unflinching idealism ... since 1997 archivessitemapabouthelpfeedback
where paths intersect
  • Home
  • InFocus
  • Themes
  • Columns
  • Articles
  • Fiction
  • iLogs
  • Gallery
  • Unplugged
  • Writers
  • Interactors
  • Tags
Sign in | Join Chowk
web chowk
  • Article
  • Interact
  • read writer comments
  • add to favorites
  • get rss feeds
  • print
  • email this link

A Case for Banning Polygamy

Ayesha I Khan December 3, 2003

Latest comments   flat   threaded   latest   oldest   all
listing 112-128   1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11

#127 Posted by tahmed32 on December 8, 2003 7:45:53 am
RationalFaith #123 i assume one day you will be able to write something that matches your the self-flattering nick you have adopted. any fool can LOL.
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#126 Posted by RationalFaith on December 8, 2003 7:01:15 am
``What you call my simple flaw is actually your complex flaw``

Ijtihad - the Islamic path to reformation!

oooooh, I used the word `reformation.` There is no need for reformation. Islam is right. Anew is rigth. Tahmed32 is right. All`s well with the world. Long live Saudi Arabia.

LOL!
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#125 Posted by tahmed32 on December 8, 2003 7:01:15 am
anew #119 you write ``actually your complex flaw of misunderstanding Hijab as shuttlecock burqa or a head scarf.``

So in order to cover up your twisting the clear meaning of the Quran (as i pointed out) you now say you never meant head covering or burqa when you referred to the hijab? This is like saying that when you said table you really meant chair. You are only fooling yourself with this rubbish.

You have just demonstrated another example of the hypocritical life you jamaatiyas lead.

And spare me your high and mighty talk about not being scholarly enough to understand the real meaning of hijab. This is typical of the arrogant talk of you ignorant, semi-literate people. You are unable to write two sentences that make logical sense, are among the most ill-informed and ignorant people on earth, and yet take on airs of being some kind of ulema. You humiliate women and play games with the Quran (as i have already pointed out), and if someone challenges you, you simply take on airs of having special meanings for words. Go and read the section on the Quran that talks about hypocrites like you.
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#124 Posted by tahmed32 on December 8, 2003 7:01:15 am
nazar #121 i beg to differ. i have been married for over two decades and still have a very romantic notion of marriage. and i have seen lots of couples like this. i dont think there is anything more satisfying than craving for one woman only, the one sleeping next to you.
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#123 Posted by fuzair on December 8, 2003 7:01:15 am
Re: Sattar2 #70

Evolutionary psychologists argue that we are basically hardwired, through 10,000 generations of hunter-gatherer evolution, along certain paths and its very difficult for us to `bypass` our programming in these areas. So, yes, we are genetically predisposed to behave in certain ways, e.g., lusting after every attractive (i.e, good breeding stock) woman we meet. BTW, women are also inherently unfaithful, they are just smarter and less obvious about it than men.

So, after we are through with this debate, can we go on to how many angels can dance on the head of a pin? I don`t think the Church`s officially approved answer of 5,000 can stand up in light of the latest research in physics, especially quantum and string theory.

And, after that, how about going on to figure out how to harness jinn power to solve the energy crisis? After all, the good book says they exist!

OR, how about getting a grip on life and your intellect and thinking for yourself?
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#122 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on December 8, 2003 12:31:16 am

Just an observation -

The men & women who are not married normally have a very romantic perception of a marriage.

A marriage which begins with the attraction of free availability of sex for 24 hours soon turns into an administrative & logistical management arrangement between two adults.

As for banning, nothing should be banned between two consenting adults.
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#121 Posted by cipram on December 8, 2003 12:31:16 am
=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#120 Posted by anew on December 8, 2003 12:31:05 am

Welcome to Uthman`s page on Niqaab. (better visit his sight for better reading)

http://members.tripod.com/~ibnfarooq/niqaab.htm

Niqaab in the light of Quran

Niqaab in the light of Hadith

Niqaab according to the Sahaba (Radhiallaahu Ánhuma)

Niqaab according to the Tabi`een

Niqaab according to the 4 Madhabib

Niqaab according to the mufasrieen of Quran

Niqaab according the great scholars of Islam



Refutations For those who claim niqaab is not wajib and the face and hands of a woman can be seen by (ghairMahrrum) strange men.



Definition of Hijab and Jilbab by Sahaba and Ullima

``The Niqaab in light of the Holy Quran and Sahih Hadith and in the Opinions of the great scholars....

From the Quran.....(This tafseer is Agreed upon by Ibn Kathir, Al-Qurtabi and At-Tabari)



The Noble Qur`an ........
Surah Al-Ahzaab, Verse #59

‘O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (``Jalabib``) veils all over their bodies (screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way Tafseer Al-Qurtabi) that is most convenient that they should be known (as such) and not molested: and Allah is Oft-Forgiving Most Merciful.``

....
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#119 Posted by anew on December 7, 2003 10:21:05 pm
#104 by tahmed32 on December 7, 2003 7:41am PT
anew #98 you are unable to explain a simple flaw i noted on your earlier post: namely, the conclusion you present (about women being required to put on the hijab) is in fact clearly not supported by the Quranic verses that you present in support of them.

What you call my simple flaw is actually your complex flaw of misunderstanding Hijab as shuttlecock burqa or a head scarf. I have done my best to explain for any body who really want to understand and observe. I will post another article for those who really want to understand with full depth.


you then seek instead to cover up this flaw in your post by giving a long sermon on why women should not be lecherous. Have you no shame?

have you no shame in deducing what I never meant or said?

your posts indicates a lack of respect for the Quran (whose teachings you ignore) and a lack of respect for women (whom you assume to be lecherous unless controlled). how dare you and others of your kind insult our religion and our women. the language you people understand is not that of civilized human beings, nor that of the Quran. the only language you jamaatiyas understand is that of the stick.

I am a simple Muslim and prefer a Dialogue than a stick. I hope you will learn how to debate than mere try to win debate by taunts and use of stick.
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#118 Posted by tahmed32 on December 7, 2003 8:36:18 pm
Maula Jat: nice!
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#117 Posted by dost_mittar on December 7, 2003 5:39:53 pm
A lesson for chowk women?

``Power of ‘parkati’ women The educated woman is not as politically irrelevant as the pundits think
SAGARIKA GHOSE
Send Feedback E-mail this story Print this story

AS political pundits ponder why they were unable to predict most of the results of the assembly elections of 2003, and wring their hands about not just one but three women chief ministers, let us examine the phenomenon not so much as one of Uma Bharti (whose victory can be attributed at least partly to a “wave” election) but of the Sophia College-educated Vasundhara Raje and the Miranda House-educated Sheila Dikshit. Two women chief ministers who represent that troublesome category described as “English-speaking women”.

There’s something suspicious about the “angrezi bolne wali aurat” isn’t there? The “English-speaking woman” is not a “Real Indian”. In fact, she’s a parachutist into the social order, where she doesn’t really belong. Not only is she not bharatiya, but she can never hope to be as authentic as the late RJD MP Bhagwati Devi or even Mayawati. The “parkati aurat” (or short-haired woman), as Sharad Yadav—one of the original proponents of the Mandal revolution, mind you— so famously scoffed during one of the debates on the Women’s Reservation Bill, is also the western-educated woman who has no business trying to enter politics, because not only is she modern and educated, but because she also wears certain immoral textiles like chiffon, maybe (shock! horror!) smokes a cigarette or has the occasional drink and perpetually teeters on the edge of frivolity.

From Mandalised intellectuals (both male and female), to RSS patriarchs, to brahmanical poll pundits, to superior television anchors, to jeering, sneering male MPs, all are united in their loathing for the “parkati aurat”. It is a brutal hatred, dressed up as political analysis, and can be described as the “Mandal mindset”. The Mandal mindset is an attitude that considers Vasundhara Raje and Sheila Dikshit politically irrelevant, not because of their achievements or ideology, but simply because of the families they come from, the clothes they wear or the educational institutions they may have been fortunate enough to attend.

But the Indian voter, praise Mirabai, has never been as narrowly judgemental as the sneering intellectuals in the cities. As far as the Indian voter is concerned, when princesses hit the dirt track, he first turns up to watch. And, if he likes them, if he is moved by the quality of their work or the sincerity in their voice, he gives them his vote.

Urban psephologists poured scorn on Vasundhara’s parivartan yatra, ridiculed her costume changes and yelled that she would never be able to learn better Hindi. But the voter turned up in great numbers from Ganganagar to Barmer to Alwar to listen to her speeches. Media czars scorned Sheila Dikshit in her first term saying she would never be able to survive in a bitterly divided party like the Delhi Congress or ever be able to take on local warlords like Sajjan Kumar or Jagdish Tytler. But the Indian voter listened to Dikshit’s no-nonsense speeches and gave her a second term.

Intellectuals unleashed venom on Vasundhara. She doesn’t know Rajasthan, they will never accept an aurat, she’s rootless, she’ll never be able to touch a chord, she’s nothing but a Delhi socialite. But the Indian voter made no such judgments. The Indian voter heard her say that she would represent not just Hindus but also Muslims. They heard her say she would try and provide jobs. They heard her say she would strive for Rajasthani handicrafts. More than all this, they saw, that when most male politicians were snoring in air-conditioned rooms during the summer, Vasundhara Raje was touring the districts in her parivartan yatra, and however tokenist her costume changes may have been, the voter saw that here was a woman who was trying, and trying very hard, to win their hearts. For the first time ever in Rajasthan, a state with one of the most chilling social indicators in India, where a feudal culture of obeisance stamps out female liberty, the voter was being given a progressive choice. They didn’t care whether Vasundhara was English-speaking or Hindi-speaking or Dutch-speaking, whether she was salt of the earth or sugar of the earth, whether she was wearing nylon or chiffon or khadi, all they cared about was the promise of development held out by the lone woman on stage. Nowhere is the savage gap between the hate-filled metropolitan pundits and the Indian voter more apparent than in the sharply contrasting treatment given to Vasundhara Raje, a five-time winner from her constituency, a conscientious minister and diligent MP.

Male politicos detest Sheila Dikshit. Nothing but a tail of Sonia Gandhi, they say dismissively. An elite woman with no grassroots support, bah, who cares about Aunty Sheila? The Delhi voter does. The voter doesn’t care that Sheila Dikshit wears handloom silk, or that she speaks convent-educated English or that she lives in genteel Nizamuddin. The voter only cares about the fact that Sheila Dikshit has pulled off visible development in Delhi. No empty promises, no cunning caste combinations, no soft hindutva, no temple-visiting or mosque and gurudwara -tourism, but simply development that is visible. New flyovers, the metro, the CNG buses, Bhagidari scheme, the anti-pollution drive and privatised power. The voter noted the pathetic contrast provided by Khurana, who remained associated with an older sleazier type of politics. However “rooted”, “authentic” and “male”, Khurana may be, the voter made no mistake about choosing the ‘parkati’ woman who holds the key to Delhi’s future.

Elite women have played a tremendous role in India. In the 19th century, Kadambini Ganguly became the first woman to address the joint session of Congress. Kalpana Joshi and Pritilata Waddedar were crucial participants in the Chittagong Armoury Raid. Later, there was Mridula Sarabhai, Sucheta Kripalani, Sushila Nayar, Aruna Asaf Ali and Tarakeshwari Sinha.

It has been acknowledged that hindutva has been marginalised in these elections: the voter has shouted that only when the BJP is moderate and development-oriented will they vote for it. But another stereotype has also been defeated in these elections and this is that women who are not backward caste are politically irrelevant. Privileged women have an undoubtedly unfair advantage and the biases of party bosses like Laloo Prasad Yadav and Mulayam Singh Yadav are natural. But these elections have shown that the voter doesn’t care too hoots about gender or background if governance is at the heart of a speech, whether the speech is delivered in fluent or broken Hindi.``
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#116 Posted by hamidm2 on December 7, 2003 5:38:19 pm
sameer,

..... i feel your pain... that is why i aleays keep my george carlin cd handy :

``When it comes to bullshit, big-time, major league bullshit, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there`s an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever `til the end of time! ``
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#115 Posted by Maula_Jat on December 7, 2003 5:30:12 pm
Sahab biwi to aik he bahut hai. This article and discussion reminds me of an old poem that I heard (unfortunately I do not re-call the name of the author):


SHADI NA KARNA YARO
TUM KO BATA RAHA HOON
AAFAT GALAY PARE HAI
US KO NIBHA RAHA HOON
SHADI NA KARNA YARO

SUBHA KE 9:00 BAJE HAIN
MERE BIWE SO RAHE HAI
BACHON KE FOOJ BETHE MERE JAN KO RO RAHI HAI
BACHON KE BEECH BETHA KHANA PAKA RAHA HOON
AAFAT GALAY PARE HAI
US KO NIBHA RAHA HOON
SHADI NA KARNA YARO

MERE BEWI HAI M.A.
WOH KAM KIYA KARE GI
WOH ``LUX`` SE NAHA KAR
KHUSHBO ME TAR RAHE GI
``TUKRAY`` PARE HAIN YARO
UN SE NAHA RAHA HOON
AAFAT GALAY PARE HAI
US KO NIBHA RAHA HOON

SHADI NA KARNA YARO
TUM KO BATA RAHA HOON
AAFAT GALAY PARE HAI
US KO NIBHA RAHA HOON

MJ
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#114 Posted by macgupta on December 7, 2003 5:30:11 pm
The footnote which says :

``1. For clarification purposes, “what your right hands possess” was common Arabic diction at the time in referring to women to whom a man was already married.``

is not quite right, is it?

``What your right hand possesses`` means ``slaves and prisoners of war``. You can step back just two verses (see Sura 33, Verse 50), and it will be clear. A. Yusuf Ali`s translation has the footnote that ``This point does not now arise, as the whole conditions and incidents of war have been altered and slavery has been abolished by international agreement``.

Understanding the correct meaning is important; because if the meaning has changed over time, or if international agreements make it a moot point - then, likewise, you do not need to refer back to the Quran to decide whether polygamy is good or bad, but would likewise go by the conditions obtaining now.

reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#113 Posted by RationalFaith on December 7, 2003 3:11:39 pm
Quite funny to observe people trying to turn Arabian dog shit into gold.

Will see where this ijtihad reaches after 150 posts.

reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
#112 Posted by SameerJB on December 7, 2003 1:31:07 pm

..anew, asif naqshbandi and thier ilks can not be convinced on the basis of any man-made principles and logics. Allah has already made evertthing very clear for them. They have no choice as Muslims but to follow - submission unconditionally. Allah is most interested in success but success to him means victory and not prosperity. People who follow him are working for his victory above everything else including human rights, equality, justice, prosperity, rule of law, democracy etc because they are all man-made principles. As they say, ``allah knows better`` and he has already laid out guidelines and blueprints for the best ways to live in this world. Those who do, will be rewarded in the indefinitely extended afterlife.

So, hamidm Saheb, it does not matter if fashion and cosmetic industries alongwith entertainment and banking industries go down the drain. They are nothing compared to victory for allah as Muslims everywhere shout, allahu akbar. Allahu Akbar does not mean than god is great in size, shape, knowledge, power but it means that ``we`` promise to make him great even if it means destroying everything that is unsanctioned by him 1400 years ago.

What will be left of allah if Muslims accept monogamy and discard god`s sanctioned polygyny? Who is in command and who is right? Next, you decide fasting between 4:30AM to 4:35AM (five minutes) instead of sunrise to sunset. Then it is free for all to chose whatever. That is why, religion should not have any place in life. Just take it lightly as panjabi identity of panjabi Muslims.....;)) Do whatever is necessary for living in the 21st century and let god rule in the afterlife which is real and permanent anyway according to Islam. The stay here is just a mirage, pani ka bulbula..then why worry about god?
reply to this interact write a new interact add to favorites flag objectionable content
listing 112-128   1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11

Interact Index

    #239 jay
    #238 trojan_123
    #237 jay
    #236 Kulharee
    #235 jay
    #234 teshah
    #233 paradox
    #232 trojan_123
    #231 Shobuz
    #230 tahmed32
    #229 plats8
    #228 tahmed32
    #227 tahmed32
    #226 plats8
    #225 dost_mittar
    #224 tahmed32
    #223 tahmed32
    #222 tahmed32
    #221 dost_mittar
    #220 nasah
    #219 tahmed32
    #218 hamidm2
    #217 anew
    #216 sattar2
    #215 tahmed32
    #214 vertex
    #213 RationalFaith
    #212 dost_mittar
    #211 dost_mittar
    #210 anew
    #209 hamidm2
    #208 khotasikka
    #207 anew
    #206 tahmed32
    #205 sattar2
    #204 RationalFaith
    #203 anew
    #202 anew
    #201 wajahat
    #200 dost_mittar
    #199 wajahat
    #198 jay
    #197 nazarhayatkhan
    #196 nasah
    #195 anew
    #194 anew
    #193 anew
    #192 anew
    #191 anew
    #190 tahmed32
    #189 anew
    #188 anew
    #187 anew
    #186 anew
    #185 anew
    #184 anew
    #183 anew
    #182 hamidm2
    #181 dost_mittar
    #180 sattar2
    #179 RationalFaith
    #178 tahmed32
    #177 hamidm2
    #176 ZahraJ
    #175 fuzair
    #174 Shobuz
    #173 anew
    #172 anew
    #171 sigalph235
    #170 anew
    #169 nazarhayatkhan
    #168 anew
    #167 anew
    #166 nasah
    #165 khotasikka
    #164 anew
    #163 anew
    #162 cipram
    #161 tahmed32
    #160 dost_mittar
    #159 hamidm2
    #158 tahmed32
    #157 ZahraJ
    #156 hamidm2
    #155 tahmed32
    #154 Shobuz
    #153 anew
    #152 wajahat
    #151 hamidm2
    #150 anew
    #149 anew
    #148 nazarhayatkhan
    #147 anew
    #146 anew
    #145 anew
    #144 anew
    #143 RationalFaith
    #142 Pankaj
    #141 hamidm2
    #140 tahmed32
    #139 fuzair
    #138 Shobuz
    #137 Shobuz
    #136 Shobuz
    #135 tahmed32
    #134 anew
    #133 tahmed32
    #132 tahmed32
    #131 nazarhayatkhan
    #130 anew
    #129 hamidm2
    #128 Shobuz
    #127 tahmed32
    #126 RationalFaith
    #125 tahmed32
    #124 tahmed32
    #123 fuzair
    #122 nazarhayatkhan
    #121 cipram
    #120 anew
    #119 anew
    #118 tahmed32
    #117 dost_mittar
    #116 hamidm2
    #115 Maula_Jat
    #114 macgupta
    #113 RationalFaith
    #112 SameerJB
    #111 ZahraJ
    #110 hamidm2
    #109 hamidm2
    #108 PM
    #107 Pardesi
    #106 Pakfin
    #105 taimurmalik
    #104 hamidm2
    #103 tahmed32
    #102 tahmed32
    #101 Saminasha
    #100 veeresh
    #99 Jahil
    #98 anew
    #97 anew
    #96 sigalph235
    #95 tahmed32
    #94 sattar2
    #93 hamidm2
    #92 hamidm2
    #91 ZahraJ
    #90 tahmed32
    #89 nasah
    #88 Saminasha
    #87 tahmed32
    #86 PM
    #85 tahmed32
    #84 SameerJB
    #83 anew
    #82 anew
    #81 Jahil
    #80 AlephNull
    #79 urbashi
    #78 dost_mittar
    #77 dost_mittar
    #76 PM
    #75 nasah
    #74 tahmed32
    #73 ZahraJ
    #72 sadna
    #71 hamidm2
    #70 PM
    #69 kaurasach
    #68 sattar2
    #67 ZahraJ
    #66 harris_ansari
    #65 nasah
    #64 ali_1
    #63 hamidm2
    #62 jang
    #61 dost_mittar
    #60 ballukhan
    #59 cipram
    #58 PM
    #57 PM
    #56 tahmed32
    #55 Romair
    #54 anjaan
    #53 dost_mittar
    #52 harimau
    #51 tahmed32
    #50 AlephNull
    #49 anew
    #48 AlephNull
    #47 PM
    #46 Shobuz
    #45 PM
    #44 Romair
    #43 tahmed32
    #42 sac
    #41 tahmed32
    #40 rafay_alam
    #39 SyedAhmed
    #38 veeresh
    #37 dost_mittar
    #36 Jahil
    #35 RationalFaith
    #34 sigalph235
    #33 sigalph235
    #32 jay
    #31 yagacho
    #30 jawahara
    #29 sattar2
    #28 fuzair
    #27 dost_mittar
    #26 temporal
    #25 harimau
    #24 nakhok
    #23 MalangBaba
    #22 MalangBaba
    #21 PM
    #20 faizahussain
    #19 ziahmed
    #18 sac
    #17 Romair
    #16 malik99
    #15 temporal
    #14 kaurasach
    #13 faizahussain
    #12 faizahussain
    #11 mog
    #10 hamidm2
    #9 kaurasach
    #8 PM
    #7 sac
    #6 sigalph235
    #5 Urstruly
    #4 stuka
    #3 FarzanaVersey
    #2 temporal
    #1 ziahmed

Latest Interacts

  • ahmedmadani: Re: # 64 I... US Commando Strike in
  • ahmedmadani: Re: # 64 I... US Commando Strike in
  • nkg: Re: # 62 Ahmed... You should... US Commando Strike in
  • nkg: Re: # 59 ahmed... Yes sir,... US Commando Strike in
  • ahmedmadani: Re: # 61 Major... US Commando Strike in
  • MatloobZaman: Re: # 39 by... There is no ‘honour’
  • Ravi_Kopra: Interesting! paani paani har jagah tum... Bihar & Louisiana: A
  • pavocavalry: in logon main itna... US Commando Strike in

THEMES

  • Pakistan's Struggle for Democracy
  • The Indian Story
  • Indo-Pak Relations
  • Personal Narratives
  • Religion Today
  • War on Terror
  • Role of Media
  • Call for Social Change
  • Hold Them Accountable
  • Environment and Us
  • Way of Life
more »

Top 5 Articles This Week

  • Popular
  • Save Me From Charismatic Leaders!
  • Free to Breed
  • Why Zardari Should Be President!
  • US Commando Strike in Waziristan
  • There is no ‘honour’ in killing
  • Featured
  • There are a Lot of Monkeys
  • White Charade
  • Words of a Woman
  • FOX News and the Smelly Shoes
  • Dilemmas of Creative Children
  • 10 Years Ago
  • Reconfiguration of the South Asian Polities
  • Iqbal: Selected Verse I
  • Some nights are long and dreary
  • The Amsterdam Treasures
  • Vomit

Write on Chowk Interact Guidelines Privacy policy Terms Contact

Copyright © 1997 - 2008 chowk.com. All Rights Reserved
Reproduction of material on any www.chowk.com pages without prior written permissions is strictly prohibited