Luv,
C C

Mussharaf is not the solution - he is the problem & also a liability

It would be also advisable if he mouth shut - most of the time.

And let Jamali speak out on national issues

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Basic Formula

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(1) Our current military dictator is better than some of the many other nutcases we have in our country.


(2) Whatever the problem is, it is not our fault. It is XXXX`s fault (US, Israel, India,...).


(3) Give us money and terrritory. Otherwise, we may do terrible things.....


What a bunch of losers! You think you can win at anything with this attitude? oh, I am sorry, I forgot that you have no positive goals, only the wish to spoil things for others.

The real losers are the Pak intellectuals who write such Na-Pak articles. Pakistan fought Communist extremism on one side and VHP fundamentalism on the other. Faiz was drinking Vodka, and Nizami was dancing to the Punjabi drums, while Friday times was printing pro-India theories.

Musharraf is more than happy to work with Americans. Thanks to the sacrifices of young GIs, and Pak soldiers, the whole region is a safer place. The crime rate has gone down and car jackings are relatively low. Millions of girls are in Afghan school instead of being kicked around in the streets. Women`s rights in Talibanic country Oh Yeah!

Mullahs are not a problem. They can be bought and sold for Deg of halwa. The real problem is our half-literate educated elite who refuses to learn from history. They are not willing to work for a bright future for Pak. They are the ones pumping out half baked conspiracy theories a la Bedouin style, and repeating the lies for a bit of satisfaction.

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I think this symbolizes not just Musharraf`s situation, but of Pakistan as a country.

I have issues with the details outlined (the population thing cracked me up), but that`s not important. What I notice is the absence of any solution whatsoever - in this article or otherwise. Forget vitriol, logical thinking and concrete steps forward is what I totally fail to find.

And when the country as a whole goes nowhere, the Haves consolidate their wealth and power (means being immaterial), and the Have-nots are tempted by sweet smell of jihad even if the enemy needs to be created from nowhere.

India is the last thing in the world pakistan should be worried about. Worry about pakistan, pakistan.

I agree fully with shahid that Musharaff made a wise descision in joining the ranks of US in fighting terrorism. He has bought a temporary solution to Pakistan from isolation.

However Mia Mushraffs commitment to the war against terrorism is half hearted. For that matter even a commitment given by a democratic leader (had there been one in place of Gen sahab) would still be half hearted.

Pakistan over its 50 years of indepence has tread too far along the path of fundamentalism. This is the groud reality which limits the power of even the army general. Its experiments of creating the demon of Taliban have caused mutations in its own society which are too powerful for any ruler to weed out. The growth of Islamic fundamentalism in Pakistan apart from being a sign of imment danger to India and West, is not a good thing for future of Pakistan as a nation. While the world is riding on waves of the digital millenium, the fundamentalists believe in running back in time. The Taliban has proven beyond doubt this argument. In the name of religion and god they aim to setup a society run on fear, opression, suppression, lack of freedom.

While peoples aspire for freedom in every sphere of life, the fundamentalists in the name of religious righteousness supress every means that enables the individual to think and act freely. If persuation doesnt work, they use elimination. Priorities will be on so called religious war, spread of Islam, production of warriors for the jihad and all such absurd things instead of being on issues of science, technology, research, education, elimination of poverty, trade, self sufficiency etc.,

It will need a great amount of will power on behalf of polity and peoples of Pakistan to come out of this trap.

Luv,
Cosmic Citizen

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[Karachi, Lahore, Delhi, and Bombay have a combined population of one million people]

hello???

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