Beena Sarwar April 2, 2004
#1 Posted by Urstruly on April 2, 2004 12:16:29 pm
Mohammad 47:20 And those who believe say: Why has not a chapter been revealed? But when a decisive chapter is revealed, and fighting is mentioned therein you see those in whose hearts is a disease look to you with the look of one fainting because of death. Woe to them then!
#2 Posted by arjun_m on April 2, 2004 2:03:08 pm
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#3 Posted by hamidm2 on April 2, 2004 2:03:08 pm
waiting for gabriel,
.......our resident jihadi, urstruly, has spoken .......... now you see why it is so difficult to change the text books in pakistan without changing the source book?............ the koran has to be rewritten before we can get rid of this nonsense ............. unfortunately, this task is beyond mortal me - it can only be done by a winged creature who hasn`t been seen in fourteen hundred years
.......our resident jihadi, urstruly, has spoken .......... now you see why it is so difficult to change the text books in pakistan without changing the source book?............ the koran has to be rewritten before we can get rid of this nonsense ............. unfortunately, this task is beyond mortal me - it can only be done by a winged creature who hasn`t been seen in fourteen hundred years
#4 Posted by kaurasach on April 2, 2004 2:03:08 pm
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#7 Posted by ZahraJ on April 2, 2004 4:11:34 pm
Bina,
Good points. Valid arguments. And, well put together feature!
The other major issue is how people at a high visibility role do not realize how the rest of the world will interpret their views. There is definitely lack of pragmatism and prudence.
That`s where Maliha Lodhi should be asked to coach some of the upcoming elected or nominated women.
Ironically, Pakistani Society does not value people of caliber by their brain, knowledge, and exposure. They mostly go by the age factor. To them, the older you are the more experience you have.
Good points. Valid arguments. And, well put together feature!
The other major issue is how people at a high visibility role do not realize how the rest of the world will interpret their views. There is definitely lack of pragmatism and prudence.
That`s where Maliha Lodhi should be asked to coach some of the upcoming elected or nominated women.
Ironically, Pakistani Society does not value people of caliber by their brain, knowledge, and exposure. They mostly go by the age factor. To them, the older you are the more experience you have.
#8 Posted by hamidm2 on April 2, 2004 4:21:39 pm
just for a moment..........
............ are we willing to consider the notion that we might be confronting an ideology that is beyond reform, beyond redemption, beyond any possibility of reform ?.......... think about it ........ do we have to thoroughly discredit, defeat, and vanquish this insidious philospophy before the text books can be changed ?................think about it ..............was it possile to ``reform`` communism?......... was it possible to ``reform`` nazism? .......... can we reform islam ?................ are these valid questions?
............ are we willing to consider the notion that we might be confronting an ideology that is beyond reform, beyond redemption, beyond any possibility of reform ?.......... think about it ........ do we have to thoroughly discredit, defeat, and vanquish this insidious philospophy before the text books can be changed ?................think about it ..............was it possile to ``reform`` communism?......... was it possible to ``reform`` nazism? .......... can we reform islam ?................ are these valid questions?
#9 Posted by aminashah1 on April 2, 2004 7:03:27 pm
I think curriculum has failed. But it does not matter. Rich people like my Abbaji sent all their children to convent English school and we end up in usa. Medium send to patriotic english school and children end up in usa. Only poor go to urdu medium school(end up in usa) and only no nothing marginal economic people send children send to Religious school. These poor people have less have than most dogs in rich house hold and their children live and work in Pakistan and it does not matter. Its preprogramed.
Religious schools and army has failed. Indian schools cram computers and get jobs so they achieve limited success.
This religious school product is supposed to be fighting man for Jehad incorporated and that is ok. But still they have not been successful in Liberation of Kashmir. Even army has infinite supply of religiously charged young man but proper training is not given so his sacrifice is wasted. But that does not matter as who dies he does not care for his life neither the senders them as cannon fodder to eastern front. I think Its best way to keep frustrated jehadis in control by destroying as once jehadi is always jehadi. An ideal jehadi when cools can find thug generals plan and will take care of fake muslim leaders who encourage jehadi for fight and army sends them to certain death. And army does not move for kashmiris and never moves when needed to help kashmiris. It just like Indian movie hero complains to heroine abou his ``Mjaburi, mai kya kar sakata hay?``.Its like chicken meat factory for male chickens, feeded , antibioticxed, fatttened and put on assembly belt and slaughtered and processed and marketed.
Religious schools and army has failed. Indian schools cram computers and get jobs so they achieve limited success.
This religious school product is supposed to be fighting man for Jehad incorporated and that is ok. But still they have not been successful in Liberation of Kashmir. Even army has infinite supply of religiously charged young man but proper training is not given so his sacrifice is wasted. But that does not matter as who dies he does not care for his life neither the senders them as cannon fodder to eastern front. I think Its best way to keep frustrated jehadis in control by destroying as once jehadi is always jehadi. An ideal jehadi when cools can find thug generals plan and will take care of fake muslim leaders who encourage jehadi for fight and army sends them to certain death. And army does not move for kashmiris and never moves when needed to help kashmiris. It just like Indian movie hero complains to heroine abou his ``Mjaburi, mai kya kar sakata hay?``.Its like chicken meat factory for male chickens, feeded , antibioticxed, fatttened and put on assembly belt and slaughtered and processed and marketed.
#10 Posted by SoulKeeper on April 2, 2004 8:25:49 pm
And I thought `Jehad` meant `Not cheating on your Girlfriend.`
;)
;)
#11 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on April 2, 2004 8:50:46 pm
Beena
A good crusade.
But it is like cleaning a table when the house is full of muck.
The `Constitution` says no law shall be made repugnant to Quran & Sunnah.
TNT, its purpose long achieved, is now re-hashed and touted as `Pakistan was made in the name of Islam` - as if the 140 Muslims in India are unable to perform their rituals.
The Army`s motto is `Jihad fe Sabeel Illah` - fight for Allah.
There is no end to the distortions in our structure.
Hamidm2 has absolute clear thinking on the subject.
A good crusade.
But it is like cleaning a table when the house is full of muck.
The `Constitution` says no law shall be made repugnant to Quran & Sunnah.
TNT, its purpose long achieved, is now re-hashed and touted as `Pakistan was made in the name of Islam` - as if the 140 Muslims in India are unable to perform their rituals.
The Army`s motto is `Jihad fe Sabeel Illah` - fight for Allah.
There is no end to the distortions in our structure.
Hamidm2 has absolute clear thinking on the subject.
#12 Posted by bilal843 on April 2, 2004 8:51:31 pm
This article is timely & based on a good research. Now there are many people inside the country who are aware of the fact that history which is written in Pakistani curiculum is somewhat mis-represented. But this is the problem with many of the countries in the world. Most of the governments try to show history with color of their respective religion, culture or political ideology.
#13 Posted by malik99 on April 2, 2004 9:29:27 pm
nazarhayatkhan # 11 - You wrote: ``A good crusade``.
Your ignorance of history, your parrotting of western mantra and even their vocabulary has rendered you nothing more than a monkey who mimicks his master.
Instead of using ``good crusade``, why didn`t you use the phrase ``good pogrom``? Because then your masters would have casterated you and sent in their crusaders into your house looking for you.
Your ignorance of history, your parrotting of western mantra and even their vocabulary has rendered you nothing more than a monkey who mimicks his master.
Instead of using ``good crusade``, why didn`t you use the phrase ``good pogrom``? Because then your masters would have casterated you and sent in their crusaders into your house looking for you.
#14 Posted by malik99 on April 2, 2004 9:29:27 pm
Let me pose this simple question: Is religious fundamentalism the ONLY problem emanating from Pakistani curriculum?
The obvious answer is NO. Our curriculum contains low grade subject matter; it LIES about history of Pakistan; it LIES about the history of the land on which Pakistan was created; it HIDES the dark truths about our post-independence years; it produces BRAIN DEAD products who lack the minimal cognitive abilities or critical thinking to do anything fruitful in their lives.
So why this emphasis on ONLY the religious element of text? ahhhh! its because the west asked us to. Its because we are a SLAVE people. This was the only `problem` area in our curriculum that West seemed to be interested in.
Our whorish elite in Pakistan never cared much about curriculum since their own children were studying in convents and abroad. Now suddenly this elite has awoken and is scrambling to meet the timeline imposed by West for `improving` our curriculum by only focusing on the verses. As if substituiting a few verses will usher in an era of elightenment and our own ``spanish inquisition``.
Here is another feather in the low hanging skirt of General Whore.
The obvious answer is NO. Our curriculum contains low grade subject matter; it LIES about history of Pakistan; it LIES about the history of the land on which Pakistan was created; it HIDES the dark truths about our post-independence years; it produces BRAIN DEAD products who lack the minimal cognitive abilities or critical thinking to do anything fruitful in their lives.
So why this emphasis on ONLY the religious element of text? ahhhh! its because the west asked us to. Its because we are a SLAVE people. This was the only `problem` area in our curriculum that West seemed to be interested in.
Our whorish elite in Pakistan never cared much about curriculum since their own children were studying in convents and abroad. Now suddenly this elite has awoken and is scrambling to meet the timeline imposed by West for `improving` our curriculum by only focusing on the verses. As if substituiting a few verses will usher in an era of elightenment and our own ``spanish inquisition``.
Here is another feather in the low hanging skirt of General Whore.
#15 Posted by nazarhayatkhan on April 2, 2004 10:32:03 pm
Malik99 # 14
I agree word `crusade` could have been avoided; especially when talking in this context.
However, I sandby with my views of ``Zero Tolerance`` for state telling its subjects what to believe in.
Pakistan also has Christians, Parsis, Hindus, Sikhs, non-believers - and they are equal citizens of the state.
#16 Posted by malik99 on April 3, 2004 7:05:54 am
Nazarhayatkhan # 15 - You wrote ``I sandby with my views of ``Zero Tolerance`` for state telling its subjects what to believe in``
Your ideas are not just slavish, they have an added element of hypocricy too. Why is your ``Zero Tolerance`` of state meddling in our beliefs limited to the religious part of the text? Why not to the history part? Why not the social studies part? or the even the science part? Does it have something to do with the fact that religious part is the only ``belief`` part that the West is interested in?
Yes, Pakistan has 1% minorities who do not share Islamic belief. They could be easily accomodated by customizing their texts with their own religious beliefs. Why you, the slave of west, are asking the 99% people of Pakistan to revamp the ``religious only`` portion of their texts to accomodate the 1%?
Listen man, I respect the atheists and secularists. But your secularism does not arise from a studied approach. It arises from ignorance and slave mentality.
Your ideas are not just slavish, they have an added element of hypocricy too. Why is your ``Zero Tolerance`` of state meddling in our beliefs limited to the religious part of the text? Why not to the history part? Why not the social studies part? or the even the science part? Does it have something to do with the fact that religious part is the only ``belief`` part that the West is interested in?
Yes, Pakistan has 1% minorities who do not share Islamic belief. They could be easily accomodated by customizing their texts with their own religious beliefs. Why you, the slave of west, are asking the 99% people of Pakistan to revamp the ``religious only`` portion of their texts to accomodate the 1%?
Listen man, I respect the atheists and secularists. But your secularism does not arise from a studied approach. It arises from ignorance and slave mentality.
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