Promise Me

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Urstruly/Romair:

I completely forgot to mention, in case some readers were wondering, that this couplet:

``ZubaaN pay baa`r-e khudaayaa yeh kis kaa naam ayaa
Keh mairay nuTQue nay bosay meri zubaaN kay liyay. ``

IS by Ghalib..the genius who also claimed he could not write `simple` verse.

---

A plantaition slave`s heartache: simple, moveing--staright from the recesses of the heart.

I get weary
but keep on trying
I`m tired of living
but scared of dying

But Old Man River just keeps on rolling along.

( old man river: the genuine Paul Robeson: another genius crushed by the U.S thugs. Like thousands of greats who abandoned USA, Land of getting milked and sucked , to seek freedom and liberty elsewhere )

simple. elegant. touching:
(Our filmi poetry has been blatantly ignored and ``elited`` by professional, ``literate``, univesity-type nincompoops--the brain auctioneers)

Chaandni khill na saki, chaand nay munh moaR liya
BUdliaaN chhaa GaeeN, Barsaat naa honay paa-eey.

Urstruly:
This was just to make it a bit interesting, like a riddle. No `education` intended . Thanks for playing.

The name is that which when uttered makes the lips to ``kiss`` twice: the `M` letter
Then the last letter, the tongue slightly touches the palate for the letted: the `D`. letter.

Nutque , arabic word, is used interchangably for lips/palate/tongue (biology) as well the faculty of speech/ability to reason (function)

So when I that name was on my lips my faculty (to speak/reason) gave my tongue a kiss (again meaning: Oh what a noble deed).

I hope I contributed something of value.

nasab: ``belongs to Mir Taqi Mir``

nope. it belongs to momin khan momin......

Echo

sorry, I do not know the background of the couplet though I will apreciate the education.

HP

I did not understand your question or assertion, however, there is a little anecdote about the couplet that you have written. My room mate, when I was in Engineering school developed serious bladder problems -most of them psychological after experiencing the carnage in Karachi. He used to read that couplet as:


`Moot` Kaa aik din moeen hai
Neend kiyoon raat bhar nahin aati.

Umair -- if I may -- that shayr -- tum meray paas hotay ho goya/jub koiee doosraa nahiN hota -- belongs to Mir Taqi Mir --

Ghalib once said that for that one couplet of Mir I can give up my whole Diwan.....

there is another couplet in the same ghazal -- that is another marvel of simplicity and feeling that instantly touches your heart.........

aik tum hee naheeN huway meray/
warnaa dunya meiN keya naheeN hotaa...

Romair:

[Of course. And that is what I was implying, when I asked you, whom your Valentine was. It could be anyone - a friend, a close relative, parents.]

There is one other category that you skipped. I have meaning to come back to that. It`s that cute and sweet term ``significant other`` and I hope in future you will include that in your running list of implications :) You see this is what happens when you get married. You start leaning towards implications vs. being specific. No doubt I have yet to envy any married person. Please and please and for god`s sake ... no lectures or sermon.

I don`t really know which would be deeper and simpler. Here are some more, however:

ishq nay Ghalib nakamma kar diya......warna hum bhi aadmi thay kaam kay

kiya bharosa hai zindagani kaa.....aadami bulbala hai paani ka

Following is the shortest poem ever writtern in English:

Me; we.

Romair!

It is said that ‘Tum mere pass hotay ho… is the simplest urdu couplet, but where does it stands when compared to this by Ghalib.

Maut Kaa aik din moeen hai
Neend kiyoon raat bhar nahin aati.

Any thoughts, Urstruly! as it seems you are the resident expert on Urdu poetry.

Thanks Urstruly:
But tashree`h please.

Who? Why? & how? in the shair?

Others: Please do participate,

answer after 5 posts on THIS shair or if asked so asked.

( It is being quoted here for its simplicity , profoundness and artistic merit)

echo

The closest translation that I can come up with is:

Lo! As I named your sweet name
the faculty of speech bowed down to my diction.

Romair:

matlab ki baat shakal se pehchan jaiyay

Urstruly #44: To quote SugarBaap, are you suggesting that, the shair reads better with hotay (and not hoti) becasue it seems``addressed between two gay pakistani men lining up in san fran for their marriage licence.``

Romair # 43

That correction was a fatal mistake - your reputation was already on line here.

Tum mare paas hotay (not hoti) ho goya.......

Usrtruly/temporat/echoboom: The most simplistically deep shair ever written - Hakim Momin`s untranslatable:

Tum mere paas hoti ho goya......Jab koi doosra nahin hota

SugarBaap #41: I agree. Its strange how context can change the effects of identical words.

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Re-post: previous one seems to be lost.

Saeen Sachhay:

Khaali haiN Grchay masnad O minbar, niGooN hai khalque
RaUb-eQuabaa O haibat-e dastaar daikhnaa.
(kuchh samjhhay? kyaa samjhhay?)


How does one tashree`h this ``simple`` one by Ghalib:

``ZubaaN pay baa`r-e khudaayaa yeh kis kaa naam ayaa
Keh mairay nuTQue nay bosay meri zubaaN kay liyay.

Open to: Romair, Urstruly, MNI, Khamkhwa, Lifta, edgeNridge, temporal, wolfe and ALL others.

I will give mine after five replies--on this topic OR if so asked.

Looks like i`m alone in thinking that this is cheesy & reads like a sixties pop song. Perhaps everyone is lavishing praise on this hoping Romair would give up his long, turgid ramblings in favor of ``poetry.`` Can`t fault you there.

Echo

Here is one for you:

meiN nay jab likhna seekha tha
pehle tera naam likha tha.

(probably Nasir Kazmi).

When I heard that couplet the first time, I was young and stupid; so without a second thought I wrote this couplet on top of a love letter to her. The reply was ``Thank you, I appreciate the sentiments, but I am not your Godess``.

It took me a while to decipher that reply. As it turned out, the couplet was the start of a hymn and poet was referring to God.

Urstruly:35
Ah! simplicity in poetry--that elusive, will-O-wispish teaser.

Baba Alam siyaah-posh one of my very favourite lesser known poets--awesome. Then there was this really really great poet , who was a labourer too, from gujraat ( i cannot fully recall that verse about being exhausted from work and seeking maternal embrace).

Anyhow: The following two (among others) immortal songs from ParrchhaiN were written by an angoothha chhaap poet. Could Not read or write at all! Prime example of simplicity and melody.

1. Seenay maiN sulugtay haiN armaaN
2. Kut-tay haiN dukhh maiN yeh din.

Ghalib bichharay kay liyay aasaan kehnaa kabhhee aasaan naheeN rahaa:

``Z-buss keh mushkil hai aasaan kehnaa
Goyam mushkil aur naa goyaam mushkil``

issi liyay tO kahaa thha.


.PS: The top misra`a in avaami poetry
``Papoo yaar, tuNg naa kr``
does anybody know second misraa or it was never written. Let us try on our own:

Here goes: ``lai kashmir, jung naa kr``

Zahra #24 Alas! Rather than taking the missus to a romantic dinner for two, and reading her suitable passages from Keats and Shelley (or even our own newly appointed chowk poet laureate, Romair) inbetween different courses of meal, I took her to watch ``Monster``. And not just the two of us, since we also were accompanied by visitors from pakistan (her brother and sister-in-law, who like all normal pakistanis, are convinced that the west is a modern day Sodom and Gomorrah, and the movie did nothing to improve their views).

Needless to add, having suffered through two hours of watching all forms of human depravity in that movie, accompanied by violence and language, any semblance of a gentle valentine`s evening out was shattered. It turned out to be a valentine`s day massacre.

Far from comparing the missus to a summer`s day, and receiving rewards for my thoughtfulness, I was left having to explain for the rest of the eveining what I was thinking when I decided this would be a good movie for valentine`s day.

The only saving grace was that the folks from Pakistan enjoyed the movie, thought it had depth and seriousness. So, things came back to normal once valentine`s day was over.

t

and here is one more for you:

dil ki basti ajeeb basti hay
lootney walay ko tarasti hay

(Iqbal)

(lootney = pillaging)

Urstruly:

..check out this Ghalib`s Gahazal: Verse{111,14}

ham muvahhid haiN hamaaraa kesh hai tark-e rusuum
millateN jab miT gaeeN ajzaa-e eemaaN ho gaiiN

1) we are a monotheist, our practice is the renunciation of customs
2) when the communities were erased, [they] became parts of the faith

rgds,

t

temporal

kissi ko hiqarat ki nazar se na daikh
har chehra kissi ka mehboob hota hai.

I read it on the back side of a truck once.

Umair:

...timely and pleasant!…you should write more…if nothing it would have some redeeming and hopefully lasting influence on your long drawn out and seemingly endless inter-acts;)

digression re: simplicity

poetry is too vast a field or discipline to be defined by simplistic statements…individuals like/dislike poetry according to their abilities and sensibilities…

rgds,

t

simple, nice and sweet...

however,

As the eggshell brakes and the earth under my knees moves,
I see two angels making love in the living grass...

well why just till the dying day? lets make it eternal ;)

HP

Here is something that I read yesterday. Can anything get any simpler yet more profound than that:

Zindagi kaise basar ho gi
mohabat meiN ji nahi lag raha.

nasah #23: Any resemblence of this piece with my personal life, is a mere coincidence. The only part that may apply relates to, ``silly kids`` due to our ages when we got married. I did once suggest to her, after marriage, that we should try to, ``change the world.`` She was too pre-occupied with an Indian movie at the time, and said she wasn`t intersted. So that part was settled, right there and then. So like most Pakistanis, only the last stanza applies.....

echoboom #26: ``True or false, doesn`t matter. You`ve endeared yourself to me even more because I also felt like a teen-tweenager.``

Age is nothing but a state of mind. So everyone is as old, as they think they are....

Ras: #27: I was forced into this, by a few repliers. Either they wanted me to write this stuff, or they wanted to find some way to stop me from writing what I normally write. So you will have to blame them...:)

ZahraJ #18: ``Just for the record, Valentine`s Day is not dedicated in anyway or shape to the married ones. Human beings can celebrate the said day in all phases of their life...singlehood, married life, and the life after.``

Of course. And that is what I was implying, when I asked you, whom your Valentine was. It could be anyone - a friend, a close relative, parents.

``I understand that being a newly wed you are into that Parveen Shakar mode.``

Ah! Parveen Shakir. ``Woh jab bhi gaya, lota.....tou meray paas aayah`` It is possible I may have been in Parveen Shakir mode at one time. I suppose one could argue, marriage is new, everyday. Though I got married a long long time ago, at a very very young age. When Parveen may have bee alive.....

Impressive #19: ``You guys just made my day. No you just made my week!``

I think you may be giving us credit which is not earned, nor deserved.......

I have seen Irshad Manji on TV a lot, though I have yet to read her book

Tahmad #20: ``Romair, we hardly knew thee!!``

I will take that as a compliment :)

Chowk-Staff #21: ``The writer name has been corrected``

Bahut dair kee maharban aatey aatey.....

Urstruly #22: ``I think the best poetry is that which is the simplest one.``

This is definitely true. For both poetry and prose. The best writers are the ones, who can explain the most complex things using the simplest words.

Dear Tahmed,

Thank you so much for your kind wishes. But I do suggest that you and others like you on Chowk learn a thing or two from Romair.

Hope you were able to grab a stanza or two from Keats or Byron for Mrs Tahmed.

Best Regards.

Romair:
Somehow I still think that for Rafique-e hayat you invented this Omer Rafique [omer as in age]. why the coquettish smiling icon?
``Omer`s name seems to keep showing up on Chowk, for everything sent in by me :-)``

If not a very strange co-incidence.

True or false, doesn`t matter. You`ve endeared yourself to me even more because I also felt like a teen-tweenager.

Thanks.

God help us

Romair is trying his hand at romance now.

Not a half-way bad effort though.

Must have finally succeeded in slaying the evil feudals

of the PPP.

Time to move on.

Ras

``Each time some pretty girl would break my heart
I’d bare my soul to you
Did you not see, it was an alibi
To spend more time with you?``

Umair -- great Valentine piece -- however you have to explain yourself -- are you saying you tell your wife about your each and every affair......what a tattletale.......Amazing!


``They said our love was false; it would not last
No one gave us a chance
Two silly kids we were; all on our own
Out to change the world``

are you implying your marriage was not arranged -- if it wasn`t -- it WAS false....:-)

great poem.....encore

#22 by Urstruly on February 16, 2004 5:06pm PT
``I think the best poetry is that which is the simplest one.``

So Urstruly and Umair here is some simple peotry for you!!!


Monsieur Le Pew, a dapper skunk, arrived on the big screen in January 1945 in the Warner Bros. cartoon ``Odor-able Kitty.`` His creator was animator Chuck Jones, who also dreamed up Road Runner and Wile E. Coyote.

ICEBREAKERS
``Permit me to introduce myself. I am Pepe Le Pew, your lover.``

SWEET NOTHINGS
``You are my peanut, I am your brittle!``
``Ah, my leetle much ado about somezing. [kiss, kiss] Ah, my leetle lost labor`s love.``
``Where are you, my leetle gumbo of chicken? Your French fried shrimp is sizzling for you.``
``You may call me Streetcar, because of my desire for you!``
``Where are you, my leetle objet d`art? I am going to collect you!``

SELF-AFFIRMATION
``You know, eet eez possible to be too attractive!``
``You know, most men would get discouraged about now. ... Fortunately for you, I am not most men.``
``Ah, my darling, I love you. Where have I been all your life?``

How about a little side by side comparison.

Each day I want to hear you say
You’re still glad you took the chance
I don’t know why I feel this way
Tell me; is this what’s called romance? By Umair

LOVE IS A BATTLEFIELD
``I`ll tell you what. You stop resisting me, and I`ll stop resisting you.``
``If you have not tried eet, do not knock eet!``
``You are zee corned beef to me, I am zee cab-baj to you. Zee cab-baj do not run away from zee corned beef!``

DEEP THOUGHTS
``One nice thing eez, the game of love eez never called on account of darkness.``
``Sometimes I ask myself, `Eez it really worth eet?` And I answer myself, `Yes!```

They said our love was false; it would not last
No one gave us a chance- Umair

I think the best poetry is that which is the simplest one. I liked the following:

`` They said our love was false; it would not last
No one gave us a chance
Two silly kids we were; all on our own
Out to change the world ``

The writer name has been corrected to Umair Raja only. Earlier due to a db mixup Omer Rafique`s name was also showing in author name.

From the Left:

Dear Romair,

You guys just made my day. No you just made my week!

Way back when there used to be a certain `Kafir Khan` on Chowk. He was openly gay. But this is the first time someone with such a high profile as yours has come out of the closet on Chowk. You courage is awe-inspiring. You guys are fabulous fabulous fabulous.

And kudos to Chowk for allowing you and Omer to break out of the closet with such fierce pride. The gay rights movement is greatly in debt to chowk.

This really got to me:

Each time some pretty girl would break my heart
I’d bare my soul to you
Did you not see, it was an alibi
To spend more time with you?

I couldn’t tell you how many times I’ve tried to snuggle up to a guy with a fake story of a girl breaking my heart. That one hit very close to home and tugged fiercely at my heartstrings.

You go girlfriend!

Your fellow flaming queer,

Left.

P.S: Did you read the latest Irshad Manji book? Isnt she fierce?



From the Right:

I’m not gay!!

Regards,

Right.

ZahraJ #18 ``Just because you are married now does not mean the world around exists only for your ilks :) ``

Agreed. Happy valentine`s day to all the unmarried female ilks as well. And indeed to all female ilks under the sun.

And cheers to Romair once again for lifting chowk out (if only for this one board) from the spiritless rut it had gotten stuck into in recent times. Romair, we hardly knew thee!!

Romair,

I understand that being a newly wed you are into that Parveen Shakar mode. I could not recollect earlier where the tone was coming from ...but this poem had a ``yin`` touch... Just for the record, Valentine`s Day is not dedicated in anyway or shape to the married ones. Human beings can celebrate the said day in all phases of their life...singlehood, married life, and the life after. Just because you are married now does not mean the world around exists only for your ilks :)

Take Care.

hossp: #7: ``This is beautiful!``

Thanks. Vanessa Williams must rank amongst the ten most beatiful women in the world, along with the likes of Ashwariya Rai and Michelle Pfieffer and Olivia Newton John. And this ballad is definitely her best work.

Sobia #8:

``sweet :)``

Thanks

fara #9:

``last stanza is the best. waiting to read more from you``

The first six stanzas are for the couples who have had love marriages. And the last one is for those of us, who have had arranged marriages. I think most Pakistanis (and Indians) would relate to the last stanza. While most Americans to the first six. Most Pakistanis never get a chance to experience the first six, while most Americans rarely get to experience the last one.

moulabax #10:

``Haha. (thumbs up)``

Thanks

cipram #11:

``so nice.
today chowk front page is looking so beautiful.
no politics no confrontation.``

Each has its own place. I guess everyone made an exception for Valentines` day.

tahmad32 #12: ``Romair: Very nice poem

I second hamidm in suggesting your true profession is that you are a far better poet than you are a socio-political commentator.``

Thanks. The reason everyone likes poetry is that it is always non-confrontational. While political commentary, by its nature, is confrotatinal. I think.

wajahat #13:

``Good Work Romair``

Thanks. Maybe an anthem for MRM should be the next step

freesoul #15:

``In the last 3 days gays were being wedded in city hall, san francisco. So i guess we know where the inspiration is coming from.``

I think Chowk Staff is bent upon creating rumors. Usually they correct the names, on things I submit, by the second day. This time it seems like they are going to let it slide.

ahmadzai #16: ``This is an excellent poem.``

The only one on your list I can relate to is Bon Jovi. Though, this was primarily written for Vannessa Williams. If she ever calls, I am willing to give it to her for free. Or to Lionel Ritchie.

Umair:

This is an excellent poem. You are the first person with a balanced right and left sides of brain (recalling that you are a researcher and IT expert).

If written earlier, this could easily have been borrowed for a ballad by hard rock acts of the beautiful years gone by. I am already imagining David Coverdale (Whitesnake), Scorpions, Cinderella, Ratts, LA Guns, Robert Plant and Jimmy page (in their second coming), etc. playing it to the jam packed American arenas in the 80s till early 90s. Bon Jovi can still have a crack at it, although listening to their latest # viz Street Anger, I can`t visualize Metallica taking this one.

:-)

Umair Raja & Omer Rafique,

two guys writing romantic poem in california !!

In the last 3 days gays were being wedded in city hall, san francisco. So i guess we know where the inspiration is coming from.

Touchin indeed :)

Good Work Romair

I was indebted as the General Secretary of MRM to give my acquiescence to this before they start breaking up our party into the MRM-F(Fundoo), MRM-L(Liberoo). jk

:))

Rgds

W

last stanza is the best. waiting to read more from you.

Haha. (thumbs up)

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Romair: Very nice poem.

I second hamidm in suggesting your true profession is that you are a far better poet than you are a socio-political commentator.

sweet :)

Romair!


And now we`re standing face to face
Isn`t this world a crazy place
Just when I thought our chance had passed
You go and save the best for last
-Vanessa Williams

Thanks for clearing that up for me. When I first read your poetry, I just had a nagging feeling that I have heard something like that before. It would have come to me sooner or later. Thanks for clearing that up.

This is beautiful!

I will second Hamidm though!!!!

Rozaiba #2: ``But I guess it`s appropriate for the occasion. : )``

I would have sent it in one day earlier, on the actual Valentine`s day (or night). However, I wanted the last word to be, ``Valentine.`` And it took me a bit of time to balance it out.

ZahraJ #3: ``This was sweet! A blend of East and I do not know what.``

Thanks.

``By the way, it seemed both of you(Omar and Umair) contributed to complete the thought ``Promise Me.``

We contributed an article together, once. Since then Chowk Staff keeps putting our name up together, for some reason. And then removes it the next day.

``Happy Belated V. Day.``

To you and everyone else, as well. Btw, for those of us who are married, the answer is obvious, but who was your Valentine, this year?

Hamidm2 #4: ``.......... simply wonderful!........ now, this is what i call poetry!.........you are a poet par excellence!..........

.......waiting with bated breath for your next masterpiece.................``

Thanks. I am speechless. I hope you are not joking. Sometimes it is hard to tell. It took me about two hours to right this, after I heard Vanessa Williams beautiful solo of, ``You saved the best for last.`` It is very inspiring. This is based on the same rhyme, theme, beat and, ``wazan.`` Some of her lines would have fit in perfectly well here.

``so stop wasting your time (and ours) by writing long winded treatises on politics and other useless stuff ............ stick to poetry - it is your true calling``

People keep telling me this. I don`t know why. It has forced me to stop writing articles, other than book reviews, and now a bit of poetry. But not writing long treatise on politics in my replies....That is a bit too much to ask :)

echoboom #5:

``Is Omer rafique=life-partner?
am I the first to interpret so?``

Just an old friend. Please see reply #1.

``Good simple poem.``

Thanks.

Umair:
Is Omer rafique=life-partner?
am I the first to interpret so?

Good simple poem.

romair,


.......... simply wonderful!........ now, this is what i call poetry!.........you are a poet par excellence!.............so stop wasting your time (and ours) by writing long winded treatises on politics and other useless stuff ............ stick to poetry - it is your true calling!..........

.......waiting with bated breath for your next masterpiece.................

Romair,

This was sweet! A blend of East and I do not know what.

By the way, it seemed both of you(Omar and Umair) contributed to complete the thought ``Promise Me.`` It did not seem from any angle that it was written for each other. Still the clarification helps in understanding the motive :)

Happy Belated V. Day.

Cheesiest poem I`ve read on the front page. : ) But I guess it`s appropriate for the occasion. : )

Thanks for putting this on the page, so quickly.

Before people start getting any ideas, we did not write this for each other. Omer`s name seems to keep showing up on Chowk, for everything sent in by me :-)